Talk:Queensbury tube station

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[edit] Song about Queensbury

I have removed the following text from the article:

The station, and its local surroundings and characters were immortalised in the song "Queensbury Station" by the Berlin-based punk-jazz band The Magoo Brothers on their album "Beyond Believeable", released on the Bouncing Corporation label in 1988. The song was written by Paul Bonin and Melanie Hickford, who both grew up and lived in the area.

This is not even a remotely famous song, there are no other references to it on the internet and I cannot find anything regarding the band. I have left the text here on the talk page for future reference if necessary but I will remove any reinsertion into the main article unless someone can prove notability first here on the talk page. Cheers :-) Sassf 16:05, 12 October 2007 (UTC)

It is true, this song is not remotely famous, but it was written by someone who lived at 3a Queensbury Station Parade(right above the station itself) for many years. The record was released in Germany and if you were to make a proper search of the internet instead of wasting your time deleting what is admittedly interesting trivia regarding the station, you would find that there are many hundreds of references to both the album and the song. Paulwellard Paulwellard (talk) 10:30, 16 December 2007 (UTC)

I moved the fact to the talk page because it does it seems like non-notable trivia. Anyone who lives in an area can write a song about it and have it released on a minor label but this does not make it worthy of including a reference to it in an encyclopedia - sorry. I did do a proper search on google and just did one again. The only pages that include "the magoo brothers" and queensbury station are this wiki page and I aso noticed that the only pages that make reference to the Beyond Believable album are a handful of ebay listings and a couple of German record shops. You'll have to link me to some of these many references because I couldn't find them. Sassf (talk) 13:06, 17 December 2007 (UTC)

I have taken it back out again for now, but if you really believe it is interesting enough to readers looking for info on queensbury station then you should probably list it under Cultural References or something. If you do reinclude it then at least don't include the word 'immortalised' as that is pretty unencyclopedic and also not really true (seeing as barely anyone knows the song!) I am not against interesting facts being included (of course!) but seeing as the whole article is so short it just feels like the paragraph of the song gives undue weight to this little known song (making it sound more important than it actually is). I retract my previous comments on notability as I see from the guidelines that article content doesn't have to be notable, just verifiable by independent sources (this is borderline - cf my above reference to not really beling able to find any mention of the song). Anyway, lets not fall out over Queensbury bloody station. Put it back in if you like, but as I say, please rewrite a little to play down the importance of the song. Sassf (talk) 13:26, 17 December 2007 (UTC)

I'm sorry but I was under the impression that Wikipedia is an encyclopaedia that is open to all, and repected by all. I use it often, and I find I'm shocked and surprised to find that there are people in the Wikipedia system who spend their time wantonly deleting information solely on the whim of their own personal value judgements. I'm unable to find any Wikipedia guidelines which mandate your actions. I live in Germany, where deletion of public information is seen a crime (due to the fact that this was institutionalised by the Nazis during their book burning campaigns of the 1930's). Do you have a uniform to go with your job? No, I didn't think so. Please reinstate this information where you originally found it, in its original state, and let the reader decide whether it is meaningless rubbish or not. I know for a fact that when the Magoo Brothers were well know in Germany in the 1990's, several German tourists did actually make the trek to north London to view the station. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Paulwellard (talk • contribs) 15:28, 18 December 2007 (UTC)

I did not wantonly delete the text, I moved it to the talk page pending citation of sources (I tried to cite them myself but couldn't find any decent ones as I have already said). I was trying to keep the page encyclopedic, not acting on value judgements, but I accept that we differ on our opinions there. The guidelines that 'mandate my action' are, as far as I can see: Wikipedia:Verifiability, which includes the line "If you want to request a source for an unsourced statement, consider moving it to the talk page". This is what I did and wiki recommends it. Furthermore, "Do not leave unsourced information in articles for too long". Please do not think I see your information as 'rubbish' and not worthy of being in the article. I have only asked for citation from a reliable source and also a rewording of the info to meet a balanced NPOV and to make the actual cultural importance of the song clear (as I believe it's wording/place in the article gives it undue weight for a little known song). Mainly, I think that 'immortalised' is inappropriate. Regarding your previous statement, fans making a pilgrimage to Queensbury Station would be very interesting for the article so please include this information if you have the sources to prove it. I hope we can come to some sort of consensus on this issue. Peace Sassf (talk) 16:41, 18 December 2007 (UTC)

I saw this on the 30 page and thought I would offer my opinion. A statement as the above does need an easily verified source. Please see WP:V and WP:RS. Also since two people are mentioned in the sentence and a claim is made about those two people, the guidelines set out on WP:BLP also apply, so a source is needed that definitively establishes those two as the authors. We simply want to ensure that we are crediting the correct people and not leaving out anyone who might also share credit. Please do take the time to read the links provided.TheRingess (talk) 04:30, 19 December 2007 (UTC)

Hello Ringess, Please could you leave this paragraph as it is now. I confirm that the 2 people cited as authours really are the people who wrote the song, here is a link proving it at the German royalty agency. https://mgonline.gema.de/werke/searchArea.do;jsessionid=0a020c1830d77ec2a54bcb6046d1b8a98789507fed94.e38LchuRc30NbO0Lah0KbxqRahqSe6fznA5Pp7ftolbGmkTy I hope this clears things up. Many thanks and have a good Christmas.

Thanks for finding that Paul. The above link didn't work but I looked on the site you found and got a permanently working link (I think!) so I put that in the article. Maybe one day I'll actually hear the song... Happy Christmas Sassf (talk) 22:42, 23 December 2007 (UTC)