Talk:Perth, Western Australia

From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Perth, Western Australia was one of the Geography and places good articles, but it has been removed from the list. There are suggestions below for improving the article to meet the good article criteria. Once these issues have been addressed, the article can be renominated. Editors may also seek a reassessment of the decision if they believe there was a mistake.

	Article milestones

Date

Process

Result

April 20, 2006

Good article nominee

Listed

September 16, 2007

Good article reassessment

Delisted

Current Status: Delisted good article

Portal	Perth, Western Australia is within the scope of WikiProject Australia, which aims to improve Wikipedia's coverage of Australia and Australia-related topics. If you would like to participate, visit the project page.
B	This article has been rated as B-class on the quality scale.
Top	This article has been rated as Top-importance on the importance scale.
	This article is supported by WikiProject Perth.
Assessment comments This article has been rated for quality and/or importance but has no comments yet. If appropriate, please review the article and then leave comments here to identify the strengths and weaknesses of the article and what work it will need.

This page has been selected for the release version of Wikipedia and rated B-Class on the assessment scale. It is in the category Geography. It has been rated High-Importance on the importance scale.

To-do list for Perth, Western Australia:

edit · history · watch · refresh

Photos needed:

List the article here, Also use Category:Wikipedia requested photographs in Western Australia it's been created for this purpose, instructions to use are available on the page

Brookton Highway
Casuarina Prison
Ascot Racecourse
~~Hyde Park~~
Vlamingh's Plate I believe it's on display in the Western Australian Maritime Museum in Freo

Articles needed:

Prof. Gordon Stephenson's 1955 Plan for the Metropolitan Region, Perth and Fremantle
~~History of Perth, Western Australia~~
~~Buy WA First~~
Original Tram company (1899!)
... or trams and light rail WA
~~Fremantle Cemetery~~
~~Fremantle Markets~~
Perth Markets
Fiona Stanley Hospital
Geláre
Buy West, Eat Best

	Perth Meetup Next: TBA Last: 13/02/2008 This box: view • talk • edit

Archives
1, 2

How come their is no economy section? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 68.109.127.19 (talk) 04:17, 6 November 2007 (UTC)

I added the sister cities, but I don't know how to fix the border so the image of the Northbridge tunnel is not cutting over it.I like Radiohead 05:57, 8 October 2006 (UTC)

I've removed this list. This article is about the Perth metropolitan area, not the City of Perth, which these cities are sister to.--cj | talk 15:38, 27 December 2006 (UTC)

And I have done so again. I think someone is going through the Australian cities articles and adding them 58.174.41.169 (talk) 11:51, 23 April 2008 (UTC)

[edit] Native Title

This makes no sense to anyone who has no clue what Native Title means. Please clarify the term Native Title if you know what it is. Dkriegls 08:14, 20 March 2007 (UTC)

Doesn't "native title" refer to legislation dealing with the returning of land ownership to the original occupiers, specifically aboriginals?

[edit] Housing Prices/Economy

I think this should be added somewhere, as it is often mentioned in The West and in the local news reports. Something about being the second highest in the country, and the huge growth rate. I have a link which I got off the Canberra wiki REIA. This has all of the necessecary information I think.

There's also no mention of the Economy of Perth, I don't feel it's adequetly covered in the Western Australia article, which passes over the heavily services based sector. I'm not sure if it's needed though, as, except for the Major mining companes based here, it's much like other large western cities.

