Talk:Rammstein

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December 2005 – January 2006 Febuary 2006 – May 2007

[edit] Redundancy

The members section and history section seem redundant. anyone else agree? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 70.188.246.60 (talk) 02:53, 17 October 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Rammstein is pronounced Rahm-shtine not Ram

Someone keeps changing the phonetic to the improper "ram" instead of "rahm". Listen to any interview with the band mentioning the bands name and you will hear them pronounce it "rahm-shtine". Like here for instance : http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sj1cbnMqrs8 -- 75.179.136.157 07:48, 6 June 2007(signature added by JonnyJD 16:46, 6 June 2007 (UTC))

Or just listen to their title track. ≈ The Haunted Angel 16:56, 6 June 2007 (UTC)

Or learn how to pronounce German.Cameron Nedland 19:21, 7 July 2007 (UTC)

[edit] and German Industrial Cat in C Minor

This and German Industrial Cat in C Minor seems like nonsense and I can't find any information about German Industrial Cat on google. Someone know enough to know if this was a vandal present? Nesnad 06:04, 25 June 2007 (UTC)

Sounds like vandalism, go ahead and remove it. ≈ The Haunted Angel 11:34, 25 June 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Fair use rationale for Image:Sehnsucht.gif

Image:Sehnsucht.gif is being used on this article. I notice the image page specifies that the image is being used under fair use but there is no explanation or rationale as to why its use in this Wikipedia article constitutes fair use. In addition to the boilerplate fair use template, you must also write out on the image description page a specific explanation or rationale for why using this image in each article is consistent with fair use.

Please go to the image description page and edit it to include a fair use rationale. Using one of the templates at Wikipedia:Fair use rationale guideline is an easy way to insure that your image is in compliance with Wikipedia policy, but remember that you must complete the template. Do not simply insert a blank template on an image page.

If there is other other fair use media, consider checking that you have specified the fair use rationale on the other images used on this page. Note that any fair use images uploaded after 4 May, 2006, and lacking such an explanation will be deleted one week after they have been uploaded, as described on criteria for speedy deletion. If you have any questions please ask them at the Media copyright questions page. Thank you.BetacommandBot 04:14, 6 June 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Fair use rationale for Image:Reise-reise.jpg

Image:Reise-reise.jpg is being used on this article. I notice the image page specifies that the image is being used under fair use but there is no explanation or rationale as to why its use in this Wikipedia article constitutes fair use. In addition to the boilerplate fair use template, you must also write out on the image description page a specific explanation or rationale for why using this image in each article is consistent with fair use.

[edit] Fair use rationale for Image:Rosenrot.jpg

Image:Rosenrot.jpg is being used on this article. I notice the image page specifies that the image is being used under fair use but there is no explanation or rationale as to why its use in this Wikipedia article constitutes fair use. In addition to the boilerplate fair use template, you must also write out on the image description page a specific explanation or rationale for why using this image in each article is consistent with fair use.

[edit] Links, 2, 3, 4

Should it be noted that "Links" was used in the concentration camps to select victims for the crematory? (I'm not sure if it was links or rechts that was the crematory) Mendel though would stand and direct people either "Links" left or "Rechts" right. - 68.100.210.50 July 1, 2007 10:47 UTC

Links simply means "Left". "Links 2 3 4" alludes to marching. This is also why you hear marching in the background. --Ich (talk) 06:45, 7 July 2007 (UTC)

Links 2-3-4 is a song that negates the accusations that Rammstein are nazis. "Links" represents their political orientation, and singing "zwo" instead of "zwei" further shows that they have no connection to anything that has to do with nazis or a superior race. The song is militaristic in both sound and lyrics, but you should first find out what Rammstein meant behind this song. --Cjepo (talk) 17:52, 11 January 2008 (UTC)

I dont know about their use of zwo as a sign that they're not connected to nazis whatsoever, but it's the official millitary term for "two", because zwei spoken on the radio could sound like drei, which means three. So to avoid any confusion, they say zwo, instead of zwei. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Chaitai (talk • contribs) 23:52, 25 May 2008 (UTC)

[edit] Most Successful German-language Rock Band?

