Talk:PNC Park/Archive 1

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Contents

attendance

second largest crowd: 39,129 (April 10, 2006)

obviously this includes 'standing room only'


It's not the smallest park in baseball. Fenway Park has added seats and McAfee Coliseum in Oakland stopped selling seats in the upper deck (it's now technically the smallest park in baseball).

Homers into the Alleghany

Removed Cliff Floyd hitting the river on the fly. He actually made it on a bounce, prompting a lot of good-natured ribbing from Daryle Ward, his current teammate on the Cubs.

Yeah, a few have bounced one in. The only player that I know about, to do it on the fly, is Daryle Ward (on a grand-slam too). With the exception of the Home Run Derby of course. Blackngold29 (talk) 15:33, 15 April 2008 (UTC)

Neutral POV on "Features"

The "Features" section of this this article is not very neutral. See below:


PNC Park is noted for its beautiful look. The low, open-air infield stands offer a wide, breathtaking view of the downtown Pittsburgh skyline across the Allegheny River. The interior walls and backstop behind home plate are made of limestone, a departure from the red-brick walls present in most of today's newer ballparks. The limestone captures the city's trademark "gold" color while also representing the rugged local landscape. Also prevalent throughout the ballpark is the use of steel construction, a tribute to Pittsburgh's history in the steel industry. The spiraling rotunda in left field, which allows access to the various concourse levels via escalators and stairs, employs this the best. All of the concourses are open-air except for the Pittsburgh Baseball Club section, meaning fans can still watch the game and even enjoy the riverfront view when standing in line at concessions stands. A 2003 ESPN study gave the park a 95 rating (out of 100), making it "the best stadium in baseball", a moniker the stadium has openly adopted since.


PNC Park is also notable for having some of the best food of any Major League venue.[1] The ballpark features an extensive selection of local specialities and favorites, including pierogies, Primanti Brothers sandwiches (serving meat, cole slaw, and french fries within the sandwich), Quaker Steak and Lube, Benkovitz Fish, Smorgasburgh, Pop's Plaza (named for Willie Stargell), a barbecue run by former catcher Manny Sanguillen (who signs autographs while fans wait in line), as well as "Outback in the Outfield," an Outback Steakhouse at the top of the left-field bleachers.

This section sounds like a persuasive essay.

75.182.106.197 20:02, 22 September 2007 (UTC)

I've gotta say, though, that is a widely held opinion among most fans and analysts either from or outside of the city. It has been called the best stadium in baseball numerous times (regrettably, arguably fielding the absolute worst team). I agree though that the food section is a very biased Pittsburgh opinion. Anyone who knows the menu that well has to be from here. User: lawrence142002 —Preceding unsigned comment added by 72.95.250.122 (talk) 07:50, 24 January 2008 (UTC)


= I went ahread and edited the POV parts out, it was clearly written by a Pittsburgh fan, not an unbiased editor...regardless of whether fans think the stadium and its food are the 'best', it's not cited, and really can't be cited as fact. It's all a matter of opinion, or Point Of View. 162.136.192.1 (talk) 19:18, 29 February 2008 (UTC)

Seating capacity vs other parks?

The article says that PNC is the second-smallest, only a few thousand smaller than Wrigley, which seats over 40,000, but makes no mention of Fenway, which is also smaller than Wrigley (less than 40,000). Why compare it to Wrigley at all, when Fenway is much closer in capacity? Also, Tropicana Field's page shows a capacity of 38496, which is MORE than PNC's 38437,so isn't PNC the smallest? 162.136.192.1 (talk) 19:09, 29 February 2008 (UTC)

There are a few sources which state upon opening it had the second smallest. This has changed since other stadims have added on or covered/removed seats. It is difficult to keep up with all stadiums because they are constantly changing and capacity figures, and they differ from source to source. I included only what the sources give. Blackngold29 (talk) 15:28, 15 April 2008 (UTC)

Fair use rationale for Image:PNCParkLogo150.PNG

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BetacommandBot (talk) 15:50, 8 March 2008 (UTC)

Somebody has added one. Done. Blackngold29 (talk) 15:29, 15 April 2008 (UTC)

Re-write

The article is in need of an overhaul. There is a lot of good information present, however very little is sourced and it is very unorganized. I am going to start a re-vision in my sandbox, contribution, big or little would be much appreciated. Thanks! Blackngold29 (talk) 21:06, 4 April 2008 (UTC)

