Talk:Phil Simms

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Good article Phil Simms has been listed as one of the Everyday life good articles under the good article criteria. If you can improve it further, please do. If it no longer meets these criteria, you can delist it, or ask for a reassessment.
May 9, 2008 Good article nominee Listed
This article must adhere to the policy on biographies of living persons. Controversial material about living persons that is unsourced or poorly sourced must be removed immediately, especially if potentially libellous. If such material is repeatedly inserted or if there are other concerns relative to this policy, report it on the living persons biographies noticeboard.
Maintained The following user(s) are actively contributing to this article and may be able to help with questions about verification and sources:
Quadzilla99 (talk • contribs • email)
This in no way implies article ownership; all editors are encouraged to contribute.

Contents

[edit] Fine person

Phil Simms is as fine a person as you will ever meet..... Ron Henke —Preceding unsigned comment added by 68.1.116.225 (talk • contribs)

[edit] Terrible Announcer

Worst, most biased color man......ever. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 64.53.136.44 (talk • contribs)

You're kidding me, right? Have you ever actually listened to him? Have you ever actually listed to the likes of Phil Rizzuto? Randy Cross? There's a reason he's part of CBS's number 1 announcing team. Regardless, however, this has nothing to do with the improvement of this article. —Wrathchild (talk) 20:38, 7 November 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Revision

I think this cleans up the article a bit. It still has a lot of NPOV issues, but at least it is better formatted. It would be appreciated if someone could come forth with more sources so that it adheres to Wikipedia guidelines. Thanks and comments/advice appreciated. 70.21.216.202 22:18, 15 November 2006 (UTC)

This article has way too many sections, this really needs to be addressed. Quadzilla99 09:11, 1 February 2007 (UTC)
The sections should be fine now I reduced them in number, I'm going to expand them with sourced info. If they get long I'll break the article up into more sections. Quadzilla99 08:13, 9 May 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Broadcasting career

I removed this, as it's OR:

"Simms is known for his warm, conversational broadcasting style (as well as his tendency to say "eem" in place of "him" in his Kentucky accent), which has endeared him to many football fans who tune in every Sunday. However many football fans dislike his aggressive speaking style where he seems to be moderately yelling during analysis. Despite this Simms is respected and admired in the broadcasting industry."

Feel free to re-add it with sources. Quadzilla99 08:10, 23 April 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Referencing style

I'm going to convert the referencing to a manual format, if anyone disagrees please let me know. I'll wait a while before doing so to see what if someone objects. Quadzilla99 08:14, 23 April 2007 (UTC)

If not let me know and I'll convert the refs I added to CITET format and be on my way. Quadzilla99 08:16, 23 April 2007 (UTC)
I'll give it a few more days. Quadzilla99 21:35, 1 May 2007 (UTC)
Okay I'm going ahead with it. Quadzilla99 05:16, 9 May 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Major work done

Okay, I re-formatted the refs, added a stats table, expanded the article and nominated it for GA, which passed. Looks pretty good. Quadzilla99 10:35, 9 May 2007 (UTC)

This is great. Does anyone have an image of Mr. Simms to add? The article seems incomplete without one. Stevie is the man! Talk • Work 14:38, 9 May 2007 (UTC)
Hopefully we'll have one in a day or two. I'm an active editor over at Wikimedia Commons and a photographer that was nice enough to share the photo now in use on Joe Montana, has one of Simms. I've asked him to change the license and I assume he'll say yes. Quadzilla99 14:40, 9 May 2007 (UTC)
To clarify I asked him if he would mind sharing the Montana pic and he didn't mind, so I don't see why he wouldn't share the Simms pic. Quadzilla99 14:42, 9 May 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Politics

I removed this info in lieu of a source:

"Prior to the 2006 election campaign, some bloggers suggested that Simms seek the Republican nomination for U.S. Senator from New Jersey, comparing his appeal to former New Jersey Senator Bill Bradley. The entry of Thomas Kean, Jr. to the 2006 senate race ended this speculation." Quadzilla99 06:34, 10 May 2007 (UTC)

[edit] GA Review

A review has been requested for this article regarding the passing of the GA nomination due to the following concerns:

[edit] Lead

[edit] Early life and rookie season

  • "While an elementary school student his family moved and Simms grew up in Louisville, later starting his NFL career when drafted out of Morehead State University, in the first round of the 1979 NFL Draft, by the New York Giants." - Would read better if broken into two sentences.
    • done.
  • "... planned to draft Phil in the 3rd round." "3rd" → "third".
    • done.
  • 1979 NFL Draft is wikilinked twice, one sentence after the other. It should only be wikified in the first appearance (for this section). This is per WP:MOS#Wikilinking.
    • I don't see this, it's linked in the lead and the first section, I unlinked it in the first section
  • "...his selection was booed loudly by Giants fans, something he would get used to in his early Giant years." - I googled this and didn't find anything, not to say I didn't just keyed in the wrong keywords. But it currently appears to be OR. Reference 4 may verify it, but without a subscription, I can't read it.
    • I removed the last half of the sentence and sourced it, I used a readable source.
  • "He led the team to a 6–4 record as a starter, throwing for 1,743 yards and 13 touchdown passes and was named to the NFL All Rookie Team." - Shouldn't this be referenced?

