Wikipedia talk:SGpedians' notice board/Archive 5

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New "Welcome Singaporean" template!

I just created a new template at {{Template:Welcomesg}} so that we can insert them easily into any new suspected Singaporean we come across here. Comments are welcome, and please feel free to edit that template if you deem it neccesary. I unabashedly merged text from multiple welcome pages to come up with this one...hehehe.--Huaiwei 14:49, 8 October 2006 (UTC)

Looks good, I'm using it; :D --Vsion 04:34, 13 October 2006 (UTC)

DYK

The DYK section featured on the main page is always looking for interesting new and recently expanded stubs from different parts of the world. Please make a suggestion.--Peta 02:08, 10 October 2006 (UTC)

Continuously doing so! —Sengkang 02:17, 10 October 2006 (UTC)
We do get lots of great items from Singapore, thanks :) Keep up the good work. --Peta 02:23, 10 October 2006 (UTC)

Re : Loke Yew

I was informed about an article, Loke Yew which appears to look like a cut-and-paste. Instead of an outright deletion for non-notability a quick background check appears that some facts are verifiable and correct [1] [2] , and the person is notable. Any takers to do a clean-up, or perhaps a rewrite for this one? - Mailer Diablo 14:55, 19 October 2006 (UTC)

  • It has been deleted as copyvio, but if anyone can do a rewrite still that'd be good. - Mailer Diablo 15:15, 19 October 2006 (UTC)
    • I have to mug, my Maths is goyak and I need to practice it, I can't even solve some factorisation questions. :X Maybe after 27 October, but Loke Yew is not that notable after all. --Terence Ong (T | C) 15:19, 19 October 2006 (UTC)

Ivy Goh Nair

I'm not sure whether this person is notable or not. Google says no. Will somebody please have a look at Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Ivy Goh Nair. Thanks. utcursch | talk 08:04, 21 October 2006 (UTC)

Pure vanity, person is non-notable. Never heard of her. I've heard of Ivy Singh Lee not Ivy Goh Nair. The former is a netballer association president and runs a veggie farm in Kranji. --Terence Ong (T | C) 10:28, 21 October 2006 (UTC)

Hey fellow Singaporeans/Singapore-phils, please note that the Editor/creator himself, Chandran Nair has requested (on 20 Oct 06) that the article Ivy Goh Nair be withdrawn because the debate page had degenerated in to personal attacks and deletion of positive comments by users. This was posted on the notice board here after the request was made. Further comments while they are possible since Wikipedia is a such a free site, would call into question the motives of these users. This is only common sense!Ivygohnair 08:08, 24 October 2006 (UTC)

Wikipedians who wish to follow the full discussion of the debate on Ivy Goh Nair should see also Talk:IvygohnairIvygohnair 09:32, 29 October 2006 (UTC)

Project directory

Hello. The WikiProject Council has recently updated the Wikipedia:WikiProject Council/Directory. This new directory includes a variety of categories and subcategories which will, with luck, potentially draw new members to the projects who are interested in those specific subjects. Please review the directory and make any changes to the entries for your project that you see fit. There is also a directory of portals, at User:B2T2/Portal, listing all the existing portals. Feel free to add any of them to the portals or comments section of your entries in the directory. The three columns regarding assessment, peer review, and collaboration are included in the directory for both the use of the projects themselves and for that of others. Having such departments will allow a project to more quickly and easily identify its most important articles and its articles in greatest need of improvement. If you have not already done so, please consider whether your project would benefit from having departments which deal in these matters. It is my hope that all the changes to the directory can be finished by the first of next month. Please feel free to make any changes you see fit to the entries for your project before then. If you should have any questions regarding this matter, please do not hesitate to contact me. Thank you. B2T2 15:11, 25 October 2006 (UTC)

Meetup

Hello, the meetup maybe on these dates. November 24 or 25 or both days, do leave your name at the meetup page if you can make it. If you have any enquiries, you may contact me. --Terence Ong (T | C) 16:08, 28 October 2006 (UTC)

Notice

I would just like to draw fellow Singaporean's attention to edits by one particular user by the name of User:Instantnood. For example, see his attempts to refer to Singapore as a Single-party state [3] [4] [5] and his comments in Talk:Pedra Branca, Singapore. This user has been known to engage in prolonged disruptive editing, and I have long noticed his curious edits on Singapore related articles, often in childish response to my edits on HK-related articles. It is by no coincidence that he is banned from editing the Singapore article itself.--Huaiwei 15:54, 5 November 2006 (UTC)

"Single-party state" is descriptive, and not necessarily negative nor positive. Singapore is described as a "single-part state" not only on Wikipedia [6] [7], including an academic from the NUS [8]. The reason why I was barred from editing the article on Singapore because you insisted that the abolished City Council had duties over the entire Singapore (which was not true), and the entirety of modern Singapore is officially defined as or designated to be one city. In what way were my comments [9] [10] at talk:Pedra Branca, Singapore disruptive? — Instantnood 18:47, 5 November 2006 (UTC)

Removed requested article

I have removed this requested article, Narasimha (band) from the notice board as it will likely be deleted if created. In this website, it is stated that the band from Singapore had only released one album so far. This fails WP:MUSIC guidelines. Moreover, all the songs which this band has released as not has any charted hits in this country. This band has not gone in for any international tour so far. So, in conlusion, this request should be deleted from the notice board. If anyone disagrees with this view, your comments would be deeply appreciated! --Siva1979Talk to me 08:31, 6 November 2006 (UTC)

Removed requested article

I have removed Far East Plaza Kids from the to create section as this article will most likely be deleted if created. A google search for this subject shows only three unique hits. This shows that it fails notability guidelines. If anyone objects to this, your comments would be greatly welcomed! --Siva1979Talk to me 12:19, 6 November 2006 (UTC)

WikiProject Singaporean Arts and Entertainment

Description

Hello! I am interested to see if any SGpedians will be interested in a WikiProject for Singaporean arts. Our scope will include:

as well as the people involved, such as Singaporean actors, musicians and writers. Like all WikiProjects, we will focus on menial yet exciting tasks such as creating new articles, cleaning up articles, and setting consistent standards across articles of the same scope. If enough people join the project, we could even set up a separate task force for each different aspect of Singaporean arts! Not only would the project be awesome, we'd also be helping out the myriad of pages on Singaporean entertainment that are in sore need of cleanup and expansion. -ryand 11:04, 7 November 2006 (UTC)

Interested SGpedians

Sign below if interested!
  1. I have been pushing for such a WikiProject for some time, but failed to get it rolling. I have made major contributions to several articles on Jack Neo movies (see Homerun (film), I Not Stupid and I Not Stupid Too) and minor contributions to several articles on Singapore TV shows and actors. I'm interested in making further contributions to articles on Singapore TV shows (the 9pm drama serials on Channel 8) and movies (Jack Neo movies). --J.L.W.S. The Special One 11:10, 13 November 2006 (UTC)
  2. Interesting. --Terence Ong (C | R) 11:24, 13 November 2006 (UTC)

Discussion

Add any additional comments!
  • Comment - No one up for making these articles not suck? :( -ryand 12:35, 12 November 2006 (UTC)
  • Not all the arts and entertainment topics are mentioned in your list. If we start, please also include them in. Thanks. --Terence Ong (C | R) 11:24, 13 November 2006 (UTC)
    • Such as? "Arts and entertainment" is a term that can be applied very loosely... -ryand 19:02, 14 November 2006 (UTC)
  • The project is up. -ryand 14:52, 22 November 2006 (UTC)

Deleted potential article

I have deleted a potential article Keppel Viaduct, from the to create section of the noticeboard as it would most likely go through an AfD nomination if created. A google search shows up only two unique hits. This lack of reference would likely cause this article to be deleted. Moreover, in my humble opinion, I do not think that the subject matter of this article is encyclopedic in nature. However, if any Wikipedian could give reliable sources for this article and write this article in such an encyclopedic style, I would definitely try to chip in some information. But at the present, I do not think that Wikipedians, especially from other countries would support in keeping this article on Wikipedia (Of course, being a Singaporean, I would like to see this article on Wikipedia, but on further research, I have to reluctantly agree that the subject matter is not notable under Wikipedia standards, yet). --Siva1979Talk to me 15:01, 8 November 2006 (UTC)

The above argument also applies to the requested article, Marina Square Kids. A google search shows up only four unique hits. --Siva1979Talk to me 15:03, 8 November 2006 (UTC)
The requested article, Kendrick Lee should also be removed. The main reason is that he has not won anything major yet. For example, this webpage shows that the above mentioned badminton player has not even competed at an Olympic meet. However, I wish to add that a google search shows about 700 unique hits. --Siva1979Talk to me 16:01, 9 November 2006 (UTC)
NO, Kendrick Lee shouldn ot be removed. A Commonwealth Games participant is considered good enough to be included on Wikipedia. We shall see his performance at the Asian Games in Doha. But definitely he is notable, and meets WP:BIO. Kendrick has represented Singapore at a very high level and we should be proud of that. --Terence Ong (C | R) 11:23, 13 November 2006 (UTC)
Kendrick Lee is considered the second-best Singaporean player after Susilo. Not notable enough? Meanwhile, Keppel Viaduct has been the longest viaduct in Singapore for a decade or so, and has been the solution to link two major expressways together. Not notable enough also?--Huaiwei 15:33, 13 November 2006 (UTC)
Well, there is no harm in creating the article on Kendrick Lee. But I feel it would be better if this article was created after the Asian Games as it will less likely be posted on AfD. Quite a number of Singapore related articles was deleted as well by the Wikipedia community. For example, a few of the articles about our athletes who represented Singapore at the South-East Asian Games were deleted, citing notability concerns, a few months back. As for the subject on Keppel Viaduct, getting reliable sources on the net might be a problem here. But there is no harm trying to create an article about this as well. --Siva1979Talk to me 20:32, 19 November 2006 (UTC)
We can always archive a copy in our sandbox. Something like Wikipedia:SGpedians' notice board/Keppel Viaduct for example, to save it in case it's deleted. --Rifleman 82 20:36, 19 November 2006 (UTC)

