User talk:SatyrTN/Archive 13

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This is an archive of past discussions. Do not edit the contents of this page. If you wish to start a new discussion or revive an old one, please do so on the current talk page.

Contents 1 Proposed deletion for article 2 LGBT Categories 3 Gay Pride series? 4 Lories and lorikeets 5 Sean Gallagher 6 Exley 7 Wine 8 regarding this change 9 Administrators' noticeboard 10 Intereffectuality 11 Image:LAplateSonsOfConfederate.jpg 12 Noel Pemberton Billing 13 A user has asked me for a bit of help 14 Admin help 15 SatyrBot 16 Bot Errors 17 Question 18 Favor 19 Monir Amerkhous 20 Why was the article on Contract Freighters Inc (CFI) deleted? 21 KARE 22 AfD for GSBA 23 The Edge of Heaven 24 Deputy Coordinator 25 SatyrBot question 26 Bot help 26.1 Fine tuning 27 Year 28 Note 29 Sources 30 Question 31 Um 32 my RFA 33 Musical groups 34 WP:LOTD 35 If no confirmation in print, then what? 36 Happy Easter 37 DRV request 38 Satyr picture 39 Happy Easter 40 Greetings from the Opera Project again 41 what up homegirl 42 Fair use rationale for Image:AND1 logo.png 43 Converting images to PNG 44 Banner Shell 45 TrashMail 46 Re: Gucci Gang controversy 47 Case law 48 Screenshot G7s 49 Sera monastery 50 Ummm... 51 Colorado Library Consortium 52 Thanks 53 re:Re: WikiProjectBannerShell 54 Images 55 Bochica 55.1 Bite the newbies and get rewarded with an adminship 56 Inclusionist? 57 Carolena Nericcio article 58 Speaking of user pages... 59 Commendation 60 ITU-T etc.

Proposed deletion for article

Hi, concerning the article List of Diversity Organizations in Utah, is it the topic that is not good or the fact of the many external links? In this last case, it can be fixed by eliminating the "linkfarm" and put the links in the "notes" section. Please let me know.

Concerning the topic itself: I think that there are already similar lists in wikipedia:

• List of disability organisations in Singapore
• List of ethnic interest groups in Canada
• List of youth organisations in Singapore

And more. I think that it would be fair to propose for delition also the similar ones, unless it is a problem of the links to external sources. Adrian Comollo (talk) 15:26, 15 March 2008 (UTC)

Hi, Adrian! In my opinion, the Utah list and the two Singapore lists fail WP:LINKFARM entirely. I don't think putting the links in the "notes" section would work because then we'd have an article with three lines and a WP:LINKFARM.

The reason the Canada list above seems different is because each item on it has it's own Wikipedia entry. If the Utah list were changed to that model, I'd be all for it. -- SatyrTN (talk / contribs) 17:46, 15 March 2008 (UTC)

LGBT Categories

Hey. You posted on my talkpage a couple weeks ago. I replied at the time but you obviously haven't seen it. Take a look and let me know your thoughts... -- Lincolnite (talk) 18:15, 15 March 2008 (UTC)

Gay Pride series?

Hi, there is an (old?) tag on Talk:Stonewall riots which I think should simply be removed but I wanted to check and see if I'm missing something. Hope you're well! Benjiboi 00:49, 16 March 2008 (UTC)

I bet that should go. Does that predate the LGBTProject? Aleta ^Sing 00:59, 16 March 2008 (UTC)

Yes, that's an old old tag. Must be over 2 years old by now =D I've deleted them where I found them - feel free to do the same :) I'm doing well - trying to debate lesbianism with another editor over a woman I've never heard of - Katharine Lee Bates. But I'm learning oh so much! =D

Lol! Little known but everything cool was done by butch dykes long before gay men ever fabbed them up. Not sure if there's a source for it though. Benjiboi 02:21, 16 March 2008 (UTC)

Lories and lorikeets

I think there was a consensus in favour of moving it away from Lorries and lorikeets (for naming convention reasons) and a mild preference for Loriinae. But that may just me. Sabine's Sunbird talk 04:53, 16 March 2008 (UTC)

I honestly couldn't tell. You and Snowman seemed to come to agreement, and much later MeegsC chimed in. But since it generated such a discussion between you two, and (as you said) it would be best to have a consensus of more than two, I felt it likewise best if you had a consensus of more than three. Reopen the discussion? Get input from a few more people, maybe from WP:BIRDS? -- SatyrTN (talk / contribs) 04:58, 16 March 2008 (UTC)

Sean Gallagher

No, I don't have that issue, but my flatmate might, so I'll check. — OwenBlacker (Talk) 21:53, 13 March 2008 (UTC) PS: Please reply on my Talk: page, or I'll not notice it  ;o)

Sorry, not been able to find a copy here — neither my flatmate nor I have it and none of my mates has got back to us (we read AXM more often than Attitude these days). Feel free to remove the comments ro to label them with {{fact}}, I guess… — OwenBlacker (Talk) 08:07, 17 March 2008 (UTC)

Exley

Hi. Please forgive me for temporarily editing this area, btu I could not find any other way to contact you. I noticed in a bulletin (found here: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia_talk:WikiProject_LGBT_studies/Archive_9 ) that you mentioned possible upcoming wiki projects on a number of people, one including Adrian Exley. Adrian was my Big Brother, and i also run The Adrian Exley Foundation, after setting it up in His name last year. If you wish to contact me to discuss further info etc if and when you decided to create a page on Adrian, I would be happy to hear from you and help/contribute in any way i can. my email is: bananacologne AT gmail DOT com regards, fang —Preceding unsigned comment added by 90.195.236.133 (talk) 02:16, 14 March 2008 (UTC)

Wine

OK - there's been no complaints, so I think you can make a regular thing of the Wine to-do list on Mondays and Thursdays - I'll do something pretty with the output when I've a moment. Could you do a trial run of the tag-adding bot, produce a list of the articles that would be tagged? The category list seems stable and wholly-owned, but it would be nice to eyeball the article list before it goes ahead and does anything major. Italy can wait another week or two, the assessment of what is already there has turned into a major sort out of 8000-odd town articles. :-(( FlagSteward (talk) 13:04, 15 March 2008 (UTC)

Hi, FlagSteward! I've done a quick run with the bot to find articles that aren't currently tagged. The list the bot came up with is only 465 long, so that's not bad at all. I've put it at WP:Sandbox/Wine.

I'll set the bot to run the to-do lists on Mondays and Thursdays.

Thanks! -- SatyrTN (talk / contribs) 21:31, 15 March 2008 (UTC)

That's great, thanks. Although it does look like we're a way away from letting the add-to-Project bot loose on that list, there's a lot of articles put in the wrong categories there. I suspect that we'll have to junk the wine regions cats as they don't get used reliably in the real world - and we need to go through a lot of the other articles to sort the wheat from the chaff. So I think it will be a couple of weeks before we're ready to go live with adding to the Wine Project by bot. But it's really nice to see some of the articles that are coming up, some of the winemaking ones in particular. :-)

I'm thinking ahead to the Italy job, but assuming that you have ready access to the data, would it be possible to group articles in this kind of list according to the categories they're matching? What would be really nice would be to have it in the same hierarchy as the cats themselves (for eg the Italy geographical cats), but I recognise unnecessary work when I see it, just a straight list would be nice. Cheers. FlagSteward (talk) 18:05, 16 March 2008 (UTC)

regarding this change

When you tag something for an image copyvio, you are supposed to list the image on the day's page as stated in the template. --Rockfang (talk) 19:37, 16 March 2008 (UTC)

Read the tag? Follow instructions? Doh!!!!! Totally my bad - sorry about that :) -- SatyrTN (talk / contribs) 19:50, 16 March 2008 (UTC)

Wait - I did - Wikipedia:Copyright problems/2008 January 31/Images. See - I can follow instructions :) -- SatyrTN (talk / contribs) 19:54, 16 March 2008 (UTC)

My apologies.--Rockfang (talk) 19:57, 16 March 2008 (UTC)

Is there a backlog back to the end of January? NP, BTW - just glad I actually did follow directions :) -- SatyrTN (talk / contribs) 19:59, 16 March 2008 (UTC)

Administrators' noticeboard

Hi, Please, I kindly ask you not to open an incident in the notice board to raise disputes over content, or reports of abusive behaviour. As a courtesy, please inform other users and editors if they are mentioned in a posting, or if their actions are being discussed. Cheers,

--Mhsb (talk) 01:35, 17 March 2008 (UTC)

WP:AIN is where reports of abusive behavior belongs. AgnosticPreachersKid (talk) 01:39, 17 March 2008 (UTC)

Mhsb is somewhat correct in this case. I mentioned at ANI that I believed something fishy was happening. And I did not leave a message with them. My bad. -- SatyrTN (talk / contribs) 01:44, 17 March 2008 (UTC)\

I know, I was just stating that AIN is indeed the place for users to report abusive behavior. AgnosticPreachersKid (talk) 01:46, 17 March 2008 (UTC)

Sorry AgnosticPreachersKid, but not this kind of user behavior. The WP:AIN is supposed to report on abnormal user behavior such as evasion of blocks, abuse of admin tools, persistent vandalism, persistent spamming. Again, these pages are not the place to raise disputes over content, or reports of abusive behavior. Please take such disputes to requests for comment, requests for mediation, or requests for arbitration rather than in the WP:AIN. And please, be communicative, You just left a message to SatyrTN. Please, SatyrTN, I ask you to delete this entry in the WP:AIN. Cheers.

