User talk:PMK1 (renamed)

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Hello, P m kocovski, and welcome to Wikipedia! Thank you for your contributions. I hope you like the place and decide to stay. Here are some pages that you might find helpful:

I hope you enjoy editing here and being a Wikipedian! Please sign your messages on discussion pages using four tildes (~~~~); this will automatically insert your username and the date. If you need help, check out Wikipedia:Questions, ask me on my talk page, or ask your question on this page and then place {{helpme}} before the question. Again, welcome! BalkanFever 09:39, 23 March 2008 (UTC)

Contents

[edit] Adding images to Wikipedia

Hi! You asked a question here about adding images to Wikipedia. Who owns the copyright on the images? What was the name of one of the images? (You can look in the deletion log to see why it was deleted.) You might find some help at Wikipedia:Uploading images. --Coppertwig (talk) 01:05, 24 March 2008 (UTC)

Zdravo, I myself don't know much about images - I would have to agree with Coppertwig. Just go through the links provided. If you need any more help, user:Future Perfect at Sunrise can probably provide assistance. Pozdrav, BalkanFever 08:52, 24 March 2008 (UTC)
I replied at User talk:Coppertwig#RE:Pictures. By the way, Melesse also knows a lot about images (much more than I do). You could try asking her. --Coppertwig (talk) 14:32, 24 March 2008 (UTC)


[edit] Fair use rationale for Image:Simbol na opstina Pustec.jpg

Thanks for uploading or contributing to Image:Simbol na opstina Pustec.jpg. I notice the image page specifies that the image is being used under fair use but there is not a suitable explanation or rationale as to why each specific use in Wikipedia constitutes fair use. Please go to the image description page and edit it to include a fair use rationale.

If you have uploaded other fair use media, consider checking that you have specified the fair use rationale on those pages too. You can find a list of 'image' pages you have edited by clicking on the "my contributions" link (it is located at the very top of any Wikipedia page when you are logged in), and then selecting "Image" from the dropdown box. Note that any non-free media lacking such an explanation will be deleted one week after they have been uploaded, as described on criteria for speedy deletion. If you have any questions please ask them at the Media copyright questions page. Thank you. NOTE: once you correct this, please remove the tag from the image's page. STBotI (talk) 07:43, 2 April 2008 (UTC)

[edit] Re: pictures

hi melesse i heard you have some knowledge on uplodaing pictures??? i you do could you please reply?? thanx P m kocovski (talk) 05:26, 4 April 2008 (UTC)

Sure, what do you need to know? Melesse (talk) 05:38, 4 April 2008 (UTC)

[edit] Re:

IMO, I would call it "Macedonians in Bulgaria", but obviously focusing more on Pirin. With the map, the best thing would be to get in contact with the bloggers, and ask them where they got it from. Hopefully they can get you a larger version, with a readable legend.

BTW, do you prefer for me to reply on your talk page, or on mine? BalkanFever 10:04, 5 April 2008 (UTC)

The map on the blog is a false one. You were already told that [1] this is the original one and the other was edited so that it suits the bloggers propaganda. --Laveol T 10:14, 5 April 2008 (UTC)

[edit] Macedonians in Bulgaria

Stop with the removals before you read this. See, I have added info with reliable sources that are not even from the Balkans. If you just remove them with no reason that is vandalism. Try discussing what you don't like first. And something else - try to be more precise when you add sources - what was this: The Center for Strategic and International Studies)' - is that a source (I mean written like this with no other mention) - be more precise what kind of a source is this. See, I have given everything for my sources. --Laveol T 21:26, 6 April 2008 (UTC)

you have written

RE:At the plenum of the Bulgarian Communist Party held that year the decision was made that the Macedonian, Dobrujan and Thracian nations did not exist and neither did their respective languages.

please explain what are these so called dobrujan and thracian languages? and or peoples and where are they today? do you have census data from the 1940s or 1950s regarding the thracians and dobrujans? P m kocovski (talk) 21:41, 6 April 2008 (UTC)

