Template talk:S-rel

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I would like to add Sith as an option (for the relevant Star Wars articles). The added code to the top section should be:

|si=[[Sith|Sith titles]]

And to the bottom section it should be:

  • si = Sith titles

Thank you!
–Whaleyland ( Talk • Contributions ) 16:27, 18 July 2007 (UTC)

N Not done - inappropriate for encyclopaedic entries. If we don't have, say, scientologist or Church of the Flying Spaghetti Monster, we're not going to have Sith, are we? More seriously, I don't think this template is used for fictional religions or characters. ck lostsword•T•C 16:43, 18 July 2007 (UTC)
Actually, maybe it is :S. Still, not done - this is referring to major existing religions. ck lostsword•T•C 16:46, 18 July 2007 (UTC)
I would like to know why a header designated as religious cannot be used for fictional religions? We allow for Gondor and Arnor in Template:s-roy. That seems like a bit of a double-standard. And on a different note, neither of those religions you listed have successive titles, unlike the Sith who have only two lords at a time, which are both successive.
–Whaleyland ( Talk • Contributions ) 17:55, 18 July 2007 (UTC)
There is nothing that prevents you from copying the correct code to that article, but I agree that these templates are meant for nonfictional things only. The one for royalty will need to be fixed at some point. — Carl (CBM · talk) 01:47, 19 July 2007 (UTC)

Contents

[edit] Edit Protect Request

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I am trying to standardize these templates a bit more by adding instruction pages and the such and also I am attempting to remove the required pipe after open parameters. Please make the following changes:

In the template, replace the current: {{{else=Religious offices||{{{test={{{1|}}}|1|}}}}}}{{#switch:{{{1}}}

With: {{#if:{{{1}}}||Religious titles}}{{#switch:{{{1}}} |#default={{{1|Religious titles}}}

This will create a default parameter that will allow old pipe links to work as well as new non-pipe links to work, without negating the integrity of the template.

Also, please add {{/doc}} at the bottom of the template just before the /noinclude to allow the page to link to its document page. Thank you!
–Whaleyland ( Talk • Contributions ) 21:05, 25 July 2007 (UTC)

Are you trying to make it so that the following occurs?
  • {{s-rel|bu}} produces "[[Buddhism|Buddhist titles]]"
  • {{s-rel|other-religion-titles}} produces "other-religion-titles"
  • {{s-rel}} produces "Religious titles"
If so, it might be better to replace the text you're proposing with {{#switch:{{{1}}}|#default={{{1|Religious titles}}} Tra (Talk) 22:36, 25 July 2007 (UTC)
I've made that change, since no other opinions have been raised. Tra (Talk) 01:18, 26 July 2007 (UTC)
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Can you make a similar change so that {{s-rel|ac}} produces "[[Anglican Communion|Anglican Communion titles]]"? It's kind of odd that the template would support a national branch of the Anglican Communion (the Church of England) and not support the Communion itself. --Tim4christ17 talk 14:14, 29 July 2007 (UTC)

Done - Nabla 17:28, 30 July 2007 (UTC)

{{editprotected}} It looks like we finally have the solution to the open parameter problem. Please replace:

{{#switch:{{{1}}}

|#default=Religious titles

with:

{{#switch:{{{1}}}

|#default=Religious titles

This will default all open open parameters to the default. Thank you!
–Whaleyland ( Talk • Contributions ) 00:39, 3 August 2007 (UTC)

Wait, wouldn't that make the default "Royal titles"? And what is this <nowiki> tag doing in the middle of the thing? Circeus 00:43, 3 August 2007 (UTC)
Sorry, the above version should work now. I was using the same request on multiple pages and forgot to change it. Ignore the nowiki too, it was for making the template properly viewable from the non-source page.
–Whaleyland ( Talk • Contributions ) 00:49, 3 August 2007 (UTC)
Done. Cheers. --MZMcBride 16:06, 3 August 2007 (UTC)

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"Religious offices" at the bottom of the code should read "Religious titles" as per the top listing. Not sure how that got out of alignment. Thank you!
–Whaleyland ( Talk • Contributions ) 16:14, 3 August 2007 (UTC)

Y Done --ais523 16:28, 3 August 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Adding the word "religious"

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Any chance someone could add the word "religious" into each option, so it reads (for example) "Jewish religious titles". The terms "Jewish titles" and so on just don't seem to scan well. I'd suggest the ones that could do with editing are:

Current text Code Proposed text
Buddhist titles bu Buddhist religious titles
Orthodox Church titles or Orthodox religious titles
Islamic titles is Islamic religious titles
Jewish titles jw Jewish religious titles
Shī‘a Islam titles sh Shī‘a religious titles
Sunni Islam titles su Sunni religious titles

We might also want to do the others. Thoughts? — OwenBlacker 17:44, 8 September 2007 (UTC)

There should be discussion and consensus before this change is made. Cheers. --MZMcBride 20:55, 8 September 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Pre-Schism titles

I'm not sure how best to deal with this, but there may be POV issues with the application of this template to historical figures. The Roman Catholic Church and the Eastern Orthodox Church split in the 11th century; prior to this, they claim a common history. Less significantly, in England, the Church of England declared itself out of communion with Rome in 1534; prior to this, it claims the history of the Catholic church in England as its own. Chad of Mercia, though, is currently marked as holding (in the 9th century) the "Catholic Church titles" of Bishop of the Mercians and Lindsey People and Bishop of the Northumbrians. This attribution to the modern Roman Catholic Church of the shared histories of the Catholic, Orthodox and Anglican churches could be viewed by some as somewhat controversial - while it is certainly what the Roman Catholic Church asserts, it is at least nominally disputed by the other churches, who would view their descent from the early church as just as valid.

Perhaps less significantly, the article, after various prolonged and inconclusive debates, seems to be settled at the moment at Roman Catholic Church, due to the contentious and sometimes ambiguous meanings of the term 'Catholic'. Shouldn't this template follow suit? TSP 04:14, 13 November 2007 (UTC)

You have a point, there, TSP. There is admittably an amount of ambiguity during certain historic periods. However, I should also like to draw your attention to the fact that the headers describe titles as opposed to individuals, something which should clear up at least some ambiguities, given that titles are long chains that can more easily be assigned to a specific religion (or branch thereof) from which they have originated or to which they were later closely connected.
On the Roman Catholic Church header, you have my support. The header ought to be precise and reflect Wikipedia's consensus on the name. But I am not the one to decide this. Basically, I believe you should bring both issues to WikiProject Succession Box Standardization's talk page. I am afraid these template talk pages are not much watched and few people answer posts here. Waltham, The Duke of 11:22, 13 November 2007 (UTC)
Fair enough - I probably shall. I note that for most religions there are not specific denominational entries in here - there are, for example, simply 'Jewish titles', despite the existence of Reform Judaism, Orthodox Judaism, and so on.
To answer your specific issue - it is true that the template refers to titles rather than individuals; however, this doesn't remove the problem. For example, Paulinus of York is described as holding the Catholic Church titles of Bishop of York and Bishop of Rochester, both of which are now titles solely in the Church of England, which traces a continuous inheritance back to these individuals. You could say that these were Roman Catholic Church titles until the English Reformation, after which they were Church of England titles (though that still leaves you in a bit of a grey area with people like Thomas Cranmer), but that would seem to explicitly deny the Church of England's claim to be the continuation of the Catholic church in England, which seems POV. TSP 14:08, 13 November 2007 (UTC)

Transferred to Wikipedia talk:WikiProject Succession Box Standardization#S-Rel_-_Pre-Schism_Titles —Preceding unsigned comment added by TSP (talk • contribs) 19:45, 13 November 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Change of title for Catholic Church titles

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Following the discussion at Wikipedia talk:WikiProject Succession Box Standardization (WT:SBS#Catholic or Roman Catholic?), I ask for the header produced by the "ca" parameter to change from Catholic Church titles to Roman Catholic Church titles. Waltham, The Duke of 16:13, 23 February 2008 (UTC)

Y Done Happy‑melon 16:39, 23 February 2008 (UTC)

[edit] Color

Per [1] can we change Orthodox Church titles to the appropriate color? Thanks. Grk1011 (talk) 15:18, 17 March 2008 (UTC)

I fear that we follow not such rules, my dear compatriot. Succession box headers are strictly thematic, as opposed to infoboxes, and thus each of them has one colour which is used for all of its parameters. (You might wish to see the chart at Template:S-start#Headers.) Thank you for your suggestion, all the same. Regards, Waltham, The Duke of 02:26, 19 March 2008 (UTC)

[edit] Edit request

{{editprotected}} Please update {{/doc}} with {{documentation}}. Per Wikipedia:Template documentation/List Thankyou. -- ṃ•α•Ł•ṭ•ʰ•Ə•Щ• @ 06:28, 28 April 2008 (UTC)

Done. – Luna Santin (talk) 08:30, 28 April 2008 (UTC)