I like Radiohead 06:12, 8 October 2006 (UTC)

Definately agree, Perth's economy is booming at the moment. Not only the mining sector, but other areas such as tourism and the businesses services sector. AustralianTraveller 21:28, 26 February 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Perth Tram Company

This article reads like an add for the company and I think it should be deleted. The original request in the to/do box was for Perth Trams, which I took as the use of trams in Perth between 1890 and 1960. can who ever put the original request please clarify what they were looking for. Gnangarra 09:38, 28 October 2006 (UTC)

I can't see how the article reads like an add for the company - it is not bias or one-sided in my point of view. For tourism in Western Australia, I think it is quite a prominent attraction, hence the need for the article. The original request was for Perth Trams, but I didn't take it as the old trams that were in use. If that was the original intentions for the request, then maybe another article can be made about the mode of transport used in Perth at that time. So while it may not have been the intended article, I think the article is still needed, having been a tourist in Perth myself. Sorry Gnangarra if I totally misread the original request, --Ali K 09:57, 28 October 2006 (UTC)

I dont know what the origiinal request was for hence the question, its not Bias its just reads like an add rather than an article. The other point is it doesnt link from any articles, I though maybe who ever requested the article in the first place would respond and link to what they wanted it for. Gnangarra 12:36, 28 October 2006 (UTC)

Okay, thanks for the concern. --Ali K 12:58, 28 October 2006 (UTC)

Ahem! I have only just got back online and can now confirm that I made the original request for the original trams (historical). Sorry to have generated any confusion yet glad for the interest. Fred.e 19:16, 8 November 2006 (UTC)

I think the article should be deleted - although perhaps some of the info should go on the new page about the historical trams. Anyway, i've nominated it for deletion. See: Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Perth Tram Company DonkeyKong the mathematician (in training) 08:27, 4 December 2006 (UTC)

Afd finished early after all article editors indicated it should be deleted. Gnangarra 13:29, 4 December 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Robert Holmes à Court

Robert and Janet had 4 children, Peter, Paul and Simon and a daughter whose name I cannot remember. Help. — Moondyne 14:42, 28 October 2006 (UTC)

Catherine. Thanks User:124.189.207.200 — Moondyne 08:01, 2 November 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Metropolitan Regional Scheme

Do we want to mention the MRS in here someplace, or would it be better in a separate article? Gordon | Talk, 11:36, 12 November 2006 (UTC)

Both Gnangarra 11:59, 12 November 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Archived Old Talk

Hi, I just archived pretty much everything before October, as it was mostly out of date. They can be found in /Archive1 and /Archive2. I like Radiohead 13:50, 16 November 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Picture

The picture of Perth's location in relation to the rest of Australia was recently changed, and I believe it should be changed back. It is now inconsistent with the other state capitals, and it doesn't show the location of Perth in relation to anything, AND it cuts out half of the metropolitan area, for example, Gosnells to the south, where I live, and Joondalup to the north.I like Radiohead 13:52, 16 November 2006 (UTC)

Ummmm. Er... Why are there now two "Perth in Australia" maps in this article? When the one in the text below the info-box not only shows Perth, but also all the other State capitals? The locator map which I like Radiohead replaced was not intended to show Perth City in relationship to the rest of the state, but its position on the Swan River. None of the other inner suburban locator maps show Gosnells or Joondalup either -- but they are clearly visible on the outer suburban locator maps which show Perth as a small blip. Gordon | Talk, 13:15, 19 November 2006 (UTC)

This article has too many maps - someone needs to be brave! SatuSuro 13:53, 19 November 2006 (UTC)

I can see your point :> OTOH, we could have a very bright debate here, as I value maps in this context -- I believe it is necessary to show people graphically the geographical relationships a place has, 'cos doing it with words lacks a certain je ne sais quois. However, maybe there is a better way of doing it, perhaps a map-oriented sub-page or something? Gordon | Talk, 14:05, 19 November 2006 (UTC)

I think that the current "yellow" map in the info box is the one thats got to stay as it maintains consistancy across all capital city articles. the second detailed map should be removed, in its current positio nit doesnt add any value and actually detracts signifcantly with its location so close to the "yellow" one. Gnangarra 14:20, 19 November 2006 (UTC)

There is surely a subsidiary or sister page that could utilise the second map - um 'Swan coastal plain' springs to mind but there might be others you folks could think of? SatuSuro 14:26, 19 November 2006 (UTC)

the detailed map with scale etc maybe Australia Gnangarra 14:31, 19 November 2006 (UTC)

it is on Geography of Australia already Gnangarra

Anyway, I've removed it. Gordon | Talk, 14:36, 19 November 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Isolated city

