Talk:Sheikh Mujibur Rahman

From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

This is the talk page for discussing improvements to the Sheikh Mujibur Rahman article.
Article policies
Featured article star Sheikh Mujibur Rahman is a featured article; it (or a previous version of it) has been identified as one of the best articles produced by the Wikipedia community. Even so, if you can update or improve it, please do.
Main Page trophy This article appeared on Wikipedia's Main Page as Today's featured article on February 10, 2007.
Peer review This History article has been selected for Version 0.5 and subsequent release versions of Wikipedia. It has been rated FA-Class on the assessment scale (comments).
This article is within the scope of the following WikiProjects:

Contents

[edit] POV Tag

Since I didn't see any justification for the POV tag placed yesterday despite request for explanation, I have removed it. Thanks. --Ragib 22:19, 30 October 2005 (UTC)

Don't be so impatient. I'm not in the same time zone as you are, and haven't had time to set out my objections yet. Anyway, I found the following sentences to be POV:
  • "the Pakistani military commenced one of the most atrocious genocides of the human history."
  • "His assassination later in the year ended the promise of a secular, modern, democratic nation."
  • "military leaders later claiming the full glory of the war of independence participated in what appears to be a plan initiated and executed by the then Dhaka station-chief of the CIA."

Unless you can link controversial claims to a REPUTABLE SOURCE, they constitute Original research, which is against Wikipedia's policy. I have rewritten the quoted sentences. David Cannon 23:44, 30 October 2005 (UTC)

Ok, here are some answers to the points you raised
  • Genocide - interesting, that's well supported, documented and referenced. Please refer to the rich collection of documents at [[Bangladesh Liberation War]. The total death toll was 1.5-3 million, according to different estimates.
  • Assassination-ending-years-promise of secular state: I agree, this sounds POV of the person adding the line. Better removed!!
  • CIA-connection : Here is a reference, from a book by Lawrence Lifschultz,then a journalist reporting on south asia, and now a Research Fellow, Center for International and Area Studies at Yale , "Title: BANGLADESH, THE UNFINISHED REVOLUTION Author: Lawrence Lifschultz Publisher: ZED Press Year: 1979". I don't have the book, but here are reports from Deccan Herald, Bangladesh Observer reports on the revealations. Quoting from the Deccan herald report, According to Lifschultz, Eugene Booster, then US Ambassador to Bangladesh repeatedly objected to the conspiracy and even issued written instruction in this regard, but then CIA Station Chief, Philip Cherry would not listen to him.. I hope this provides the reference you were looking for. Thanks. --Ragib 01:21, 31 October 2005 (UTC)

[edit] Images

A lot of images and information on Mujib are available here. As noted by Rama's arrow, the pre-1956 images are in Public domain according to the copyright laws of Pakistan. --Ragib 06:32, 4 July 2006 (UTC)

[edit] AL economics

"He remains the paramount icon of the Awami League, which continues to profess Rahman's ideals of socialism."

As best as I can remember, the Awami League officially embraced market economics sometime in the 1990s. So the above statement may be incorrect.. any way of verifying? --Peripatetic 18:19, 10 July 2006 (UTC)

Well it has become a sorta socialist in name with limited support of free-markets. Its not like a communist party, and more like the Indian National Congress, in which it maintains socialism as one its key ideals. It is a left-wing party. This Fire Burns.....Always 19:41, 10 July 2006 (UTC)

[edit] President for life

I thought the 4th amendment had a provision that declared this verbatim, but now I'm confused whether it did it in the text. Of course, the effect was to make Mujib president for life, but the amendment itself may not have said so in text.

From http://banglapedia.search.com.bd/HT/C_0336.htm

"Fourth Amendment Act The Constitution (Fourth Amendment) Act 1975 was passed on 25 January 1975. Major changes were brought into the constitution by this amendment. The presidential form of government was introduced in place of the parliamentary system; a one-party system in place of a multi-party system was introduced; the powers of the jatiya sangsad were curtailed; the Judiciary lost much of its independence; the supreme court was deprived of its jurisdiction over the protection and enforcement of fundamental rights. This Act (i) amended articles 11, 66, 67, 72, 74, 76, 80, 88, 95, 98, 109, 116, 117, 119, 122, 123, 141A, 147 and 148 of the constitution; (ii) substituted Articles 44, 70, 102, 115 and 124 of the constitution; (iii) amended part III of the constitution out of existence; (iv) altered the Third and Fourth Schedule; (v) extended the term of the first Jatiya Sangsad; (vi) made special provisions relating to the office of the president and its incumbent; (vii) inserted a new part, ie part VIA in the constitution and (viii) inserted articles 73A and 116A in the constitution."

