Talk:Prometheus

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[edit] Comments

--The Promethean myth in modern culture section of this page is an embarassment. It contains numerous references to trivial instances of the word Prometheus in various videogames, science fiction and comic books, and heavy metal music. In an otherwise good article, this section seems to have been inserted by a geeky 14 year old boy. Really, is it necessary? I thought Wikipedia was striving (too often unsuccessfully) for credibility with the wider world.--Thorubus (talk) 13:08, 28 December 2007 (UTC)

--Reverted an older version to remove some vandalism. Aaron Segstro 23 October 2006

Am I correct in that this article has no references? There are some things I'd like to learn more about (and verify) but I find no references. MikeMullins 01:54, 11 September 2006 (UTC)

'To punish him for his hubris, zeus took fire away from the earth?' that can't be right. i didn't want to blank it cuz i'm not an expert on this field, but i'm almost certain that isn't how it happened. [[User:Archhttp://en.wikipedia.org/skins-1.5/common/images/button_italic.png Italic texttemplar|Archtemplar]] 07:03, 14 May 2006 (UTC)

Are any of the 'ancient writers' who compared the chaining of Prometheus to a crucifixion identifiable? Or is this "as legend would have it..." material? User:Wetman

Yes. In Prometheus Bound, Might orders Hephaestus to, "Spike him. Beak of steel drives through flesh and bone and bites the rock." (64-65) This is traditionally thought to be a work of Aeschylus, yet there is some controversy today as to its real author. Still, there is a written account of Prometheus being crucified rather than simply oral legend, which is what I think you were asking.

Can someone elaborate on this phrase, and give us a source for it:

He held no awe for the gods, and he ridiculed Zeus and his lack of farcical plays in which only he could eat dead moles, though he fought alongside the gods against the other Titans

This sentence is quite confusing. I can't even figure out what it's saying. I mean the part about farcical plays and dead moles; the sentence starts out making sense and ends that way, but what in the world is the "dead moles" part talking about?

I'm too new here to know what you people do about this kind of situation, but I'd like to either remove this reference to dead moles, or make it more clear what it means (and ideally, provide a source).

In fact, the closer I examine it, the more it looks like patent nonsense. Perhaps I should just delete it, and if it does make sense, we can bring it back, reworked so that it makes sense. 00:22, 11 March 2006 (UTC)Ojuice5001

And we read The motif is believed to have been borrowed from the Nart sagas of the Caucasian peoples. Apparently the Nart sagas of the 'Caucasian peoples' are of great antiquity indeed, reaching back before Hesiod's Theogony. But where has such an idea been implanted from; that would be illuminating to know. Is this being taught somewhere in the Caucasus, like Azerbaijan?... Wetman 22:01, 18 Jan 2004 (UTC)

Not sure what you mean. The only borrowed motif I was talking about was that of Prometheus being chained to Mount Elbrus, not the whole idea of Prometheus himself. And anyway, trickster figures are very common in mythology; the Bushmen of the Kalahari have a trickster figure, too. As well, the fact that the ancient Greeks knew of the existence of Colchis (Georgia) means that a borrowing from the Nart sagas is not unlikely. thefamouseccles 03:43, 29 Apr 2005 (UTC)

[edit] Overthrower of Zeus

In Edith Hamilton's Mythology, she says that Prometheus knew that one of Zeus' sons would one day overthrow him, but Prometheus wouldn't tell Zeus. Does anyone have more info about this? jettofabulo 02:41, 17 Feb 2005 (UTC)

Yeah, I heard about this particular story too. I was under the impression it would be Hercules, but I don't think he did overthrow his dad. --Menchi 02:57, 17 Feb 2005 (UTC)
Right. Hercules died before he could gain enough power to overthrow the gods. And even if he could, he probably wouldn't have. jettofabulo 02:18, 19 Feb 2005 (UTC)
I recollect Hamilton saying that Prometheus knew who would overthrow Zeus, but nothing of her saying that it would be Hercules or a son of Zeus who would do so, though that fits both the line of succession and also the cyclical nature of the whole thing. Wish I knew the source for it because it really adds another dimension to the Greek myths. -- marudubshinki 10:22 PM Saturday, 19 February 2005

In Aeschylus' Prometheus Bound, Prometheus knows that if Zeus mates with a certain woman, she will bear a son who will one day overthrow him. He hopes to convince Zeus to release him in exchange for this knowledge. The woman was the sea nymph Thetis. Zeus eventually found out, and she married the mortal Peleus, and with him gave birth to Achilles, fulfilling the general meaning of the prophecy: that Thetis would bear a son who would be greater than his father. (In this play, but nowhere else that I know of, Prometheus' mother is Themis, or Gaia (Earth), and it is from her that he aquires his prophetic knowledge.) -leah 9:57 PM August 15, 2005

Prometheus did indeed warn Zeus of the danger of being overthrown by his son, we should note that Zeus was already a little paranoid about this having overthrown his father who had overthrown his father. Take for example the eating of Metis. --Gordon
The implication that Prometheus could be the overthrower of Zeus mainly comes from Aeschylus' Prometheus bound. (I believe it has to do with some of the chorus's statements earlier in the play.) However, it is also known that Aeschylus's Prometheus implies a reconciliation at the end of the trilogy. My opinion is that the title of 'overthrower' has to do with the Romantic poets's view of the Promethean myth; namely Percy Bysshe Shelley's version of Aeschylus's lost play "Prometheus Unbound". Percy B. Shelley's version of the play features a much bigger rivalry than implied in classical mythology. Prometheus indeed overthrows Zeus and takes his place. However, this play/poem is a romantic celebration of the intellect succeeding over tyranny. The point is that the concept of 'overthrower' might not necesarrily hold true for the mythical figure. However, Romantics definately pushed for this view of Prometheus. i.e. Percy's poetry, Goethe's Prometheus, Byron's Prometheus... - M —Preceding unsigned comment added by 76.15.43.246 (talk) 06:47, 26 February 2008 (UTC)

[edit] Disambiguation

This page has a long list of disambiguation links at the top of the article. Would it be better to move the article to "Prometheus (mythology)" and create a disambiguation page at "Prometheus"?