--Mhsb (talk) 02:39, 17 March 2008 (UTC)

Since this user thinks the same message should be posted in multiple places, here's my response. P.S. I'm very communicative, see? AgnosticPreachersKid (talk) 03:39, 17 March 2008 (UTC)

Mhsb, my report to ANI was correct. If you read the top of the page, it says "This page is for reporting and discussing incidents on the English Wikipedia that require the intervention of administrators. Any user of Wikipedia may post here." What I reported was an incident I felt might need the intervention of administrators and that needed to be discussed. What I apologize for is for not leaving a note on your talk page. That incident was a week ago, and you've had others appear on the noticeboard since then, so why don't we leave that in the past? Thanks, -- SatyrTN (talk / contribs) 05:03, 17 March 2008 (UTC)

Hi User:SatyrTN, it's absolutely fine for me to live it in the past but the problem is that other users are using this entry to evaluate my behavior such as this one and this one where an admin user declined access to WP:AWB on the basis I had an entry in the WP:ANI, which totaly non sense to me, since I didn't have the chance to present my defense and to edit an archived discussion where my actions were cited. If you go back to the first incident you created, you'll see that from my history, two things originated that incident: (1) trying to move an article page and my user page, you will see that for these two moves, I updated them in a very short period of time, meaning that I did a mistake and I was trying to fix once I realised what I was doing. Unfortunately, I didn't have the chance to present my defense in this case. Regarding the User:Opinoso, I really had some edit dispute with him, I will not raise here who is right or wrong in this matter because this is highly debatable, but in any case, the WP:ANI was not the right place to discuss a disagreement between two users. Now another user, User:Smoth_007, who didn't know what was going on, saw my name in the WP:ANI and rapidly realised that I was a bad guy and disrupting Wikipedia. Guess what? he opened an incident in WP:ANI and called the user User:Opinoso to discuss against me. At first I though that this was some kind of plot against me, but then the user User:Smoth_007 said he was unaware what was going on. Please, I kindly ask you to intervene. Thanks.

--Mhsb (talk) 06:12, 17 March 2008 (UTC)

Hi, Mhsb! I can tell that this is frustrating for you and must seem bizarre. And I don't know that I can do much here. I'm not going to delete my post from ANI - partly because that's not done (that I know of), and partly because my post there was proper. And I can't grant you AWB because I don't know anything about it, and because two other admins have declined it for two different reasons, only one of which had anything to do with me.

What are you looking for? Can you edit the articles you're interested in? Do you have any questions about how to do that? I'm willing to help you out to the best of my ability. -- SatyrTN (talk / contribs) 06:28, 17 March 2008 (UTC)

Intereffectuality

The article Intereffectuality, which I nominated for AfD and you deleted, went quicker than I was expecting, and there is something about it I would like to check. Could I ask you to undelete it, with its history, into my user space? I will check what I want, and then blank the pages and tag them {{db-u1}} to get rid of them. Thanks. JohnCD (talk) 14:12, 17 March 2008 (UTC)

• Thanks - is there any way to get back the page history? That was what I was really interested in. JohnCD (talk) 14:36, 17 March 2008 (UTC)

• Thanks again. JohnCD (talk) 14:46, 17 March 2008 (UTC)
• I've finished with them now. What I had planned to do was blank them and tag them {{db-u1}} to get rid of them; but I see what you did was a "move" so I guess that would mean they were gone for ever. Should I instead ask you to move them back into their gone-but-not-forgotten deleted state? Regards, JohnCD (talk) 14:53, 17 March 2008 (UTC)

• Well, the originator denied to TenPoundHammer that it was a hoax, so I suppose he just might ask for DRV. Perhaps best to move it back, if that's not a problem. JohnCD (talk) 15:12, 17 March 2008 (UTC)

I've moved it back and re-deleted it. -- SatyrTN (talk / contribs) 15:18, 17 March 2008 (UTC)

• Thanks yet again. Sorry to have given you so much trouble. Regards, JohnCD (talk) 16:37, 17 March 2008 (UTC)

NP :) -- SatyrTN (talk / contribs) 20:37, 17 March 2008 (UTC)

Thanks for giving me the article for my records. all the best.--Chakira (talk) 02:31, 18 March 2008 (UTC)

NP -- SatyrTN (talk / contribs) 02:36, 18 March 2008 (UTC)

Image:LAplateSonsOfConfederate.jpg

I'm requesting that you undelete this image because it was used in two articles Sons of Confederate Veterans and Vehicle registration plate‎ as recently was yesterday. It appears to have been removed from those articles and then deleted as orphaned. If there is some dispute on the copyright and or licensing status of the photo, I'd like an opportunity to fix that. Sf46 (talk) 15:04, 17 March 2008 (UTC)

Thanks for the help. Sf46 (talk) 16:23, 17 March 2008 (UTC)

NP :) -- SatyrTN (talk / contribs) 20:37, 17 March 2008 (UTC)

Noel Pemberton Billing

I am perplexed by your assertion that there is no reference to Billing's homophobia in the article. Have you read the article? Of course it is mentioned. Homophobia is one of the two things he is now best known for. He's known essentially for his activities as an aviator/promotor of air power and for his activity as an anti-homosexual activist. There has been a great deal written about this, notably Philip Hoare's book Oscar Wilde's Last Stand [1] and Michael Kettle's Salome's Last Veil: The Libel Case of the Century (1977). The case is also well known for the fact that Lord Alfred Douglas appeared in Billing's favour and that it is supposed to have hastened the death of Robert Ross. This is discussed in biographies of Douglas and Ross. All in all Billing is very well known as a major figure in promoting early 20th century homophobia. Paul B (talk) 15:56, 17 March 2008 (UTC)

Replied on the article's talk page. -- SatyrTN (talk / contribs) 20:51, 17 March 2008 (UTC)

I really cannot understand your argument. The other categories included here are, for example, "Royal Navy personnel of World War I | English businesspeople | English aviators | Members of the United Kingdom Parliament for English constituencies". How much of the article is devoted to his activity as a member of the Royal Navy in WW1? How much is devoted to his aviation? How much to his business activity? In most cases it is about the same or less than the space devoted to his anti-homosexual campaigning. Should we delete all these categories because "it's not all he was known for"? In any case, the literal amount of space devoted to a subject in this article now should not determine whether a category is included, given that several whole books have been written on the subject. Length is this case depends on how much particular contributors want to devote to a topic. Categories are supposed to be there to help people to find relevant information. If you cut down the category to only a tiny number of very very obvious members, I would suggest that you undermine the whole point of a category. Incidentally, the concept of homophobia applies to Billing perhaps even more than to Phelps and Bryant, since they are simply extending to an extreme extent traditional Christian arguments. Billing is specifically promoting a paranoid fear of homosexuality as something a "associated with a fear of contagion", as in the original definition of the word. Paul B (talk) 09:34, 18 March 2008 (UTC)

A user has asked me for a bit of help

Hi! A new user, ChaosBaby, just did a new article on a San Francisco-based belly dance company which began as a clear-cut copyvio. I stepped in and helped her clean it up. She's asked via my talk page if you'd consider undeleting her original contribution at Carolena Nericcio. I got about 7000 Google hits, most of which seem to be relative to the subject. Seems she's a heavy hitter in the belly dancing field. I can help her bring it up to snuff if you feel it's OK to restore the article. Thanks for the consideration! --PMDrive1061 (talk) 16:13, 17 March 2008 (UTC)

• Perfect solution. That's a great way to give her some time to flesh it out "offline" and then move it over when it's ready. Bravo! --PMDrive1061 (talk) 22:07, 17 March 2008 (UTC)

Thanks :) -- SatyrTN (talk / contribs) 22:54, 17 March 2008 (UTC)

Admin help

Hello. This is in regards to a request placed by Chakira (talk · contribs) on my talk page regarding the page Intereffectuality. This user has asked that the page be userfied. I politely informed the user that since I'm not an admin, I can't undelete/userfy the page -- but since you're the one who deleted it, I figured that I could ask you to do it for me. Ten Pound Hammer and his otters • ^{(Broken clamshells•Otter chirps)} 02:05, 18 March 2008 (UTC)

• Okay, thanks. Ten Pound Hammer and his otters • ^{(Broken clamshells•Otter chirps)} 02:15, 18 March 2008 (UTC)

SatyrBot

Just FYI: Wikipedia:Australian_Wikipedians'_notice_board#SatyrBot.2C_again. I looked at the bot's contribs and didn't see the template issue anywhere else, so it's hopefully a standalone... dihydrogen monoxide (H₂O) 08:04, 18 March 2008 (UTC)

Bot Errors

Crossposting from the bot's talkpage SatyrTN. Your bot has been tagging article space with the WP Australia talkpage tag. I've rolled the edits back and you need to check the coding soonish - Peripitus (Talk) 09:35, 18 March 2008 (UTC)

Question

Hi, I am the author of an article about an Firefox extension I have wrote. I have seen that there are plenty of description of Firefox extension, so I decided to add mine. Why did you deleted my article and other articles about Firefox extensions are not deleted as well.