You're the one with the censuses - you should know. As for the other question, I'll leave it without an answer - it speaks for itself. --Laveol T 22:01, 6 April 2008 (UTC)
well ive been looking around an havent found much on the drobujan and thracian nations. Are their any links on the net which has info about them??? + "The Bulgarian Communist party was compelled by Stalin to accept the formation of Macedonian, Thracian and Dobrujan nations in order to include those new separate states in a Balkan communist federation." is really highly debatable because their is enough sources that are completely oppostie to what has been said. and this could end up leading to some sort of edit war. possibly making it NPOV would cause less edit warring. Also stalin died in 1953 so it is a bit innacurate to continue to have the point stalin did this, especially after 1953. As for the census' they are correct. P m kocovski (talk) 22:10, 6 April 2008 (UTC) please add any other points of consideration.
Is now the right moment to ask you where you got your population data from. I doubt it comes from the official archives. One more question - why have omited the bigger part of the ethnic MAcedonians living in Bulgaria nowadays. Most of them are recent immigrants waiting for their Bulgarian passports. Are you omitting them on purpose? Oh, and, please, try discussing your changes before applying them. I have sourced every single of the sentences I have written. And have done it properly. I'd advice you to work on your own refs before deleting propoperly sourced info.--Laveol T 22:13, 6 April 2008 (UTC)
An NPOV version would be one with the present situation only. Everything else might lead to an edit-war if you refuse to acknowledge the info that is sourced. And one more thing - this is not MK Wiki, this is the real deal. Noone here would possibly let you write the stuff that's written there. --Laveol T 22:15, 6 April 2008 (UTC)
Lets continue the discussion on the page. And by the way if you have noticed Bulgarian wikipedia has sourced every single macedonian village and added the number of "bulgarians' who were their in 1905?? what a joke ps: continue on here P m kocovski (talk) 09:49, 7 April 2008 (UTC)
You call it a joke. Other people call it otherwise.--Laveol T 15:43, 7 April 2008 (UTC)

[edit] Image

I'll try to give you a hand there. I think the problem's that the pic you're trying to put is uploaded on MK wiki. You should upload it either on en wiki as well or on Commons (with which you already have experience). --Laveol T 23:28, 7 April 2008 (UTC)

thats the krusevo monument rite?P m kocovski (talk) 01:22, 8 April 2008 (UTC)
Mhm - it's only on MK wiki. --Laveol T 01:27, 8 April 2008 (UTC)


[edit] Fair use rationale for Image:Bannernarodnavolja.gif

Thanks for uploading Image:Bannernarodnavolja.gif. You've indicated that the image meets Wikipedia's criteria for non-free content, but there is no explanation of why it meets those criteria. Please go to the image description page and edit it to include a fair use rationale. If you have any questions, please post them at Wikipedia:Media copyright questions.

Thank you for your cooperation. NOTE: once you correct this, please remove the tag from the image's page. STBotI (talk) 03:58, 8 April 2008 (UTC)

[edit] template (lol!)

All you have to do is copy and paste:

{{Ethnic Macedonians}}

to get the template onto the page. Otherwise, we have to edit every single page when we want to change something. :D BalkanFever 07:33, 12 April 2008 (UTC)

[edit] Source

Sorry, but you'll have to provide a better source than the Greek Helsinki Comittee. It is not relevant - how should people in Greece know what's going on in Bulgaria and it is hardly reliable. I was going to mention who says so in the article, but imagine how it sounds - The Greek Helsinki Committee is of the belief that in Bulgaria this and this and this. It's ridiculous. I'll give you a day to find a better source and then I'll replace all the links to this pdf with fact-tags. --Laveol T 11:48, 12 April 2008 (UTC)
And another thing - are you sure you're gonna use Македонското малцинство" в Република България, Антон Ж. Иванов,1991 as a source? Cause if you are, I'm gonna add the other info from his article as well. --Laveol T 12:01, 12 April 2008 (UTC)

Why are you re-instating the sources like "Kanev, 1999"? --Laveol T 00:11, 14 April 2008 (UTC)

[edit] 2 things

Yes, the page should be revamped. I'm happy to follow on with your plans for the article. I'll look for some more sources etc.

