Talk:Sachsenhausen concentration camp

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[edit] Value of fake currency

"This fake currency is considered very valuable by collectors." - actually a Bernhard fiver cost less than a real one from the same period. Jooler 18:09, 1 January 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Were there gas chambers at Sachsenhausen?

I just finished merging Sachsenhausen (Oranienburg) into this, and made a few other changes, one of which was to reword "...the mass murders with gas took place in other concentration camps further east" to "It is worth noting that organised mass murder with gas did not happen at Sachsenhausen; instead, this took place in death camps that were further eastwards." However, the Wikitravel guide to Sachsenhausen ([1]) mentions: "In 1942, the additional section known only as Station Z was constructed. Designed for murdering people clinically and quickly, Station Z consisted of a gas chamber, a firing range and a crematorium. While small in comparison with the death factories of places like Auschwitz, on several occasions up to 5000 people in a several days were executed here."

I've visited Sachsenhausen, and I recall that when we were given a tour of Station Z (all that remains are the foundations) that the guide didn't mention gas chambers (the preferred method, I seem to remember, was a shot through the side of the neck). Can anyone clear this up? Thanks.--Doug (talk) 17:48, 28 March 2006 (UTC)

Yes, there was a gas chamber. Here's a picture of the ruins, along with some history. Jpatokal 03:30, 29 March 2006 (UTC)
Thank you! I've added your link to the Related links section, and corrected the error I made in the article on the presence of gas chambers. I'm still not completely satisfied with what I've written though - the point I was trying to make is that Sachsenhausen was primarily designed to house political prisoners, etc. and later Russian POWs - and not that it was (originally) designed as a tool of the Holocaust. Doug (talk) 21:08, 29 March 2006 (UTC)


The link above is confusing - scrapbooks - the article and discussion says gassing took place but the link says that the prisoners to be gassed were evacuated to Poland a year before the gas chamber was built. I believe several "historians" - proholocaust - ( a consensus ) have stated that no gassing took place in Germany. Is wikipedia disputing their findings?

Like all other camps in Germany, Sachsenhausen was a concentration camp, not an extermination camp. It's clear that a gas chamber was built, so it was probably used, but certainly never on anything remotely approaching the scale of places like Auschwitz. What "several historians" are you referring to? Jpatokal 05:22, 27 January 2007 (UTC)
there was a gas chamber here, but was never properly used, as the fan they used, to vent the gas, did not function properly. Instead of taking in the fresh air it took in the gas, so worked backwards, so they stopped using it. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 86.137.223.121 (talk) 19:33, 28 March 2007 (UTC).


It would appear that the Germans were too stupid to unscrew the fan and rotate it 180 degrees. I hope there is a better reason as to why there was no gassing, this sounds pretty farfetched ( how could people as dumb as this run anything, the Germans would have been in the dark, not being able to figure out this new thing called electricity.)159.105.80.141 13:46, 3 May 2007 (UTC).

There was no neccesary evidence of gas chambers as Sachsenhausen


As far as I understand after a tour at the site, there was a PROBABLY a gaschamber at the installtion Station z. Arceologists have not found the exeact spot (due to blow up of the installation by the Soviets in the 1950´s) but claims it is probably located in one of the corners of the building. Henrikpaulsson (talk) 21:37, 15 January 2008 (UTC)

[edit] "Subversive" artwork

Under the heading The Sachsenhausen camp today (was Open to the public), what is meant by "...subversive artwork"? I don't understand the writer's intent; was this a Nazi or Soviet designation, rather than what the artists themselves considered subversive? This requires clarification for NPOV, let alone disambiguation. For now, I've added quotation marks to the term. --Thanks, Deborahjay 04:51, 17 June 2006 (UTC)

[edit] References section added

I've created a References section, adding only the print source for my own editing today. (The citation will be corrected with the volume and page nos. of the Encyclopaedia of the Holocaust English edition when I can check this in the library.) I've asked the editor of the Soviet special camp section to follow suit. -- Deborahjay 05:56, 17 June 2006 (UTC)

Deborahjay, in response to your posting to my talk page: Mine was a small edit. I have no references. (Indeed I came to this page from the List of war crimes page looking for some about the Soviet special camp). --Philip Baird Shearer 06:29, 17 June 2006 (UTC)

Thanks, Philip, for your helpful response. At my first opportunity, I'll review the article's edit history to identify who wrote the pertinent material, and contact them accordingly. --Cheers, Deborahjay 07:39, 17 June 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Documentation lacking for section on Soviet camp