Honolulu is further than Perth to any other similar state or national city, the full story with distances is at Talk:Perth,_Western_Australia/Archive1#Isolated_City. I commented out the section for this claim to be added it needs to supported by an independant reference. Gnangarra 03:08, 26 December 2006 (UTC)

The exact claim of isolation was that Perth was a metro area of population of atleast one million that was furthest away from another metro area of population of atleast one million than any other metro area of population of atleast one million on the planet. That is, imagine that all human inhabitations of less than a million people staying fairly close to each other were wiped off the planet. Then, Perth would be the most isolated city on the earth. According to it's article, Honolulu has 377,260 people, and the island of Oahu (a reasonable definition of Honolulu's metro area) has around 900,000 people - too small to meet our cut-off of a million people. True, in 10-15 years or so Honolulu's population will probably increase enough to make the cut-off and it will become the most isolated city, but for now Perth is the winner in this contest. You could ofcourse ask what makes the one million number so special that it was chosen as the cutoff. Well, apart from its round attractiveness in base 10, nothing. 999,999 or 1,000,001 could be just as valid a cut-off as 1,000,000, but if we play that game and keep stretching the limit just a little bit in both directions then soon we end up with any square inch that does not have humans on it or the whole planet itself as being the most isolated - clearly an absurd notion. A limit (necessarily arbitrary) must be picked at some point, and one million is just as good a number as any other for this purpose. Therefore, I for one choose to ~~welcome our new Perthian overlords~~ mention this piece of trivia on the article page. Anybody else with me? --Qwertyca 02:51, 6 January 2007 (UTC)

The section says Perth is the most isolated metropolitan area on Earth. The nearest city to it with a population of over 1 million is Adelaide in South Australia, a distance of approximately 2,104 kilometers (1,307 miles). and doesnt define the above parameters neither does Metropolitan area. Is there a source for this claim, which states the methodology use to establish the claim. Currently the information is an ambigious claim based on a necessarily arbitrary number as such is of no encyclopedic value and it violates WP:OR. Gnangarra 03:48, 6 January 2007 (UTC)

Cities with at least a million inhabitants in 2006

Actually, I've heard this "most isolated city" claim both on the Travel Channel (if you're in the USA you should know about it, if not just Google it) and also on the Lonely Planet website. Therefore, this is not original research. We should rephrase the claim to make it specific that we are referring to metro area only. The definition of metro area is on the metro area page (essentially, zone of economic influence / commuter belt). As for being unencyclopedic, I'd disagree with that because it is quite an interesting piece of trivia IMHO. --Qwertyca 09:03, 7 January 2007 (UTC)

The adjacent map confirmed this discussion. Gazjo 10:40, 2 November 2007 (UTC)

but...

after checking that map, I see that Auckland is 2152km from Sydney, which is greater than the Perth-Adelaide distance, which would suggest that Auckland may in fact be the most isolated city of over one million people. Would someone like to confirm this? Gazjo 09:10, 3 November 2007 (UTC)

Perth is 2700km from Adelaide. It's also a three hour flight from Adelaide, whereas Sydney is a two hour flight from Auckland. Orderinchaos 09:25, 3 November 2007 (UTC)

The article says 2104km so there is an error somewhere. Gazjo 11:01, 3 November 2007 (UTC)

It's difficult finding reliable sources for large distances, but sources giving distances between 2690 and 2722 kilometres are plentiful online. Plugging 601 Wellington Street, Perth and King William Street, Adelaide, with shortest distance into whereis (a joint venture between our nation's only telephone directory and our biggest national mapping company) gives 2,697.69km. Google Maps gives 2,694. Orderinchaos 11:32, 3 November 2007 (UTC)

For distances between places within Australia, the ideal source is As The Cocky Flies. Yes, I know it is hard to take seriously with a wanky name like that, but it is backed by Geoscience Australia's gazetteer and extensive geodetic data, and therefore simply can't be beat as an authoritative source. It gives the distance between Perth and Adelaide as 2130km. Hesperian 11:59, 3 November 2007 (UTC)