[edit] Foreknowledge of death

My knowledge of the classics is limited, but one of my tutors in first-year heavily emphasized another "crime" of Prometheus -- taking away from man the foreknowledge of the hour of his death, and therefore giving him hope. I've found a brief mention of this in Prometheus Bound ([1]) - and in Gorgias ([2]) but I don't feel entirely comfortable adding it to this article. Perhaps someone else more knowledgable would be braver? Greyfedora 21:11, 24 Jun 2005 (UTC)

[edit] Disambig page

Disambig page done. I've kept the Prometheus page as-is, because it seems to be the commonest usage, biggest page, and original meaning. If someone changes this to a disambig page (which I am against), PLEASE move rather than copy/pasting, so that the history and discussion is maintained. Mat-C 15:27, 26 Jun 2005 (UTC)

[edit] Etymology

You do know the proposed etymology for Prometheus ("forethought") is wrong, don't you? Ancient Greeks believed that etymology to the point they invented Prometheus' brother, or Epimetheus, but modern studies have denied this popular belief. The name Prometheus is akin to the Sanskrit word 'pramantha', which is related to fire (in particular its beginning "pr-" has given the Greek "pyr" and the English "fire" (which mean the same thing), as well as the Latin "purus", meaning bright, shining white, and therefore "pure". --Xelloss 14:35, 16 November 2005 (UTC)

Whats with the anbetung section? Is that German? Shouldn't be on the English page, could somebody fix that?

Actually, the etymology for Prometheus as forethought of foresight is a correct one. The Mythology surrounding Prometheus originates from the ancient Greek epic, Hesiod, Theogony from which the original translation is foresight or forethought. Sanskrit is the original language of Vedic texts whose writing styles are similar to Latin and Greek in Europe, but the legend of Prometheus entirely revolves around the meaning of his name. The legend is because he is a being of great insight, or foresight. However it is interesting to note that association, namely the bringing of fire to mortals;

"'pramantha', which is related to fire (in particular its beginning "pr-" has given the Greek "pyr" and the English "fire" (which mean the same thing), as well as the Latin "purus", meaning bright, shining white, and therefore "pure"."

but Προμηθεύς or Prometheus means foresight.

[edit] Prometheas?

What's the origin of the "Prometheas" spelling variant? I've never heard of it before Wikipedia, and it doesn't seem to have an etymological basis, unlike the -us/-os variants. Where's it from? -Silence 14:34, 23 December 2005 (UTC)

[edit] Prometheus' Liver

Does anyone have information on how Prometheus' liver is regenerated every night? Is it due to his immortality, or brought about by Zeus?

I believe it's due to his immortality, though most sources don't specify, and I suppose it's not impossible that Zeus specified that aspect of his punishment as well. -Silence 21:41, 7 January 2006 (UTC)

It's actually interesting that, to quote liver, 'The liver is among the few internal human organs capable of natural regeneration of lost tissue'. It might be that, perhaps, the Ancient Greeks had discovered that too and casually placed this info in the myth - but that's probably just a rant of mine, not even worth being called a theory :-) --David88 01:29, 10 July 2006 (UTC)

I'm a grad student at the University of Kansas Medical Center. The school has a few profs whose research is focused on conditions involving the liver. On the floor where these prof's offices are, the hallway is decorated with scenes from various myths. Appropriately, one of these is a picture of Prometheus and the bird. Back when I toured the school, someone asked the doc showing us around why they chose that particular image and we were told that it was a tribute to the scientific knowledge of the ancient Greeks, who were most likely aware of the regenerative ability of the liver. I wasn't surprised to learn this because I already knew that vivisection and experimental surgery were common among early Greeks. Anyway, thats my contribution. Mrmb6b02 15:09, 29 July 2007 (UTC)

[edit] More about Prometheus

Deucalion is the son of Prometheus and Clymene. When Zeus punished humankind for their lack of respect by sending the deluge, Deucalion and his wife Pyrrha were the sole survivors. They were saved because of their piety. Prometheus advised his son to build an ark and they survived by staying on the boat.

When they were finally able to get back on land (on Mount Parnassos), they gave thank offerings to Zeus and consulted the oracle of Themis how they might replenish the earth with humans once again. They were told to throw the bones of their mother behind their shoulder and the human race would reappear. Since the mother of all is Earth, they threw stones and reformed the human race. The stones thrown by Pyrrha became women, those thrown by Deucalion became men.

Article "Deucalion" created on 03 March 1997; last modified on 04 February 1999 (Revision 2). 135 words. http://www.pantheon.org/articles/d/deucalion.html © MCMXCV - MMVI Encyclopedia Mythica™. All rights reserved.