Replied on user's talk page. -- SatyrTN (talk / contribs) 14:56, 18 March 2008 (UTC)

Favor

Please semi-protect indefinitely my userpage and my user talk page. All the anti-vandal wacking I do, there's no sense in them coming over to my crib doing the same thing. Thanks muchos! - ✰ALLSTAR✰ ^echo 06:26, 18 March 2008 (UTC)

I don't think I can? User pages can be semi-protected, even indefinitely, but I think user-talk pages can't be - at least, that's how I read WP:Protect. Besides, you've only had about a dozen IP edits on your talk page in the last month. But let me know if you want me to semi-protect your user page. -- SatyrTN (talk / contribs) 15:14, 18 March 2008 (UTC)

FYI, when MS was posting abusive material as an IP editor on talk pages (mine and others), John Vandenberg indicated he'd be willing to semi-protect talk pages to prevent the continued abuse. I am not suggesting that the situations are similar, but indicating that semi-protection of user talk pages is something some admins will consider in some circumstances.  :) Jay*Jay (talk) 15:21, 18 March 2008 (UTC)

That's true. And I recommend WP:RFPP if you feel that's necessary. =D -- SatyrTN (talk / contribs) 15:23, 18 March 2008 (UTC)

OK, I saw where someone requested Rjd0060 (?) to do theirs and he did it. Thanks. I'll RfPP. - ✰ALLSTAR✰ ^echo 16:15, 18 March 2008 (UTC)

Monir Amerkhous

You have deleted a page which describes the life of this official recordman in rubik's cube (with an official link to prove it) for notability problem, and i think it's more weird that you have no problem to accept articles about some unknown porn stars (i never saw their performance and few did i guess). This man worked hard (i don't mean that the actress doesn't) and he is now sad to be treated like that, very sad. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Damdamprout (talk • contribs) 13:39, 18 March 2008 (UTC)

As I mentioned on your talk page, the page hasn't been deleted. It's been "Userfied", which means it is in your userspace User:Damdamprout/Monir Amerkhous and you are free to edit it all you want. When you feel it's ready to go, you can move it back to article space. And let me know if you have any questions. Thanks! -- SatyrTN (talk / contribs) 15:38, 18 March 2008 (UTC)

I'll improve the article, add a photo of the event, correct the mistakes and re publish the article. Thank you very much. ==== —Preceding unsigned comment added by Damdamprout (talk • contribs) 12:14, 19 March 2008 (UTC)

Why was the article on Contract Freighters Inc (CFI) deleted?

I put in the company history from our website. I included our ISO documentaion information and our aquisition by Con-way. Why was the page deleted?

Instead of just chopping out a page, why not state what needs to be changed? —Preceding unsigned comment added by Mqldr (talk • contribs) 16:57, 18 March 2008 (UTC)

Replied on user's talk page. -- SatyrTN (talk / contribs) 18:12, 18 March 2008 (UTC)

KARE

Have a look see? Seems quite POV and there are concerns of COI and that the station's competition, WCCO-TV, is pushing the agenda. The article is about KARE so all that WCCO mess doesn't belong, per POV and I think also UNDUE. Thoughts? - ✰ALLSTAR✰ ^echo 18:43, 18 March 2008 (UTC)

Hunh. No clue. There's a ton in there that seems out of place. And there seems to be almost no references. Gah. =D -- SatyrTN (talk / contribs) 22:25, 18 March 2008 (UTC)

AfD for GSBA

On Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Greater Seattle Business Association, it appears that someone inserted a "Keep" next to your name, where I had read that line as a comment. Can you review and confirm how that line should be tagged? --- Barek (talk • contribs) - 19:21, 18 March 2008 (UTC)

Thanks - I've removed the "keep" since, as Nom, I'd rather delete it. :) -- SatyrTN (talk / contribs) 21:04, 18 March 2008 (UTC)

The Edge of Heaven

• Hi, Lighterside! I ran across the recent edits you made to The Edge of Heaven (film) and was wondering something. You added Category:Lesbian-related films. From reading the article, it seems as though there's one lesbian relationship, but that it's not central to the film, and is more of a "by the way". Could you clarify? Is the film really "lesbian-related", or is there a lesbian relationship between two characters in an action-adventure movie? Thanks! -- SatyrTN (talk / contribs) 15:31, 17 March 2008 (UTC)

• • Hi SatyrTN, The Edge of Heaven describes the stories of different people. One of the main stories is focusing on the relation between Ayten and Lotte. --Zeynep (talk) 14:19, 19 March 2008 (UTC)

Deputy Coordinator

According to this, you are a Deputy Coordinator for LGBT Project.. but it only had a userbox for the Coordinator. So, for you and User:Fireplace (whom I don't think I've ever seen before??): {{CoLead LGBT Project}} =

Enjoy! - ✰ALLSTAR✰ ^echo 13:11, 19 March 2008 (UTC)

You have waaay too much time on your hands... Don't you have a boyfriend? =D -- SatyrTN (talk / contribs) 14:14, 19 March 2008 (UTC)

Yeah, a husband.. 4 years together. When you've been with someone that long, it tends to make free time, cause we're like an old married couple now. - ✰ALLSTAR✰ ^echo 15:22, 19 March 2008 (UTC)

Which one are you? AgnosticPreachersKid (talk) 15:30, 19 March 2008 (UTC)

The one not in that picture but getting all his money. - ✰ALLSTAR✰ ^echo 15:36, 19 March 2008 (UTC)

SatyrBot question

Hey Satyr, having started that RfC, I started wondering, does SatyrBot make note of RfCs on LGBTproject pages for our to-do list? That could be a useful addition if it doesn't already. Aleta ^Sing 21:22, 20 March 2008 (UTC)

Hm - no. I'm not quite sure how I would do that. Is there a banner that goes on the page when an RFC is started? I'll have to look in to that. -- SatyrTN (talk / contribs) 21:25, 20 March 2008 (UTC)

Not a banner, no, but there is a template that is used. I don't know if that would be what you'd use. It's {{RFCxxx}}, where the xxx (or xxxx) indicates a category, such as soc for society, etc. and bio for biography. Aleta ^Sing 21:38, 20 March 2008 (UTC)

Bot help

Kirill has mentioned you may be able to help with a small job for Milhist. Basically, we would like the contents of Category:Unassessed military history articles listed regularly in WP:MHA#REQ, probably in a separate sub-section. Can you help? Or do you know someone that can? Thanks in advance, --ROGER DAVIES ^talk 11:35, 12 March 2008 (UTC)

Hi, Roger! I don't mind doing that, but you might check with User:CydeBot. My reason for saying that is because CydeBot currently listifies Category:Candidates for speedy deletion every five minutes on his User:Cyde/List of candidates for speedy deletion/Subpage, so adding this function would be trivial. But if there's any issue at all, it's not a difficult function and I would be glad to do it. Let me know! :) -- SatyrTN (talk / contribs) 15:09, 12 March 2008 (UTC)

Thanks very much indeed! I'll get straight onto it. --ROGER DAVIES ^talk 15:32, 12 March 2008 (UTC)

Cyde doubted that it was a worthwhile activity. Initially, I wondered about this too but having watched it since (and manually updated it) it probably is much easier handled by a bot. Any further thoughts would be welcome, --ROGER DAVIES ^talk 18:20, 14 March 2008 (UTC)

Want it done every night? -- SatyrTN (talk / contribs) 18:23, 14 March 2008 (UTC)

Great! That would be fine. Your help is very much appreciated. Easiest is just to replace the old list with a new one. Presumably that's what you had in mind? --ROGER DAVIES ^talk 18:47, 14 March 2008 (UTC)

Yes, I'll just have the bot overwrite whatever is currently in there. Has MILHIST already discussed the bot doing this? -- SatyrTN (talk / contribs) 18:49, 14 March 2008 (UTC)

Yes. It was raised in here on the coordinators' talk page, which is where Kirill suggested contacting you. I'll ask if there are any objections, if you like, but none have been raised so far. --ROGER DAVIES ^talk 19:00, 14 March 2008 (UTC)

No need - just wanted to make sure you weren't some sort of Rouge Editor :) I'll be glad to add that to the bot's maintenance tasks. Look for it in the morning! -- SatyrTN (talk / contribs) 19:04, 14 March 2008 (UTC)

Thanks very much. I asked if anyone objects (before I saw your reply). Could you hang fire for twenty-four hours just in case (unlikely) there's an onbjection? I'm the new lead coordinator, by the way :) --ROGER DAVIES ^talk 19:26, 14 March 2008 (UTC)

Oh no! A Rouge coordinator!!!!!