{{User Singapore}}

I've noticed that {{User Singapore}} causes an extra line break when transcluded onto other pages. Can someone look into it?
--ZhongHan (Email) 17:08, 10 November 2006 (UTC)

Military history of Singapore

Okay guys. Haven't interacted much with those here collectively, but some have seen my work in Singapore-related topics. Started a new article which is strangely lacking since there is so much info on the "now" but not the "then". Only one section is halfway complete, that is the post-war period. How we can help: the Library of Congress reference at the bottom actually has not a bad story to tell. Rather than cut-and-paste, I've been rephrasing, summarizing, wikifying and supplementing with other articles already extant. If you have a bit of time, you can pitch in by doing the same from this source, and any others you can find. --Rifleman 82 19:52, 10 November 2006 (UTC)


Pedra Branca

Do note, that the above article, which was (disputedly) moved to Pedra Branca, Singapore by an anon, is now being proposed to be moved to Pulau Batu Puteh by, you guessed it, a Malaysian. See Talk:Pedra Branca, Singapore for the full discussion, which is currently on-going as I speak.--Huaiwei 14:42, 17 November 2006 (UTC)

I Not Stupid for GA?

There are currently 3 Singaporean GAs: Singapore, History of Singapore and Singapore Changi Airport.

I have been working on I Not Stupid since September, and I believe it is close to GA status. Several of my Wikifriends have agreed with me during discussions on MSN Messenger.

I invite all SGpedians to read the article, and help me improve it to GA status.

Several points:

  • Please leave the Plot section alone for now. I know it sucks, but I'm going to thoroughly rewrite it. Once I rewrite it, I welcome everyone to copyedit it.
  • We should create a "Jack Neo movies" template to place at the bottom of articles about Jack Neo movies. Could someone with more experience in wiki markup help me create it? As far as I know, there are 10 Jack Neo movies: Money No Enough, Liang Po Po: The Movie, That One No Enough, I Not Stupid, Homerun (film), The Best Bet, I Do I Do, One More Chance (film), I Not Stupid Too and Just Follow Law. I created the template, and Vsion formatted it. Done.
  • The Political satire section is unreferenced. Will it affect I Not Stupid's GA chances? If so, should we delete it? Could we find any references for that section? (The rest of the article is well-referenced, except for the Plot section, which doesn't need references.)
  • Is there enough information to write a Production section with references? If not, will the lack of a Production section affect I Not Stupid's GA chances?
  • Are these screenshots fair use? If so, which should I use in the article?

Hopefully I Not Stupid will become Singapore's fourth GA by the end of November!

--J.L.W.S. The Special One 10:18, 18 November 2006 (UTC)

Yeap, our cultural-related articles have been relatively neglected compared to articles on infrastructure, history, etc. It is good to get one culture/arts-related article up for GA as a start. The references and production content are indeed lacking. I guess we have to research more in these areas. Isn't there a theme song for the movie? --Vsion 02:20, 20 November 2006 (UTC)
I think that the Cast, Reception and Sequels sections are adequately referenced. The Plot section doesn't need references - it just needs rewriting. Only the Political satire section lacks references. We should decide whether to reference it, delete it or leave it alone.
Due to the lack of information and references available for Singaporean topics, it will be difficult to write a good and well-referenced Production section. We will need to decide what information should go into the Production section (music? shooting? writing? crew?) and find referenced information. To answer Vsion: yes, the movie does have a theme song.
Two other articles - Singapore 2006 and Singapore general election 2006 - are close to GA status. Please consider working on them as well. At the end of the month, I will nominate Daniel Brandt, I Not Stupid, Singapore 2006 and Singapore general election, 2006 for GA status.
--J.L.W.S. The Special One 03:49, 24 November 2006 (UTC)

Wikiproject

(cut from preceding discussion) To the sgpedian community: Remember we were once discussing if we should turn this notice board community into a project community (and didnt do it because the functionality is basically the same)? I would be quite amused if we find ourselves having to do the switch for no better reason than Thadius856's comments, but we might very well have to! Ridiculousness on a bright Sunday morning. :D--Huaiwei 23:29, 18 November 2006 (UTC)

It appears that our community, being a notice board rather than a wikiproject, has implied a lack of legitimacy. So, how do we turn it into a wikiproject? Can we get it done now? --Rifleman 82 23:34, 18 November 2006 (UTC)
User:Mailer diablo has done the marvellous thing of adding SGpedians' Resources,. our de-facto extension of WikiProject's functions within this notice board. Kudos to him! A number of us are now busy grading sg-related articles and declaring them as part of this "NB-Project". ;)--Huaiwei 12:59, 19 November 2006 (UTC)
To be honest I decided to extend it because I was too lazy to convert. And I don't think our resources are big enough to have a really active WikiProject around. ;) - Mailer Diablo 21:40, 19 November 2006 (UTC)
I've been waiting for this importance-and-quality ratings for a long time :D. Btw, aren't we too conservative in placing articles in the Category:Top-importance Singapore articles? There is only one article there so far. I would think that all the "main articles" listed under the main sections in Singapore should be Top-importance articles, which give us about 10 top-importance articles. This will give us a broader spectrum for rating the other articles. Any comments? --Vsion 22:26, 19 November 2006 (UTC)
Yes that's very true. I was wondering the exact same thing. I was having some issues deciding importance of military articles:simply coz there are too many steps in their "hierachy" of sorts. and only a three-step importance scale to rely on. ;)--Huaiwei 22:39, 19 November 2006 (UTC)
Seems like everyone is up and about early this morning. I've recatted 10 articles. I hope you do agree with my assessment. I chose mostly articles which are either significant in our history or culture. --Rifleman 82 22:43, 19 November 2006 (UTC)

Oh btw, did anyone notice we are already considered a "Wikiproject" of sorts in Wikipedia:WikiProject Council/Directory/Geographical. The thing is you have to look for us under the China section [11]!--Huaiwei 13:15, 19 November 2006 (UTC)

Moved to Singapore. Sheesh. -Rifleman 82 13:52, 19 November 2006 (UTC)

My God I love this table [12]! ;)--Huaiwei 16:42, 20 November 2006 (UTC)

I was looking at Wikipedia:WikiProject China and Wikipedia:WikiProject Canada, and I suddenly had a change of heart. It dosent look too much work to form a wikiproject page based on that template, and move some of our more collaborative-based functionalities currently in our notice board to the Wikiporject while maintaining the notice board for what its meant to be...notices of good work, new articles, and so on. Of course if we are up to it, we can always evolve into the likes of Wikipedia:WikiProject Australia later, but do the rest of you think we can manage with the simplier version as characterised by the first two egs, or if this is needed at all?

Your opinions please!--Huaiwei 16:54, 20 November 2006 (UTC)

Since we are expecting a spike of contributions during november and december, I would say be ambitious and go for the Aussie model. I especially like the table of importance-quality matrix. One thing, please don't call the subgroups "departments" (sounds too bureaucratic), call them "teams" or something that sounds nicer. --Vsion 17:07, 20 November 2006 (UTC)
I was hoping everybody would like the new assessment table. I was giving it quite a push and thankfully Olev agreed that it was doable. It seems like the exact reasons why I was trying to get it created are panning out to be the case here. I'm astounded, however, at the massive rate which assessment has already commenced. The only problem is that the template doesn't always transclude correctly, most noticeably when trying to float it next to another wikitable.
Don't have enough active members to be a WikiProject? You've got to be kidding me. My mind is blown by the massive amount of effort thats already gone into assessment alone in the last couple of days. Surely you guys have seen tiny projects floating around, such as WikiProject Yukon Territory Roads, WikiProject Myrtle Beach or WikiProject Silver Dollar City? WikiProject Singapore would be extremely helpful, if not already desperately needed. :) thadius856talk 04:16, 22 November 2006 (UTC)

Collaboration

I've set up a new collaboration process. I'll expand in detail on the day of the meeting, and hopefully it will start working soon. - Mailer Diablo 10:54, 21 November 2006 (UTC)

Hm...nice work and page, but dosent that really look alot like a Wikiproject extension? ;)--Huaiwei 15:20, 21 November 2006 (UTC)
Great. I can't believe it won't work this time. When does the nomination day starts? Or can we start nominating article already? As for the objective stated on the collaboration page, shouldn't we reinsert the statement which says "to bring articles to FA standard"? I assume we have not abandoned that as a goal for the collaboration effort ;) --Vsion 15:54, 22 November 2006 (UTC)
When would this return? I miss this the most. --Terence Ong (C | R) 16:02, 22 November 2006 (UTC)
I was wondering about that as well. It seems that the new collaboration page is to replace SGCOTF, but it is not explicitly stated. --Vsion 17:20, 22 November 2006 (UTC)
I wish to nominate I Not Stupid, Singapore 2006 and Singapore general election, 2006 for the collaboration, as I believe that with some work, we can get them to GA status. --J.L.W.S. The Special One 03:39, 24 November 2006 (UTC)

WikiProject Singaporean Arts and Entertainment - Redux

So I decided to be bold and create WP:SGAE after all! Feel free to help out, give feedback, yell at the things I should've done differently, whatever. Also expect to see a new project banner appearing on various talk pages soon. -ryand 14:57, 22 November 2006 (UTC)

So how do you pronounce SGAE? See-Gay? :D--Huaiwei 15:13, 22 November 2006 (UTC)
I... I've never actually thought about it that way :/ It was "suh-jay" in my mind, if anything. -ryand 15:19, 22 November 2006 (UTC)
I joined the WikiProject. I'll be working on articles on Jack Neo movies and some TV shows. --J.L.W.S. The Special One 03:38, 24 November 2006 (UTC)

Singapore as a single-party state?