"With the release of the album Reise, Reise (2004), they became the most successful German-language band of all time." At 12 million albums sold, they are one of the most successful German-language rock bands. According to both the English and German wikis, Puhdys has sold "over 18 million" (.en) and "almost 20 million" (.de) albums, recording almost exclusively in German. As a side-note, a fan site (what was credited) isn't exactly the most reliable of sources for this sort of thing. I have changed the aforementioned sentence in the main article. --Ich (talk) 06:45, 7 July 2007 (UTC)

Forget the Puhdys *g*, remember the "Scorps" - I don't know if the here printed number is correct, but certainly they sold over 50 million records worldwide. And also Blind Guardian are more successful in commercial way I assume (cefaclor)

Maybe the original author wanted to say that Rammstein has sold more albums in german language outside of germany than any other rock band. That could be true as the scorpions are german but don't use german lyrics. And the puhdys might not have sold as many albums OUTSIDE of germany as Rammstein has. 89.166.165.90 19:16, 22 July 2007 (UTC)

Without any further reference at hand, I think Rammstein is always mentioned as being the most commercially successfull german band with german lyrics. There are definitely bands that sold more records, but all of those I know generally use english lyrics. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 85.181.35.150 (talk) 12:59, 15 April 2008 (UTC)

[edit] New lead singer?

According to Blabbermouth, Till Lindemann has been replaced by En Esch. I'd make the change myself, but I decided to bring this here, in case others feel we should wait until the band releases a statement on their website. Thoughts? Nufy8 14:15, 16 July 2007 (UTC)

Holy shit, I didn't know that, and that's bad news... I think its best that we wait 'till the band confirms it. I, on the other hand, will be grieving Till quitting the band... ≈ The Haunted Angel 14:18, 16 July 2007 (UTC)

It's a press release from their management company - Pilgrim Management GmbH. I don't think you can much more confirmed than that. 220.245.107.141 15:17, 16 July 2007 (UTC)

Shit, Till was the greatest vocalist, I don't expect the new guy to be very good. No one could ever replace Till, My real question is how the hell will they do their old shit without till. This may sound bad but I would rather see the whole band end after this album on a happy note than like this. gravediggerfuneral

Till will still be doing vocals on Rammstein's next album. He will not be leaving until after it is completed. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 74.139.217.108 (talk)

It really shouldn't be stated as fact on the Rammstein page. Nothing has been confirmed on the Rammstein website -- and sure, it may be true, but I'd hold fire until a little more evidence has come to light, well other than blabbermouth.net. I mean, I've got Google Alerts sending my instant e-mails every time a internet news article comes up with the word 'Rammstein' in it, and I only got this single one sent to me... If it is true, I'll be devestated to see him go and Rammstein will never be the same without his voice and his lyrics. I really hope that if there's a tour for this new album, Till will go on it, otherwise that'll just be adding insult to injury... --SaraFL 17:32, 16 July 2007 (UTC)

The Blabbermouth article is gone now. I guess it was nothing but a rumor, then, or something. It's insane! (LuvataciousSkull 01:25, 17 July 2007 (UTC))

I bloody hope so... ≈ The Haunted Angel 01:50, 17 July 2007 (UTC)

I am sorry but I don't think it's a fake. It just doesn't look like. Here in Germany there is not often Rammstein playing or anything else about Rammstein in the radio or daily news, but now it is... Okay, last hope: its might be a marketing strategy, but I personally don't think so... (cefaclor)

Until it is proved by the band themselves, this remains a rumor. Remember how it happened with Tarja and Nightwish: it was public and clear, through open letter on band's website.Garret Beaumain 10:13, 17 July 2007 (UTC)

I think it's safe to say that the matter is now dead. The people who released it said it WAS a hoax. So let's all sit back, relax, and be happy it was just a really mean joke. :D (LuvataciousSkull 19:33, 17 July 2007 (UTC))

I just finished posting the official German release from Emanuel Fialik on the matter. It is over. He said that it is all a hoax. So now that we know, it is no longer a current event. It is finished. I am just so happy to see that. However, they didn't post it on rammstein.com! They just put it on rammstein.de! Why do us German speakers get ahead of the crowd? =p --68.14.170.32 04:41, 19 July 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Rammstein Template is ready!

This user likes listening Rammstein

You can use this template.

Code:

:Kızılsungur/rammstein

Danke schön

Teşekkürler, iyi çalışmalar. XD kızılsungur 18:56, 16 September 2007 (UTC)

~Steals~ :P ≈ The Haunted Angel 13:35, 17 September 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Denver?