[edit] London Court

I am suprised that no Perth related articles mention London Court. It is a distinctive architecture and major tourist drawcard. http://www.londoncourt.com.au/ --Biatch 05:08, 16 January 2007 (UTC)

It is true - negigble mention - also it is a potential good separate article that could be written - as the context of construction and its survival - would help notability - tourist attraction is not necessarily sufficient to warrant an article as such SatuSuro 05:15, 16 January 2007 (UTC)

Any anyone does fancy the article I have some reasonable pics to add. SeanMack 13:27, 16 January 2007 (UTC)

I remembered give it a plug it in the Claude de Bernales article I did last year. —Moondyne 08:30, 21 January 2008 (UTC)

London Court. Thanks for the pics Sean. —Moondyne 09:57, 23 January 2008 (UTC)

[edit] Antipode Trivia

I removed this due to inaccuracy. Perth is 31.5248S 115.5258E, Hamilton Bermuda is 32.293N 64.782W. Not even close to being antipodes. According to mapquest.com, the closest city to Perth's antipode is Ensenada, New Mexico. [1] (You'll need to zoom out on the map link), and even that is too far away to be considered an accurate antipode. Orichalcon 17:28, 2 March 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Jazz in Perth

I was surprised to find no mention of jazz in Perth under the music section, considering that Perth is home to one of the top jazz conservatories in the world. I'm sure that those maintaining www.jazzwa.com would be more than happy to suggest a suitable contribution.

[edit] Wikipedia Version 0.X

Somehow, Perth failed to be included in Wikipedia:Version 0.5. I've nominated it to Wikipedia:Version 0.7. Regards Comte0 06:07, 12 March 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Western Fury

Western Fury (state womens cricket team) needs to be added into the article - i dont want to take away its GA status - so i wont add it myself. Twenty Years 13:52, 30 April 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Time Zone

I looked at various other cities and they all have the time zones listed, but I don't know where to put it, and don't want to mess up the article. If anyone wants to know it is GMT+8. If someone could put it in that would be great --Fapmyster 13:35, 21 June 2007 (UTC)

[edit] GA delisted

In order to uphold the quality of Wikipedia:Good articles, all articles listed as Good articles are being reviewed against the GA criteria as part of the GA project quality task force. Unfortunately, as of September 16, 2007, this article fails to satisfy the criteria, as detailed below. For that reason, the article has been delisted from WP:GA. However, if improvements are made bringing the article up to standards, the article may be nominated at WP:GAC. If you feel this decision has been made in error, you may seek remediation at WP:GA/R.

Every statement that is likely to be challenged needs an inline citation.

Regards, Epbr123 17:37, 16 September 2007 (UTC)

No wonder considering the ad hoc accretion of un-cited parephenalia into the article - the Perth project should be called on its slumber to cleanup the article Satu Suro 01:03, 17 September 2007 (UTC)

The structure's kind of fallen apart and images are randomly scattered everywhere, that seems to be the main problems. I will do what I can in the next couple of weeks, there's no reason we can't get this back up there. Orderinchaos 06:38, 17 September 2007 (UTC)

I've been working on those citations last week, the result being several red links left in the references and a couple of {{fact}} in the article. More specifically, I've corrected some numbers in the Demographics section, and I'm afraid that correctly sourcing the population by year infobox on its right will be a major headache. Comte0 (talk) 14:20, 2 March 2008 (UTC)

[edit] Some proposed changes to the structure

Some basic things that need fixing are:

A proper summary section of the main History of Perth, Western Australia article
Remove all the gallery sections and moving to commons all images not already there
Clean up geography section, probably remove skyline section, remove CBD section and reformat relevant information.
Move demographics section to level 3 under Geography.
Remove Metropolitan Region Scheme section and include relevant information in Geography
Create Level 2 section "Culture" and Combine Visual Arts and Performing Arts into one level 3 section, add a level 3 music section after moving three quarters of the listed music groups to Music of Perth and write the section in prose.
Write sport section in prose rather than in list form
Move native title section to Native title article and move relevant information to history section.