The issue has cropped up again over at the above page, with the reintroduction of Singapore there. See Talk:Single-party_state#User:Instantnood.27s_political_views_on_Singapore.--Huaiwei 22:46, 23 November 2006 (UTC)

Guys, check out what our friend is commenting over in [13]. His use of the word "evil" was particularly interesting.--Huaiwei 13:59, 3 December 2006 (UTC)

Navbar

Now that it looks like the Singaporean WikiProject aspect is expanding beyond the SGpedians' notice board, I made a little navigational aid template to help navigation between the related pages. Feel free to modify it as you see fit:


WikiProject Singapore
SGpedians' notice board · Discussion · Portal · Manual of Style
New SGpedians' Collaboration · WikiProject Singaporean Arts and Entertainment · WikiProject Singaporean places

Also, the only page it's not currently on is this talk page itself. The top of the page is kinda cluttered and I couldn't figure out how to put it there without making the whole thing look ugly. Enjoy! -ryand 07:26, 25 November 2006 (UTC)

Thanks for the intiative. Hold on a little on this thou, as we are considering setting up a true-blue Wikiproject and reorganising our collaborative system if need be.--Huaiwei 13:28, 26 November 2006 (UTC)

SG politician infobox

I've been browsing through the articles on Singaporean politicians (it's really a mess in there) and I realize that what we really need is an infobox for Singaporean politicians. I am aware that {{Infobox Politician}} exists, but it's primarily US-centric, and a Singaporean infobox could better encapsulate the political scene in Singapore. I would do one myself, except that being the politically-apathetic Singaporean that I am, I have no idea what information would be relevant. Comments and/or offers to take up the challenge? -ryand 07:54, 25 November 2006 (UTC)

I may be able to help abit along the way. I am thinking we need a wikiproject dept on Singapore politics anyway, which I will be glad to be a part of! ;)--Huaiwei 13:27, 26 November 2006 (UTC)

Next meetup

Rather early to decide, but just to let you all know. Keep March 10 or 11 free if you are interested in the next meetup. It will be more organised and professional this time round. See here for more details. Only confirm the dates you are free after February 11 2007. If you are interested, do leave your name there. Any queries, ask Goh wz, Chaerani or myself. --Terence Ong (C | R) 14:49, 27 November 2006 (UTC)

Pedra Branca

The above article was moved to Pedra Branca, South China Sea by an admin despite the fact that the dicussion mentioned both options as possibilities, but with more indicating Pedra Branca as the preferred version. I wonder if the community here sees a need for collaborative action in light of this prematured conclusion by an admin (and which a user even thanked for "helping out" there [14])?--Huaiwei 17:04, 27 November 2006 (UTC)

If you count both polls, doesn't concensus obviously tell that we want it moved back to Pedra Branca, not its current name. That was not much discussion about this move, it was so abrupt. --Terence Ong (C | R) 17:09, 27 November 2006 (UTC)

Meetup infobox

I'll like to propose setting up a meetup infobox a la Wikipedia:Meetup/Melbourne/Invite, Template:Meetup/LA/Invite, Template:SeattleMeetup and Wikipedia:Meetup/Sydney/Invite. It'll enable us to inform multiple users (not just SGpedians) (through their talk pages, this notice board, etc) without having to edit the individual pages. Please vote. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by ZhongHan (talk • contribs) 15:53, 28 November 2006.

To add on, it should preferably be created at Wikipedia:Meetup/Singapore/Invite. If there aren't any issues, I will create it after 1 week. --ZhongHan (Email) 02:51, 29 November 2006 (UTC)
  • Support. —Goh wz 15:29, 28 November 2006 (UTC)
  • Support --Terence Ong 16:07, 28 November 2006 (UTC)

Please note that is has been done. Feel free to improve it. --ZhongHan (Email) 13:39, 6 December 2006 (UTC)

Fann Wong for GA status

After recent cleanup by Voda voda and myself, I believe that the Fann Wong article is almost ready for good article status! All it needs is a little more polishing and copyediting to prepare it for peer review and GA. Anyone is welcome to help; there's a to-do list on the talk page. -ryand 15:56, 30 November 2006 (UTC)

Although the article is well-referenced, two major issues must be addressed if Fann Wong is to achieve GA status:
  1. The article contains excessive lists. A list of films/dramas she starred in and awards/nominations she received will do.
  2. The article lacks a section on Fann's "personal life". "Broad coverage" is a GA criteria.
As a member of the GA and SGAE WikiProjects, I am willing to help with writing, copy-editing and ensuring quality of prose.
I am currently working on improving I Not Stupid to GA status. Could you let me nominate Fann Wong and I Not Stupid at the same time (along with Singapore 2006, Singapore general election, 2006 and Daniel Brandt)?
--J.L.W.S. The Special One 09:26, 1 December 2006 (UTC)
Thanks for your points. I am aware of the first point and intend to clean it up soon. As for the second point... well, I guess it's back to research. Nominate both articles together if you like, but go ahead and nominate I Not Stupid first if it meets all the GA criteria before Fann Wong does (or vice versa). -ryand 13:57, 1 December 2006 (UTC)

Infobox for names?

SGpedians' notice board/Archive 5
Hangul 인천국제공항철도
Hanja 仁川國際空港鐵道
Revised Romanization Incheon Gukje Gonghang Cheoldo
McCune-Reischauer Inch'ŏn Kukche Konghang Ch'ŏlto

Lots of articles on subjects in Singapore start with a huge slew of names in English, Malay, Tamil, Mandarin, Hokkien, Cantonese, Proto-Quechua, etc. While this information is useful for some, it adds a lot of clutter to articles and often makes the first sentence nearly impossible to read:

The Mass Rapid Transit or MRT (Traditional Chinese: 大眾快速交通 or more commonly known as 地鐵; Simplified Chinese: 大众快速交通 or more commonly known as 地铁; Malay: Sistem Pengangkutan Gerak Cepat; Tamil: சிங்கை துரிதக் கடவு ரயில்) is a rapid transit system...

I think an infobox along the lines of the koreanname template to the left would be a good way of storing and displaying this info. Opinions? Jpatokal 04:50, 10 October 2006 (UTC)

  • Agree --ZhongHan (Email) 14:29, 17 October 2006 (UTC)
  • Disagree. There are plenty of templates on specific subject matter which does the same thing, so how useful will another box be?--Huaiwei 14:53, 17 October 2006 (UTC)
Of course it's a generic box, if there's a more specific one then obviously use that one instead. Jpatokal 15:04, 14 November 2006 (UTC)

Bumpity-bump. I am so not wading into that Changi Airport mess again, but let's see if we can get some more opinions on this. Huaiwei, please also understand that this is intended as a "default" infobox for cases when there is no appropriate specific template, so I'd like to hear if you have other objections. Jpatokal 09:02, 24 November 2006 (UTC)

  • Weak agree − I would like to see how it looks like on the page itself, however. I think many users are used to seeing the language information in the topic sentence. -ryand 14:17, 26 November 2006 (UTC)
  • Agree – Don't know if this topic is still under active discussion, but I think an infobox for names would tidy up articles and would be an improvement. Cheers, Jacklee 15:43, 23 March 2007 (UTC)

Languages and Singapore Changi Airport

Do take a look at Talk:Singapore Changi Airport. Several editors have taken exception to the use of the four languages on this article (which is consistently applied throughout most of Singapore-related articles). I believe instead of making any change on Singapore Changi Airport based on any consensus on that particular talkpage, the issue of languages should be discussed here first, then applied across all our articles.

Some issues at hand (both for and against):

  • English, Chinese, Malay, and Tamil are the official languages of Singapore and for the sake of equity, it is all or nothing for the latter three.
  • All these languages are used in the signboards most (if not all) government-owned buildings.
  • Having a string of languages makes the article lead rather cluttered.
  • Some (if not the vast majority) of users worldwide cannot understand the other languages, and just skip them over.

Let's come to an agreement whether the names should stay, go, or be changed somehow. Once done, we can proceed from here. I do prefer that this issue is settled here rather than in Changi Airport's article, where the interested parties are not necessarily from here and so may not understand the issue as well.