Also, anything about the јазик (dialects etc.) should go on {{Macedonian language}}, not Ethnic Macedonians. You might want to look at the talk page too, and give your opinion on the image we should use. Pozdrav. BalkanFever 09:47, 13 April 2008 (UTC)


I saw the comment, which is why I edited the actual image page (clarifying the sources and whatnot) but didn't have time to answer. Yes, it is. BalkanFever 08:39, 14 April 2008 (UTC)


Hey, I believe you want to make an article on the ethnic Macedonian minority in Greece. My advice would be, at least for now, не. Simply because there will be too many reactions from the Greek side. Some will be constructive, but most won't. There are so many newly created Macedonia-related articles, like your three minority articles (алал да ти е!) that I think you (and the other Makedonci) should just concentrate on improving them more. Maybe later we can start one, but right now, I can see massive potential for it to simply become a battlefield where POV pushers from all sides rape the article over and over. Pozdrav BalkanFever 12:23, 15 April 2008 (UTC)

I would say that all that article would be yet another fork of information already present here and here. If you have something new to add from reliable sources, I'd suggest that you add it there for now.--Dexippus (talk) 14:22, 15 April 2008 (UTC)
Trebame povekje izvori. Kje probam da najdam nekolku, ama nemam mnogu vreme. BalkanFever 14:19, 15 April 2008 (UTC)

[edit] Maps

Hi. As I'm sure you're aware, there are two trends among pre-1940s ethnic maps of the Balkans. Most classify the Slav population of Macedonia as "Bulgarians", the rest classify them as "Macedonian Slavs" or "Macedonians". Since there are two trends, why are you trying to suppress one of them? Isn't it only fair that both be presented to make clear that the situation back then was far from undisputed?--Dexippus (talk) 14:17, 15 April 2008 (UTC)

[edit] НОБ на Македонија

Здраво P m kocovski, како е? Би сакал да те замолам да ја надгледуваш статијата National Liberation War of Macedonia. Има еден корисник кој постојано ја напаѓа и ги вади промените, со цел статијата да изгледа грдо. Поздрав. --Revizionist (talk) 15:41, 15 April 2008 (UTC)

Ohhh... you sly dog, you. Perhaps Future would find your way of dealing with things quite rational *cough* Köbra Könverse 15:50, 15 April 2008 (UTC)

Да, роден сум во Битола, но не живеам таму сега. Да јас ја ревидирав статијата за НОБ, мило ми е што ти се допаѓа. Сега е многу поинформативна и е збогатена со полезни фотографии, мапи и фактологија. Би сакал одвреме навреме да ја надгледуваш. Поздрав голем. --Revizionist (talk) 11:39, 16 April 2008 (UTC)

[edit] Vevčani-Radoža dialect

I hope so you will like this article [[2]]. Regards --MacedonianBoy (talk) 20:37, 15 April 2008 (UTC)

Možeš li da si ja otvoriš e-pošta? ;) BalkanFever
Znaeš li kako da go praviš toa? BalkanFever 09:52, 17 April 2008 (UTC)
Ti prativ dve poraki, ama ne gledam odgovori od tebe :S BalkanFever

[edit] Dialects of the Macedonian Language

Rado bi pišuval, ama nemam golemi poznavanja kako MB vo sferata na lingvistikata. Ќe se obidam nešto ako možam. Pozz--Raso mk (talk) 10:28, 17 April 2008 (UTC)

Да, имам литература од таа област, кога ќе се поослободам малку ќе подготвам материјал за статија. Поздрав. --Revizionist (talk) 07:25, 18 April 2008 (UTC)

[edit] Census figures

As far as I know, Albania recognizes a Macedonian, not a Macedonian Christian minority. There's no evidence that they don't include Macedonian Muslims in the minority they recognize (or is there?). Unofficial estimates shouldn't override offical data; they can go in the main text, but the infobox should be reserved for official data (if it exists).