PROMETHEUS (Promêtheus), is sometimes called a Titan, though in reality he did not belong to the Titans, but was only a son of the Titan lapetus (whence he is designated by the patronymic Iapetionidês, Hes. Theog. 528; Apollon Rhod. iii. 1087), by Clymene, so that he was a brother of Atlas, Menoetius, and Epimetheus (Hes. Theog. 507). His name signifies "forethought," as that of his brother Epimetheus denotes "afterthought." Others call Prometheus a son of Themis (Aeschyl. Prom. 18), or of Uranus and Clymene, or of the Titan Eurymedon and Hera (Potter, Comment. ad Lyc. Cass. 1283; Eustath. ad Horn. p. 987). By Pandora, Hesione, or Axiothea, he is said to have been the father of Deucalion (Aesch. Prom. 560 ; Tzetz. ad Lyc. 1283; Schol. ad Apollon. Rhod. ii. 1086), by Pyrrha or Clymene he begot Hellen (and according to some also Deucalion; Schol. ad Apollon. l. c.; Schol. ad Pind. Ol. ix. 68), and by Celaeno he was the father of Lycus and Chimareus (Tzetz. ad. Lyc. 132, 219), while Herodotus (iv. 45) calls his wife Asia. The following is an outline of the legends related of him by the ancients. Once in the reign of Zeus, when gods and men were disputing with one another at Mecone (afterwards Sicyon, Schol. ad Pind. Nem. ix. 123), Prometheus, with a view to deceive Zeus and rival him in prudence, cut up a bull and divided it into two parts : he wrapped up the best parts and the intestines in the skin, and at the top he placed the stomach, which is one of the worst parts, while the second heap consisted of the bones covered with fat. When Zeus pointed out to him how badly he had made the division, Prometheus desired him to choose, but Zeus, in his anger, and seeing through the stratagem of Prometheus, chose the heap of bones covered with the fat. The father of the gods avenged himself by withholding fire from mortals, but Prometheus stole it in a hollow tube (ferula, narthêx, Aeschyl. Prom. 110). Zeus now, in order to punish men, caused Hephaestus to mould a virgin, Pandora, of earth, whom Athena adorned with all the charms calculated to entice mortals; Prometheus himself was put in chains, and fastened to a pillar, where an eagle sent by Zeus consumed in the daytime his liver, which, in every succeeding night, was restored again. Prometheus was thus exposed to perpetual torture, but Heracles killed the eagle and delivered the sufferer, with the consent of Zeus, who thus had an opportunity of allowing his son to gain immortal fame (Hes. Theog. 521, &c., Op. et Dies, 47, &c. ; Ilygin. Poet. Astr. ii. 15; Apollod. ii. 5. § 11). Prometheus had cautioned his brother Epimetheus against accepting any present from Zeus, but Epimetheus, disregarding the advice, accepted Pandora, who was sent to him by Zeus, through the mediation of Hermes. Pandora then lifted the lid of the vessel in which the foresight of Prometheus had concealed all the evils which might torment mortals in life. Diseases and sufferings of every kind now issued forth, but deceitful hope alone remained behind (Hes. Op. et Dies, 83, &c.; comp. Horat. Carm. i. 3. 25, &c.). This is an outline of the legend about Prometheus, as contained in the poems of Hesiod. Aeschylus, in his trilogy Prometheus, added various new features to it, for, according to him, Prometheus himself is an immortal god, the friend of the human race, the giver of fire, the inventor of the useful arts, an omniscient seer, an heroic sufferer, who is overcome by the superior power of Zeus, but will not bend his inflexible mind. Although he himself belonged to the Titans, he is nevertheless represented as having assisted Zeus against the Titans (Prom. 218), and he is further said to have opened the head of Zeus when the latter gave birth to Athena (Apollod. i. 3. § 6). But when Zeus succeeded to the kingdom of heaven, and wanted to extirpate the whole race of man, the place of which he proposed to give to quite a new race of beings, Prometheus prevented the execution of the scheme, and saved the human race from destruction (Prom. 228, 233). He deprived them of their knowledge of the future, and gave them hope instead (248, &c.). He further taught them the use of fire, made them acquainted with architecture, astronomy, mathematics, the art of writing, the treatment of domestic animals, navigation, medicine, the art of prophecy, working in metal, and all the other arts (252, 445, &c., 480, &c.). But, as in all these things he had acted contrary to the will of Zeus, the latter ordered Hephaestus to chain him to a rock in Scythia, which was done in the presence of Cratos and Bia, two ministers of Zeus. In Scythia he was visited by the Oceanides; Io also came to him, and he foretold her the wanderings and sufferings which were yet in store for her, as well as her final relief (703, &c.). Hermes then likewise appears, and desires him to make known a prophecy which was of great importance to Zeus, for Prometheus knew that by a certain woman Zeus would beget a son, who was to dethrone his father, and Zeus wanted to have a more accurate knowledge of this decree of fate. But Prometheus steadfastly refused to reveal the decree of fate, whereupon Zeus, by a thunderbolt, sent Prometheus, together with the rock to which he was chained, into Tartarus (Horat. Carm. ii. 18, 35). After the lapse of a long time, Prometheus returned to the upper world, to endure a fresh course of suffering, for he was now fastened to mount Caucasus, and tormented by an eagle, which every day, or every third day, devoured his liver, which was restored again in the night (Apollon. Rhod. ii. 1247, &c. iii. 853; Strab. xv. p. 688 ; Philostr. Vit. Apoll. ii. 3; Hygin. Poet. Astr. ii. 15; Aeschyl. Prom. 1015, &c.). This state of suffering was to last until some other god, of his own accord, should take his place, and descend into Tartarus for him (Prom. 1025). This came to pass when Cheiron, who had been incurably wounded by an arrow of Heracles, desired to go [p. 545] into Hades; and Zeus allowed him to supply the place of Prometheus (Apollod. ii. 5. § 4; comp. CHEIRON). According to others, however, Zeus himself delivered Prometheus, when at length the Titan was prevailed upon to reveal to Zeus the decree of fate, that, if he should become by Thetis the either of a son, that son should deprive him of the sovereignty. (Serv. ad Virg. Eclog. vi. 42 ; Apollod. iii. 13. § 5; Hygin. Fab. 54; comp. Aeschyl. Pronm. 167, &c. 376.)