Um - I've already got the bot-generated list Wikipedia:WikiProject Military history/Assessment/Unassessed. My thought was to transclude that into the list at WP:MHA#REQ. Let me know if you want me to do that or if you do it - either way. The bot *should* fire again tonight (I think at 5am UTC), so we'll check to see that it works and transclude or whatever if it does. Hope that works for you! -- SatyrTN (talk / contribs) 19:30, 14 March 2008 (UTC)

More a pinko one, I suspect :)

I can set up a separate section [[WP:MHA#BOT for this if you like. That'd separate it from the manual ones. Is that easier, with a bit of header text? (I know nothing about bots so this is all new territory.) --ROGER DAVIES ^talk 19:43, 14 March 2008 (UTC)

(ec) I'll take a look at it tomorrow and see what I can do. -- SatyrTN (talk / contribs) 22:49, 14 March 2008 (UTC)

Thanks very much. Sorry to be so wet behind the ears :) --ROGER DAVIES ^talk 00:15, 15 March 2008 (UTC)

Are we still good to go? You asked for 24 hrs, so I thought I'd check... -- SatyrTN (talk / contribs) 16:09, 16 March 2008 (UTC)

Yes! Thank you very much. --ROGER DAVIES ^talk 17:58, 16 March 2008 (UTC)

Fine tuning

Thanks for sorting the bot. Can I trouble you to fine-tune it a bit please? Probably best if we put the articles from the category into a new separate section ("Backlog of articles for assessment"), to avoid over-writing any manually added editor requests. (They often ask for re-assessment from start to B-Class or whatever so the elegant solution you proposed may not always work.) I've put some suggested text for a header for the bot-generated list below:

==Backlog of articles for assessment==

This is a bot-generated list of articles from [[:Category:Unassessed military history articles]], courtesy of [[User:SatyrTN|SatyrTN]]. It is updated daily. After assessing please strikethrough the article name to avoid duplication.

I hope I have covered everything. Very many thanks, --ROGER DAVIES ^talk 20:41, 16 March 2008 (UTC)

See how that works for you. Feel free to change the wording as you will - the transcluded list is indicated with {{Wikipedia:WikiProject Military history/Assessment/Unassessed}}. That list will get changed nightly, anything you add/edit around it won't be affected.

Hope that works! -- SatyrTN (talk / contribs) 20:51, 16 March 2008 (UTC)

		The WikiChevrons
		For setting up our assessment bot, and for dealing with my stumbling questions, please accept the Military history WikiProject WikiChevrons. --ROGER DAVIES talk 20:55, 16 March 2008 (UTC)

Awesome! Many thanks! I have a hat and purse that will go with that perfectly! =D -- SatyrTN (talk / contribs) 20:57, 16 March 2008 (UTC)

We're bring out limited edition Milhist slingbacks based on the Chevrons design that'll accessorize a treat. --ROGER DAVIES ^talk 18:46, 21 March 2008 (UTC)

Incidentally, is the bot working correctly at the moment? --ROGER DAVIES ^talk 18:46, 21 March 2008 (UTC)

Unfortunately, no. There's an error in the API that the bot uses to access Wikipedia. It's supposed to be cleared up here shortly, but is probably not reporting correctly. I don't think it's making any bad edits to article space, but is probably not reporting correct info to project space. Sorry :( -- SatyrTN (talk / contribs) 19:08, 21 March 2008 (UTC)

Ok, thanks. Let's hope it's up and running again soon :) --ROGER DAVIES ^talk 19:12, 21 March 2008 (UTC)

Year

Where exactly? I don't have time to read the whole page and I can't find it in the year section.Zigzig20s (talk) 15:13, 20 March 2008 (UTC)

Thank you. BTW, I think Henry James should be categorised as LGBT writer. It is referenced, though as always with fin de siecle writers some may say they were 'lifelong bachelors' - same case as Willa Cather.Zigzig20s (talk) 15:29, 20 March 2008 (UTC)

Yes, he should be. If there aren't enough references regarding his sexuality in the article already, glbtq.com is another one you can use. -- SatyrTN (talk / contribs) 20:44, 20 March 2008 (UTC)

Is that site reliable? I remember a tiff over Joris-Karl Huysmans.Zigzig20s (talk) 14:55, 21 March 2008 (UTC)

They are reliable - they site all the sources they use in their articles. -- SatyrTN (talk / contribs) 17:08, 21 March 2008 (UTC)

Note

Hi, I deleted Fatherhood dreams as a copyvio yesterday after you marked it for deletion, but the author of the page claims he wrote the website as well and owns the copyright. It wouldn't qualify for CSD then but from what I can see the film doesn't appear notable anyway, so you might want to bring it to AfD. Just letting you know. shoeofdeath 19:34, 21 March 2008 (UTC)

Isn't it still a copyvio since the original is not marked as GFDL/PD? -- SatyrTN (talk / contribs) 19:36, 21 March 2008 (UTC)

I guess it would be, although the last part doesn't appear to be from the wesbite. Anyway I'm sure it would just be recreated with the wording changed a little so I am hesitant to speedy delete it again. Do you think the movie is notable? If you don't I think AfD would be the best option. shoeofdeath 19:46, 21 March 2008 (UTC)

Sources

Hello again, my friend. Just a question. I am attempting to add some color and flesh out a story that appears on wikipedia. I assume that one thing that wikipedia wants is some exclusive content. I am attempting to add a bit of that to a piece. I can verify my sources. Is there a way perhaps to correspond in email about this? In any case, thanks.MarmadukePercy (talk) 21:16, 21 March 2008 (UTC)

Hm. No, actually, Wikipedia *doesn't* want exclusive content. In fact, it's very much frowned upon - see the policy on original research. However, WikiNews might be a good place for exclusive content?

BTW, if you want to email me, you can click the "E-mail this user" on the left-hand side. Thanks, -- SatyrTN (talk / contribs) 21:44, 21 March 2008 (UTC)

Thanks again. I took you up on your offer to email you.MarmadukePercy (talk) 22:30, 21 March 2008 (UTC)

Question

Hey SatyrTN, I was wondering if you (your bot specifically) would be able to do a pretty simple but useful task for me. Would your bot be able to add |importance= to all {{GreenBayPackersProject}} to the pages in Category:Unknown-importance Green Bay Packers articles? So basically all the articles in the category have on their talk pages {{GreenBayPackersProject|class=ARTICLE CLASS}}, so all the bot would need to do is make it look like {{GreenBayPackersProject|class=ARTICLE CLASS|importance=}} (where ARTICLE CLASS is stub/start/B/etc). The reason for this is so my assessment script notices the importance parameter so I can assess the articles quicker. Thanks! « Gonzo fan2007 (talk ♦ contribs) 03:48, 22 March 2008 (UTC)

Hm. I could, but I'm not sure that accomplishes anything. I mean in the big picture, it's ~580 edits to the database that doesn't change anything, and all ~580 articles are going to be edited again to actually add the importance parameter. -- SatyrTN (talk / contribs) 06:21, 22 March 2008 (UTC)

Yeah, the main thing is that for me to regularly assess an article, I go to Category:Unknown-importance Green Bay Packers articles and click on an article which takes me to the talk page. I then have to click to the article page, look at the article and assess its importance, then click back to the talk page, then click "edit" and then finally add the importance parameter and hit save. Then I hit the back button on my browser 3 times to get back to the category and do it all over again. But I just installed the assessment script which would allow me to go to the category, go to the talk page, then the article and assess it right then and there. It cuts the time in half, but the script doesnt work unless the importance= is in the template. There in lies my problem. Its no big deal though, I will get the assessing done one of these days, Im just trying to see how I could optimize it ;-) Whatever you think would be best. « Gonzo fan2007 (talk ♦ contribs) 06:46, 22 March 2008 (UTC)

Nevermind, the dang script wasnt working right. It now is so... just disreagrd that whole thread lol ;-) « Gonzo fan2007 (talk ♦ contribs) 21:10, 22 March 2008 (UTC)

Um

I didn't know you were musically gifted, but I'm trying to understand this one. I want whatever this guy is smoking. AgnosticPreachersKid (talk) 07:25, 22 March 2008 (UTC)

This might be more my style of Satyrdom. =D -- SatyrTN (talk / contribs) 13:58, 22 March 2008 (UTC)

Just replace the topless chick with fill in the blank. AgnosticPreachersKid (talk) 14:02, 22 March 2008 (UTC)

Why? I don't mind knocking a topless chick off a branch when she's laughing at me =D -- SatyrTN (talk / contribs) 14:13, 22 March 2008 (UTC)