Regarding census figures at the article Greeks, I'm not following the developments on that article. Naturally I believe that census figures should be preferred, the Greek Foreign Ministry's estimates (which of course are more "official" than those of some random nationalist author) could go in the article Greek diaspora (where min-max ranges are used).--Dexippus (talk) 16:35, 17 April 2008 (UTC)

[edit] Edno prašanje

Just curious; is it Kocovski (Коцовски) or Kočovski (Кочовски)? BalkanFever 08:53, 19 April 2008 (UTC)

E-poštata od pred dva dena - da. I mene mnogu mi dosaduva eden korisnik - toj so tri bukvi vo imeto ;). Posle nekolku vreme, kje vidiš deka e pointeresno da igraš majtap :D. Ušte čekam ako MacedonianBoy kje se vrati kako korisnik - nekoi od tuka im gi skinale žicite :(. Ako toj doagja navistina mislam site tie stranici za dijalektite kje bidat napraveni. Ama bez nego, ne znam što kje se stori. BalkanFever 12:54, 19 April 2008 (UTC)
skinale žicite? --Laveol T 14:24, 19 April 2008 (UTC)
Literally "ripped his wires". "Wires" is more like "nerves" but you get the idea. BalkanFever 14:31, 19 April 2008 (UTC)
I thought so. WAs this about my wires or everybody's wires? --Laveol T 15:02, 19 April 2008 (UTC)
About MacedonianBoy's wires. BalkanFever 15:04, 19 April 2008 (UTC)

NO, NO, NO I am back! Ask Laveol about his nerves on the BG Wikipedia! He acted very nervous. :) Regards--MacedonianBoy (talk) 15:07, 19 April 2008 (UTC)

[edit] lower preaspa dialects

Can you help me with the cyrillization and the addition of the standard Macedonian alternative word to the words I added in the article, Thanks: Alekishere (talk) 21:01, 20 April 2008 (UTC)

[edit] Image upload

Hello, I'm afraid your licensing claim on Image:EthnicMacedoniansinBulgaria.jpg ("fair use: free image off UMO-pirin") won't work. First of all, "free" and "fair use" have nothing to do with each other. Please see WP:NFC and related pages. What you need is an explicit statement of the owners of that website or organisation or whatever it is, stating that they allow anybody to use this image for any purpose, and you need clearly documented proof of that. Short of that, there's no way you can use such an image here. Fut.Perf. ☼ 08:57, 22 April 2008 (UTC)

Uh-oh. Just had a look at some of your other image uploads. Image:InsidethePaintedMosque-Tetovo.jpg is a clear copyright violation from here. I am certain Image:Bitolskacatolickskacrvka.jpg is stolen off the web too (if it was your own photograph, why would you have uploaded it in that tiny format?) - I give you 24h time to tidy up all your images - for each of them, please add a correct and truthful copyright declaration, or tag them with {{db-g7}}. If you don't comply I'll have to ban you from all image uploads. Fut.Perf. ☼ 09:06, 22 April 2008 (UTC)
The template {{db-g7}} is a request for deletion stating that you uploaded it "in error" (milder form than tagging it as a downright copyvio... :-) As for "web images", no, that's just the point, "I found it on the web somewhere and I was assuming the owners wouldn't mind me using it" is NOT, EVER, a justification for using an image here. You need an explicit license, we really mean that.
As for your question about the map: the program I use myself for such color-coded country maps is Inkscape, which works with .svg files. There must be an svg version of that blank map somewhere, if you find that you can easily assign each country a different color. But working with photoshop on the .png file is also acceptable of course. SVG is sort of "cleaner". Fut.Perf. ☼ 09:19, 22 April 2008 (UTC)
I've deleted the three we talked about; please also check any others you might have uploaded. Also, if you could do me a favour, please remove the redlinks from any pages where you included them. Thanks, Fut.Perf. ☼ 09:31, 22 April 2008 (UTC)

[edit] Image copyright problem with Image:Simbol na opstina Pustec.jpg

Image Copyright problem

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[edit] Image copyright problem with Image:Bannernarodnavolja.gif

Image Copyright problem

Hi P m kocovski!
We thank you for uploading Image:Bannernarodnavolja.gif, but there is a problem. Your image is currently missing information on its copyright status. Wikipedia takes copyright very seriously. Unless you can help by adding a copyright tag, it may be deleted by an Administrator. If you know this information, then we urge you to add a copyright tag to the image description page. We apologize for this, but all images must confirm to policy on Wikipedia.

