Wikipedia:Reference desk archive/Language/2006 September 22

From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

< September 21	Language desk archive	September 23 >

Humanities Science Mathematics Computing/IT Language Miscellaneous Archives

The page you are currently viewing is an archive page. While you can leave answers for any questions shown below, please ask new questions at one of the pages linked to above.

< August September October >

Contents 1 What does Greensleeves mean? 2 15 words from Portuguese to English

[edit] What does Greensleeves mean?

We all know the old traditional song Greensleeves. But what does its title mean? Is it literally the sleeves of a shirt that are green? Or somebody's name? Or a place? Or is it Old English for "love pain" or something? What does it mean exactly as a word or words?--Sonjaaa 20:10, 22 September 2006 (UTC)

Ahh it looks like it's a lady's name. Apparently her last name? What kind of name is that?--Sonjaaa 20:10, 22 September 2006 (UTC)

Alas my loue, ye look a mess,

to wipe your nose off on your dress

it's quite disgusting, ye must confess

and that's why they call you "Greensleeves".

I don't think it is an actual name more an epithet based on the typical dress of a person. Maybe there was a woman who frequently wore green sleeves so instead of writing "Lady Anne is a right mardy cow" they thought "Greensleeves you are so discourteous" to be more poetic. From there greensleeves became proverbial for an inconstant lover in the same way as "black shirt" and "blue stocking" suggest different kinds of people. BTW that doggerel helps confirm my theory that the internet is the largest toilet door ever created. MeltBanana 21:13, 22 September 2006 (UTC)

From an excellent site, Online Etymology:""Greensleeves," ballad of an inconstant lady-love, is from 1580. Meaning of "a field, grassy place" was in O.E. Sense of "of tender age, youthful" is from 1412; hence "gullible" (1605)." at http://www.etymonline.com/index.php?l=w&p=7 But is it the girl who is gullible or the boy who gets "gulled?"Edison 21:24, 22 September 2006 (UTC)

Oh, dear. Not gulls again. :) DirkvdM 04:26, 23 September 2006 (UTC)

As I understand it, that name came from a time when such bright colors were considered inappropriate for a woman, thus she was a woman of questionable taste, at the very least, and quite possibly a prostitute. I lived in an apartment that had apparently been occupied by a prostitute prior to me, and had a hot pink room, a chartreuse room, etc., so I can relate to this phrase. StuRat 05:16, 23 September 2006 (UTC)

[edit] 15 words from Portuguese to English

I posted this at Wiktionary, but no responses yet. :( I've checked Babelfish, Wiktionary, the Portuguese Wiktionary, and the Portuguese Wikipedia, but I still don't know the direct translation of about 20 words (bolded) from the Brazilian song Águas de Março. Could someone help? Hyenaste ^(tell) 22:33, 22 September 2006 (UTC)

É peroba do campo

A kind of hardwood tree. --Lambiam^Talk 00:09, 23 September 2006 (UTC)

Caingá, candeia

Caingá: another kind of tree. Candeia is something like a lamp ("candle"). --Lambiam^Talk 00:16, 23 September 2006 (UTC)

É o Matita Pereira

Yet another kind of tree. --Lambiam^Talk 00:16, 23 September 2006 (UTC)

Tombo da ribanceira (riverbank?)

I think it's more like a canyon, with steep sides. --Lambiam^Talk 00:19, 23 September 2006 (UTC)

É a viga (beam of light or of wood?), é o vão festa da cumeeira (the Portuguese area?)

Together it refers to a party you hold when, in building a house, the roof beam is in place. I guess vão has something to do with the (wooden) skeleton of the house, but I wouldn't even know the proper terminology in English. --Lambiam^Talk 00:22, 23 September 2006 (UTC)

Oh, I never thought of putting it together as one line. If I am understanding you correctly festa da cumeeira refers to the party? That would mean the beam, the coming of the associated party, which makes perfect sense. Thanks a bunch for these so far! Hyenaste ^(tell) 00:29, 23 September 2006 (UTC)

É conversa, é ribeira das águas de março

(It's a conversation; it's the river of the waters of March?)

This doesn't make much sense; are you sure it's correct? As a poetic metaphor it is over the top. --Lambiam^Talk 00:27, 23 September 2006 (UTC)

É o fim da canseira,

É a mancha estradeira

Pedra de atiradeira

É um regato

É o estrepe

É um belo horizonte (the city?), é uma febre terçã

Did you realize that the article you linked to has an external link offering a translation? You can simply look up the words and phrases you don't know there. --Lambiam^Talk 00:31, 23 September 2006 (UTC)

Ahahaha! I had literally been looking for weeks for the direct translation, but all I could find was pages and pages of the english version, but there my answer was under my nose the whole time. I would be humiliated if I weren't so delighted! Thanks, Lambiam; you rock three levels in this thread alone! Hyenaste ^(tell) 00:41, 23 September 2006 (UTC)