Hardy-har-har. (ec) On a side note, Masculinity now wants to add Heterosexuality to the LGBT project. This is a serious issue to me. Not the Hetero thing, but his attempts to change the definitions of Gay, Bisexuality, Heterosexuality, Homosexuality, Sexual orientation, Gender role and Straight acting. On these talk page discussions he says there is no such thing as a gay person in India and that lesbians don't exist, yet somehow we're supposed to be okay with letting him add his biased article link to these LGBT articles and adding material like this? I need you to explain to him somehow that the Heterosexuality article does not belong in the project and that there has not been a consensus reached for his edits, the exact opposite of what he claims on the Gay Talk page. I've lost all patience with him and I know Aleta has tried and tried to talk to him, but I can tell you that her patience is withering away as well. Can you try? It would be appreciated. Notice what it says on his user page, "I'm facing stiff resistance and sabotage from a segment of the LGBT community, the chauvinists who don't want the non-Western voice to be heard on the issue of man-man sexuality. Please offer your support at these discussions that are going on at the talk page of the article on 'Gay'." The Talk:Gay page is a circus. AgnosticPreachersKid (talk) 14:20, 22 March 2008 (UTC)

I'm sorry, hon. I tried. I started reading the Talk:Gay page, but got lost. I can't possibly follow his rantings, nor do I want to. If there's an issue I can specifically help with, please let me know, but I find myself wanting to tear my teeth out one by one just to escape his POV rants. Sorry :) -- SatyrTN (talk / contribs) 15:17, 22 March 2008 (UTC)

Sigh. I just left him a message on his talk page. Hopefully he will post his long quotes and references there. He doesn't know how to space his comments, making the conversations hard to read. At least say something to him if he tries tagging the heterosexual article. You are one of the co-chairs of the project, so maybe he'll listen you if he does try to add it. AgnosticPreachersKid (talk) 15:21, 22 March 2008 (UTC)

I can't believe I just watchlisted the "heterosexuality" page. Almost makes me feel dirty. I think I'll watchlist "Twink (slang)", just to balance myself out. =D -- SatyrTN (talk / contribs) 15:27, 22 March 2008 (UTC)

Even more gay than the twink article. Also, did you read my post on the project page about your "favorite" YT'er, What the Buck? AgnosticPreachersKid (talk) 15:38, 22 March 2008 (UTC)

I just added heterosexuality to my watchlist as well. I don't plan on getting into the discussion there, but I will revert if I see him add the LGBT tag there. Aleta ^Sing 15:57, 22 March 2008 (UTC)

my RFA

Thank you! Thank you for your support in my RFA. The final vote count was (73/3/1), so I am now an administrator. Please let me know if at any stage you need help, or if you have comments on how I am doing as an admin. Have a nice day! :) Aleta Sing 16:58, 22 March 2008 (UTC)

Musical groups

Essential, probably not...it was an attempt, misguided or otherwise, to separate musical groups from individual musicians within Category:LGBT musicians from Canada. But for what it's worth, I suspect there are a lot more groups on Wikipedia that should be in Category:LGBT musical groups but aren't yet. Bearcat (talk) 20:29, 22 March 2008 (UTC)

WP:LOTD

Congratulations! List of gay, lesbian or bisexual people/W-Z was selected as a List of the Day for April. Let me know if you have a strong preference for a date.--TonyTheTiger (t/c/bio/WP:CHICAGO/WP:LOTD) 07:35, 23 March 2008 (UTC)

If no confirmation in print, then what?

Question--There are individuals for whom their LGBT status is widely known by colleagues, but the fact has not been mentioned in print (or if mentioned, the print reference has not been discovered). How is it possible to include LGBT status in the article if no print reference can be identified? Henry-Russell Hitchcock was widely known to have been gay, but this fact was deleted from the article on Hitchcock.Kentucknob (talk) 03:24, 20 March 2008 (UTC)

I've already replied at Talk:Henry-Russell Hitchcock. -- SatyrTN (talk / contribs) 20:38, 20 March 2008 (UTC)

Problem solved -- Hitchcock is in Shand-Tucci's 2003 book on gays at Harvard.Kentucknob (talk) 22:26, 23 March 2008 (UTC)

Happy Easter

Sadly, Former First Lady Nancy Reagan has been abducted by the Easter Bunny's evil cousins, Frank and Billy Ray. But don't let that stop you from having a great Easter! Cheers. The one and only ----> AgnosticPreachersKid (talk) 07:49, 23 March 2008 (UTC)

Happy Easter 2008. We will not see Easter this early again in our lifetimes, most likely, unless we will live for another 152 years. From the article on Easter: The calculations for the date of Easter are somewhat complicated. In the Western Church, Easter has not fallen on the earliest of the 35 possible dates, March 22, since 1818, and will not do so again until 2285. It did, however, fall on March 23 in 2008, but will not do so again until 2160. Peace brother. — Becksguy (talk) 14:37, 23 March 2008 (UTC)

AhHa. Just learned a new formatting tool: {{clear}} There had to be a way. Thanks Satyr. — Becksguy (talk) 04:15, 24 March 2008 (UTC)

DRV request

Beat you by about 5 minutes. :) DarkAudit (talk) 03:41, 24 March 2008 (UTC)

lolz! I *think* I've cleaned up after myself, but would you check? =D -- SatyrTN (talk / contribs) 03:42, 24 March 2008 (UTC)

Looks good. Thanks for the assist. DarkAudit (talk) 03:44, 24 March 2008 (UTC)

NP =D -- SatyrTN (talk / contribs) 03:45, 24 March 2008 (UTC)

Satyr picture

What - you've never had your picture taken during a mani/pedi/haircut? Sheesh - no privacy around here! =D -- SatyrTN (talk / contribs) 03:52, 24 March 2008 (UTC)

Heehee! =) Aleta ^Sing 04:15, 24 March 2008 (UTC)

Such a queen! P.S. Add &fmt=18 to the end of any YT URL address to see the video in higher definition. I know you probably have a hard time keeping up with my subscriptions, I add so many! AgnosticPreachersKid (talk) 05:45, 24 March 2008 (UTC)

I did not know that! Thanks - doesn't work for all of them, but that's kewl! A new fave of mine :) -- SatyrTN (talk / contribs) 05:53, 24 March 2008 (UTC)

HA! I'm adding that to my userpage. Did you notice the 2 recent additions to my list of future ex-husbands on my page? This has to be the BEST YT EVAH!!!!!!! AgnosticPreachersKid (talk) 06:08, 24 March 2008 (UTC)

Speaking of the gay gene. AgnosticPreachersKid (talk) 06:34, 24 March 2008 (UTC)

Happy Easter

And thanks again for helping Jeff with his page. I couldn't do it, really, because of the COI issues I have with him. --David Shankbone 15:20, 24 March 2008 (UTC)

Greetings from the Opera Project again

Hi, Satyr. You'll remember that you and your bot did some excellent work for us (on the Wagner sub-project) a few months ago. How are you fixed at present? We'd like to dip a bigger toe in the assessment process by automatically giving a "Start" rating to those articles that are tagged with the Opera Project banner and are not already classified as Stub.

Exceptions: articles which have been promoted to Good Article, Featured Article or Featured List should show those ratings on the banner. Also, it would be good if any articles which currently show Stub on the banner but have been manually de-stubbed without the banner having been altered could be rated Start.

We'd like the facility to comment when we start doing the assessments. For the Wagner project, you organised it so that the banner carries a dormant link: if a comments page is present, there's a link, but if not, not. The link will nevertheless appear (and work) if a comments page is subsequently added.

I can give some examples of the various possibilities outlined above if that would help, and you might like to review our correspondence about the Wagner project to refresh your memory of what you did then (also to refresh your memory of how useless we were then at specifying what exactly we wanted, maybe!).

Hope to hear from you when you have a moment. Best. --GuillaumeTell (talk) 01:38, 25 March 2008 (UTC)

what up homegirl

So I was reading about WP:PR and WP:GA. I'm trying to get Clarence Lightner (and eventually Leonard Hall (Shaw University) to GA status. Should an article be a certain length to get that status? Lightner is kinda short compared to some articles, but what's on there is just about all the information I can find on him. I know they will never be a FA, but GA is good enough for me and I want to have one of those under my belt. Is it better to ask for a peer review before nominating the article for GA? I don't know if you've contributed to a GA, but I thought I'd ask. AgnosticPreachersKid (talk) 23:19, 25 March 2008 (UTC)

Hm. Some people will tell you PR is not worth it. IMHO, though, PR is to get users in the WikiProject to take a look at the article. GA is to get users outside the WP to look at it. And FA is when everyone agrees it's good :) So I recommend it.

That said, I haven't gone through much of either. I've FL'd five lists, but that's a *much* less rigorous process. -- SatyrTN (talk / contribs) 00:25, 26 March 2008 (UTC)

Fair use rationale for Image:AND1 logo.png

Thanks for uploading or contributing to Image:AND1 logo.png. I notice the image page specifies that the image is being used under fair use but there is not a suitable explanation or rationale as to why each specific use in Wikipedia constitutes fair use. Please go to the image description page and edit it to include a fair use rationale.