For starters, here are my opinions:

  • Drop the pinyin - if you know Chinese you probably can read the words as-is; if you don't, it's not going to help.
  • Use <small> </small> tags to shrink the other names to take up less space. However, the Chinese characters are already quite hard to read at this font size so it might not be practical.
  • Infoboxes with the other languages will just lead to even more clutter, so I object to a dedicated infobox for the names.

--Rifleman 82 22:37, 18 November 2006 (UTC)

Rifleman, you yourself posted this on the talk page only moments ago:
"I think that the presence/absence/line drawn should be dictated by a consensus of the people in those wikiprojects tending to the articles."
While this notice board is useful (which I do not debate) and may "claim" jurisdiction over the article, WP:AIRPORTS would be the only actual WikiProject associated with the article, as apparent by the lack of other project banners on the article talk page. That is a more appropriate place to discuss this, as you have stated yourself. If there a WP:SINGAPORE (WP:SG?) existed, which would likely be extremely useful, I concede that would also have a say in it. But remember, Singapore Changi Airport is, by definition, an airport and its location is somewhat less important. However, I do agree that pinyin should be dropped entirely, as its not even one of the official languages to begin with that we've all been debating over for well past a month now.
You're right in that the vast majority of the world does not understand these languages. While they may be useful to some, they're most likely only particularly useful to those who only speak that language, as those who have enough understanding of the English language to comprehend the 85kb article itself should be able to understand the name in English. What percentage of the English Wikipedia's readers only speak Chinese, Tamil or Malay? Hopefully none—why browse this Wikipedia if you can't understand what's being written?—though there are probably a few lurking around. These readers are far more likely to be reading in whichever language suits their needs best anyway if they're actually interested in the subject at hand.
As for the <small> element wrapping you're proposing for the names, the template (used in every article under WikiProject Airports) has been written with a nativename, nativename-a and nativename-r parameter for longer than I can remember. I'll be making the changes to the template shortly after I post this, as its been long established on the airport infobox's usage page that these should be used. I hadn't noticed that they were hard-coded with HTML tags instead of following accepted format until you mentioned it.
Like I keep reminding every on the article's talk page, the proposal is to keep all of the names in the existing airport infobox, which it was designed to accomodate, and to remove the other names from the lead paragraph only. A section on the names in other languages may be useful, but so far none of the supporters for keeping them have stepped up to the plate and actually written it. thadius856talk 23:05, 18 November 2006 (UTC)
Pray tell, why should Singapore Changi Airport be an aberration compared with all the other Singapore-related articles then? --Rifleman 82 23:28, 18 November 2006 (UTC)
I find it nonsensical that jurisdiction over articles is now being fought over based on nothing but banners. I remember there was a time disagreements were so heated over the content of the article that the Singapore Changi page was even removed from the Airport project. Would you like us to go down this path once again? We very well might if this kind of provincial thinking persists. Wikipedia is a SHARED project. Try arguing against that.--Huaiwei 23:10, 18 November 2006 (UTC)
If you read closely, I did not claim that since that project has the only banner on the page that it is the only one with jurisdiction. However, I can only assume such, as nobody has mentioned any other project that has even the slightest interest in the article. Even you have to understand that notice boards are not WikiProjects by definition. thadius856talk 23:21, 18 November 2006 (UTC)
Are you in the business of playing with words for the sole purposes of trying to exclude segments of the wikicommunity from participating in concensus building? Worse, are you claiming wikiprojects take greater ownership of wikiarticles, and have the final word over them? If this is what you are simply getting at, then no wonder you are part of that project. Its staffed by plenty of like-minded individuals like yourself.--Huaiwei 23:27, 18 November 2006 (UTC)
Can we not at least be civil and observe ettiquite? We're discussing a couple hundred bytes on a remote server somewhere. thadius856talk 06:03, 19 November 2006 (UTC)
Oh sure we all wish everyone could be civil since we are talking about civil aviation (and bless User:Strom for dropping me a kind note just when I am getting really hot under the collar [15]), but I am particularly insinuated by aggreesive comments such as those above which clearly attempt to elevate the status of some wikipedians and exclude others, for no reason other than over disagreements on a couple hundred bytes. That suggestion is a full scale insult on my very existance in this wiki, where I filmly believe everyone has a fair say in its growth and development. In a site where even anons are threated with respect and their contributions valued, may I see some justifications for sidelining non-project members and dismissing their views?
May I repeat, that for all our existance in this wiki, and for all the work the sg community have done for any kind of topic, the only wikiproject which has continously run into problems with the this community is none other then Wikipedia:WikiProject Airports and Wikipedia:WikiProject Airlines, both led by more or less the same individuals. Is this pure coincidence, or does it tell you something else? Let is all try to assume good faith, shall we?--Huaiwei 08:33, 19 November 2006 (UTC)
I'll try to actually answer the original question(s). In my opinion, the official languages are worthwhile but low-priority information and should hence be kept, but in an infobox to the side, not in the lead. If possible, the names should ideally be integrated with other existing infoboxes, not presented in a standalone box. In the odd case that the names differ radically or have interesting histories (eg. Tekka Market), a full explanatory section is of course warranted.
Incidentally, I believe that the most government buildings in Singapore consistently display only the English name. This is certainly true for Changi, which I pass through about twice per week: there's one prominent quadrilingual sign on the expressway coming in, and a whole lot of "Welcome!" type signs in all four (plus Japanese, Arabic, etc), but the overwhelmingly most common name is just the English "Changi Airport". Cf. the official home page, which consistently uses this name and doesn't even have Malay or Tamil versions. Jpatokal 09:14, 24 November 2006 (UTC)

{{Singapore topics}}

Question - is it possible to make it collapsible? --ZhongHan (Email) 07:01, 5 December 2006 (UTC)

Can, but why? There's some template you have to use though. Terence Ong 07:59, 5 December 2006 (UTC)
Because, my dear friend, I feel it's <insert list of expletives here /> long and because many other navigational templates are. The closest is {{Navigation with image}}, but makes the text align centre instead of align left, and can get a little messy, to put it nicely. --ZhongHan (Email) 14:49, 5 December 2006 (UTC)

Four potential Singaporean GAs!

The following four Singapore-related articles are close to meeting the Good Article criteria.

  • Singapore general election, 2006: This article is rated A-Class, and therefore should meet the GA criteria. However, Terence Ong mentioned that the article needs copyediting.
  • Singapore 2006: This article is rated B-Class. It currently has 47 references. I do not see any reason why it does not meet the GA criteria.
  • I Not Stupid: I have been working on this article for several months. It is currently B-Class. Once the "Production" section is complete, it should meet the GA criteria.
  • Fann Wong: Ryan-D and Voda voda have been working on this article for several a few months. It is currently B-Class. Once the "Personal life" section is complete, it should meet the GA criteria.

On 16 December 2006, I will nominate all four articles, together with Daniel Brandt, for GA status. It usually takes about a week for an article to be reviewed. If minor changes or clarifications are needed, a reviewer may place the article on hold, giving you another 7 days to address their concerns.

I encourage all Singaporean Wikipedians to collaborate on these articles. We should address any issues that are raised, and improve the articles to ensure they meet the GA criteria. Having more Singapore-related articles achieving GA status means Wikipedia's coverage of Singapore has improved, and this helps to counter systemic bias.

Besides working on the production section of I Not Stupid, I will help copy-edit Singapore general election, 2006, and ensure NPOV and compelling prose in Fann Wong.

--J.L.W.S. The Special One 13:48, 7 December 2006 (UTC)

I have submitted my nominations of all five articles (including Daniel Brandt). You may wish to comment in I Not Stupid's ongoing peer review. --J.L.W.S. The Special One 14:51, 17 December 2006 (UTC)
Unfortunately, I Not Stupid's GA nomination failed, and Fann Wong was placed on hold. Money No Enough's DYK nomination was successful. I will do my best to address the concerns raised by the GA reviewer. --J.L.W.S. The Special One 15:40, 27 December 2006 (UTC)
Fann Wong passed. Congratulations, Ryan-D! --J.L.W.S. The Special One 08:59, 5 January 2007 (UTC)
Daniel Brandt failed (none of our business). Singapore general election, 2006 has been placed on hold. Please collaborate to address the issues raised, most notably several unreferenced paragraphs and information that may be out-of-date. Singapore 2006 has not been reviewed yet. Based on the ongoing discussion on I Not Stupid's talk page, I doubt it will be able to achieve GA status in the future. --J.L.W.S. The Special One 14:01, 17 January 2007 (UTC)
Singapore 2006 has been reviewed, but the outcome of the review is unclear. On the talk page, the template indicates that the nomination failed, but the heading indicates that the article has been placed on hold. --J.L.W.S. The Special One 14:51, 20 January 2007 (UTC)

Wikipedia:WikiProject Saivism

anyone want to help out?--D-Boy 10:25, 19 December 2006 (UTC)

Sorry this is the wrong place. We are supposed to discuss things related to Singapore or chat about anything fun. But this is the wrong place if you are asking for people to help out. Terence Ong 13:08, 19 December 2006 (UTC)

Can you add Einstein Kristiansen to the "Expand/Improve" category?

If this is in the wrong place, apologies in advance; I don't really "do" Wikiproject & I know next to nothing about Singapore, but I was doing grammar/style cleanup & came across the Einstein Kristiansen page. He's a Norwegian cartoonist, but, according to the limited amount of info on the bio, he mostly produces children's television broadcast in SE Asia, especially Singapore.