The public statement about the Columbine shootings as the person saying "Denver" and not "Littleton" is this a mistake on his part or the article itself? -WarthogDemon 21:18, 22 September 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Lyrics

Is it just me or does the author of the lyrics sections seem extremely assumptions without citation to prove the point? Unless it is written otherwise elsewhere by the band, I always understood the song "Du Hast" as a pun, having both meanings of "You have asked me" and "You hate me" (since the words in German are homonyms).

Du... Du hast... Du hast mich... meaning "You have me". This line is often mistaken for "You hate me", because in German, there is no clear distinction between the pronunciation of Du hasst (double S) which means "you hate" and Du hast (single S) which means "you have".

I think the irony lies within the singer building up the lyric. Fruit Blender 19:29, 14 November 2007 (UTC)

For sure - it is not "mistaken as You hate me", but meant as a word play with have and hate - it is musik, which you normaly not read but listen to. I am from Germany and know that the orthography means have, but it is obviously that the listener shall hear "hate" first and than recongnize the meaning out of the weeding ceremony (have). Someone who says that it the entire song is meant to be "have", must have a low view of Rammsteins lyric abilities and their irony. 195.243.51.34 (talk) 10:30, 28 November 2007 (UTC)

Rammstein's lyrics are a powerful tool in expressing feelings and ideals through music. Many of their songs have double-meaning lyrics, and this proves that Rammstein is not a lame metal band, but a true, artistic and powerful group of German musicians. --Cjepo (talk) 17:56, 11 January 2008 (UTC)

Most certainly. Personally I've always enjoyed the ambiguity between "willst du, bis zum Tod, der scheide,..." and "willst du, bis zum Tod der Scheide,..." in "Du has[s]t". And I don't intend explaining that here - email me if you need an explanation! ☺ Tonywalton ^Talk 23:48, 21 April 2008 (UTC)

That's most interesting - Until I read this article I didn't know anybody who even had the idea to understand it as "willst du, bis zum Tod, der scheide,..." (which the author seems to take for the only valid interpretation). I think almost every german fan will tell you that is just one final (and very debasing) rejection of the whole concept marriage. It also serves to make clear that the literary you ("Du") definitely refers to a woman.

And as this is the english wiki and Tonywalton did not explain the difference, I will have to do it: "Tod der Scheide" litterally translates to "death of the vagina".

But it's an interesting point. Reminds me much of a controversy that came up about one line in "Rosenrot": in the booklet it says "Tiefe Brunnen muss man graben/ wenn man klares Wasser will" which roughly translates to "Deep wells must be burrowed / if you want clear water", but a lot of people "misheard" it as "Tiefe Wunden ...", translating to "Deep wounds..." (if you want to know how many, google the "wrong" line).

There are many examples for this kind of ambiguous choice of words or even unclear pronounciation in Rammstein's lyrics.

[edit] "Relation to violent events" - Band statement

This statement allegedly issued by the band was removed without explanation by an anonymous user, and it appears that before the edit could be reverted, another anonymous user vandalized the page, and that edit was reverted to the supposedly "clean" revision by the first anon. I restored the statement, but it lacks a source.

"The members of Rammstein express their condolences and sympathy to all affected by the recent tragic events in Denver. They wish to make it clear that they have no lyrical content or political beliefs that could have possibly influenced such behavior. Additionally, members of Rammstein have children of their own, in whom they continually strive to instill healthy and non-violent values"."

72.200.136.8 (talk) 02:12, 18 January 2008 (UTC)

[edit] Samples

Does anyone else feel that the three samples don't portray varying style very well? Bestrafe Mich, from Sehnsucht, is okay for the early, heavy industrial sound. But Zwitter, from Mutter, seems pointless to me. I know it's there to portray the humorous lyrics, but being this is the English Wiki and the lyrics are German I don't think it accomplishes much. The description already on the page helps more than the audio sample. Ohne Dich, from Reise, Reise, is fine for the purpose of showing the higher vocals, but I think using Nebel from, Mutter, shows that this change happened earlier and frees up using a song from Reise, Reise to show their more current style.

Two of the three examples there are to show the differences in Till's vocal style but they don't show the musical change. I think with a better selection we could show both the differing vocals and the changing musical style.

