Talk:Premier of Western Australia

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Some of the Party titles for the early Premiers are meaningless: Ministerialist was a contemporary term meaning `of the government party' while the term `opposition' may better be described as `former opposition'. as a minister is no longer the opposition once he formed a government. My limited information describes the early ministries as Protectionist or Conservative for Forrest, and obviously Throssell succeeded him. Leake is described as lioberal, possibly correctly with a small `l' until James succeeded him.

An anonymous editor changed "Sir John Forrest" to "Lord Forrest". I have reverted it. For most of his life John Forrest was known as "John Forrest" or "Sir John", and he is still referred to exclusively by these names. "Lord Forrest" is not appropriate here. This is consistent with Wikipedia:Naming conventions (names and titles).

Snottygobble 00:01, 29 Nov 2004 (UTC)

[edit] Eric Ripper

I agree with this reverted edit that Eric Ripper, although acting, is not the Premier and shouldn't be documented here as such. I believe he has been 'acting' for about the last month while Gallop has been on leave. regards Nachoman-au 11:48, 16 January 2006 (UTC)

Geoff Gallop is no longer the premier. As such Eric Ripper is the Premier, albeit in a temporary role until a successor is chosen. This is different from when he was only acting on behalf of the Premier while he was out of state. Xtra 12:36, 16 January 2006 (UTC)

Also see Prime Minister of Australia for the numerous acting Prime Ministers listed. Xtra 12:39, 16 January 2006 (UTC)

Earle Page, Frank Forde and John McEwen are listed as Prime Ministers even though they served briefly after the deaths of the previous Prime Ministers at the time. Gordon Chalk is listed as a Premier of Queensland even though he was Premier for seven days between Jack Pizzey's death and Joh's appointment. Therefore Eric Ripper should be counted as a Premier of WA. Eric Ripper counts.--The Shadow Treasurer 01:35, 17 January 2006 (UTC)

Earle Page, Frank Forde and John McEwen were appointed Prime Minister of Australia by the Governor-General of Australia. Eric Ripper is Premier of Western Australia if and only if he was appointed Premier of Western Australia by the Governor of Western Australia. I do not believe that this has happened. Drew (Snottygobble) | Talk 01:39, 17 January 2006 (UTC)

Was Gordon Chalk appointed by the Governor of Queensland as Premier in 1968? Either way Eric Ripper still counts because as Xtra has said he is not acting as Premier while the Premier is not in the state he is now the Premier because Gallop is no longer Premier. Eric Ripper began as acting Premier when Gallop was still in office, Ripper is only continuing as acting Premier due to the timing of the resignation. Since Gallop has formally handed his resignation to the Governor, the Governor is therefore obligated to formally appoint Ripper as Premier for the interim period, not to do so would be irresponsible.--The Shadow Treasurer 01:58, 17 January 2006 (UTC)

You may be right, but I would prefer to have information that the Governor had acted, rather than having to deducing it from postulates about what is and isn't irresponsible. Drew (Snottygobble) | Talk 03:52, 17 January 2006 (UTC)
Now that I think about it, no, you are wrong. The governor does not appoint a premier as such. The governor invites a particular person, whom he believes to have the confidence of the majority of parliament, to form a government. That appointed person then directs the governor to appoint certain people to certain ministerial positions, including the premiership. The obvious convention is that the person appointed to form government directs the governor to appoint them as premier.
In this case, Ripper may well have been invited to form a government by the Governor. However, Ripper is unable to direct the governor to appoint him premier without first gaining approval to do so from caucus. If he did so, he would probably be booted out of the labour party, and without the confidence of the majority of parliament he would have the shortest premiership ever. Drew (Snottygobble) | Talk 03:59, 17 January 2006 (UTC)
Which was Colebatch to date yes? SatuSuro 04:40, 17 January 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Westminster system 101

  • The Premier of WA, like any leader in a Westminister system, holds office by virtue of a commission from the Crown, represented in this case by the Governor of WA.
  • When a Premier announces his or her resignation or retirement, or is defeated at an election, they retain office in a caretaker capacity until the Governor is ready to commission a successor.
  • In this case, there can be no successor until the Labor Caucus meets and chooses a new leader. I am not following this in detail (being currently in Laos), but I imagine it will take a few days at this time of year for the Caucus to assemble.
  • Therefore Gallop will remain Premier until the Caucus elects his successor. He will then visit the Governor and tender his formal resignation and his successor will then be commissioned.
  • The only occasions on which the Crown will immediately appoint a new Prime Minister or Premier is on the death of the incumbent. This is what happened with Chalk, Page, Forde and McEwen refered to above.
  • To sum up: there is no new Premier of WA, and no acting Premier. Gallop is Premier, and will remain so until the Governor commissions someone else.
  • Since we just went through all this debate, including reverting all the usual silly premature edits, with the Carr - Iemma transition, I don't know why people find this so hard to follow.

Adam 02:51, 18 January 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Faulty infobox

Can someone with coding expertise check out this article's infobox which has a spacing problem causing 'Governor of Western Australia' to be only partly visible. Bjenks (talk) 00:09, 26 May 2008 (UTC)

It looks fine to me. I've fooled around with my text size and window width, and I am unable to break it. What is the nature of your problem? Hesperian 00:16, 26 May 2008 (UTC)
Hmm. My browser is IE7.0. Using 'medium' text size, I see only (after Ken Michael) 'Governor of Western' with a few dots underneath, representing four ascender tips of 'Australia'. My 'largest' and 'smallest' text sizes cause both lines to disappear, leaving only the upper tips of the first line's ascenders. Does anyone else have this difficulty? Bjenks (talk) 01:28, 26 May 2008 (UTC) (sig. added later)
Yes, I'm seeing this in IE6, but not in Firefox. I'll see what can be done. Hesperian 00:49, 26 May 2008 (UTC)
Someone had made the "as Governor of Western Australia" bit smaller by putting it in subscript, rather than using a smaller typeface. I fixed this rather dodgy piece of coding, and the template now looks fine to me in IE6. Can you verify that the problem is fixed for you, pls? Hesperian 00:57, 26 May 2008 (UTC)
Yes, it's better, at least in text sizes which display the lot in one line. When the line is broken (as in 'medium' text size on my wide monitor), there is an excessive space between the two lines. The type size is also noticeably smaller than surrounding matter. Maybe the solution is to reduce the point size of the lines at left ('Appointed by', etc) and/or to increase the width of the infobox--or decrease the relevant line to read just 'State governor'. Cheers and thanks Bjenks (talk) 01:13, 26 May 2008 (UTC)

Shortening has fixed it, but type size now needs to be increased again(:-)) Bjenks (talk) 01:28, 26 May 2008 (UTC)

Hang on, I'm working on something else at the moment.... IE6/7 was breaking the line unnecessarily because the template was using images for headings like "Ministry". We shouldn't use images to present text because people with text browsers and screen readers can't read them, they can't be searched for, and (as we've seen here) they remove the flexibility of the browser in laying out the text as it sees fit. I have replaced the images by textual headers, and IE6 no longer puts a line in "Governor of Western Australia" for me.
I'll have a go at fixing the type size.
Hesperian 01:47, 26 May 2008 (UTC)
I set the type size at 75% of normal, with is about what it was when it was using "sub". Hesperian 01:59, 26 May 2008 (UTC)