Talk:Rocket 88
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[edit] Rocket 88 car
- "Step into my rocket and don't be late, baby, we're pullin' out about half past eight".The real Rocket 88 - (the car you can see below), advertised as "the lowest priced car with "rocket engine" - was a chrome sparkling symbol of of the American postwar prosperity that even poor people were getting a taste of at the time.General Motors billed the Olds 88 engine as "Futurmatic".Even a young black man in the segretated South could dream about driving a rocket, movin'on out and cruisin' along. Stephan KŒNIG 09:15, 6 July 2006 (UTC)
[edit] Jackie Brenston
- I suggest a separate article for Jackie Brenston. Verne Equinox 04:57, 29 July 2006 (UTC)
- I have no idea why that redirect exists. Apparently it was created 2 years ago because someone didn't like the article that had been created on the singer. I have deleted the redirect, creating a redlink intentionally. Now a proper article can be created. I'll do the same with Brenston itself if I find it's another redirect. 23skidoo 15:18, 29 July 2006 (UTC)
- A separate article for Jackie Brenston has been created and I have fixed the redirects accordingly. 23skidoo 16:31, 5 November 2006 (UTC)
- I have no idea why that redirect exists. Apparently it was created 2 years ago because someone didn't like the article that had been created on the singer. I have deleted the redirect, creating a redlink intentionally. Now a proper article can be created. I'll do the same with Brenston itself if I find it's another redirect. 23skidoo 15:18, 29 July 2006 (UTC)
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- I put the redirect in two years ago. There were at that time *two* articles, one about Brenston, one about the record, neither one mentioning Ike Turner. I consolidated the two articles (with credit to Turner) into the "Rocket 88" and put a redirect on Benson, not because I "didn't like" the article, but because the article was inaccurate and the only significant accomplishment of Brenston's life was that one doubtfully applied credit. (I also just now went to the Brenston article and changed "recorded" "Rocket 88" to "credited" with "Rocket 88". I have no beef about Brenston, but Ike Turner was a founder of rock and roll and Brenston was a sideman for awhile. Great record, great honking sax and vocal by Brenston (and we still haven't identified the other sax player called "Raymond" on the reconrd by Brenston). Ortolan88 04:44, 6 November 2006 (UTC)
- No worries. I didn't even realize a Brentson article had been created until I was sorting out "What links here" after shifting the band to its own article. 23skidoo 05:41, 6 November 2006 (UTC)
- I put the redirect in two years ago. There were at that time *two* articles, one about Brenston, one about the record, neither one mentioning Ike Turner. I consolidated the two articles (with credit to Turner) into the "Rocket 88" and put a redirect on Benson, not because I "didn't like" the article, but because the article was inaccurate and the only significant accomplishment of Brenston's life was that one doubtfully applied credit. (I also just now went to the Brenston article and changed "recorded" "Rocket 88" to "credited" with "Rocket 88". I have no beef about Brenston, but Ike Turner was a founder of rock and roll and Brenston was a sideman for awhile. Great record, great honking sax and vocal by Brenston (and we still haven't identified the other sax player called "Raymond" on the reconrd by Brenston). Ortolan88 04:44, 6 November 2006 (UTC)
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- I've added refs to the Tosches and Dawson / Propes books, which have sections on "Rocket 88" which were main sources for my contributions. Incidentally, they make it clear that the sax on the record was by Raymond Hill, not by Brenston. Also see discussion at Jackie Brenston.Ghmyrtle 09:41, 6 November 2006 (UTC)
[edit] Rocket 88 band
I have created a separate article at Rocket 88 (band) for this group, as this article should only be about the song. 23skidoo 16:24, 5 November 2006 (UTC)
[edit] Prove it
I took this out of the article:
- An alternate explanation maintains that Brenston, an accomplished pianist, wrote the song to showcase his skill, hence the "88" (the number of keys on a standard piano).
Ike Turner played piano on the cut. Brenston was a sax player. I hate the little {fact} tag things, so I moved this here where it can be properly dealt with. Who can forget Alfred Brendel's "Rocket 105", played on the bg wide Boesendorfer piano? Ortolan88 04:44, 6 November 2006 (UTC)
- Bill Haley, in a 1972 radio interview that I have on tape, goes with the theory that the song was simply named after the car. The fact there's 88 keys on the piano is probably more a coincidence. Of course if anyone can provide a source to support the piano keys assertion, I see no objection to including it at that point. 23skidoo 05:41, 6 November 2006 (UTC)
The "88" in my stagename comes from Dr. John's boast about a piano break, "Dat's what dey call radiatin' on the 88". Ortolan88 14:29, 6 November 2006 (UTC)
[edit] Pete Johnson's Rocket 88
Interesting discussion page. Am including the following reference: All the above versions were in fact preceded by Pete Johnson's track, originally recorded for the Swingtime label in 1949. 83.180.164.137 16:50, 9 November 2006 (UTC)
[edit] Authorship
The article states unequivocally that the song was written by Ike Turner. There is no question whatsoever that Turner had a major and probably lead role in what was recorded in March 1951. However, the credits say - for whatever reason - that the song was written by Brenston. It is also clear that, like many songs, it borrowed freely from earlier sources, including Jimmy Liggins' "Cadillac Boogie". The balance of evidence is that the band - including in all probability both Turner and Brenston - worked it up together in rehearsals before the recording. My only point is that it is overstating the case to state unambiguously that the late great Ike Turner was its SOLE author. Ghmyrtle (talk) 22:42, 12 December 2007 (UTC)
[edit] Deleted content
I'm sorry, but the following text which I removed and was reinstated (with revisions) still doesn't work, because especially given the fact a "Citation needed" tag has been added to the article, such material needs to have a third-party source. Find a book or article that talks about this, and then we can add it. Otherwise it could be seen as a WP:NOR issue. Here is the content I deleted:
- While open to debate, like much of the origins of Rock and Roll music itself, Brenston's and Turner's Rocket 88 might have found inspiration in Big Joe Turner's 1949 classic jump blues number "Fuzzy Wuzzy Honey." Rocket 88 has a strikingly similar, almost note-for-note, horn ending as Big Joe Turner's song half way through. The fact that Big Joe was accompanied by Pete Johnson, who recorded "Rockett 88 Boogie" as mentioned, easily leaves room for the possibility that Ike Turner was influenced by it.
In order to make this acceptable, a source needs to be added that says Ike Turner was influenced by the song cited. Or a source related to Joe Turner that claims Rocket 88 was based upon Fuzzy Wuzzy Honey (?) or Rockett 88 Boogie. 23skidoo (talk) 20:28, 24 January 2008 (UTC)
[edit] Deleted paragraph
Those who subscribe to the definition of rock and roll as the melding of country music with rhythm and blues believe that it is Haley's version of the song, not the Turner/Brenston original, that is the first rock and roll record. No matter which version deserves the accolade, "Rocket 88" is seen as a prototype rock and roll song in musical style and lineup, not to mention its lyrical theme, in which an automobile serves as a metaphor for romantic prowess.
No references to this, OR -- 82.209.225.33 (talk) 07:25, 22 April 2008 (UTC)