I don't know the policy on samples, but I think four examples would be ideal.

"Bestrafe Mich" is good for the more industrial Herzeleid/Sehnsucht albums, and shows the deep vocal style.
"Nebel" a clip from around 1:15-1:40 for the higher vocals and slower song styles.
"Mein Teil" a clip from around 2:15-2:40 to show somewhat the style they've used in the last two albums. (I'm not really sure bout this one, the passages on the songs in the last two albums tend to be longer, it's hard to find a 30 sec clip that'd show this well.)
"Feuer und Wasser" if we could have four examples, a clip around 1:55-2:25 would show the contrasting soft and heavier styles as well as the current predominant vocal style.

I think these four songs would show the various styles well without picking a song that's kind of far off track. I mean, a song like Te Quiero Puta shows that they do different things some of the time, but it doesn't show what makes up most of their tracks. --ÐeadΣyeДrrow (Talk | Contribs) 05:11, 3 March 2008 (UTC)

Well if there's no argument I just may go ahead and do this. --ÐeadΣyeДrrow (Talk | Contribs) 09:44, 15 March 2008 (UTC)

[edit] Contradiction

What? "In 1989 he escaped from East Germany over the border between Austria and Hungary"?! Since when does Germany border Austria AND Hungary? CoolKoon (talk) 21:14, 3 March 2008 (UTC)

I think the sentence is trying to describe how he ended up in West Berlin to start Rammstein. Many people in East Germany went through Czechoslovakia then Hungary then through Austria in 1989 to get there. It's not really a contradiction, it's just badly worded or false. I just removed the sentence being that it's unsourced and it's about a living person. It can always be readded properly. --ÐeadΣyeДrrow (Talk | Contribs) 21:41, 3 March 2008 (UTC)

A song about this event. (Note maps in background at start of video.)

I was back-packing both sides of the iron curtain in 1989, speaking English in the West and German in the East. In Hungary, local people thought I was an East German student trying to escape to the West and were extremely helpful to me. Their German was worse than mine, but mine was poor enough not to realize what they were doing until Austrian friends explained it to me in Vienna.

The sentence is precisely correct, it simply doesn't explain the legalities that made this possible. Young people in East Germany could obtain travel documents to travel (Reise ) to Hungary, since both were part of the Soviet Block. Hungary and Austria (Neutral) made a deal in 1989 to open their border. The nations have always had a close relationship (see Austro-Hungarian Empire and Holy Roman Empire) and Austria was neutral in the East-West division. However, because of Austria's neutrality, its borders were also open to the West. East Germany > Hungary > Austria > West. It had to be exactly that way given the way the visas were issued.

Many, many young people exploited this situation, and it was commonly said at the time that this prompted the people's demolishing of the Berlin wall. This tremendous event continues to unfold in a growing European Union, which has the potential to allow a freedom of all sorts of exchange and co-operation across the whole continent unknown since Roman times 2,000 years ago.

Ironically, Germany evaded participation in the Roman Empire, however it may end up being the catalyst of something bigger and better. German people, and Rammstein in particular, are acutely aware of all the legality and history above, and feel it emotionally also.

It's a shame to remove the sentence. It suggests personal involvement in a very formative event. It'd be great to find a source for the information. The "living person" issue is not an issue unless it is a negative commentary on a living person, without sources.

Please someone, find a source. If all else fails, email Rammstein, let them know you're working on their Wiki biography! Vielleicht ein Deutscher kann uns helfen? ;) Alastair Haines (talk) 14:10, 9 April 2008 (UTC)

I dont see the contradiction at all and the german wiki sais the same, so I dont think its wrong. Seems that he used the exact way Alastair suggested, since that was a common way to escape from east Germany —Preceding unsigned comment added by Chaitai (talk • contribs) 00:02, 26 May 2008 (UTC)

[edit] poor =

The video for Mann gegen Mann ("Man against man"/"one against one") from their latest album Rosenrot may have caused some controversy, as most of the band members are naked in the video, apart from lead singer Till Lindemann, who is wearing what can best be described as a "latex diaper" - most likely because he does not have an instrument with which to cover his genitalia.

some one needs to rewrite this sentence or remove it. —Preceding unsigned comment added by SeanCollier (talk • contribs) 19:45, 25 March 2008 (UTC)

Yes, especially as most of it just isn't true.