If you have uploaded other fair use media, consider checking that you have specified the fair use rationale on those pages too. You can find a list of 'image' pages you have edited by clicking on the "my contributions" link (it is located at the very top of any Wikipedia page when you are logged in), and then selecting "Image" from the dropdown box. Note that any non-free media lacking such an explanation will be deleted one week after they have been uploaded, as described on criteria for speedy deletion. If you have any questions please ask them at the Media copyright questions page. Thank you. NOTE: once you correct this, please remove the tag from the image's page. STBotI (talk) 03:07, 26 March 2008 (UTC)

Converting images to PNG

Hello, SatyrTN. I've noticed you've been converting some images from JPEG to PNG recently. While I appreciate your effort to improve these images, I don't think your method of converting the JPEGs directly to PNGs is very helpful. The main problem with JPEGs, when used for text, screenshots, maps, diagrams, flags, and other images with sharp edges and big blocks of solid colors, is that the JPEG algorithm introduces compression artifacts into the image, which are practically invisible in photographs but stand out as "fuzz" in non-photographic images. These compression artifacts allow JPEG to produce smaller file sizes for photographs, but they don't help much for non-photographic images, for which PNG is a better choice. When you see the {{badJPEG}} or {{ShouldBePNG}} tag on a JPEG image, it generally means that the JPEG compression artifacts are distracting in the image, or that a smaller file size could have been achieved if the image had been originally saved as a PNG (usually both). However, when you simply convert the JPEG image to a PNG, the compression artifacts introduced when the file was saved in the JPEG format are still there, resulting in a fuzzy-looking PNG. Worse, such compression artifacts often cause PNG to produce a much larger file size than the original JPEG! So the best course of action is to recreate the image from scratch, or find a version of the image which has never been saved as a JPEG and save that as a PNG. This will result in a clean PNG image, often with a smaller file size than JPEG would have given.

Please take a look at Wikipedia:Preparing images for upload for more information, especially the section called "Do not save diagrams as JPEG". Let me know if you have any questions. —Bkell (talk) 03:10, 26 March 2008 (UTC)

Banner Shell

Well thanks for you willingness to help. The thing that turned me off about that template was the fact that, try as I might, I could not get rid of a space after the first item when I placed it on Talk:Ronald Reagan. I was going to put it in my sandbox to show you what happened, but that didn't work. So if you would like to check it out, place

{{WikiProjectBannerShell |1= {{USP-Article|class=FA|importance=High|nested=yes}} {{WikiProject California|class=FA|importance=Top|nested=yes}} {{WikiProject Cold War history|class=FA|importance=Top|nested=yes}} {{WPBiography|living=no|class=FA|priority=High|politician-work-group=yes|listas=Reagan, Ronald|nested=yes}} {{WPBiography|living=no|class=FA|priority=Mid|filmbio-work-group=yes|listas=Reagan, Ronald|nested=yes}} {{WikiProject United States presidential elections|class=FA|nested=yes}} {{WikiProject Radio|class=FA|nested=yes}} {{WikiProject Illinois|class=FA|importance=Top|nested=yes}} {{ChicagoWikiProject|class=FA|importance=low|nested=yes}} {{WP1.0|WPCD=yes|class=FA|nested=yes}} }}

over the WikiProject Banner template and all of its contents in the editing screen and preview it. When I did that, a big space appeared. How to I get rid of that? Happyme22 (talk) 01:48, 27 March 2008 (UTC)

Hm. When I try that, either on an article or in a sandbox, I don't see any problems. Now, I'm on a Mac using Firefox, so there's the outside chance it's an IE issue. And another outside chance the problem was in one of the interior banners, but has since been fixed. I have occasionally seen a space show up between individual lines, which is usually because someone added or changed something on one of the banners. I don't see it now, but let me know if you do and I'll follow up. -- SatyrTN (talk / contribs) 04:55, 27 March 2008 (UTC)

You know what? I tried it again (exactly what I placed here) and it worked. Thanks a lot for your willingness to help me. --Happyme22 (talk) 06:31, 27 March 2008 (UTC)

Glad to help - and if you find any others that do that, let me know? It's easy for an extra line-break to creep in when someone makes a change to a banner. Thanks! -- SatyrTN (talk / contribs) 14:32, 27 March 2008 (UTC)

TrashMail

You removed the speedy tag from this article- can I just ask why? We were discussing the matter on the talk page, and the author has failed to bring forth any reliable sources. Would you mind if I deleted the article, or are you seeing something I'm not? J Milburn (talk) 13:12, 27 March 2008 (UTC)

It's pretty standard for articles to be nominated for deletion within seconds of being created, that's the nature of new page patrol. And yes, I realise Wikipedia has no time limit, but that doesn't mean we can have useless articles sitting around for days at a time, though I do take your point that this article is nowhere near as bad as many. I do sort of resent the speedy tags being removed when I was in the process of asking the user for reliable sources, but I'll trust your judgement and give the article the benefit of the doubt. J Milburn (talk) 14:15, 27 March 2008 (UTC)

That first statement worries me a whole lot. And I don't mean this personally - as in you worry me - but rather the process worries me. That means it's standard practice to WP:BITE the newbies, something that goes against the very nature of Wikipedia. I'm not criticizing you here, and I have no clue if something needs to change (or what), I'm just writing down a few thoughts that came to me reading your statement and wondering if that really is "standard process". -- SatyrTN (talk / contribs) 14:30, 27 March 2008 (UTC)

Re: Gucci Gang controversy

Simply counting raw !votes, and excluding those of the SPA's I tagged (Lenoil odarama does have contributions outside the topic, and from several months previous, so I'm assuming good faith on him) the discussion came out to 7 keeps and 4 delete (counting your nomination). Looking into the discussion itself, the arguments for deletion could be summarized as a violation of WP:NOT#NEWS. While that is a valid concern, this was refuted by the keep arguments - that there is sufficient referencing to justify the article, the article expands beyond the scope of a simple news article, and there is precedent to allow such articles. 9/11 was a horrible example for the last argument, however, I'll give you that - but WP:OSE does acknowledge that "other stuff exists" arguments can be validly used in this manner, as it was by Starczamora with Edison Chen photo scandal. The bottom line is, there was a clear consensus not to delete the article, but rather to continue to expand it and improve upon it as necessary. I hope this explains things. Hersfold ^(t/a/c) 03:17, 27 March 2008 (UTC)

My decision stands. Simply because the article isn't getting expanded any further does not mean it should be deleted. We don't punish articles for being stubs, and certainly not starts, as this one is. If you still feel the article should be deleted, I'd recommend bringing the issue to deletion review. Hersfold ^(t/a/c) 16:13, 27 March 2008 (UTC)

Case law

Hi SatyrTN! The difference between Category:LGBT case law and Category:United States gay rights cases is simple: the second category only deals with US cases, whereas the first deals with LGBT cases all over the world. As you can see, the first category includes a 1998 LGBT case in South Africa as well as a 1997 LGBT case in Ecuador (I created both articles in the last two days). Of course, the category is not yet very populated since it has just been created, but I intend to create several other articles about LGBT cases to populate it (in fact, Wikipedia already has many such articles which I have not yet categorized and which perfectly fit in this category). Regards. BomBom (talk) 15:06, 27 March 2008 (UTC)

Can we rename one or the other, then? To make them match? -- SatyrTN (talk / contribs) 15:09, 27 March 2008 (UTC)

Sorry, I didn't think you would reply on your talk page. Yes, indeed, using a standard heading would be more useful and coherent. I think "LGBT" is broader and thus better than "gay". I just created a new subcategory Category:LGBT-related European Court of Human Rights cases. However, I don't know how to rename categories. Does it have to be done manually or is there another, more efficient way to do it? Regards. BomBom (talk) 18:39, 27 March 2008 (UTC)

Yes, it has to be done manually. I agree that "LGBT" is broader and is better for these cats. What about the US one? Looking at the other parent cat, perhaps it should be renamed Category:United States LGBT-related case law? -- SatyrTN (talk / contribs) 18:53, 27 March 2008 (UTC)

Screenshot G7s

Put simply, I don't see how I can justify their fair use beyond boilerplate rationales. Sceptre ^(talk) 15:58, 28 March 2008 (UTC)

Sera monastery

I'm confused by your request to delete Sera monastery - could you explain what is needed? At the moment it's a perfectly reasonable redirect to a fairly stable article, so I don't see the need to delete. Let me know on my talk page? Thanks! -- SatyrTN (talk / contribs) 14:42, 28 March 2008 (UTC)

because it is a descriptive and not an actual title, I was going to move the article into that space. Also, thank you for your PNGification of graphics! (and if I recall correctly, your cleanup of my stub on Marylou Makepeace) Chris (クリス • フィッチ) (talk) 20:44, 28 March 2008 (UTC)

The article reads like it's the name of the monastery - one of the "Great three" along with Ganden Monastery and Drepung Monastery. I see that you've moved the other two redirect to small "m", but all three articles still refer to the places with cap "M". I'm not trying to be difficult, I'm just wondering at the moves you made/want to make, and wondering if they're necessary. A quick Google Books search turns up a large percentage with cap "M". Maybe we can get another opinion at WP:TIBET or WP:BUDH? -- SatyrTN (talk / contribs) 21:57, 28 March 2008 (UTC)

I've no vested interest in it one way or the other, to me as an English teacher, though, it just looks off, I wish I could describe it better. If I'm off, sorry. Chris (クリス • フィッチ) (talk) 06:42, 29 March 2008 (UTC)

And I have no clue. I've left a message at Wikipedia talk:WikiProject Tibet#Monasteries - hopefully someone there knows :) -- SatyrTN (talk / contribs) 07:32, 29 March 2008 (UTC)

Ummm...

