Talk:Rules of Acquisition
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This article was nominated for deletion on 6 January 2008. The result of the discussion was keep. |
Contents |
[edit] Rule 107
Win or lose, there's always Huyperian beetle snuff.
I've heard that said and seen it on various editions on here but in checking the sources deemed as "official", below, on this Talk page, I did not find it. It's such a nice rule though. I quote it often at work. In fact, I know many workplaces that appear to be run in strict compliance with the F.R.O.A.
I had a print-out up where I work and removal can be deemed a religious offence!Achim 17:41, 2 October 2006 (UTC)
[edit] Armada: Possible Rule Resource
Hi, I deleted ST Armada 2 from my computer a while ago, but in game, the Ferengi state some of the rules of acquisition when stealing your ships. Its possible some of them were not mentioned in DS9. Has anyone checked that resource?
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- Stuff mentioned in the games probably shouldn't be listed as its not considered canon? Rmkf1982 01:26, 28 December 2006 (UTC)
[edit] Rule #67
Anyone know if #67 was a direct homage to Joseph Heller? Cburnett 00:02, 1 Mar 2005 (UTC)
[edit] Episode linking/numbering
I think it would be nice if all the rules mentioned were linked from this page. So rule #X would have a link to each episode it appears in. Cburnett 18:01, Apr 3, 2005 (UTC)
For example:
- 95. Expand or die. (False Profits (VOY))
with the episode name followed by the three-letter abbreviation found at Wikipedia:WikiProject Star Trek. Cburnett 18:06, Jun 8, 2005 (UTC)
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- I've added in episode citations for any rules i could find. The rest seem to have been made up. Rmkf1982 01:26, 28 December 2006 (UTC)
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[edit] Canonicity
Why are all of these made-up rules here? I can see Ira Behr's book as a legitimate reference, but stuff from a site that has no affiliation w/ Paramount doesn't belong here.--StAkAr Karnak 17:40, 8 Apr 2005 (UTC)
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- Compare the Rules from totse.com with the authentic ones listed (with sources cited) at Memory Alpha.
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- Totse says at the bottom of their page: "The author wishes to thank the folks who have posted rules on CompuServe and Genie and those who sent them in to us (including ... and others) for reporting and/or creating these words of Ferengi wisdom. Material copyrighted to the original authors, and its inclusion here is not meant to be a violation of any copyright laws. Additional rules will be added to the list from time to time. Suggestions for additional rules would be welcomed. Corrections and revisions would be welcome as well."--StAkAr Karnak 19:12, 9 Apr 2005 (UTC)
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- Yep - i've taken out all of the made up ones, or at least I'm about to - see discussion at the end. Anything without a source will be disappearing soon unless anyone objects. Rmkf1982 01:26, 28 December 2006 (UTC)
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- Can we include the ones from Ira Behr in in a different section... and can someone verify if these are in fact correct from that book? http://www.hoogeveen.tv/quark/rules.htm Angelo 00:51, 10 January 2007 (UTC)
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- Nevermind, I'm an idiot. I was under the mistaken impression that Ira Behr had made a complete set. Angelo 00:56, 10 January 2007 (UTC)
[edit] Messed up list?
[edit] # 16
"A deal is a deal" was mentioned as #16 not #15 on DS9 Melora #426 (Around 35min in). ---- unsigned comment
- this has been fixed Rmkf1982 01:26, 28 December 2006 (UTC)
[edit] # 1
And the so-called #0 on this list is actually #1... This list is apparently messed up. Cburnett 23:40, Jun 26, 2005 (UTC)
- not sure what this meant but its also fixed. don't know why i'm replying to 18 month old comments but there you go Rmkf1982 01:26, 28 December 2006 (UTC)
- Though #76 is correct. So much be up through that break there. Cburnett June 28, 2005 04:43 (UTC)
- 22 is correct as well. Must be somewhere between there and 1. Cburnett June 28, 2005 17:33 (UTC)
[edit] Canon
Almost halve of these rules are non-canon, and should not be here.
- As much as I disagree with this anon user's "no non-canon material anywhere!" policy, I have to admit that in this case the rules in question were made up and not even officially licensed with Paramount. I have deleted them again. — JIP | Talk 19:27, 13 August 2005 (UTC)
- gone Rmkf1982 01:26, 28 December 2006 (UTC)
[edit] Addendum by Francis Cavanagh
I have tried to keep a list at home, at it's by no means complete or canon. So tell me if you want me to edit, what can be added, what not. I don't want to mess up the page too much...