1) "one against one"? No German would ever interpret "Mann gegen Mann" this way. It's more like a proverbial description of an "honourable fight" with a clearly masculine emphasis - which actually is the point of song and clip.

2) "may have caused some controversy" - what's that supposed to mean? That the author suspects so, but didn't find any information to confirm it? Well, at least in germany, there was none. "Rammstein" caused a contrversy, to a certain degree "Engel" did (accusations of playing with pedphilia and the like), "Stripped" did (nazi-aesthetics) - but not "Mann gegen Mann".

If this really is about the nudity: not so much a subject here. We still don't get how nipplegate could become such a big thing in the US. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 194.99.90.2 (talk) 13:10, 21 May 2008 (UTC)

[edit] Comment

I really like this article. It is informative, logical, impartial. The handling of critical commentary is very well done. It allows the fun of the comments to come through. I note that it provides several unsourced explanations, but that these seem easily verifiable, and intrinsically plausible and uncontroversial. Personally, I like this style and think it is perfectly encyclopedic, if differently so than the style of a regular article, like Sun. Congratulations and thank you to the contributors. Alastair Haines (talk) 14:23, 9 April 2008 (UTC)

[edit] Some minor points

In this article, there are some minor points, which nevertheless deserve a correction:

- Under "Covers and adaptations" ist the following text "the German pop singer Nena, author of the one-hit wonder "99 Luftballons" ("99 Air Balloons")". Though "99 Luftballons" really was her only international hit, in Germany she was no one-hit-wonder. As you look up her wikipedia-article, you can see that in Germany she had six top-10-hits in the 80ies, and has had a modest come-back in the last years. I therefore think it better to remove the "one-hit-wonder" and only leave the "author of "99 Luftballons"".
- Under "Imagery" the politician Oskar Lafontaine is mentioned as "Leader of the German party Die Linke". In 2001, when the song "Links-2-3-4" was released, Lafontaine was still a member of the "Social Democratic Party of Germany". I think the text should be changed to "repeatedly outspoken by Oskar Lafontaine, in 2001 a famous member of the SPD (Social Democratic Party of Germany)".
- Also under "Imagery" a song with the text "Links, zwo, drei, vier; links, zwo, drei, vier; wo dein Platz Genosse ist, reih Dich ein in die Arbeitereinheitsfront, wenn Du auch ein Arbeiter bist" is cited. I knew it to be much earlier than Hannes Wader, and I have found it to be texted by Bert Brecht and composed in 1934 by Hanns Eisler. The text, as it ist cited here, is not correct. You will find the complete text here: [1], and a date for the composition here: [2] (look for "Einheitsfrontlied"). The song even has its own article in the German wikipedia: [[3]]

I would be glad if somebody could change that. Karen 84.133.179.70 (talk) 14:44, 10 April 2008 (UTC)

All points you made look good, and it might be better if you went ahead and made the changes yourself as it looks like you have it all set up and such. Tazz (talk) 19:28, 10 April 2008 (UTC)

Okay, I'll try and change it myself. If my English or something with the script is bad, feel free to correct it. Karen —Preceding unsigned comment added by 84.133.166.109 (talk) 11:36, 22 April 2008 (UTC)

Now the changes are done. The first time I've edited an article, and not just added to the "talk"-page... Karen--84.133.166.109 (talk) 12:17, 22 April 2008 (UTC)

Looks "A-ok" Karen, great job, thanks for your contribution. Tazz (talk) 14:07, 22 April 2008 (UTC)

[edit] New album?

I've been waiting for a while, but no one had referenced the statement that they have an album coming out in 2008. Can someone find that? Thanks for looking. My internet is very slow. 70.133.172.52 (talk) 03:36, 30 April 2008 (UTC)

Not much info released on it, we can only confirm via their website that they have gotten together and are writing and recording. Other various media reports state men like Bushido have worked with them; but, all is up in the air as for concrete, offical info from them. Tazz (talk) 19:09, 1 May 2008 (UTC)

[edit] Kokain

Why does 'kokain' redirects to Rammstein? I guess it is a prank, but I don't know how to fix it. Nemochovsky (talk) 11:18, 13 May 2008 (UTC)

One of their songs is called 'Kokain'. I guess that's why someone's put that link it.

--SaraFL (talk) 13:13, 22 May 2008 (UTC)