[edit] Early career

  • Numbers under 11 should be spelled out per MOS. "9 interceptions" → "nine interceptions".
    • See below.
  • References some statements but not others. For example, there is a reference for his shoulder injury but not for his knee injury which, according to the article, prevented him for playing the entire 1982 season.
    • Done.
  • Also, "...playing the entire 1982 season. After the 1982 season..." would read better if it were rewritten to "... playing the entire 1982 season. The following season, ..."
    • Done.
  • "One of Parcells first decisions as coach was to replace Simms as the team's starting quarterback with Brunner." Source?
    • done.
  • Third paragraph, "3 TDs" → "three TDs".
    • See below.
  • Stand-alone years are randomly wikilinked. I see now that NFL season is in the link, just not shown in the article.
    • I unlinked those anyway I've never been a fan of that. Quadzilla99 10:21, 10 May 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Super Bowl XXI

  • Super Bowl XXI need only be wikilinked once under the heading of the same.
    • Done.
  • "...2 dropped passes..." - "2" → "two".
    • See below.
  • "...he threw 3 touchdown passes..." - "3" → "three".
    • See below.
  • "Two of the most famous plays from the game were..." - If they're so famous, why are there no sources?
    • Done.
  • "(Disney produces two versions of each TV commercial.)" - Is that really relevant to this article?

[edit] Later career

  • "9 touchdowns, and 9 interceptions." → "Nine touchdowns, and nine interceptions."
  • "2nd highest" → "second highest".
  • "Parcells resigned and was replaced..." - Reference.
    • Done.
  • "7 interceptions" → "seven interceptions"
  • "6 touchdowns" → "six touchdowns"
    • See below for the rest. Quadzilla99 10:24, 10 May 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Life off the field

  • "Simms then motioned for Taylor to run a longer pattern and after 30–40 yards threw him the pass." - Commas.
    • Done.
  • "more than 5 years" → "more than five years"
    • Done.
  • The remainder is unreferenced.

[edit] Passing statistics

Considering this table is here, it seems redundant and unnecessary to clutter the article with these same statistics.

  • Comment I don't see how it clutters the article, also it's standard practice. Quadzilla99 10:01, 10 May 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Notes

21 has a format error.

[edit] Conclusion

I feel that this is a well-written article, but that it was not adequately reviewed. If it had been, it would have been put on hold until issues were resolved. Perhaps my reviews are overly thorough compared the the reviewer of this article, but I feel that improving articles to GA status improves Wikipedia, thus all reviews should be thorough. I hope you find this review helpful. Regards, LaraLoveTalk/Contribs 07:36, 10 May 2007 (UTC)

  • Comment Okay I addressed all your concerns some of the things weren't sourced as they didn't really meet the criteria of a disputed statement to me as they're easy to verify, but I sourced them since they were requested. The numbers is the only thing unaddressed. That's because it's standard practice to put all statistics in numerals in sports articles (in the US at least) and all articles here do the same (see Tom Brady, Terry Bradshaw, Dwyane Wade etc.) Quadzilla99 10:38, 10 May 2007 (UTC)
What I see WP:UNITS stating is "Spell out units in the text." I know the digits should be used in the table, but they should be spelled out in the body. Regardless, I decided to just read the whole MOS (dates and numbers) again and found that it reads, "Within a context or a list, style should be consistent." Above that it states, "Numbers above ten may be written out if they are expressed in two or fewer words, except in tables and infoboxes." So for the purposes of this article, numbers that require more than two words to express (like those of passing yards) must use digits, thus all other numerical stats in that context must also. Therefore you're right and I've learned something new.
This article, in my opinion, now meets GA standards. Thank you for your hard work. Improving this article improved Wikipedia. Keep up the good work and good luck in future edits.
Regards, LaraLoveTalk/Contribs 17:28, 10 May 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Why hide the wikiprojects?

Is there a rationale for hiding wikiproject coverage the way it's being done now? At least with the banner shell, people can see the projects at a glance without having to click anything. I don't have the time to read a long discussion right now. What are the reverter's reasons for reverting? Stevie is the man! Talk • Work 04:45, 1 June 2007 (UTC)

See here. Quadzilla99 04:53, 1 June 2007 (UTC)
I already said I'm not interested in reading a pump discussion. There's no acceptable rationale for completely hiding project coverage. Hiding details yes, but hiding everything, no. Stevie is the man! Talk • Work 16:17, 3 June 2007 (UTC)
So you refuse to read what other people have to say and your mind's made up? That's not in the spirit of how things work here. Quadzilla99 16:27, 3 June 2007 (UTC)
There is no acceptable explanation for intransigence on a helpful change like this. Nobody owns articles in the Wikipedia. Further, nobody is paying me for my time to read a bunch of lame arguments against the better choice. Stevie is the man! Talk • Work 16:55, 9 June 2007 (UTC)