- "3a", "8b", etc.: Another version I have seen or heard.
I have not kept sources, sorry... I will come back and add the vidiot.com sources.
A lot of it is from or also found at the Michael J. Baker book and website.
Honestly, since this is a pretty well a closed list. No more Star Trek episodes will be made for a long time, especially not with Ferengi. We should just consider everything on the list, make a note of the so-called non-canon ones, and just enjoy the list.
A compromise suggestion would be to put these in a separate department, called "Non-Canon Rules". At least they should be posted somewhere, and enjoyed, because some are very cool!!!
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- cool as they may be they've no place in an article about material created within the fictional star trek universe, which is what the star trek project in wikipedia is about (correct me if i'm wrong), so I don't think anything other than canon i.e. onscreen or semi-canon (ira behr's books as he created the rules) should be there. Rmkf1982 01:26, 28 December 2006 (UTC)
It's all good!
- 2 Once you have their money, never give it back.
- 3a* You can always buy back a lost reputation.
- 4 Sex and profits are the two things that never last long enough.
- 5 If you can't break a contract, bend it.
- 8b* Keep count of your change
- 10a* A dead customer can't buy as much as a live one.
- 11 Latinum isn't the only thing that shines.
- 12 Anything worth selling is worth selling twice.
- 13 Anything worth doing is worth doing for money (cf vidiot.com)
- 14 Anything tolen is pure profit
- 15 Acting stupid is often smart
- 16 was also given as 18.
- 17a* A bargain usually isn't
- 18a* Beware of relatives bearing gifts
- 19 Don't lie too soon after a promotion
- 19a Satisafaction is not guaranteed
- 20 When the customer is sweating, turn up the heat
- 23 Nothing is more important than your health. Except for money. (cf vidiot.com)
- 23a Money can always replace dignity
- 25 Fear makes a good business partner
- 27 There's nothing more dangerous than an honest businessman. (cf vidiot.com)
- 30 Talk is cheap, synthehol costs money
- 32 Be careful what you sell. It may do exactly what the customer expects.
- 40 She can touch your lobes but never your latinum.
- 41 Profit is its own reward.
- 41a Money talks, but having lots of it gets more attention.
- 43 Caressing an ear is often more forceful than pointing a weapon
- 44 Never confuse wisdom with luck.
- 47: "never trust"... is more correct
- 52 Never ask when you can take.
- 58 There is no substitute for success.
- 58a* Friendship is seldom cheap
- 60 Let's you and him fight.
- 60a Keep your lies consistent.
- 60b Never use credit when your word will do.
- 61 Never buy what can be stolen.
- 65 Win or lose, there's always Huyperian beetle snuff.
- 69 Ferengi are not responsible for the stupidity of other races. (I LOVE that one!)
- 70 Get the money first, then let the buyer worry about getting the merchandise.
- 77 Every once in a while help your ennemies. It confuses the hell out of your enemies. (goes with 76)
- 79 Beware of the Vulcan greed for knowledge.
- 82 The flimsier the product, the higher the price.
- 85 Never let the competition know what you're thinking.
- 89 Ask not what your profits can do for you, ask what you can do for your profits.
- 97 Enough...is never enough.
- 99 Trust is the biggest liability of all.
- 101 Never do something you can make someone do for you.
- 102 was also given as 22.
- 103a* Sleep can interfere with negociations
- 104 Faith moves mountains...of inventory.
- 106 There is no honor in poverty.
- 109a* Buy, sell, or get out of the way
- 113 Always have sex with the boss.
- 121 Everything is for sale, including friendship.
- 123 Even a blind man can recognize the glow of latinum.
- 123a A friend is a friend until you sell him something. Then he is a customer.
- 141 Only fools pay retail.
- 144 There's nothing wrong with charity...as long as it winds up in your pocket.
- 147 Know your customer before he walks in
- 153 Sell the sizzle, not the steak. (LUV this one, a rule all politicians follow)
- 172 If you can't sell it, don't hesistate to steal it.
- 177 Know your enemies...but do business with them always.
- 181 Not even dishonesty can tarnish the shine of profit.
- 184 (or 191) A Ferengi waits to bid until his opponents have exhausted themselves.
- 192 Never cheat a Klingon...unless you're sure you can get away with it.
- 202 The justification of profit is profit.
- 208 Sometimes the only thing more dangerous than a question is an answer.