There was also an account, stating that Prometheus had created men out of earth and water, at the very beginning of the human race, or after the flood of Deucalion, when Zeus is said to have ordered him and Athena to make nmen out of the mud, and the winds to breathe life into them (Apollod. i. 7. § 1; Ov. Met. i. 81; Etym. Mag. s. v. Promêtheus). Prometheus is said to have given to men something of all the qualities possessed by the other animals (Horat Carm. i. 16. 13). The kind of earth out of which Prometheus formed men was shown in later times near Panopeus in Phocis (Paus. x. 4. § 3), and it was at his suggestion that Deucalion, when the flood approached, built a ship, and carried into it provisions, that he and Pyrrha might be able to support themselves during the calamity (Apollod. i. 7. § 2). Prometheus, in the legend, often appears in connection with Athena, e. g., he is said to have been punished on mount Caucasus for the criminal love he entertained for her (Schol. ad Apollon. Rhod. ii. 1249) and he is further said, with her assistance, to have ascended into heaven, and there secretly to have lighted his torch at the chariot of Helios, in order to bring down the fire to man (Serv. ad Virg. Eclog. vi. 42). At Athens Prometheus had a sanctuary in the Academy, from whence a torch-race took place in honour of him (Paus. i. 30. § 2; Schol. ad Soph. Oed. Col. 55; Harpocrat. s. v. lampas). The mythus of Prometheus is most minutely discussed by Welcker, in his Aeschylische Trilogie Prometheus, Darmstadt, 1824; by Völcker, Mythologie des Iapet. Geschlechtes, 1824; and with especial reference to the Prometheus of Aeschylus, by Schoemann, Des Aeschylus Gefesselter Prometheus. Greifswald, 1844, and by Blackie, in the Class. Mus. vol. v. p. 1, &c., which contain a very sound explanation of the mythus, as developed by Aeschylus.

Source: Dictionary of Greek and Roman Biography and Mythology. C19th Classics Encyclopedia.


I) ATHENS Chief City of Attika (Southern Greece)

"In the Akademia [outside Athens] is an altar to Prometheos, and from it they run to the city carrying burning torches. The contest is while running to keep the torch still alight; if the torch of the first runner goes out, he has no longer any claim to victory, but the second runner has. If his torch also goes out, then the third man is the victor. If all the torches go out, no one is left to be the winner." - Pausanias, Guide to Greece 1.30.2

II) ARGOS Chief City of Argolis (Southern Greece)

The Argives possessed a tomb of Prometheus, who honoured him as a dead hero.

"As to the tomb of Prometheus, their account seems to me to be less probable than that of the Opuntians [who also claimed a grave] , but they hold to it nevertheless." - Pausanias, Guide to Greece 2.19.8

III) PANOPEUS Town in Phokis (Central Greece)

"At Panopeus [in Phokis] there is by the roadside a small building of unburnt brick, in which is an image of Pentelic marble, said by some to be Asklepios, by others Prometheus. The latter produce evidence of their contention. At the ravine there lie two stones, each of which is big enough to fill a cart. They have the colour of clay, not earthly clay, but such as would be found in a ravine or sandy torrent, and they smell very like the skin of a man. They say that these are remains of the clay out of which the whole race of man was fashioned by Prometheus." - Pausanias, Guide to Greece 10.4.4

IV) OPOUS Chief City of Lokris (Central Greece)

"As to the tomb of Prometheus, their account seems to me to be less probable than that of the Opuntians [who also claimed a grave] , but they hold to it nevertheless." - Pausanias, Guide to Greece 2.19.8

In honor of Prometheus, to clear things up.

if it's a Question of sources:

   *   Hesiod, Theogony - Greek Epic C8th-7th BC
   * Hesiod, Works & Days - Greek Epic C8th-7th BC
   * Hesiod, Catalogues of Women - Greek Epic C8th-7th BC
   * The Homeric Hymns - Greek Epic C8th-4th BC
   * Homerica, The Cypria - Greek Epic BC
   * Pindar, Odes - Greek Lyric C5th BC
   * Pindar, Fragments - Greek Lyric C5th BC
   * Greek Lyric I Sappho, Fragments - Greek Lyric C6th BC
   * Greek Lyric III Ibycus, Fragments - Greek Lyric C6th BC
   * Greek Lyric V Melanippides, Fragments - Greek Lyric BC
   * Aeschylus, Prometheus Bound - Greek Tragedy C6th-5th BC
   * Aesop, Fables - Greek Fables C6th BC
   * Apollodorus, The Library - Greek Mythography C2nd BC
   * Apollonius Rhodius, The Argonautica - Greek Epic C3rd BC
   * Aristophanes, Birds - Greek Comedy C5th-4th BC
   * Plato, Protagoras - Greek Philosophy C4th BC
   * Callimachus, Fragments - Greek C3rd BC
   * Quintus Smyrnaeus, Fall of Troy - Greek Epic C4th AD
   * Strabo, Geography - Greek Geography C1st BC - C1st AD
   * Herodotus, Histories - Greek History C5th BC
   * Pausanias, Guide to Greece - Greek Geography C2nd AD
   * Diodorus Siculus, The Library of History - Greek History C1st BC
   * Aelian, On Animals - Greek Natural History C2nd - C3rd AD
   * Hyginus, Fabulae - Latin Mythography C2nd AD
   * Hyginus, Astronomica - Latin Mythography C2nd AD
   * Ovid, Metamorphoses - Latin Epic C1st BC - C1st AD
   * Propertius, Elegies - Latin Elegy C1st BC
   * Valerius Flaccus, The Argonautica - Latin Epic C1st AD
   * Statius, Thebaid - Latin Epic C1st AD
   * Nonnos, Dionysiaca - Greek Epic C5th AD
   * Suidas - Byzantine Lexicographer C10th AD

[edit] Prometheus and the Gods

This article needs editing. there are a lot of strong opinions put in the article regarding Prometheus. that he, "He surpassed all in cunning and deceit. He held no awe for the gods, and he ridiculed Zeus, though he fought alongside the gods against the other Titans." Prometheus actually had great awe for Zeus, but he criticized Zeus for his lack of foresight and that is what put them at odds with each other.

Prometheus was also at odds with Zeus because of his great sympathetic nature towards humanity, whereas Zeus just wanted humanity to die out. He was given the task of creating mankind out of clay. But in the quest to better the lives of his creations, he stole fire from the gods of heaven and cheated them out of the best share of the sacrificial portion for this reason, as said in Hyginus, Astromomica,

"When the men of old with great ceremony used to carry on the sacrificial rites of the immortal gods, they would burn the victims entire in the flame of the sacrifice. And so, when the poor were prevented from making sacrifices on account of the great expense, Prometheus, who with his wonderful wisdom is thought to have made men, by his pleading is said to have obtained permission from Zeus for them to cast only a part of the victim into the fire, and to use the rest for their own food. This practice custom later established. Since he had obtained this permission, not as from a covetous man, but easily, as from a god, Prometheus himself sacrifices two bulls. When he had first placed their entrails on the altar, he put the remaining flesh of the two bulls in one heap, covering it with an oxhide. Whatever bones there were he covered with the other skin and put it down between them, offering Zeus the choice of either part for himself. Zeus although he didn’t act with divine forethought, nor as a god who ought to foresee everything, was deceived by Prometheus - since we have started to believe the tale! - and thinking each part was a bull, shoe the bones for his half. And so after this, in solemn rites and sacrifices, when the flesh of victims has been consumed, they burn with fire the remaining parts which are the gods."(2.15)

Prometheus merely acted on sympathy not in deciet. His use of "foresight" or wisdom was strong, which caused Zeus to become very wary of Prometheus. Prometheus also took fire to the mortals because Zeus did not allow humans to have fire because of his initial trick(the sacrificial portions)so he was chained at Caucasus.

he was released for telling Zeus as said in Hyginus, Astronomica for,

"When Zeus, moved by the beauty of Thetis, sought her in marriage, he couldn’t win the consent of the timid maiden, but none the less kept planning to bring it about. At that time the Parcae [Moirai] were said to have prophesied what the natural order of events should be. They said that the son of Thetis’ husband, whoever he might be, would be more famous than his father. Prometheus heard this as he kept watch, not from inclination but from necessity, and reported it to Zeus. He, fearing that what he had done to his father Kronos in a similar situation, would happen to him, namely, that he would be robbed of his power, gave up by necessity his desire to wed Thetis, and out of gratitude to Prometheus thanked him and freed him from his chains."


[edit] Comparative Perspectives

I just cleaned up the section comparing Prometheus to Loki. However, the line, "The motif is believed, by some, to have been borrowed from the Nart sagas of the Caucasian peoples, but the analogies with Loki seem to reveal an older Indo-European source", is ambiguous. Which motif is the line referring to?

I'm not familiar with the origins of the myths, and have left the line alone. Can anyone help clarify this? Thanks! -Vagus 03:37, 5 August 2006 (UTC)