I have added requests for documentation for the following and other claims in this section. "By the closing of the camp in the spring of 1950, there had been approximately 60,000 people imprisoned there, at least 12,000 of whom died of malnutrition and disease." I have also removed broken links. Skywriter 22:22, 21 September 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Inexperienced User and Repeated Reverts

The above requests for documentation have been deleted by an apparently new and inexperienced user who does not seem to grasp the need for and requirement for documentation. The above request for documentation is reinstated and I ask this new and apparently inexperienced user to please avoid labeling colleagues as "trolls" or "vandals" as this is both off-putting and can quickly lead to troubles.

I will restate what is needed: Documentation of what transpired at the camps under Soviet control and buttressing of the claims of mass fatalities. These are not trivial claims and can not be included in any encyclopedia without documentation. Please cite credible websites, journals or books that originally provide this information. Original research or personal belief does not substitute for documentation.

Thank you. Skywriter 19:04, 22 September 2006 (UTC)

Oh yes, becuase there's a "docuemntation needed", I see. But I don't see any documenatation in the article at all, how can it be? I don't see any links or [citation needed]s with the Nazi period atrocities and the numbers of the victims, how it can be? The number of the links for the article is ZERO - not even a single one, but I don't see anyone questioning this. Or should I post [citation needed] everywhere? (of course, I won't) Just GO AWAY. Oh, and you can always visit the museum of the Special Camp 7, if you want. Or the museum of the Special Camp 2 in Buchenwald.[2] --HanzoHattori 14:37, 23 September 2006 (UTC)

Thank you for taking the time to reply, HanzoHattori. I have read the page to which you refer-- http://www.scrapbookpages.com/Buchenwald/GermanMuseum.html It says the site is "like a poor man's version of the glitzy Buchenwald museum for the Communist victims of the Nazis." Unfortunately, this is not documentation of alleged Soviet atrocities, which I requested. The museum was apparently built by the Soviets in memory of Communist victims of the Nazis. Your use of "Everybody does it" is a not a rational defense for the absence of citations on this issue. I flagged what caught my eye, due to the demands of research I am doing. If you or someone else requires documentation for the rest of the page, please flag it, and the folks who entered it will supply documentation, or the unsupported material will be deleted. That is the Wikiepdia way. I have flagged what I saw as unproven, according to the needs of my current research. You have not proven the claims in that paragraph. Please respect Wikipedia policies of no original research and the affirmative use of clear citations for all that is entered into the encyclopedia. HanzoHattori, "Just GO AWAY" is not an appropriate response to a request for documentation. Disputes are resolved. They do not "Just GO AWAY". Please try again. The request for citation is reinstated. Courteously, Skywriter 17:03, 23 September 2006 (UTC)


RE I have just read that the Russians captured the complete concentration records fron Oranieberg. It appears from this article that this was the administrative center for the entire German camp system. Are these records available? One source I stumbled across says an exact accounting of each camp's population, deaths, supplies, personel, etc is there for the entire period - 1930s till nearly the end of WW2. If so this must be a scholar's dream - or nightmare.

[edit] copyedits of 9 April 2007

I am reverting back to restore the edits I made today. The section header 'The camp under the Soviet Stalinists' is unencyclopdic in tone - just 'Soviets' is fine, since 'Stalinist' is perjorative. The first sentence refers to the camp as a 'former protective custody camp', which is Nazi propaganda. The assertion that anti-soviet activities for which some inmates were imprisoned was 'proved' (in scare quotes) by torture is too sweeping - it is true in some cases, no doubt, but some may have been caught red-handed. Squiddy | (squirt ink?) 14:44, 9 April 2007 (UTC)


Death March - April 20, 1945 - where would you go? The Russians were massing outside Berlin on Aril 1, 1945 - there was no "west" to march to for the Germans. The prisoners liberated by the Russians appear to be the whole bunch. Where did the administrative records end up?159.105.80.141 19:21, 10 May 2007 (UTC)

[edit] What about the staff??

I have been to Sachsenhausen gedentstett. And I have searched for information about the staff, esepicially the medical staff, att this camp. Is i possible that this camp was used for education of nurses and doctors? At the Gedenkstett today, it's possible to see photos of staff. But who did what at this horrible place during WWII? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 212.181.205.4 (talk) 06:49, 24 March 2008 (UTC)