There's very little info on any of the shows, so I created null links on them. Anyone who's got a head full of Singaporean-children's-TV knowledge, head over there? I didn't know where else to put this.

Again, sorry if I'm in the wrong place. Back to my comma-placement corner! --Parcequilfaut 05:09, 21 December 2006 (UTC)

Floods in Malaysia, Singapore and Sumatra

Dear SGpedians,

In the coming weeks, several editors from WikiProject Meteorology and possibly some from Malaysia and Indonsia will be collaborating on a major article pertaining to the current December 2006 floods on the Malay Peninsula, including Singapore, and Sumatra. There are several issues which we must clear up before the creation of this article, including fixing the appropriate nomenclature and scope for the article. Please consider helping out in this collaboration. A sandbox and talkpage have been created. On a separate note, here's wishing all of you a merry Christmas. - SpLoT (*C*+u+g) 05:47, 24 December 2006 (UTC)

Afd for mrbrown

mrbrown is being AFD'ed. Do take a look at the discussion. --Rifleman 82 21:39, 25 December 2006 (UTC)

Bonny Hicks

I found the Bonny Hicks article on the Wikipedia:Articles_for_deletion/Bonny_Hicks, did a little research on it, and greatly expanded the article from a stub. One prominent journal source called her first book "a significant milestone in Singapore’s literary and cultural history". So much for the dismissive "not notable" votes on the AfD page!

At any rate, Talk:Bonny_Hicks still has a template saying that the article is Stub-Class and of Low-importance. Obviously, neither of these are the case at all. Does anyone know how to go about changing this? Would anyone be willing to please initiate a re-evaluation?

CyberAnth 09:09, 27 December 2006 (UTC)

Also, the article needs Categories, and I am just not knowledgeable enough about them all to know what to add. CyberAnth 09:43, 27 December 2006 (UTC)

Wikipedia Day Awards

Hello, all. It was initially my hope to try to have this done as part of Esperanza's proposal for an appreciation week to end on Wikipedia Day, January 15. However, several people have once again proposed the entirety of Esperanza for deletion, so that might not work. It was the intention of the Appreciation Week proposal to set aside a given time when the various individuals who have made significant, valuable contributions to the encyclopedia would be recognized and honored. I believe that, with some effort, this could still be done. My proposal is to, with luck, try to organize the various WikiProjects and other entities of wikipedia to take part in a larger celebrartion of its contributors to take place in January, probably beginning January 15, 2007. I have created yet another new subpage for myself (a weakness of mine, I'm afraid) at User talk:Badbilltucker/Appreciation Week where I would greatly appreciate any indications from the members of this project as to whether and how they might be willing and/or able to assist in recognizing the contributions of our editors. Thank you for your attention. Badbilltucker 20:44, 29 December 2006 (UTC)

When do we start nominating for the awards? I like the idea, an interesting one. Terence Ong 16:05, 1 January 2007 (UTC)

Singapore's National Poet

Someone hacked into my wikipedia user account in October, and put up Chandran Nair as Singapore's National Poet in List of national poets using my user account, ivygohnair. I only discovered that this list existed a few days ago on google! Chandran Nair is not Singapore's National Poet and I have rectified this.Ivygohnair 18:23, 4 January 2007 (UTC)

NEWater

I've cleaned up the copyvio in this article. All but the Process section. Maybe someone can help with that? --Rifleman 82 16:59, 7 January 2007 (UTC)

British East India Company

An article you created or improved has been selected for Featured Article Review. Please see the talk page and the nomination page for ways you can improve it. Jeffpw 09:50, 17 January 2007 (UTC)

It has really serious problems, I can't improve with that. I guess we have to let the article be de-featured. Terence Ong 10:01, 17 January 2007 (UTC)
An article with so many "neutrality disputed", etc. tags doesn't deserve Featured Article status. --J.L.W.S. The Special One 13:48, 17 January 2007 (UTC)

Amount of users!!!

It reached 100! Gratz SGpedians! btw is this nice?

-- {{User SGpedian}}


--GravityTalk 02:42, 21 January 2007 (UTC)

Work on ASEAN

As we should all know, the ASEAN summit has ended not too long ago. This gives us plenty of material to work on to expand the ASEAN article, especially given the fact that they are planning an ASEAN reform in time for the next summit. Ariedartin JECJY Talk 03:25, 21 January 2007 (UTC)

Feature for Digital Life!

Hi, everyone. I'm Daryl, a journalist from Digital Life, The Straits Times. We're looking to run a feature on online vigilantes and superheroes, the people who volunteer their precious time to keep the internet running. One of the sections will be on the folks who contribute to and maintain Wikipedia. As such, we're looking for someone (or many people) to interview and do a photoshoot with. Email and phone interviews are also possible. If you're interested please email me at darylcatlim@sph.com.sg (remove the cat) or leave a note here with instructions on how to contact you. The article is scheduled to run in a week, so replies before that time would be appreciated. Thanks. Gaieios 02:03, 22 January 2007 (UTC)

Its possible to contact me via email. Email me the details thanks. Terence Ong 10:00, 22 January 2007 (UTC)
  • It is possible to email me too. I just emailed you. Just need the details. Thanks.--Tdxiang 10:46, 22 January 2007 (UTC)
I'm interested in doing an email interview. Special:Emailuser/Chacor on-wiki. BTW, it's best not to post full emails, lest spam bots pick them up ;) – Chacor 10:50, 23 January 2007 (UTC)
Oh wait, I just saw "remove the cat". Heh. – Chacor 10:51, 23 January 2007 (UTC)
Contacted you. Or you could email me if you haven't received the email yet. =) Ariedartin JECJY Talk 12:42, 23 January 2007 (UTC)
Would rather not do a photoshoot, but as Chacor said, an email interview would be fine. Special:Emailuser/SpLoT. - SpLoT (*C*+u+g) 13:01, 23 January 2007 (UTC)
I've been interviewed by two magazines, and once appeared in a CNA programme. Therefore, while I prefer an interview by e-mail, I would not mind a face-to-face interview, on one condition: please don't ask for my real name, as I keep my online and offline identities seperate (if the interview was about my chess-playing, I wouldn't mind revealing my real name). To conduct an e-mail interview, or make arrangements for a face-to-face interview, please e-mail me at hildanknight(AT)gmail(DOT)com.
Some background information on me: I'm a 15-year-old boy who loves computers, writing and chess. In addition, I'm a huge fan of Jack Neo movies and Chelsea F.C. I joined Wikipedia in February 2006, and enjoy writing articles and participating in discussions. I am the primary contributor to the following articles: Google Groups, AdventureQuest, Money No Enough, Homerun (film), and my best work - I Not Stupid. While contributing to Wikipedia can be fun, it can also be very stressful, and should you interview me, I will be happy to discuss both the positive and negative aspects of Wikipedia. --J.L.W.S. The Special One 13:38, 23 January 2007 (UTC)

Latest update - Hi, everyone, Daryl again. Thanks for the overwhelming response! I haven't been able to reply to all of you who've emailed me yet - the sheer number means we can't interview everyone for this article, but thanks go to those who offered anyway. I met four of you yesterday for a face-to-face interview. As such I'd like to close this request for interviewees. Thanks again for all your time, and look out for the article in next week's Digital Life. Of course, if we do another article or feature on Wikipedia again in the future, I'll be sure to get back to you guys. Many thanks! Gaieios 01:24, 25 January 2007 (UTC)


Please help to verify these articles

Could someone help to verify these related articles: Seow Poh Leng, Seow Sieu Jin, Tan Kim Ching, Ho Hong Bank? These came into my radar screen, but I'm unable to verify the content from online resource. --Vsion 05:59, 23 January 2007 (UTC)

Most were written by User:Jefferyyseow. The lack of verifiable references and the note at the bottom "researched by Jeffery Seow" suggests it's WP:OR at the very least, and dangerously close to WP:Vanity. The people involved do seem notable but I feel strongly that they should all be attributed properly, and written in a more NPOV. --Rifleman 82 08:59, 23 January 2007 (UTC)
These are indeed valid issues. We also need to determine if this is a hoax, or copyright violation. Does anyone has access to any of these two sources?
  • ONE HUNDRED YEARS' HISTORY OF THE CHINESE IN SINGAPORE' by Song Ong Siang
  • "SEOW SIEU JIN - A SECOND GENERATION BANKER" by Chen Wei Long, "Sin Chew Jit Poh" 26th July 1971
Maybe those folks wanting to be interviewed by ST can ask the journalist to access news archive to check it out. Also ask him why (the hell) SPH is still holding on to the copyrights of all the historic photographs of Singapore, and when they are going to release them to public domain. --Vsion 06:03, 24 January 2007 (UTC)

Seeking interview subjects about online knowledge sharing

Hi,

Im Junde and i seek interview subjects amongst the SGpedians community. I am a final year student from NUS working on a thesis about incentive mechanisms for online knowledge sharing communities in Singapore. I would like to conduct face-to-face interviews if possible, i will meet you at your convenience. If not, phone or email interviews would also do. There is no renumeration for this survey.

I will be asking questions on what does and does not motivate you to contribute to wikipedia and related websites.