If you have any questions, please feel free to ask them at the media copyright questions page. Thanks so much for your cooperation.
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[edit] Image copyright problem with Image:Flag of the Macedonian minority in Serbia and Montenegro.gif

Image Copyright problem

Hi P m kocovski!
We thank you for uploading Image:Flag of the Macedonian minority in Serbia and Montenegro.gif, but there is a problem. Your image is currently missing information on its copyright status. Wikipedia takes copyright very seriously. Unless you can help by adding a copyright tag, it may be deleted by an Administrator. If you know this information, then we urge you to add a copyright tag to the image description page. We apologize for this, but all images must confirm to policy on Wikipedia.

If you have any questions, please feel free to ask them at the media copyright questions page. Thanks so much for your cooperation.
This message is from a robot. --John Bot III (talk) 17:54, 24 April 2008 (UTC)

[edit] Re

No problem. Samo da soberam nekoi izvori, inaku ke ne napadnat i se ke ni ispomešaat. pozz--Raso mk (talk) 13:18, 2 May 2008 (UTC)

[edit] Please use English

Hello. When on the English-language Wikipedia, please always use English, no matter to whom you address your comments. This is so that comments may be comprehensible to the community at large. If the use of another language is unavoidable, please provide a translation of the comments. For more details, see Wikipedia:Talk page guidelines. Thank you. The Cat and the Owl (talk) 07:53, 3 May 2008 (UTC)


[edit] VOTE

Please bro vote here: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Template_talk:Ethnic_Macedonians Makedonij 13:15, 9 May 2008 (UTC)

[edit] AfD nomination of Aegean Macedonians

An article that you have been involved in editing, Aegean Macedonians, has been listed for deletion. If you are interested in the deletion discussion, please participate by adding your comments at Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Aegean Macedonians. Thank you. Do you want to opt out of receiving this notice?    Avg    18:00, 11 May 2008 (UTC)

[edit] CORECT MISTAKE

Bratmi,will you help me here?http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Macedonians_in_Slovenia.I'm asking you to chek my english? Thanks.Makedonij (talk) 14:32, 12 May 2008 (UTC)

[edit] Odgovor

Kovocvski, I did not move the article to ethnic Macedonians in Greece, but to ethnic Macedonians of Greece - because the word "OF" shows that it is not only about those people with ethnic Macedonian conscience that still live in Greek Macedonia, but also in Republic of Macedonia, Canada and so on. Regards. --Revizionist (talk) 12:47, 13 May 2008 (UTC)

P.S.About the template, it the Macedonian Muslims are included in the Religion Section of the template. If you put them into subgroups too, it will be repeated twice. About the Aegean Macedonians, they are not a subgroup. If everything is alright with the article we can include them in the link about Macedonians of Greece in the template. I would repeat once again that according to me, the appropriate name of the article must be ethnic Macedonians of Greece. Not in Greece, but of Greece - that article would be a conglomerate of those that live in Greece, and those that are refugees in R. Macedonia, Canada, Australia and so on. Regards. --Revizionist (talk) 13:04, 13 May 2008 (UTC)

No, not at all. On the contrary, you made the template much much better. Regards. --Revizionist (talk) 12:54, 14 May 2008 (UTC)

[edit] Unhelpful comments

This [3] is even more unhelpful than the posting you were reacting to. Please don't do that. Taunting an editor while he's blocked is a particular nasty form of small-mindedness. Fut.Perf. ☼ 20:45, 17 May 2008 (UTC)

[edit] "Deca begalci" in Greek

As I said before, you wouldn't use "paidomazoma" to refer to the "deca begalci" because that would imply that they are brainwashed (although this is how they are normally presented by Greek commentators). The word "paidomazoma" is more often used in relation to Janissaries. I'm not aware of any specific Greek term used term used to refer to the children in particular out of the total number of political refugees except maybe "ta apachthenta paidia" ("the kidnapped children").--Dexippus (talk) 00:44, 18 May 2008 (UTC)

[edit] Macedonians of Greece

I think that you shoud read this!

PozdravMakedonij (talk) 19:20, 21 May 2008 (UTC)

[edit] User moving

You should probably go to WP:CHU or WP:CHU/U, so that all your contributions are properly moved. This will take about a week, but I think it's better than just creating a new account and using redirects. Cheers. BalkanFever 06:19, 24 May 2008 (UTC)