This entire section is unsourced speculation, in my not-so-humble opinion. I've marked it as such for now, but if nobody can come up with sources for some of these comparisons (some of which seem a bit abstruse to me) in short order, I'm going to dike the whole section out. --Grey Knight ⊖ 13:08, 22 November 2006 (UTC)
Okay, removed. The content is copied here in case somebody can fix it up. --Grey Knight ⊖ 22:30, 19 December 2006 (UTC)
In mythology, Prometheus may be classed among the trickster gods, such as Loki in Norse mythology. Like Prometheus, Loki is a giant rather than a god, is associated with fire, and is punished by being chained to a rock, and tormented by an animal. Yet Loki is malevolent, while Prometheus is a benefactor to humanity. In addition, Prometheus is very intelligent and acts with forethought, unlike the rash Loki. The similarities between the two characters may be coincidental. The motif is believed, by some, to have been borrowed from the Nart sagas of the Caucasian peoples, but the analogies with Loki seem to reveal an older Indo-European source.
The Prometheus myth bears striking similarities to the Adamic myth of the fall of man. The Promethean fire and the fruit from the Tree of Knowledge can be considered semiotic synonyms; there are clear links between Pandora and Eve. In fact the euphemistic name for Satan's former angelic form, Lucifer — actually, a Latin name for the planet Venus — literally means "light bearer," which seems to hint at the image of Prometheus carrying the divine fire down to man. Of course, Satan was not called Lucifer until St. Jerome translated the Hebrew phrase heilel ben-schahar in the Latin Vulgate, many centuries after the account of the Fall of Man was written, making a Prometheus-Lucifer/Satan connection rather unlikely.
Such a reading seems to identify Yahweh as Zeus and the serpent/Satan as the Prometheus figure. This reading is problematic for Judeo-Christian readers, since it seems to suggest that Yahweh is jealous, vengeful and keen to restrict humankind, while presenting Satan as a Prometheus-like champion of humanity. Satanism uses Prometheus as a symbolic aspect of Satan. (see the article Satanism) However, there is no actual evidence of actual borrowing between these two cultures. Old Testament scholarship and that of the contemporary cultures (Hittitology, Assyriology, and Egyptology) show that the beginning of Genesis is modeled more in-line with Ancient Near Eastern myth, so if there is any borrowing, hait would be more likely that the Greeks borrowed from an Ancient Near Eastern culture.
What remains of Prometheus today? Prometheus continues to be the mythical founder of Western humankind, but is also shrouded in ambiguity: he was the one who continuously strove to invent new techniques, although he was also guilty of defying a “natural order”, a type of “mad savant” who acted without thinking of the consequences.
You can sense in him the liberation of humankind from the oppressive and obscurantist domination of the gods; but he is also the one who moved away from the “the golden age” of the human species. At a cost of great suffering, he placed priority on progress and knowledge over easy submission and wealth.

[edit] Promethean myth in culture section

The character in "Two Gentlemen of Verona" is Proteus, not Prometheus. I am new here. Will the original author remove the error? Thanks.

This section includes a mix of items that match the heading, and others that seem to be here because a person named something "Prometheus." In my opinion, items demonstrating Prometheus' eponymity in modern culture bear a markedly lower significance than cases illustrating...well...the Prometheum myth in culture.  :-)

I think many of these would make more sense on the Prometheus disambiguation page instead of here. Any thoughts?

-Quintote 13:53, 8 November 2006 (UTC)

Case in point: "At the beginning of Part Four, Chapter 3 of Brighton Rock by Graham Greene, the line "The Boy looked down at the body, spread-eagled like Prometheus, at the bottom of Frank's stairs." describing Pinkie looking at Spicer's dead body after he pushed him down the stairs." - I don't think we need to include every passing reference of the word. This section should include items that clearly show a deliberate connection with the Promethean story, while the disambiguation page should list items that are called "Prometheus" and have/can have their own articles. Anything else, like the example I just gave, is for the bin. --Grey Knight ⊖ 13:07, 22 November 2006 (UTC)
I trimmed it down a bit. If anyone else wants to go through and weed it out some more, feel free. :-) --Grey Knight ⊖ 13:34, 22 November 2006 (UTC)

"Prometheus was a kombol with two legs and some hair." I believe that this is vandal. According to sources, kombol means buttocks... ~Cheezyphil

[edit] Problematic Issues in this Article

O.K. I'm going to write this down because it really needs to be brought to light. There is a big conflict in the writing of this article because people keep bringing in their preconceptions into this article. They continue to insist that there is some connection to the modern (and often Dualistic) perceptions of God to Hellenic Religion and Mythology. Allow me to clarify the story of Prometheus so that preconceptions are removed about my most beloved Grecian God.

Prometheus was a primordial being. Prometheus existed since the beginning of the universe like Kronos, Ouranos, and Gaea "titan Goddess" of Earth. Prometheus often found himself at odds with the other Primordial beings. In the War against the Titans Prometheus turned his back on his titan brothers and fought alongside Zeus and the newly adult celestial gods. After the war was over, it was he who with his brother Epimetheus created all living things Mankind and beast. Zeus scorned mankind and wished for them to die out naturally through their own weakness and stupidity. Prometheus felt sympathy for his creations and gave them fire and taught them knowledge of the Gods.

Zeus was furious due to Prometheus's willful intervention on behalf of man, but Zeus gave them a chance to prove themselves worthy. Man under the tutelage of Prometheus, was humble and pious and performed their sacrifices duly to the Gods. However, the poor man could not afford to sacrifice. All the food they had to eat could not all go to the Gods, else they risk starvation. Prometheus took a risk and intervened once more on their behalf. Prometheus separated the bones and fat of the sacrifice in one bag and the flesh and intestines of the sacrifice in another he then called forth Zeus who agreed to choose the sacrifice he deemed appropriate and leave the rest of the sacrifice for man to consume. Zeus lacking the foreknowledge Prometheus had, chose the fat and bones of the sacrifice leaving the flesh to the humans. Furious at Prometheus's trickery, Zeus took the fire from mankind in order to set an example. Prometheus, still sympathetic to humanity, stole the fire from gods hidden in a fennel wand. Zeus could not take what another God had given so he allowed humanity to keep fire. As a punishment Zeus created Pandora and offered her to Prometheus. Prometheus with his foreknowledge knew what Zeus was up to, so he refused Pandora. However, that didn't stop Epimetheus from keeping Pandora as his wife. As a wedding present to Epimetheus, Zeus gave a box with all the evils of the world including the foreknowledge of every man's death causing chaos and fear to ravage the lands. Pandora released it all closing the box before hope could ever be released. Prometheus then took that foreknowledge away, giving man hope back again. Prometheus was incredibly sympathetic and often took the suffering of humanity away and Zeus was often contrary to that opinion.