So, does anyone have a reference to the sentence? I know it must be and probably IS 100% true, but a reference might help. --Ragib 20:54, 13 July 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Main page nom

I think this can be nominated for 15 August, his 31st assassination anniversary. --Ragib 03:30, 14 July 2006 (UTC)

Oh hell no! As much as I'm a Wikipedian, that date has gotta have an article on India! Hehehee...This Fire Burns Always 03:32, 14 July 2006 (UTC)
Congrats! to This Fire Burns Always and all other editors. Great work--ppm 15:15, 14 July 2006 (UTC)


[edit] Criticism of the Sheikh

It seems to me that someone hostile to Sheikh Mujib wrote the crticisms part. Calling him a rabble rouse and inept at leadership while not providing a link. Did a Paki write this? The links pointed to don't work....must be moved. Please rectify else I might add a POV tag.... —Preceding unsigned comment added by 87.74.41.206 (talk • contribs)

What exactly is the problem? The links provided here work perfectly. Look at the references. The section you question does not provide any opinion, rather states what some historians opine, with references. Be specific in your comments. Thank you. --Ragib 21:50, 10 September 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Hostile pov

I would like to know why so many criticisms of this dude (very pov eg. 'rabble rouser') while the links which apparantly evidence this lead one to nowhere! Is this article being changed by a Pakistani? lol (Plz answer). —Preceding unsigned comment added by 87.74.41.206 (talk • contribs)

The article doesn't criticize, rather points out the opinion of some historians. If you can't find the references at the end of the article, I'd request you to look again. The quote in question has been backed by the reference: "Bangladesh in 1975: The Fall of the Mujib Regime and Its Aftermath, Talukder Maniruzzaman, Asian Survey, Vol. 16, No. 2, A Survey of Asia in 1975: Part II (Feb., 1976), pp. 119-129". It IS shown at the references section. Also, please refrain from making comments on any editors or any nationalities, rather comment on content. Thank you. --Ragib 22:15, 10 September 2006 (UTC)

[edit] guerrilla

"Mujib was arrested and a guerrilla war erupted between government forces and Bengali nationalists."-- the government forces weren't fighting a guerrila war--ppm 20:59, 9 February 2007 (UTC) UTC)

[edit] Picture Caption

Rahman's portrait in the start was captioned "GAY, GAY, GAY" for some reason. I've changed it to his full name.Zainub 12:18, 10 February 2007 (UTC)

Good, some one's edited it before I could.Zainub 12:19, 10 February 2007 (UTC)
Can someone thank me for my fabulous job with the article. Wheeeee. Zamkudi 12:59, 10 February 2007 (UTC)
All you did was fix some minor errors. You should be thanking Ragib and Rama's Arrow. 70.113.74.80 16:31, 10 February 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Assassination

The source has been already provided as an Embedded HTML link in the article. Please discuss on the talk page before reverting edits. "The previous version was better" is not a reasonable explanation. In fact, the link you provided is not even working, how can it be better? You should go ahead and fix your link first. 76.185.251.116 08:53, 20 May 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Addition as a Pakistani politican

I added Sheikh Mujib-Ur-Rahman to the category of Pakistani politicians,Shehzadashiq 16:57, 29 June 2007 (UTC) however Nahid has reverted it. Is there any reason why? Sheikh Mujib won the 1970 elections from Pakistan and was thus eligible for being Pakistan's prime minister. His contribution to Pakistan politics is undeniable so why not acknowledge him as a Pakistani politician as well? I don't see any contradiction in his having been a Pakistani politician and Bangladesh's founding leader.