You can contact me at junde2 [AT] gmail [DOT] com (preferred) or junde [AT] nus [DOT] edu [DOT] sg (if you dont trust gmail)

Thanks very much, Junde—The preceding unsigned comment was added by Junde (talk • contribs) 07:58, 30 January 2007 (UTC)

SG project assessment

A list of sg-articles that have not been assessed can be found in User:Vsion/temp3. If interested please help to add the sg-template (Template:SG) to the talk pages and rate the importance and status of these article. Information on how to apply the template is given in Template:SG. Thanks. --Vsion 04:25, 3 February 2007 (UTC)

Wow, what a huge backlog. Didn't know there was so many SG articles not assessed. I think there's even more but not classified under Singapore-related categories. Will do it asap. Terence Ong 04:41, 3 February 2007 (UTC)
Thanks! Hope more people could help out, my fingers cramped after clearing a few dozens. There are certainly more articles out there, although I don't think there're many; maybe around 50 or so. This is because as we update the "it's new" section at the noticeboard, I notice that most articles are found within 2 months of creation. Great categorization effort going on at Category:Category needed.
Btw, while we are approaching the 3,000 sg-articles milestone soon, the articles' ratings are quite dismal. We should identify more articles to push for promotion to GA. --Vsion 07:24, 3 February 2007 (UTC)
Instead of like, say, creating 3,000 articles where 2,500 are stubs, we should be improving the 'Class A'-assessed 500 articles. The 2,500 stubs, many on roads, buildings etc, could hardly go GA. The remaining 500 has no references, no sources quoted, not copyedited generally etc. The more we stretch the materials, the thinner sg-articles appear. All quantity, no quality. Mandel 12:47, 6 February 2007 (UTC)
I'm glad to help out. - SpLoT // 08:05, 3 February 2007 (UTC)

I'd like to be part of this project. May I have some guidelines? Being a member of SGpedians can I help by assessing some of your huge backlog straightaway to help lighten your load and also to help get more people to come to the SGpedians Noticeboard and become members. Thanks. Would appreciate your prompt replyIvygohnair 12:41, 23 March 2007 (UTC)

May I still know whether as a member of SGpedians, I can put any article I find in WP which is related to Singapore under SGpedian Wiki project and and rate it, using the template provided?Ivygohnair 15:41, 23 March 2007 (UTC)

Backlog has been cleared. Please see Wikipedia:SGpedians' notice board/Article Assessment. - SpLoT // 14:07, 23 March 2007 (UTC)
Sadly, we can't get a bot to help us )= - SpLoT // 08:06, 3 February 2007 (UTC)
Hi, Ivygohnair, what about having a look at the table at the top of the "SGpedians' notice board" and seeing which new articles you can help to create, or existing articles you can expand or improve on? Since you're a writer, "Literature of Singapore" might interest you. Many of the articles on Singapore writers and poets are also stubs. Cheers, Jacklee 15:39, 23 March 2007 (UTC)

Thanks Jack Lee. I would like a reply to my last query. Like to know more about the actual rating process that is practised here before I start.Ivygohnair 15:43, 23 March 2007 (UTC)

SG Infopedia

There is a lot of overlap in terms of articles at SG Infopedia as well as detail of coverage. How does one go about using or citing it?

For example, a wiki article on Howe Yoon Chong(former MP of Potong Pasir) has yet to be created. But SGInfopedia has possibly the most accurate and certainly the most comprehensive writeup done. Any wiki article would effectively be a a re-write of the same information.

http://infopedia.nlb.gov.sg/articles/SIP_652_2005-01-11.html

Koxinga CDF 03:24, 4 February 2007 (UTC)

Interesting. Those articles are quite well sourced. Not sure how to use them, have to be careful not to violate copyright. As a start, I will generate a list of missing articles. --Vsion 04:18, 4 February 2007 (UTC)
See Wikipedia:SGpedians' notice board/Infopedia articles for the list of infopedia articles. -Vsion 04:52, 4 February 2007 (UTC)
I noticed that many of the articles on the list exist, but are under different names (some by NLB are pretty weird IMO, like the Woodlands MRT line). - Mailer Diablo 05:12, 10 February 2007 (UTC)

Improving articles

I'd like to say that there should be an improvement drive going on. Instead of creating 3 or 4 stubs a day, we should likely improve, edit or read up on the relevant subjects. Reading some of these articles reminds one of watching One Leg Kicking. A lot of links are there because its Singapore-related, not because the article writer has anything encyclopedic to say. mandel 23:13, 5 February 2007 (UTC)

moved to talk page.Vsion 02:10, 6 February 2007 (UTC)
I'd like to second what Mandel has said. My impression is that many editors are creating Singapore-related articles – which is a great thing – but leaving most of them as stubs rather than making the effort to try and expand them into full encyclopedic articles. I'd like to encourage all editors interested in Singapore-related topics to do so. Cheers, Jacklee 20:14, 18 April 2007 (UTC)

New template: {{Singapore Statute}}

Share with all a new template: {{Singapore Statute}}. This is an automatic external link to the statute at the Attorney-General's website. It's modeled after {{US patent}}. I'll do the documentation when I have a bit of time.

There is probably a list of Singapore-templates. If someone knows where that is, please let me know here, and/or add this template to that list. --Rifleman 82 07:49, 8 February 2007 (UTC)

Added it to the "Templates to use" section in the article. Cheers, Jacklee 19:32, 20 March 2007 (UTC)

Singapore_Airlines_Flight_117

Copyvio at this page. Perhaps someone can help rewrite and reference properly? --Rifleman 82 05:51, 10 February 2007 (UTC)

Wikipedia:Meetup/Singapore 1 does not redirect properly

I notice that when loading Wikipedia:Meetup/Singapore 1, I generally get an error message, instead of being redirected to Wikipedia:SGpedians' notice board/Meetup. Does anyone else have the same problem? --ZhongHan (Email) 02:59, 12 February 2007 (UTC)

It seems to be working fine now. --ZhongHan (Email) 04:59, 17 February 2007 (UTC)

Asian Communication Resource Centre

I was wondering what you guys think if I nominated Asian Communication Resource Centre for deletion merge. It's basically just one library out of the several Nanyang Technological University Libraries . I'm not sure how notable it is as a source of Asian material, though I use it everyday. :) If there is no objection..... Aarontay 08:13, 13 February 2007 (UTC)

Nominate it by all means. - SpLoT // 08:20, 13 February 2007 (UTC)
Okay done. I have proposed merging it into Nanyang Technological University Libraries would be better since it is already part of the article. Aarontay 08:36, 13 February 2007 (UTC)

Common Indian Surnames in Singapore?

I don't think this deserves an article. {Slash-|-Talk} 04:24, 19 February 2007 (UTC)

Article listed for deletion

List of common Chinese surnames in Singapore has been listed for deletion. If you're interested, please comment on its AfD - Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/List of common Chinese surnames in Singapore. Hong Qi Gong (Talk - Contribs) 07:24, 19 February 2007 (UTC)

Meetup on 10 March

There will be a meetup on 10 March 2007 at Chaerani's house. It will be a full day event, though you can join and leave in the afternoon or evening. Do confirm your attendance by 3 March 2007 as we need to estimate how many participants will there be. Terence Ong 恭喜发财 11:29, 21 February 2007 (UTC)


Singapore Meetup

Meetup 5
  • Status: Currently being planned
  • Date: 2008

Please indicate your interest at the meetup page.
v • d •  e

Survey respondents for a very short survey

Hi,

http://www.surveymonkey.com/s.asp?u=885123332326

Im Junde and i seek survey respondents amongst the SGpedians community. I am a final year student from NUS working on a thesis about incentive mechanisms for online knowledge sharing communities in Singapore. This is a very short single-page survey and i hope you can pass the message around.

You can contact me at junde2 [AT] gmail [DOT] com (preferred) or junde [AT] nus [DOT] edu [DOT] sg (if you dont trust gmail)

Thanks very much for your help. Junde

Jurong Point speedied

For info, Jurong Point was speedy deleted about a month ago, I just realized it. I have sent a note to the Admin who did it, requesting explanation. --Vsion 04:39, 15 March 2007 (UTC)

Wasent there an AFD on this topic before, which resulted in its deletion? Think it is speedied now coz it was recreated.--Huaiwei 15:16, 21 March 2007 (UTC)

Please comment at my editor review.

Greetings, fellow SGpedians. After a month-long hiatus, I am gradually returning to regular editing. However, I believe I still need to learn how to handle conflicts better and not let the verifiability policy hinder my ability to write. Please help me in that aspect by commenting at my editor review. Thanks. --J.L.W.S. The Special One 09:31, 16 March 2007 (UTC)

Remarkably well written especially for one so young! But do remember that while encyclopedias bring you knowledge, books bring you the wisdom that should go with knowledge. Shut down your computer young man, and get thee to a library.Ivygohnair 13:41, 22 March 2007 (UTC)

Narration?

There is a heading in the article for "Narration requests". What is narration? Cheers, Jacklee 19:42, 20 March 2007 (UTC)

Narration means reading out loud, recording that, and uploading it for everyone to hear it in orthodox Singrish. -- 我♥中國 18:53, 22 March 2007 (UTC)
EDIT: :) -- 我♥中國 18:55, 22 March 2007 (UTC)

Ah, so! Cheers, Jacklee 03:25, 23 March 2007 (UTC)

Save the "Singapore law stub"!