Zeus then found out about the prophecy. The prophecy said that one of his children would rise against him. Worried because of the fate of his father, Zeus swallowed pregnant Metis, mother of Athena and the first wife of Zeus in order to stop what he thought was the prophecy. He had horrible headaches and called upon Prometheus who criticized Zeus for swallowing Metis and for his lack of forethought. He hit Zeus on the head releasing Athena. Zeus was angry, because that meant Prometheus knew which child of his would rise against him. Zeus in anger bound Prometheus at Caucus. After many years of torture by the ripping up of Prometheus's abdomen by Zeus's Eagle, Prometheus eventually conceded telling Zeus that Thetis was the woman prophesized to have "a child greater than his father". Zeus realized that he was mistaken in trying to court Thetis and relented. He also offered to release Prometheus from Caucus but Prometheus refused because he wanted man to free him, and no god. Heracles, a mortal man who was son of Zeus, released Prometheus giving glory to them both, so Zeus was finally pacified. Prometheus was then welcomed back to Olympus, but since a God's deal is one that cannot be broken he had to have Prometheus remain somehow still chained to the rock. Zeus solved that problem by shrinking the Rock small enough to fit onto a ring, which was chained around Prometheus's finger. So in reality neither Prometheus or Zeus was Good or evil in their actions, they were just very much at odds with one another and in the end, they ended up reconciling.


End Of Story.

The below sources were all read by me and the above is a summation of my studies. I just prefer not to tediously quote every single reference I already provided, which oftentimes tells the same story. OK? Done. I'm fixing the article tomorrow.

  * Hesiod, Theogony - Greek Epic C8th-7th BC
  * Hesiod, Works & Days - Greek Epic C8th-7th BC
  * Hesiod, Catalogues of Women - Greek Epic C8th-7th BC
  * The Homeric Hymns - Greek Epic C8th-4th BC
  * Homerica, The Cypria - Greek Epic BC
  * Pindar, Odes - Greek Lyric C5th BC
  * Pindar, Fragments - Greek Lyric C5th BC
  * Greek Lyric I Sappho, Fragments - Greek Lyric C6th BC
  * Greek Lyric III Ibycus, Fragments - Greek Lyric C6th BC
  * Greek Lyric V Melanippides, Fragments - Greek Lyric BC
  * Aeschylus, Prometheus Bound - Greek Tragedy C6th-5th BC
  * Aesop, Fables - Greek Fables C6th BC
  * Apollodorus, The Library - Greek Mythography C2nd BC
  * Apollonius Rhodius, The Argonautica - Greek Epic C3rd BC
  * Aristophanes, Birds - Greek Comedy C5th-4th BC
  * Plato, Protagoras - Greek Philosophy C4th BC
  * Callimachus, Fragments - Greek C3rd BC
  * Quintus Smyrnaeus, Fall of Troy - Greek Epic C4th AD
  * Strabo, Geography - Greek Geography C1st BC - C1st AD
  * Herodotus, Histories - Greek History C5th BC
  * Pausanias, Guide to Greece - Greek Geography C2nd AD
  * Diodorus Siculus, The Library of History - Greek History C1st BC
  * Aelian, On Animals - Greek Natural History C2nd - C3rd AD
  * Hyginus, Fabulae - Latin Mythography C2nd AD
  * Hyginus, Astronomica - Latin Mythography C2nd AD
  * Ovid, Metamorphoses - Latin Epic C1st BC - C1st AD
  * Propertius, Elegies - Latin Elegy C1st BC
  * Valerius Flaccus, The Argonautica - Latin Epic C1st AD
  * Statius, Thebaid - Latin Epic C1st AD
  * Nonnos, Dionysiaca - Greek Epic C5th AD
  * Suidas - Byzantine Lexicographer C10th AD

just before the contents, end of intro contains this statement:

prometheus has now been reincarnated as the nose and brains of a boy in floral park named Thomas Galassi

is that a joke? no further reference to galassi (who, i'm guessing, is supposed to be the boy, not the floral park).

[edit] Prometheus' liver and the modern science

Why do you need refferences about the most interesting and intelligent thing about Prometheus' tale; that it seems to suggest that the ancient Greeks knew that the liver can replace its damaged cells??? I think that only dumb people can deny this evidence. Every mythologic tales have a purpose, a meaning, often deeper than today people level of understanding... FenrisUlven 18:11, 31 January 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Prometheus and Jesus

I've read of comparisons between the myth of Prometheus and Jesus, but this article doesn't mention any such similarity. Both are said to have "brought the divine light" to the people and both were punished harshly for this. Anyone familiar with comparative religion or mythology? − Twas Now ( talk • contribs • e-mail ) 07:52, 7 February 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Apperance

I'm doing a project for school on Prometheus, and I have to draw a portrait of him. Does anyone know how tall he is, hair color, skin color, and the like? Please answer, It's due in 3 days!!!

