Talk:Rattana Pestonji

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[edit] Ummm...

In the article, Pestonji's first name is spelled 'Rattana'. This cannot possibly be officially correct: 'Rattana' is a female name (and the feminine equivalent of 'Rattan'). It is however quite possible that the '-a' was (inofficially) tacked on for cultural reasons specific to Thailand. -- Fullstop 00:17, 3 August 2007 (UTC) ps: the citation in "Rattana Pestonji was born in Bangkok to a family of Persian[1] descent." was false. For one, the source did not say that. For another, the source evidently confused something (its a common error though). pps: The name Pestonji is a patronym. One of the director's forefathers had 'Peston' as his first name. The -ji is a common Indian honorific (something like "sir")

What is the solution on the name issue? Several unique references that exhisted before this article was written have him as Rattana or Ratana. Also, can you provide a definitive reference that will stop the minor edit-warring on Pestonji's ethnicity? — WiseKwai 11:06, 3 August 2007 (UTC)

Well, he's evidently best known with 'Rattana', so I'd leave it at that. On the other hand, noting that his birth name was something else certainly wouldn't hurt.

With respect to your second point: I wasn't previously aware of the edit-warring, but its evidently the same sort of thing as whats going on over at Freddy Mercury, and is based on the same confusion of Parsi (as in Indian Zoroastrian) with parsi (as in person/language of Fars, i.e. Persia proper). While the director's name is unquestionably an Indian Zoroastrian one, very possibly of the Pestonji family of Hyderabad, I don't think its necessary to specify his ethnicity in the article. He was born in Thailand, grew up in Thailand, thought like a Thai and made Thai films. He gained notability as a Thai, and thats really all that counts. Its hardly important where his (grand-)parents came from, and its certainly not important where his ancestors 1000 years ago came from.

-- Fullstop 12:48, 3 August 2007 (UTC)

First and foremost: I appreciate your contributions and the level-headedness that you are bringing to this page. I acknowledge that you weren't engaged in any of the back-and-forth reversions about Rattana's ethnicity. Neither was I. However, I'd like to see it end, and I'd like to find a solution.

Next, what was Pestonji's birthname? Ratt? Other sources refer to him as R. D. Pestonji, which is acceptable, though it brings to mind the question: What do the initials stand for? So yeah, leaving it as it is, is probably the best solution.

As far as his ethnicity being mentioned, I believe that it is notable for a couple of reasons. First, he's not ethnic Thai, and in Thailand, generally that is unusual, to Thai people at least. Also, by mentioning it, it highlights one of the minority communities in Thailand. But I can also see the view to delete it, in that it serves as a lightning rod and is a source of confusion that hasn't been definitively documented by any of the sources that have been brought to the table.

Again, Fullstop, I appreciate your comments and am gratified that another editor is looking at this article. — WiseKwai 16:47, 3 August 2007 (UTC)

Thank you for your kind words.

Next, Pestonji's birthname was 'Rattan' (or 'Ratan' as in Ratan Tata). For sure.

While I could speculate on what the 'D.' stands for, I won't. :) At any rate, 'D.' also represents his father's first name since Parsis inherit their father's first name as their own middle name.

With respect to the lightning rod (nice metaphor!) issue, yes, your're quite right about highlighting the minority community, but I still think its not a critical issue and it can be left out if there are actually people fighting over it. Its a typical reliable source issue and - lacking an authoritative source (what could that be?) - neither side is ever going to "win" this one. There is unfortunately no middle road either: The recent attempt to incorporate both was akin to describing someone to be "of Jewish French descent."

-- Fullstop 20:16, 3 August 2007 (UTC)

The man's Thai name would be transliterated 'Rat' by the current government standards. Phonetically, it's 'Rat' with a high tone. There's an equivalent of Roman 'N', but it's marked as being silent. He probably had to write his own name with Roman letters more than once; I've no idea what he did in those situations.

-- Pathawi 01:10, 3 March 2008 (UTC)