Talk:Romnichal

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	Romnichal is part of the WikiProject Romani people, an attempt to build a comprehensive guide to the Romani people on Wikipedia. If you would like to participate, you can edit this article, or visit the project page, where you can join the project and/or contribute to the discussion.
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This article was nominated for deletion on 22/2/2006. The result of the discussion was keep.

Are Romnichal ethnic Gypsies or simply considered Gypsies because of their way of life. I have seen images of Romnichal, never met one in person, and they do not look of Indian origin as do the Gypsies of Spain and the Balkans.--Burgas00 11:55, 6 April 2006 (UTC)

Yes, british-born Rom are genetically Rom, altho typically, visually leaning heavily towards fair-skinned. It may be worth pointing out that Romnichal (Romani Chal - Romany fellow) is Masculine, and Romnichel (Romani Chi/Chel - Romany girl) is feminine. Along which thread, I'm curious as to the source of the term 'Romnichal'? I've only ever heard/used the name Rom, or Sons & Daughters of Rome (Romany Chals and Romany Chies). As far as my (very limited) grasp of romanes, rom'ni chel is phonetic rather than a title. --Shaun 01:15, 17 April 2006 (UTC)

A Good reference for the family names (ancesterally 'tribes', current-day 'families' - please, not 'clan') is Romano Lavo-Lil, by George Borrow, 1844 (the 1905 edition of which is freely available from project gutenberg). It gives Hearne (lit. 'hairy fellow'), Stanley (from Stony Lea, geographical), Lovel (lit. 'amiable'), Boswell, Lee (lit. 'leek' or 'onion'), and Carter/Cartwright/Cooper - literally a Cart Fixer. The later, along with Miller (flour-fellow) and Smith (horseshoe-fellow) aren't anecdotal as the English also adopted professions as surnames at a similar stage. However; Stanley, Smith, Boswell, Cooper and Lee were very prominent families within the history of English Rom (and all outlined within same said source).

[edit] Romanichal

Many true Romanichal from the families such as Lee, Cooper and Boswell are very dark in appearance but nowadays what tends to happen is many other British travelling groups try and go under the Romani banner and give a false impression. The other problem is with the title 'Gypsy' as every travelling people gets branded as gypsy and it disguises the distinction betweens the different groups. The proper word should be "travellers" such as Irish traveller or showground traveller or Romani traveller. Not all Romanichal travel and Romani is a racial type and not a word to be associated to all travelling people.

True Roms know who is Romani by their Nav (pronounced Nahv which is Romani for name). The real truth it seems is that most travellers in the UK are actually of a European origin such as Irish and Scottish travellers, Show people, circus people and a large number come from the east end of London who took to living in caravans and tents during the summer to supply the much needed work force required for the farms of Kent and Sussex that fed London. The many different origins can be seen in the differences in appearance to some of the families.

At the turn of the 1900's it becoming very much harder to travel and the British councils forced all travelling groups to stay on council sites putting the many different groups together. There is now a majorly mixed breed travelling people who speak a mixed language.

Some families such as some Lees, Coopers and Boswells have been stricter with their laws of marrying out the Romani group and are still dark in appearance where as some others have not been so strict and can be quite fair. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 82.34.227.166 (talk) 17:08, 17 September 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Word for thought

Romnichals are consider gypsies because they are of gypsy desent that immigraded to The British Isle expecially England , Ireland, & some in scotland and do use the gypsy language Romnes ok just telling you

chav

[edit] History

I made a History section with info from here. For the first part, I used the word Romani(es), as in the acception of Ian Hancock, that is politically correct for naming any Romani groups (since all use this as adjective when describing the personal culture, be they Roma, Romnichals, Kale, Sinte) and after the crystalization of the Romnichal group I used this name.Desiphral-देसीफ्राल 10:37, 25 April 2007 (UTC)

Good stuff... I thought this entry could do with a bit of work, particularly when I saw that it had been recommended for deletion as a potential hoax(!), but I've been pretty busy in real life. Dinlo juk 12:28, 25 April 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Was Charlie Chaplin's mother a Romnichal?

It says so here. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 213.196.245.218 (talk) 00:39, 25 December 2007 (UTC)

[edit] The term 'sedentary'?

Is used throughout to distinguish a contrast from a life on the move. Surely static or settled would be better as I believe sedentary to mean sitting rather than standing? Jatrius (talk) 10:56, 26 January 2008 (UTC)

[edit] Neutral point of view

I've tagged the legislation section as it could do with a bit more on the government's POV of legislation - right now it seems very anti-gov. Paulbrock (talk) 13:19, 18 March 2008 (UTC)

[edit] Anglocentrism

Is this article about English Romanies or not? It can't make up its mind on this matter as it occasionally mentions Scotland and Wales too.--MacRusgail (talk) 14:56, 7 June 2008 (UTC)