[edit] Removed Alternative Pandora Story

I removed this from the article:

Pandora, in other stories, was said to be the root of evil, knowing what was in the box when Zeus gave it to her, and opened it anyway. In some stories, she was simply a woman with an insatiable amount of curiosity. Zeus gave her the box, told her not to open it, but curiosity got the better of her, and she opened it anyway, releasing evils upon the world. In almost all Pandora stories, someone //she or Epimetheus// manages to close the box before everything escaped, but in their mourning over what had happened to the world, did not remember to lock the lid, and the last of what was in the box came out. At the bottom of the box, placed there by one of the other goddesses //Either Athena or Hera// was hope. Hope for humanity to hold to when the worst has come to pass.

This alternative story does not relate to Prometheus; it belongs on the Pandora article page. I've therefore put this part on the Pandora article talk page where the editors of that page can decide what to do with it. I apologize to whoever wrote this part, I mean this not as a personal attack. Thanks, --France3470 03:39, 17 May 2007 (UTC)

[edit] This article is poorly organized.

As the earliest source of the myth, the Hesiodic material should come first. Then Aeschylus, and so on. I've reworked the intro and Hesiod sections, and added a section on Prometheus Bound. Also, the "Later Authors" section needs to be cleaned up in light of my Hesiod and Aeschylus section edits. Much of the information is presented as if coming from a single source (e.g., Prometheus Bound), but is in fact a mish-mash cobbled together from many sources. Some of the stuff is just wrong. No source names the eagle in the Prometheus myth "Ethon." Some Greek sources call it the Aetos Kaukasios ("Caucasian Eagle") -- is this the source of the confusion? In any event, "Ethon" as the eagle's name has its own entry. It needs to be removed. Ifnkovhg 22:10, 5 September 2007 (UTC)

P.S. I began a "Prometheus in other arts" section and quickly realized I have no training in the visual or plastic arts. Does anyone care to expand this section? Should ancient and modern art be separate, or combined? Ifnkovhg 04:57, 7 September 2007 (UTC)

Huge improvement. A synthesized "biography" is the stale heritage of Bulfinch; it's hard to get a good account from such a beginning, but it's still the approach taught in U.S. public schools, apparently. The article needs more direct sourcing in footnotes embedded in the text. Too bad to see all the illustrations crammed down at the bottom simply because they're "modern": one hopes that won't become a general program. --Wetman 06:52, 10 September 2007 (UTC)

[edit] The eagle's name is NOT Ethon.

The eagle has no name. It was sometimes called aitos Kaukasios (eagle of the Caucasus). The confusion, I think, stems from line 523 of Hesiod's Theogony: kai hoi ep' aieton orse tanupteron. "And Zeus stirred up the long-winged eagle against [Prometheus]." The word aieton (somehow corrupted into Ethon, I'm guessing) is simply the accusative form of the Greek word for eagle, aietos (aitos). The eagle HAS NO NAME. This is not a matter of personal opinion, and there is no scholarly debate. THE EAGLE'S NAME IS NOT ETHON. IF ANYTHING, THE EAGLE'S NAME IS "EAGLE." I'm changing the artwork caption accordingly (again).Ifnkovhg 19:56, 17 September 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Images

It's almost always preferrable to have an image at the lead, especially on articles such as this. I suggest the editors of the article choose one from the gallery and move it to the top. It helps conceptualize the subject to the reader. The painting of Prometheus holding the first is a good choice. --David Shankbone 20:37, 23 September 2007 (UTC)

This has now been done. France3470 (talk) 05:21, 5 February 2008 (UTC)

[edit] Etymology of Prometheus' name

I added a small section about the true proto-indo-european origin of his name. The Greeks no doubt thought his name meant "forethought," but they were way off. Cf. the false connection between Apollo Delphinus and dolphins in the Homeric Hymn to Apollo. I think this tidbit warrants inclusion, but I'm not sure of its place. Maybe it should just be a footnote in the opening paragraph? Ifnkovhg 06:20, 30 October 2007 (UTC)

P.S. Went back and looked at it -- decided to put it in a footnote. Ifnkovhg 06:28, 30 October 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Tom Holt

Prometheus is featured prominently in one of Tom Holt's books, I think 'Ye Gods'. 24.188.128.48 21:56, 15 November 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Added a mythical parallel section...

...about the humans-from-clay and theft-of-fire mythemes. I'm sure it's not exhaustive. Please chip in! Also, I did some weeding in the "modern culture" section. I agree with an earlier poster that we don't need to document every single reference to Prometheus in the modern period. (particularly in video games and comic books -- both of which I love) Ifnkovhg (talk) 10:17, 13 January 2008 (UTC)

[edit] addition of Marx

Karl Marx was quite fascinated with Prometheus. He went so far as to quote Prometheus at the end of his Thesis on Epicurean and Democritean philosophy. Berel Ollman also attributed Marx a Promethean quality in his work on Alienation. I'll add a brief synopsis of Prometheus in relation to Marx and Marxism in general soon. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 166.217.102.57 (talk) 20:34, 24 February 2008 (UTC)

in a similar vein, I remember reading somewhere that Prometheus Bound was one of two (I think Agamemnon was the other) ancient Greek tragedies allowed to be performed in the Soviet Union. I can't remember where, though. Ifnkovhg (talk) 07:58, 14 March 2008 (UTC)