I completely overhauled the article. Though it could still use a few minor improvements, please make any changes or leave anything else you would like me to add on here on on my talk page. Thank you! Blackngold29 (talk) 19:09, 11 April 2008 (UTC)
Would it be worth adding a blurb about the college baseball games played at PNC? Pitt and Duquesne have typically played the annual baseball version of the City Game there. The previous games have been:
  • 4/16/08 Pitt 17, Duquesne 6 [1][2]
  • 4/18/07 Cancelled due to poor field conditions
  • 4/13/05 Pitt 9, Duquesne 2 [3]
  • 5/12/04 Pitt 5, Duquesne 1 [4][5]
  • 5/6/03 Duquesne 2, Pitt 1 (first college game at PNC)[6] CrazyPaco (talk) 05:37, 15 April 2008 (UTC)
That's a good idea, although it may be difficult to find sources enough to write a good paragraph. I see here that it was the first collegate baseball game to be played there, that is definately worth adding. If you have any more sources let me know and we type something up. For now I'll add it to the "Fists" section. Thanks!Blackngold29 (talk) 15:39, 15 April 2008 (UTC)
I added some refs above to PG articles about the games, the Trib archive may have some too.CrazyPaco (talk) 05:26, 17 April 2008 (UTC)
Cool, I'll see what I can do. Blackngold29 (talk) 12:39, 17 April 2008 (UTC)

Comments from Scartol

Well done on the rewrite! The references are very thorough, and you've got a lot of good information here. I don't know if it's quite up to GA status yet, but I also don't know what to suggest about how to improve it. I'd say depth is the number one concern – it seems to me that a stadium of this importance should have more detailed information about the construction and maintenance processes, community impact (see below), and so forth. At the same time, I understand that it's a (relatively) young field, and this information may not be available yet.

Here are some more specific comments; I hope they're useful.

  • All 23 labor unions were involved in the building process... The first part of this sentence is unclear. Are these all the labor unions in the city? Or are you referring to the unions which represent the workers involved in the park's construction? Please clarify. YesY Blackngold29 18:31, 20 April 2008 (UTC) This was misread by me, fixed.
  • Kansas-based HOK Sport was hired to design the stadium. Was there a bidding process? Why was this company chosen? This is a good spot for more detail. On the other hand, I don't know that naming the Architect of Record is necessary. (Unless you tell us some info on why they're notable.) YesY Blackngold29 19:25, 21 April 2008 (UTC) Removed AoR, it seems to be standard in the infobox however, so I left it there.
  • I'd vote to eliminate the "Plan B" and "Additions" headings. The content is good, but those paragraphs can be included in the main "Planning and construction" and "Design and groundbreaking" sections, respectively. Too many subheads makes things choppy and less fluid. YesY Blackngold29 18:25, 20 April 2008 (UTC) Removed, altered, and moved headings
  • Can you explain what the "all-you-can-eat section" is? A buffet? Who puts it on? This seems like it would fit in better earlier in the section, with the other mentions of food providers. YesY Blackngold29 00:22, 20 April 2008 (UTC) Moved and expanded
  • What is an "out-of-town scoreboard"? Sorry for my ignorance of things sports-related.YesY Blackngold29 00:37, 20 April 2008 (UTC) Expanded.
  • If Jim Caple called the park "perfect", how can he give it 95/100? This doesn't compute to me. If the ticket prices are too high, then it's not perfect, right? Maybe he called the facilities perfect? YesY Blackngold29 18:31, 20 April 2008 (UTC) Clarified.
  • Given the emphatic criticism of the park's cost, I'm surprised there isn't any information about the economics of the park. Has it helped the local economy or not? Surely there's been some research into its net effect on the community. YesY Blackngold29 20:25, 21 April 2008 (UTC) Found basic info, looking for more in-depth, will add soon
  • I'd like to see the "firsts" section written in paragraph form, rather than as a list. See Wikipedia:Embedded list for more info. YesY Blackngold29 00:12, 20 April 2008 (UTC) Created paragraph, added info about college games.
  • I've already fixed it, but please note the following, for future reference: The stadium also hosted the Century 21 Home Run Derby the previous evening, Ryan Howard won the title hitting 23 home runs. This is called a comma splice, since it has two independent clauses separated only by a comma. A semicolon is required (or it should be split into two sentences, or rewritten to include a conjunction). YesY Blackngold29 00:32, 20 April 2008 (UTC) Thanks, I'll keep that in mind.

Good luck with the article, and please let me know if you have any questions. – Scartol • Tok 15:48, 18 April 2008 (UTC)

Archive This is an archive of past discussions. Do not edit the contents of this page. If you wish to start a new discussion or revive an old one, please do so on the current talk page.