In case there is a doubt, the Pakistani politicans category does not need to include current politicians, it can also include previous Pakistani politicians. I hope this helps. Please let me know if you are happy with his addition to this category.Shehzadashiq 10:19, 27 June 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Bangla spelling of Bangabandhu

Could someone please provide the Bangla spelling of Bangabandhu please. I cannot read Bangla so cannot add it myself.Shehzadashiq 16:52, 29 June 2007 (UTC)


[edit] Urdu spelling removal

Ragib, was there any specific reason why the Urdu spelling of Mujib's name was removed?

Yes, why Urdu? Was Urdu his mother tongue? Was Urdu the language of his region? In Bio pages, if we are to include any non-English script, ONLY the native language of the person should be considered. --Ragib 17:01, 29 June 2007 (UTC)

I didn't know that only the mother tongue of a person is to be added. If we look at Gandhi, he has his name mentioned in both Gujarati and Hindi. Now Gandhi's mother tongue was Gujarati, not Hindi. I let you decide if Urdu should be added back, just let me know what you decide.Shehzadashiq 19:42, 29 June 2007 (UTC)

Yes, but then Gandhi used Hindi almost exclusively in his speeches, books etc. Now, how is Urdu related to Mujibur Rahman? Did he speak Urdu as his mother tongue, or first language? Nope. So, no justification for Urdu. As a counter example, what do you think about having Bengali script in the pages of Jinnah, Bhutto, Ayub Khan and any living or deceased Pakistani politician born before 1971? After all, Bengali WAS one of the two state languages of undivided Pakistan. I hope you see the fallacy in your argument by now. --Ragib 20:09, 29 June 2007 (UTC)

I see your point that Urdu was his secondary language and thus makes little sense to add it. Fair enough no argument. However I disagree that Bengali should not be added to the pages of Jinnah, Fatima Jinnah, Iqbal etc. I personally believe that those pages should have Bengali. If you don't mind provide me with the Bengali script in unicode format and I will be more than happy to amend them. Wassallam.Shehzadashiq 13:41, 30 June 2007 (UTC)

Ragib will you kindly provide the Bengali script for the people mentioned above? Shehzadashiq 13:29, 6 July 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Explaining a revert

I reverted the following edit: [1]. This is because of the following reasons:

  • The edit blanked a reference ... I don't see any explanation for this arbitrary blanking.
  • No need to have the Bengali script for "Bangabandhu".
  • During the FAC or peer review (forgot which one), it was pointed out that the "life long president" wasn't backed by any citations.
  • Too much details, non-standard date formats, etc. in the intro para ... against WP:SUMMARY and WP:DATE
  • Bad English ... for example, "Once his Cabinet Minister Khondaker Mostaq Ahmad was made the president of the country by the coup leaders. "
  • This whole new para is full POV, "Law and order was largely restored after a coup on 07 November of 1975 that gave control to the army chief Ziaur Rahman. Later, as president Sayem resigned, Ziaur Rahman, then the Chief Martial Law Administrator (CMLA) took over the charge of the country. Not only he successfully restored discipline in the army, he also paved way for re-establishing democracy in the country. First he allowed multi-party politics that was banned by Mujib and then held a parliamentary election in 1979 that restored multi-party parliamentary democracy in the country."


I request the person who is mutilating this Featured article to discuss any changes before making them. This is a featured article, and the hard work of many editors. Please don't blindly undo that. Thanks. --Ragib 09:03, 19 October 2007 (UTC)


Again, this edit by Anon/AsimSanyal is full of inaccuaracies, in addition to the above points ...

  • Mujib returned to Bangladesh on January 10, 1972, and NOT April 17, 1972.
  • "On his return to East Pakistan, " ... the province was actually called East Bengal at that time
  • "The two governments remained in close cooperation during Mujib until Mujib's assasination in 1971." - Mujib was actually assassinated in 1975

I find that entire paragraphs have been removed/blanked, and entire citations from Time magazine and other sources blanked without any explanation. I request the anon/User:Asim Sanyal to refrain from defacing this article.

Thanks. --Ragib 12:19, 29 October 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Correct spelling

If we write Sheikh Mujibur Rahman in Bengali by using "Avro Phonetic" (Bengali version) software, it stands like: শেইখ মুজিবুর রাহমান instead of শেখ মুজিবর রহমান. So, which procedure we should follow?--NAHID 19:08, 29 December 2007 (UTC)