- 211a* You can't take a fish out of water
- 216 Never gamble with an empath.
- 217 You can't free a fish from water
- 218 Sometimes what you get free costs entirely too much.
- 218a* Sometimes what you get free costs entirely too much.
- 219 Possession is eleven-tenths of the law.
- 223 Beware the man who doesn't make time for oo-mox.
- 229 Latinum lasts longer than lust.
- 236 You can't buy fate.
- 242 More is good...all is better. (Luv that one!)
- 255 A wife is a luxury...a smart accountant a necessity.
- 261 A wealthy man can afford anything except a conscience.
- 284 Deep down, everyone's a Ferengi. (LUV that one too!)
Francis Cavanagh 06:47, 19 January 2006 (UTC)
[edit] #117 and #217 the same
I assume this is an error? They're both "You can't free a fish from water."
[edit] #18 and #74 the same too
I assume this is an error as wellDisparager 16:22, 15 September 2006 (UTC)
[edit] Copyright?
Canon or not, isn't this massive list a copyright violation?--Drat (Talk) 06:40, 12 September 2006 (UTC)
The book is certainly copyrighted, but you can find the rules listed on so many websites by now that it would be quite a task for Paramount to go after anybody. Perhaps they would see it as more free advertising for themselves? I wish they could have a whole series just about the Ferengi world. They could have contests and prizes. Winners get a free case of Sluggo-Cola, the slimiest cola in the universe, with at least 40% algae - in every bottle! Achim 17:46, 2 October 2006 (UTC)
- Having a list of the rules taken from the book verbatim is a massive and blatant copyvio, sorry. A list of the rules actually said on screen would not be a copyvio, but since there was no indication which rules were which, I have been forced to remove the list in its entirety. Sorry about this. I have managed to find an acceptable list in the history. Morwen - Talk 14:43, 8 November 2006 (UTC)
- i've added onscreen sources so copyright shouldn't be a problem now - see below Rmkf1982 01:26, 28 December 2006 (UTC)
Apparently around 1997 (maybe earlier), Viacom cracked down on copyright infringement on the Web and made people take down their lists of the rules. It's mentioned here: http://www.nitcentral.com/askchief/ac971121.htm ... If more info about this crackdown can be found, please add it to the article! —mjb 08:10, 10 September 2007 (UTC)
[edit] Sources have been added
I have added episode sources for all rules that were stated and numbered on screen. I've also added book references for those rules mentioned in the "Ferengi Rules of Acquisition" and "Legends of the Ferengi" books written by the creator of the rules, Ira Steven Behr.
This, incidentally, should alleviate copyright concerns as they are cited quotations from televised episodes.
The remaining rules as far as I can make out are all made up and totally unrelated to official or even semi-official (like the books) canon. Unless there are any objections, I intend to remove "rules" 5 8b 8c 10b 14 15 20 24 25 26 28 29 30 32 36 37 39 42 43 46 49 50 51 53 61 65 68 69 70 71 72 73 77 78 84 87 88 91 92 93 96 100 101 103b 105 107 115 116 119 126 127 135 142 143 146 152 153 161 169 171 172 188 191 200 204 212 216 218b 218c 219 231 253 256 260 262 265 267 270 273 277.
I also intend on removing most of the unofficial rules - the ones that are indented are ones i was able to track down, but the ones shown with numbers are as far as i can see, also made up.
We also need sources for the 5 stages - these I know (or at least I'm fairly certain) are legit but we need episode citations please.
I've also removed two links to sites where people had made up their own rules - these have no place in an article that is supposed to be documenting the fictional Star Trek universe in its entirety as they have no standing whatsoever.
If we can get this article right, i.e. no silly made up rules from people with home lists or their own websites etc., it would be a nice, simple little article and one that could be a lot of fun for people to read. Some of the rules (the real ones) are quite funny. Rmkf1982 01:15, 28 December 2006 (UTC)
- Are the rules numbered in the Star Trek universe? The Transhumanist (talk) 04:42, 12 January 2008 (UTC)
[edit] Kilngons in the Rules of Acquisition?
Why would the Klingons be mentioned in the Rules of Acquisition? In the history section of the article it states "In about the 9th Millennium B.C. Gint started writing the Rules of Acquisition laying the basis for Ferengi society." How would the Ferengi know about the Klingons to write rules about them so long ago if neither of them had warp drive. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Specie8470 (talk • contribs) 06:47, 26 March 2008 (UTC)
