Talk:Richard Rodgers

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Contents 1 Personality 2 Wider Influences 3 Bobby Lee Rodgers 4 Original Research? 5 Unsupported Facts 6 Fair use rationale for Image:Oklahoma-DVDcover.jpg 7 Claim about Rodgers being influenced by Arthus Sullivan 8 Fair use rationale for Image:Sound of Music DVD Cover.jpg

[edit] Personality

I have just seen the documentary The Sweetest Sounds. This article needs to reflect the information about Rodger's personality, his alcholholism and how these things affected/improved his artistic ability. Rodger's children actually talk about being "afraid" of him and also refer to the fact that over the course of his life he consulted with 5 psychiatirsts. Any ideas on how this can be integrated intoa Wiki article without appearing too tabloidish? I will try to draft something up and source quotes from the documentary.

I think there needs to be a section on his alleged mercurial personality. Apparently he was not a very pleasant man (Sondheim did, after all, call him a man of "limited soul") This is not to mean that this article should be gossipy or bitchy- but I do think it adds much to understanding his art (especially since- parradoxically- so much of Rodger's music is emphatically joyful- how did this eminate from a limited or unhappy soul? Disucss!!!)

Talk about the reason(s) why he became a composer!

[edit] Wider Influences

"In 1960, the waltz "My Favorite Things" from The Sound of Music was adopted and transformed into a seminal jazz performance by the saxophonist John Coltrane (Coltrane would frequently play the tune until his death)."

That is real dedication. If Coltrane died frequently, how were his audiences affected? Were they killed too, or merely made ill? --- Instead, how about: "The tune subsequently became a regular part of his répertoire." Bog 01:43, 19 July 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Bobby Lee Rodgers

I have removed this parragraph: "Bobby Lee Rodgers of The Codetalkers, who is a prolific songwriter and master musician and accomplished singer with well over 100 songs in his repertoire, is reported to be Richard Rodgers' direct descendent (Bobby Lee's great aunt claimed direct descent from Richard but this is currently being verified.) http://thecodetalkers.com"

Reasons for removal: Firstly its a puff piece for Bobby Lee Rodgers(whodat?!) and secondly , as the writer himself/herself admits, it is UNVERIFIED!

[edit] Original Research?

The following smells like original research to me:

*My Funny Valentine appeared in the film The Talented Mr Ripley and Bewitched, Bothered and Bewildered appeared in The History Boys. Both songs were used in dramatically similar scenes where one male character expressed his unrequited love for the other (straight) man by singing to him.

1. Songs do not "appear" in films.

2. "Both songs were used" is a passive-voice construction; is there a reason for not using the active voice?

3. "Both songs were used in dramatically similar scenes" smells to me like personal insight and, therefore, like original research.

4. "dramatically similar scenes where one male character expressed his unrequited love for the other (straight) man by singing to him" reeks to the highest heaven of original research with an agenda behind it. (I'm ignoring the fact that the sentence should be written in the present tense.)

5. Does this mean that in The Talented Mr. Ripley Matt Damon sings "My Funny Valentine" to Jude Law? I've seen the movie, but I truly do not remember that scene.

If there are no objections, I intend to remove this item from the Richard Rodgers article on Valentine's Day. ForDorothy 21:48, 3 February 2007 (UTC)

Hi Dorothy,

Thanks for the useful (but confrontationaly-worded and rather hostile) feedback. I posted the entry and I am more than happy to change or remove so that it complies to Wiki standards.

By way of explanation, here is what I was trying to say: The section under which this appears is "wider influence" and I was wanted to illustrate that some of the songs that Rodgers and Hart wrote (not Rodgers and Hammerstein) have been used/ have appeared/ were heard/ been performed in two movies with themes of unrequited gay love. That must count as some form of a wider influence of his work?But yes, I take your point: It is ultimately my opinion. And it might be a refelction of Hart's lyrics more than Rodger's music....

re: the passvie voice. Yes, some of my verbs are passive in this sentence... so what? are you suggesting an appropriate, alternative active verb here? I could have said "Matt Damon sang My Funny Valentine in the Taleted Mr Ripley (and, yes, he did- in one of the best scenes in the movie) but that would emphasise Damon's performance rather than the song. I think you are being pedantic by highlighting the use of the passive voice: the form exists because sometimes it aids and clarifies meaning. I cannot think of a more accurate way to talk about them than to say "were performed"...

dramatically similar scenes where one male character expressed his unrequited love for the other (straight) man by singing to him" reeks to the highest heaven of original research with an agenda behind it. (I'm ignoring the fact that the sentence should be written in the present tense.)" .... you're ignoring that? looks to me like you're highlighting it.

[edit] Unsupported Facts

The article references two Pulitzer Prizes. R&H only won one for SOUTH PACIFIC (see List of Pulitzer Prize winning dramas).

The article references "numerous" schools named after Rodgers yet the link only shows two. 162.83.13.140 13:02, 9 May 2007 (UTC)Jeff in Delaware

[edit] Fair use rationale for Image:Oklahoma-DVDcover.jpg

Image:Oklahoma-DVDcover.jpg is being used on this article. I notice the image page specifies that the image is being used under fair use but there is no explanation or rationale as to why its use in this Wikipedia article constitutes fair use. In addition to the boilerplate fair use template, you must also write out on the image description page a specific explanation or rationale for why using this image in each article is consistent with fair use.

Please go to the image description page and edit it to include a fair use rationale. Using one of the templates at Wikipedia:Fair use rationale guideline is an easy way to insure that your image is in compliance with Wikipedia policy, but remember that you must complete the template. Do not simply insert a blank template on an image page.

If there is other other fair use media, consider checking that you have specified the fair use rationale on the other images used on this page. Note that any fair use images uploaded after 4 May, 2006, and lacking such an explanation will be deleted one week after they have been uploaded, as described on criteria for speedy deletion. If you have any questions please ask them at the Media copyright questions page. Thank you.BetacommandBot 04:47, 6 June 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Claim about Rodgers being influenced by Arthus Sullivan

Although I saw that this page mentioned Arthur Sullivan's name as an influence on Rodgers' music, I doubt that Rodgers could have been influenced by the Gilbert & Sullivan operettas. It strikes me as an unverified comment. Yes I know from reading the Secrest biography that the reviews of his shows with Hart compared the songwriting team to G&S, but Rodgers shrugged off such influences. Rodgers claimed a good deal of influence from Kern and the turn-of-the-century operettas that his parents were seeing. Yip1982. 13:55, 29 July 2007.

[edit] Fair use rationale for Image:Sound of Music DVD Cover.jpg

Image:Sound of Music DVD Cover.jpg is being used on this article. I notice the image page specifies that the image is being used under fair use but there is no explanation or rationale as to why its use in this Wikipedia article constitutes fair use. In addition to the boilerplate fair use template, you must also write out on the image description page a specific explanation or rationale for why using this image in each article is consistent with fair use.

Please go to the image description page and edit it to include a fair use rationale. Using one of the templates at Wikipedia:Fair use rationale guideline is an easy way to insure that your image is in compliance with Wikipedia policy, but remember that you must complete the template. Do not simply insert a blank template on an image page.

If there is other fair use media, consider checking that you have specified the fair use rationale on the other images used on this page. Note that any fair use images uploaded after 4 May, 2006, and lacking such an explanation will be deleted one week after they have been uploaded, as described on criteria for speedy deletion. If you have any questions please ask them at the Media copyright questions page. Thank you.

BetacommandBot 07:30, 29 September 2007 (UTC)