Any chance of a reply on my Opera Project post up above before the 15 days are up and it gets archived? Not trying to hurry you, but... --GuillaumeTell (talk) 01:38, 29 March 2008 (UTC)

You mean your post from four days ago? That I've been resolutely procrastinating on? =D

Part of the reason I haven't responded is because I'm in the middle of a 4,000 cat run for WP:AUS. Another part of the reason is you've asked for quite a lot, some of which is already programmed, some of which isn't. I have to parse it out and write out a response. But ping me again in four days if I haven't responded - I'll try to get my act together :) -- SatyrTN (talk / contribs) 01:49, 29 March 2008 (UTC)

Yes, I saw the goings-on in the merry old land of Oz. There is absolutely no hurry for us, and we're grateful for any help we can get. I was just worried that it had dropped off the radar. Thanks for the reply! --GuillaumeTell (talk) 12:13, 29 March 2008 (UTC)

Colorado Library Consortium

Greetings, You deleted my Colorado Library Consortium (CLiC) article. 04:11, 18 March 2008 SatyrTN (Talk | contribs) deleted "Colorado Library Consortium (CLiC)" ‎ (A7 (group): Group/band/club/company/etc; doesn't indicate importance/significance)

Colorado Library Consortium is a nonprofit organization and is partially funded by the Colorado State Library/ Colorado Department of Education so it does not fit the A7 criteria listed above. Will you please republish my article? I also sent in a copyright permissions letter. See below. Thank you, Shannon O'Grady

To permissions-commons wikimedia.org, I hereby assert that the I and the Colorado Library Consortium staff created and owns the exclusive copyright of WORK http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Colorado_Library_Consortium_(CLiC) We agree to publish that work under the free license LICENSE GNU Free Documentation License v 1.1, 1.2 We acknowledge that we grant anyone the right to use the work in a commercial product, and to modify it according to their needs. We are aware that we always retain copyright of our work, and retain the right to be attributed in accordance with the license chosen. Modifications others make to the work will not be attributed to us. We are aware that the free license only concerns copyright, and we reserve the option to take action against anyone who uses this work in a libelous way, or in violation of personality rights, trademark restrictions, etc. We acknowledge that we cannot withdraw this agreement, and that the work may or may not be kept permanently on a Wikimedia project. Colorado Library Consortium staff Shannon O’Grady, Assigned Wikipedia Agent

Waiting for an answer on this... Shannon —Preceding unsigned comment added by Shannon8r (talk • contribs) 00:20, 29 March 2008 (UTC)

Hi, Shannon - I left a message on your talk page. The short version is that, since it's a copyvio issue, I don't feel comfortable re-instating the page. If you've sent in the correct documentation to en-permissions, then they will be willing and able to restore the page. Thanks! -- SatyrTN (talk / contribs) 00:23, 29 March 2008 (UTC)

Hi, Just read my talk page. I emailed a copyright letter on March 24. Any idea how long it takes? Shannon8r (talk) 18:55, 29 March 2008 (UTC)Shannon

Thanks

Thanks for fixing Template:Wikiproject Israel. I wish I knew where to take problems of that sort....--Relata refero (talk) 18:01, 29 March 2008 (UTC)

Hm. Well, I got pointed to it at the Template talk:WikiProjectBannerShell page. I suppose the Village Pump (technical) is also a place to go. Or just find your friendly neighborhood template guy to help out =D -- SatyrTN (talk / contribs) 21:25, 29 March 2008 (UTC)

re:Re: WikiProjectBannerShell

You stated "all banners in Category:WikiProject banners do have the nested functionality", however you are wrong. Please take a look at {{Wpt}} and {{WikiProject Slayer}}. Burningclean _[speak] 20:14, 29 March 2008 (UTC)

Thank you. What exactaly is the category? Burningclean _[speak] 21:21, 29 March 2008 (UTC)

Category:WikiProject banners -- SatyrTN (talk / contribs) 21:22, 29 March 2008 (UTC)

Images

You recently removed CSD tags from some images I tagged, you said they are not copyvios. Well they are screenshots from commercial movies that the uploader is claiming copyright of, how is that not a copyvio? Polly (Parrot) 21:55, 29 March 2008 (UTC)

You mean the Himesh pics like Image:HimeshAKS.jpg, right?

The images all come from the website himesh-reshammiya.com, which appears to be his "official" site? And nowhere on the site is there a copyright statement. My impression is the director guy is HR4 (talk · contribs), so if he is posting pictures of the movie he made both on his website and here, there's no copyvio. Is that incorrect? -- SatyrTN (talk / contribs) 22:05, 29 March 2008 (UTC)

Copyright is always presumed, only if an image is explicitly released under a free license is it otherwise. How do we know that the uploader is the person who holds the copyright, they'd need to give some proof of this to the Wikimedia Foundation via the normal email permissions at OTRS. You have to exercise extreme care with commercial images like screenshots especially when the uploader is claiming copyright, it's crucial that due diligence can be shown otherwise the Wikimedia Foundation leaves itself vulnerable to legal action from any copyright holder who's feels aggrieved by a misappropriation of their commercial rights. Polly (Parrot) 22:45, 29 March 2008 (UTC)

I stand corrected. -- SatyrTN (talk / contribs) 22:49, 29 March 2008 (UTC)

You were assuming good faith of the editor concerned, which is commendable in most circumstances, but when it comes to copyright the onus should always be on the claimant to prove their case. To do otherwise would lead to Wikipedia being swamped with copyvio images. Polly (Parrot) 22:59, 29 March 2008 (UTC)

I guess I understand. That one looked valid, but I understand what you're saying. Thanks for clarifying :) -- SatyrTN (talk / contribs) 23:07, 29 March 2008 (UTC)

No problems, copyright is a minefield, caution is always best. If the uploader wants the images included in the article they could always use a fair use rationale, though with that number of fair use images in one article I think they'd struggle to justify them all. Oh and apologies if my initial message seemed a bit snippy, I was just a bit rushed when I posted it. Polly (Parrot) 23:42, 29 March 2008 (UTC)

NP - I'm leery of pic speedies because I know so little about them, so I really appreciate the explanation. Tks! -- SatyrTN (talk / contribs) 00:14, 30 March 2008 (UTC)

Bochica

You deleted Bochica. I restored it. You wrote that there was not enough context to identify the subject. As one who had never heard of it, I quickly identified it by entering Chibchan in the search box. And there are google hits.

Don't just delete articles because you don't understand them without having exerted any effort, especially when your reason for not making the effort is just that you're unwilling to do so. Michael Hardy (talk) 17:40, 30 March 2008 (UTC)

Bite the newbies and get rewarded with an adminship

And please note that you're being talked about at Wikipedia talk:Requests for adminship. Michael Hardy (talk) 17:56, 30 March 2008 (UTC)

Wow. What an amazing amount of WP:AGF you have! Thanks for being understanding, and for asking questions when another editor does something you don't agree with! You're definitely making Wikipedia so much better by your actions!

To explain myself, WP:CSD#A1 says "Very short articles lacking sufficient context to identify the subject of the article." The version of the article that I deleted was one sentence (thirteen words a couple of them mis-spelled). That fits the "very short" part. And when I read that sentence, it says something about him/it being a god for some people I've never heard of. That fit the unable to identify the subject of the article part. Evidently another editor agreed, since they had tagged it with "db-nonsense". So I'm sorry if you don't agree with my action, but kindly leave off harassing me with "not willing to do work" and such. We're all trying to make a better encyclopedia, and my 12,000 mainspace edits show that I am willing to make an effort. -- SatyrTN (talk / contribs) 18:03, 30 March 2008 (UTC)

I am well aware of which version it was. It's the version that I restored. It seems to me that you are the one who failed to assume good faith, when you treated the entry as worthless. "Some people you've never heard of" were identified instantly by entering their name into the search box. How hard is that? You didn't want to do even that much. Michael Hardy (talk) 19:57, 30 March 2008 (UTC)

I can see that no matter what I say, or how I insist that the "article" fit No-Context, you're going to disagree and say that mop-wielders, who are simply cleaning up when other editors have marked the speedy, should instead take it upon themselves to write FA-class articles when given one non-sentence. I'm sorry we disagree. -- SatyrTN (talk / contribs) 20:08, 30 March 2008 (UTC)

Inclusionist?

