Talk:Ray O. Light Group
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Problem with the Dates?
Article begins thusly:
"Ray O. Light Group or ROL is a small anti-revisionist Marxist-Leninist group in the United States, founded by members of the Communist Party of the USA (CPUSA) who split from the party in 1961.
"Originally called Hammer & Steel (H&S) or, more infrequently, New England Party of Labor, they split from the CPUSA following Krushchev's Secret Speech to the 20th Congress of the CPSU."
But Krushchev's secret speech at the 20th Congress occurred in 1956 and was publicized almost immediately. If this group split in 1961, then maybe they split after a later congress. I recall the 22nd was also a controversial, anti-Stalinist affair. Maybe that congress caused the split?
If not, it's still plain odd to claim that they split because of an event that occurred 5 years before the split.
[edit] Note on organizing
I added a note that ROL does not do organizing in the US. This observation may qualify as "original research", but in many years of activism I have never encountered or heard reference to any work like that. The intention is neither POV nor pejorative, but would seem relevent to the nature of the organization.In the Stacks 16:37, 5 April 2007 (UTC)
- I understand why you might think this! Almost all of their members are secret members. I actually ran into someone from ROL at the January 20th anti-war rally in D.C. Also I know that they do solidarity work with progressive movements in the Philippines. -Humbabba 20:26, 5 April 2007 (UTC)
Regardless, "In the Stacks" is right on something: the note is original research, and hence doesn't belong in wikipedia. Unless he can produce documentation, its OR. Hey, I might even share the impression s/he has, but that is WP:OR all the same. It doesn't even meet WP:IAR criteria as it adds no factual value to the encyclopedic entry!--Cerejota 05:52, 26 April 2007 (UTC)
[edit] Point of view
I feel that this article is nearly effusive in its praise of Ray O. Light. Quotes and comments will be generated momentarily. V. Joe (talk) 15:19, 23 March 2008 (UTC)
1) First quote: I feel this quote praises ROL rather excessively and also makes itself too important
Because of its history Ray O. Light is an important group in International Communist Movement. ROL is close to the Communist Party of the Philippines. It has often been a participant or observer in the International Communist Seminar hosted every year by the Workers Party of Belgium and also regularly attends the International Conference of Marxist-Leninist Parties and Organizations (International Newsletter).
I think noting its alliance with the Communist Party of the Philippines is important, but I don't think that calling it an "important group in the International Communist movement," meets NPOV since it states something which can be stated by the evidence. Kind of like the "Hitler was evil," mention in the Wikipedia:Neutral point of view. This paragraph also gives ROL "undue weight."
2) Second Quote:
Today, Ray O. Light takes several interesting positions within the Marxist-Leninist movement.
. This one is easy to fix. "ROL takes several different positions within the Marxist-Leninist movement.
I am not knowledgable about CPUSA or ROL to really edit the first, but I am going to rewrite quote #2. If someone wouldn't mind taking a look at #1 it could really improve the article. V. Joe (talk) 15:28, 23 March 2008 (UTC)