Hi, fellow SGpedians. I created a new Singapore-related stub yesterday, called {{Singapore-law-stub}}, not realizing that there was actually a procedure for nominating the creation of new stub categories. (Oops, mea culpa.) Anyway, someone has nominated this new stub for deletion. I have entered a "keep" request with justifications. If you would like to support this stub, please enter your comments at "Stub types for deletion". Cheers, Jacklee 12:28, 21 March 2007 (UTC)

The number of articles seems rather limited now, hence their primary contention to remove it other than it not following "procedures" (darn the red tape! :D). Do you have intentions to greatly expand on this topic anytime soon?--Huaiwei 04:51, 24 March 2007 (UTC)
I did the same thing once and the stub-category I created got deleted. I think it is alright, there are good reasons not to have too many stub-categories, which primarily purpose is for monitoring. More people will monitor cat:singapore-stub than cat:singapore-law-stub. I believe you can still keep the template, but it will be recategorize to Cat:Singapore stubs and Cat:Law stubs instead. Thus, you can still get a listing of articles by using the "What links here" function [16]. --Vsion 13:37, 27 March 2007 (UTC)
Agreed. Since there are not much law articles regarding Singapore here, there's no need for a particular stub type. Having two stub types will have more articles linked since people will watch these pages more. Its okay to let it be deleted. Terence 13:45, 27 March 2007 (UTC)

Hello

I have just signed up to the SGpedian community. I am sixty years old and live in France but I return to Singapore at least twice a year for at least a month each time. I would like to get to know fellow SGpedians in WP, so I have made a proposal for the next Meetup to be at my place. Please see the Meetup section. Looking forward to seeing you on 1st July. Ivygohnair 07:49, 22 March 2007 (UTC)

May I have an answer please?

Refering to Vsion's post on SG project assessment above:

A list of sg-articles that have not been assessed can be found in User:Vsion/temp3. If interested please help to add the sg-template (Template:SG) to the talk pages and rate the importance and status of these article. Information on how to apply the template is given in Template:SG. Thanks. --Vsion 04:25, 3 February 2007 (UTC)

I would gather that up to now any single person can rate any article on WP that they decide to bring under the Sg Wiki project any way they like as long as they use the SG template given above. A single SGpedian, like user SPlot, can in half an hour rate all the numerous remaining unassessed articles that were there a couple hours ago, all by himself and the onus was on him alone to decide the quality of each article.

Please confirm that this is correct.Ivygohnair 22:06, 23 March 2007 (UTC)

Yes, I believe that's the case, since anyone is entitled to edit Wikipedia. It's also open to people to reassess and re-rate articles that have already been rated – and in fact, this should probably be done regularly. Cheers, Jacklee 00:57, 24 March 2007

(UTC)

Thanks for your prompt reply, Jack Lee. I propose that we should review this practice. As it stands, it leaves the door open to hastily rated articles by individuals (who might not even bother to comment on the reasons for their ratings even though this is asked for in the SG template itself). An editor who has spent considerable effort creating an article should surely have the right to know why his or her article is rated poorly. We also have to be extra sensitive about biographies of living persons for real people's reputations are at stake here. The fact that any other individual can use the same template and re-rate articles seems a little bit crazy, like the law of the jungle, and would lead to edit wars and possible 3R violations. Also what happens if an article is also international in scope? Does the creator have the right to ask it not to be under the umbrella of the SG Wiki Project?

Singapore is a small country which has distinguished itself internationally by its many outstanding achievements. SGpedians should be careful not to tarnish her reputation by continuing this unfair and unreasonable practice in an open and international forum such as WP.Ivygohnair 02:55, 24 March 2007 (UTC)

Let's try first to resolve this matter among ourselves, without anyone having to appeal for outside arbitration.Ivygohnair 03:09, 24 March 2007 (UTC)

I can tell you this much, the ArbCom would not accept a request because there is no dispute to arbitrate (yet). They'd probably end up admonishing whoever brought the case for wasting their time. See WP:DR for full steps if you truly believe there is a dispute. Cheers. – Chacor 03:19, 24 March 2007 (UTC)
As for "Also what happens if an article is also international in scope? Does the creator have the right to ask it not to be under the umbrella of the SG Wiki Project?", the answer is a resounding NO. See WP:OWN. No-one owns any article. "Creators" don't get extra input. If it is international in scope it will then fall under more than one project, but the Singapore project is more than free to tag it if it's related to Singapore. Cheers. – Chacor 03:22, 24 March 2007 (UTC)
Ivygohnair, I'm not sure what you're proposing is feasible. Even if your preferred policy were implemented, people who elected not to comply with it would be quite free to re-rate an article (and, indeed, to amend it) if they disagreed with the "official" rating. It seems to me that this is the essence of Wikipedia: an article evolves through the inputs of a number of editors and, perhaps after a while, stabilizes when consensus is more or less is reached as to its content. Order is not imposed from top down, and creators of articles are not specially privileged in any way. In fact, at the bottom of every editing page is the following statement: "If you don't want your writing to be edited mercilessly or redistributed by others, do not submit it." Cheers, Jacklee 03:49, 24 March 2007 (UTC)

Thank you Jack Lee again for your prompt reply. It is a good that we can all air our views calmly even if we do not always agree.Ivygohnair 04:44, 24 March 2007 (UTC)


I left a note on her user talk page. --Coredesat 04:00, 24 March 2007 (UTC)

Great thanks to SpLoT and Terence for helping to clear the backlog! And kudos to Mailer and others who started the process. Now we have a fairly good picture of where we are, in terms of article scope and quality: Wikipedia:SGpedians' notice board/Article Assessment. --Vsion 13:48, 27 March 2007 (UTC)

Raising some Points

I was just raising some points I was concerned about here in this forum. Is it necessary to set an admin on me for that? What happen to the spirit of free debate and discussion that WP is supposed to incarnate?Ivygohnair 04:59, 24 March 2007 (UTC)

No one "set an admin" on you. Please don't make unsubstantiated accusations, which is in violation of WP:CIV and a failure to assume good faith. – Chacor 05:01, 24 March 2007 (UTC)

Coredesat left a note here that he had left a note in my USER:talk page. The last time he admolished me on "mass postings" it was on the request of SGpedians. My apologies if this is not the case. CheersIvygohnair 05:14, 24 March 2007 (UTC)

Just a thought, but if he's talked to you before about this "on the request of SGpedians", it's possible he has this page watched and saw the discussion, and hence decided to remind you. – Chacor 05:17, 24 March 2007 (UTC)
Beware of baseless claims. - SpLoT // 08:50, 24 March 2007 (UTC)
  • Sorry to hear what has happened, perhaps this is just some misunderstanding. Several pages, including this one, are watched by several non-SGpedian editors, including admins. If you need any help, drop a note on my talkpage. - Best regards, Mailer Diablo 11:54, 24 March 2007 (UTC)

The Best Bet

Fellow SGpedians, I have written an article on The Best Bet and nominated it for DYK. Please help me improve the article, and respond to the request for feedback I filed on the article. --J.L.W.S. The Special One 03:18, 4 April 2007 (UTC)

The DYK nomination was successful! My next goal: I Not Stupid for GA status, and another DYK. --J.L.W.S. The Special One 15:11, 5 April 2007 (UTC)

I have filed a peer review for I Not Stupid.

Please leave comments at the peer review to help me improve the article to GA status. --J.L.W.S. The Special One 16:14, 5 April 2007 (UTC)

Military History task force

A Southeast Asian task force within the Military History WikiProject has finally been created. If there is anyone here who is interested in the subject - stretching from the origins of civilisation up through today - I invite you to please come and lend your support, questions or comments, here. No serious responsibilities or obligations connected to signing up, only another way to meet one another, to work together to expand and improve Wikipedia's coverage of these subjects. Thank you. LordAmeth 06:15, 8 April 2007 (UTC)

Bilateral relations discussion

I would like to invite you all to participate in a discussion at this thread regarding bilateral relations between two countries. All articles related to foreign relations between countries are now under the scope of WikiProject Foreign relations, a newly created project. We hope that the discussion will result in a more clean and organized way of explaining such relationships. Thank you. Ed ¿Cómo estás? 18:12, 8 April 2007 (UTC)

USP

Please see Wikipedia:NUS Scholars Programme and its talk page. Someone please take them in hand! -- RHaworth 16:57, 19 April 2007 (UTC)

The topics were very poorly selected. How did you get this list? Could you provide some background and the point of contact? Thanks. --Vsion 05:16, 20 April 2007 (UTC)

The list was included in several of their articles - eg. this. The caption to the first, deleted image in this gave their supervisor's name and I have linked to his web page in Wikipedia:NUS Scholars Programme. Ask Quek Ser Hwee for the background! I have already emailed him requesting hime to read the Wikipedia: project page. -- RHaworth 06:59, 20 April 2007 (UTC)

Should we add a disambiguation link at WP:SG?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/WP:SG!

If you click on the above link, which was intended to point to the SGpedians' noticeboard, you will go to the Manual of Style, because the parser does not consider the exclamation mark to be part of the URL. During MSN Messenger conversations with Wikifriends, I have encountered this problem several times. URL parsers aside, even experienced Wikipedians are likely to confuse WP:SG! with WP:SG, or forget the exclamation mark when typing in the URL.