On your userpage you claim to be an inclusionist, but you are really bent on deleting Joshua Plague. What gives? ;-) Yilloslime (t) 20:39, 30 March 2008 (UTC)

Yeh, I might need to take that off. I'm more of a Darwinist/Inclusionist - Give it a chance, but make it work to survive =D -- SatyrTN (talk / contribs) 20:43, 30 March 2008 (UTC)

I see, I see. Yilloslime (t) 20:45, 30 March 2008 (UTC)

Hey, so what do you think about my point about the bands listed here? Seems to me like if Joshua Plague non-notable, than there's no way many of the bands listed there are notable either, e.g. [2],[3],[4], and I doubt this problem is limited to KRS bands. Are you going to AfD or PROD all of these too? Yilloslime (t) 22:00, 31 March 2008 (UTC)

Take a read of WP:OTHERSTUFFEXISTS - in short, the presence or absence of other articles is not a factor in deciding whether a particular article should be deleted, it's a non-argument. If a subject is notable, the article can stand on its own merits according to WP:NOTE, if not it gets deleted - period. FlagSteward (talk) 22:58, 31 March 2008 (UTC)

Flag, I can't help but think that you didn't look at my post above very closely, since the first diff is to a comment in which I say I am fully aware of the caveats in WP:OTHERSTUFFEXISTS.

But anyways, SatyrTN, my post was not arguing for Keep, which I've done elsewhere, but rather questioning your future plans, which, in retrospect, probably isn't very useful. I guess I'm just frustrated that out of sea of poorly sources/unsourced articles about blatantly non-notable bands and musicians, you've singled out Joshua Plague—an article that's in much better shape than myriad others, and that's about someone much more notable than myriad others. (And maybe you haven't singled out Plague, and are AfDing all kinds of bands, I haven't checked your contribs.) I really wouldn't care (and probably shouldn't care) except that I've actually put a bit work into the article. And, of course, I do think he's notable, though I also admit that in googling for material for the article, I've been surprised by the relative paucity of information on him/his bands on the internet. I suspect that part of the reason for the relative dearth of info is that his most notable band (MK) was most active before the tubes of the internets really took off, but still, I think there is enough to establish notability by WP standards.

I guess my point is, if you are on a "cleansing WP of non-notable garbage" streak, and this Plague article is simply swept up in that, then that's fine, I can understand that. But if you've singled this out for some reason, then that's frustrating. Even if it weren't a policy, I can't help but WP:AGF since you are such a prolific, solid, and civil editor, but that just makes it harder for me to wrap my head around the singling out of this article in the face of so much lower hanging fruit. Don't you have bigger fish to fry? I see I have rambled on. Sorry. Yilloslime (t) 00:40, 1 April 2008 (UTC)

(outdent) Hi, Yilloslime! I ran across Plague and Mukilteo Fairies because of the LGBT WikiProject. We have an on-going project to make sure every person categorized as LGBT has appropriate RS citations, partly to help create List of gay, lesbian or bisexual people, and partly to cut down on vandalism, and partly to abide by WP:BLP. Plague is in Category:Queercore and Category:LGBT musicians from the United States, so he's on the "to-do" list. When I started looking for a reference for his being gay or bisexual, I realized there was a lack of WP:RS material. That's when I prodded it, that's when you added quite a few references (though I question their RS value), and at least the article *looks* much better. You mentioned that Plague is pre-interweb - are there any good books or movies that might be able to help? I've searched Google Books, but probably not very thoroughly.

So, a bit of my own rambling later, I'll conclude by saying I'm not on any sort of clean-out-the-chaff kick. Of the articles you mentioned, only Mecca Normal comes close to being anywhere near my normal subjects, so I probably wont run roughshod over any of them :) Sorry for being such a bother, and I hope there's no hard feelings. Happy editing! -- SatyrTN (talk / contribs) 02:07, 1 April 2008 (UTC)

Definitely no hard feelings. I'm just venting my frustration. It's not fun watching something you've worked on get deleted. (Although the AfD ain't over til it's over.) Yilloslime (t) 02:51, 1 April 2008 (UTC)

Carolena Nericcio article

Thank you for your comment! I have re-written the article, would you mind taking a look?

It is taking me a while to get my head round how everything works on wiki, I keep getting tagged for things accidently before I even get chance to spot and change my own mistakes, Hope my revised article is ok. Let me know, take care ChaosBaby (talk) 02:06, 1 April 2008 (UTC)

Speaking of user pages...

I recently uploaded an image you might find handy:

The SVG conversion left a bunch of gaps I didn't have a chance to fix... plus I deleted one of his hooves... if you use this yourself and decide to touch it up, feel free to upload your fixes! --❨Ṩtruthious ℬandersnatch❩ 04:09, 1 April 2008 (UTC)

Why *thank you*!! Where in the world will I put a one-hooved, treed Satyr? Hm - that might take some thought.... =D -- SatyrTN (talk / contribs) 05:45, 1 April 2008 (UTC)

Commendation

I would like to commend you for your tireless work in making sure that LGBT issues are covered in a fair and balanced way on wikipedia. Well done! Contaldo80 (talk) 09:06, 1 April 2008 (UTC)

Aww! Thank you! That isn't an April Fool's joke, is it? =D -- SatyrTN (talk / contribs) 14:14, 1 April 2008 (UTC)

ITU-T etc.

Hi, you deleted the article Malcolm Johnson (Director) a couple of days ago, even though the talk page mentioned the article was built from material released into the public domain. In such cases, you're supposed to (short version) instruct the editor to mail permissions-en at wikimedia dot org, to show that they're authored to use the content.

Furthermore, you blocked the account based on the username policy, without any warning, or reasoned discussion. People are usually very open to eg. username changes, but simply notifying them they've been blocked with a template is a horrible idea. In a case like this, when dealing with a representative of an organization, you'll end up creating bad publicity for Wikipedia, and drive away knowledgeable contributors. So in short, I'd appreciate if you undeleted things, listed it on WP:CP instead to wait for a confirmation e-mail, and unblocked the user, while leaving a comment about the naming policy instead. Or barring that, I'll do it if you want that instead. Thanks. - Bobet 23:50, 31 March 2008 (UTC)

Hi, Bobet! You seem to have some knowledge about either the person or the ITU. Here's the timeline and my reasoning:

When I came across the article, it was tagged db-copyvio by User:Delicious carbuncle. I read through what was there, and parts of it were copied, though I didn't examine the article fully. It had been previously tagged copyvio (the day before) by "Delicious carbuncle" and deleted by User:DJ Clayworth. Furthermore, it was a single edit that had an infobox, a photo, full wikilinks, and eight refs (though almost all of them to the same page). My impression when I looked at it was that it was an advert-type of article that was re-created periodically.

I don't know a whole lot about copyvio, but I'm reluctant to restore the article. WP:CP says to list there "If you are not sure who originally authored the material," but we do in this case. I'm totally willing to let the user know about WP:DCP, but if you know more about copyrights, you may want to chime in. And if you really feel it's okay to restore the article, I will, but I'm a tad reluctant.

As for the user, I'm willing to unblock, but the WP:USERNAME says "Use of Wikipedia for promotion of a company or group is not permitted, and accounts that do this will be blocked." This seems to be a username editing an article strongly related to the company, and in a way that could be considered "promotion". I'm totally willing to unblock and request a username change, and will do so now. The user has made a few significant contributions, mostly images, in the past six months, so perhaps the block was unwarranted. But I'm very concerned about this being a group account doing promotional edits.

Let me know how else I can help. -- SatyrTN (talk / contribs) 01:44, 1 April 2008 (UTC)

Thanks for the reasoned reply and the unblock. I usually wouldn't mind a COI block, but I looked over the account's edits and they've posted stuff on article talk pages for comment before putting them live. The ITU-T is the standardization part of the international telecommunications union, which is an intergovermental organization working under the UN, so I'd hope there's not that much reason for them to push a POV. However, I've the same problem with you with the account's name and the comment on its userpage, since the account does appear to be shared, which is specifically not permitted, and can really lead to problems when an account is representing a large organization. I hope the comment you left on their talk page will fix that (unless they left for good after the block). - Bobet 11:14, 1 April 2008 (UTC)

I don't think they've left for good. I got a long email as well, right after unblocking. Just because I'm curious, how did you run across the situation? -- SatyrTN (talk / contribs) 14:16, 1 April 2008 (UTC)

I have the page H.323 on my watchlist and saw someone add categories to it. Then I thought, "I'm sure that page had categories before" and looked at the history, saw the username there (they'd rewritten the whole article a while back and forgot to include categories) and looked at their contribs, talk, and saw that they were blocked. Or something pretty close to that. The point of the story therefore is: always use edit summaries. (Because otherwise I probably wouldn't have noticed the diff or looked at the history on H.323) - Bobet 16:05, 1 April 2008 (UTC)