Hence, I propose that WP:SG should have a disambiguation link to WP:SG!, and vice versa. Besides pointing confused Wikipedians in the right direction, a disambiguation link from such a popular project page would give our noticeboard more exposure.

--J.L.W.S. The Special One 13:43, 25 April 2007 (UTC)

Good idea, but we do have two new shortcuts at WP:SGN and WP:SGNB. Nonetheless, go ahead. - SpLoT // 14:01, 25 April 2007 (UTC)
You might also simply change WP:SG to point over here instead. (That’s allowed, isn’t it?) There are only a dozen legitimate references to WP:SG for the Manual of Style, mostly users’ talk pages, and most of them were added by the same user. Why clutter things up to disambiguate a link that’s hardly ever used? --Rob Kennedy 06:10, 30 April 2007 (UTC)

Categories and NA

Hi I have dabbled a bit in the Indonesian and Australian projects with the tagging of articles - and got into WP xxx class=NA tags on the talk pages of Categories - as a means of pulling in rogue categories, unpopulated ones, and generally creating Non-article XXXX page categories - it seems to help to get a sense of order. Is there anyone in the Singapore project who might see benefit of this for the singapore project? Just an idea - interested if anyone has any ideas on this for your project - cheers SatuSuro 13:07, 26 April 2007 (UTC)

Not quite sure what you're talking about here. Are you referring to the non-existence of a category for pages which are tagged NA class by {{SG}}? - SpLoT // 13:15, 26 April 2007 (UTC)
It can mean two - things. 1. All categories in most projects are not tagged - but in the ones I have mentioned above - Category talk:Australian sports articles by importance a recent edit - the category page is clearly identified as a non article page and is tied to the major project, and a sub project. 2. The NA class category can self ref (I havent been told otherwise so far) - I hope that explains clearly enough SatuSuro 14:51, 27 April 2007 (UTC)
Ugh, I'm really sorry, but I don't understand what you're referring to. I know you're talking about NA-class articles and their categories. Would you like to see a category of NA-class SG articles? - SpLoT // 05:12, 28 April 2007 (UTC)
No need to apologise - it can be of a small benefit for a project to have all its categories effectively listed on a Non-article category page (from being tagged) - it is a tidy record of what categories have been caught by the process - I am more interested in the either approval or understanding of s SG project person who might either see some benefit by doing such a level of tagging - if there is no interest - no bother - I still have heaps to for the Indonesian and Australian projects - but if you were interested - its worth a start! SatuSuro 05:16, 28 April 2007 (UTC)
Oh, go ahead then! =) I'm pretty clueless about how to add such a category, but if you can, please do! - SpLoT // 05:24, 28 April 2007 (UTC)

Consensus?

For Singapore Changi Airport, a user keeps removing "Taiwan" from one of the names of it's international airports. And he said "the majority of singaporeans editors have agreed upon this and if you are unhappy about it...it is just too bad". I want to clarify, is there a consensus at all in the first place? - 218.186.9.4 14:40, 27 April 2007 (UTC)

That article has experienced more than its fair share of heated debate. I would suggest that you raise that on the article talkpage, or contact the individual in question. However, in my knowledge, there has been no such agreement. But do check with other frequent editors of that article. Thanks for your concern. - SpLoT // 05:10, 28 April 2007 (UTC)

The reason why I sought clarification is because of that user's attitude. That user thinks that what he does is always right, and everyone else is wrong. And because of that he can do whatever he wants. That is just so wrong and rude of him. He acts like he owns the place and any views contrary to his is not allowed. If he just stopped his incessant barking and discuss with me about it I would be more than happy to listen to him. - 218.186.9.4 05:22, 29 April 2007 (UTC)

Whatever the situation is, the best thing to do is to keep your cool and be polite. Assume good faith and remain civil, never ever make personal attacks against any user. Just discuss with that person on the talk page. Terence 06:14, 29 April 2007 (UTC)
Perhaps, but it will be far more constructive to gain some kind of concensus in the talkpage of the Taiwanese airport (and not in the Changi article's talkpage) first, for in every content dispute, both users could very well think the other user as having a "Bad attitude". Meanwhile, you may wish to consider registering an account with us. :D--Huaiwei 06:16, 29 April 2007 (UTC)

I don't see why people can't discuss it on the talk page of Singapore Changi Airport. The issue in question concerns the airport, in particular a destination airport that an airline flies to from Changi. Another matter is, saying to someone that it's just too bad when someone disagrees with him and telling that someone to distance himself from the article isn't very friendly behaviour either. I have never considered registering an account in the first place. - 218.186.9.4 12:37, 29 April 2007 (UTC)

The naming of the airport affects all airport pages which has a connecting air service with it. Any changes in one page will obviously need to reflect changes in the other pages as well. There is already an on-going discussion on this matter at the talkpage of the Taiwanese airport, and should you insist on having a dictinct discussion at the Singapore airport's talkpage, you are simply fragmenting the discussion and will be counter-productive because whatever comes out of it is unlikely to overule decisions made in the Taiwanese airport's talkpage.--Huaiwei 13:25, 29 April 2007 (UTC)

The reasons why things like this happen is because the discussion is too centralised in one location. - 218.186.9.4 13:58, 29 April 2007 (UTC)

That is a rather odd presumption, and is also at odds with Wikipedia's concensus policy. Could you provide the diffs to explain your reasoning?--Huaiwei 14:17, 29 April 2007 (UTC)

New users would not know that a discussion has taken place somewhere else on the issue at hand. Having a link to the issue being discussed at the "others" talk page will minimise confusions from arising. - 218.186.9.4 14:31, 29 April 2007 (UTC)

Then all you need to do, is to remove the said edit by the new user and provide a link to the discussion page in the edit summary in the bare minimum. This is not a good reason to fragment the discussion, for how in the world do you expect to come up with a single concensus if people are talking independently from each other in multiple places?--Huaiwei 14:44, 29 April 2007 (UTC)

That would be easy if everyone cooperates. Sadly it doesn't happen in reality. Some people's views will always come first. - 218.186.9.4 16:15, 1 May 2007 (UTC)

We make do with whatever is available to us, but this dosent mean proposing a counter-productive means of doing things. We arent multiplying negatives here in the hope of getting something positive. ;)--Huaiwei 15:22, 2 May 2007 (UTC)

Yeah, Wikipedia isn't perfect. - 218.186.9.4 07:21, 3 May 2007 (UTC)

Eliyathamby - Just Curious

The article Eliyathamby makes many boastful claims without any reference or verification.

Was he really ever in the Forbes List? Was his net worth about $9B (Singapore or US dollar)?. The rest of the articles also seem very poor quality. Can someone clarify and if the facts are true reference it to make it more professional. Without references or links it is useless. Another thing is there are no dates or names properly. The whole article seems like a school boy boast.

Busterbenbusterben

I tagged Eliyathamby as suspected hoax. Let's see what happen. If we still can't verify the information within the next few days, the article should be listed at Afd. --Vsion 17:19, 30 April 2007 (UTC)
For a person who is supposed to be a pioneer of Singapore, there certainly seems to be dearth of verifiable information on him. I ran all the books listed in the "References" section through the on-line catalogues of the National University of Singapore Libraries and the National Library of Singapore. The only one which popped up was the first one. I also did a "Find" on the web page containing the Genealogy of the Royal Family of Jaffna listed in the "External links" section, and "Eliyathamby" did not appear anywhere on it. Hmmm... (I've put a copy of this message at "Talk:Eliyathamby".) Cheers, Jacklee 23:34, 30 April 2007 (UTC)

Angsoontong

Please also take a look at Angsoontong. Despite the murder case, how much is known about this gang? Is the article, in its current state, worth keeping?--Vsion 03:49, 1 May 2007 (UTC)

Not really, imo. It's cluttered with original research. The one source only references that Tan Chor Jin incident. - SpLoT // 07:26, 1 May 2007 (UTC)

References for Eliyathamby and Other issues

Its been a few weeks/months since the issue of verification/references cropped up for the page Eliyathamby. In the absence of any references or proofs, it is not wikipedia material. What is equally disturbing is in the page of two other billionaires, Ng Teng Fong and T. Ananda Krishan, Elyathamby's name comes up with no reason. Factual accuracy and relevance are issues in those pages. Is he the real brother of TAK? If not is it relevant to have his name in that page? I believe the families come from different villages in Jaffna so it is unlikely they are brothers.

Did NTF become a billionaire because of Eliyatamby? If so please quote with reference for the relevance.

I have been unable to locate the Forbes edition which valued ET's wealth at $9.6B yet.

Either references or the relevance of it must be shown. Otherwise it is safe to assume, people are acting together with the intention of "creating" a profile. I hope Admins look into this seriously and the SGPedians pay attention to ensure that all articles related to Singapore maintain the necessary standards. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by Busterben (talk • contribs) 19:47, 4 May 2007 (UTC).

The article is now nominated for deletion: Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Eliyathamby. Thanks for alerting us on this matter. --Vsion 05:31, 11 May 2007 (UTC)

Merge

The Singapore Grand Prix and Singapore Street Circuit articles are very similar to each other. They should be merged. - 218.186.9.1 13:14, 11 May 2007 (UTC)

Please confine the discussion to Talk:Singapore Grand Prix. Thanks!--Huaiwei 13:28, 11 May 2007 (UTC)