Other's thoughts? -- Mattinbgn\ ^talk 12:50, 17 September 2007 (UTC)

All sound like good ideas. I think we should also try to look at FAs of similar size/importance cities such as Houston, Texas and Boston, Massachusetts and see what good ideas they present. Orderinchaos 13:47, 17 September 2007 (UTC)

Looks good - also anything to stop the ad hoc chaotic addition of everybodys backyard music group must be good Satu Suro 23:45, 17 September 2007 (UTC)

Previously there was a list of musical acts from Western Australian - when the list was converted to the two categories; [Category: Western Australian musical groups] & [Category:Western Australian musical artists] - I kept a version of the list on my user page (as it included a number of Western Australian bands which didn't have specific articles - some of which are notable and others of which are not) - List of Western Australian Musical Acts. There are some gaps in the list that I am endeavouring to fill (abiet slowly) but am happy if you want to copy those notable bands from Perth in the article - List of musical acts from Perth. Dan arndt 05:07, 18 September 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Perth Spirit

Perth Spirit are a Rugby Union Team representing Perth in Australian_Rugby_Championship, just so the person who removed it knows, they are a legit team and a Professional team so I am adding them back in, I honestly don't understand why someone would remove them?. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 203.161.86.177 (talk)

[edit] Named After Perth Scotland

Someone removed my note about Perth being named after Perth Scotland stating that it required a citation. This is ridiculous - the page, like most Wiki pages contains hundreds of other facts that do not reference a citation. Citations are great if you have the info available, but people should not be prevented from adding due to lack of citation. —Preceding unsigned comment added by GrandPoohBah (talk • contribs) 15:59, 28 October 2007 (UTC)

Actually citing is a requirement, as its part of the lead which is a summary of information presented in the article body the necessity for a cite is rather pointy. Gnan garra 16:07, 28 October 2007 (UTC)

Also the evidence suggests it was not named after Perth, but after Perthshire, a much bigger land area which I was led to believe in history classes that Captain James Stirling once called home. Orderinchaos 21:26, 28 October 2007 (UTC)

What evidence ? I was always taught that it was named after Perth. GrandPoohBah —Preceding unsigned comment added by GrandPoohBah (talk • contribs) 01:20, 30 October 2007 (UTC)

Stirling named it Perth at the request of Sir George Murray, who was born in Perth, Scotland, and was Colonial Secretary and MP for Perthshire at the time. I'll check Appleyard & Manford (1979) The Beginning: European Discovery and Early Settlement of Swan River Western Australia tonight, and confirm the details. Meanwhile, I think it reasonable to leave it in, as it is broadly correct, citation or not.

The reversions were made by Ckatz, a Canadian, who probably knows nought about the subject, and was simply reverting on principle. He is within his rights to do so, but it does seem a rather senseless exercise.

Hesperian 01:35, 30 October 2007 (UTC)

I'm not sure Stirling had a specific request that it be named "Perth", rather an instruction where to place the city (which he ignored anyway as Murray wanted it either at Cockburn Sound or near the confluence of the Canning and Swan Rivers - Point Heathcote) - Murray's instructions dated 30th December 1828 including transcripts. But anyway, whether it was named after Perth, Scotland or Perthshire is largely moot and it is undisputed it was named after one or the other. As well as Stirling, other influential Scotsmen like Peter Broun and James Drummond at the colony no doubt had some influence. The choice of name caused some consternation. A general statement needs to be in the article regardless. —Moondyne 04:13, 30 October 2007 (UTC)

Ah cool, makes more sense now :) I forgot about Murray. (Head cold ain't helping either.) Orderinchaos 20:15, 30 October 2007 (UTC)

In response to Hesperian's comment, there's really no need to be insulting, to presume my intentions, or to assume a lack of knowledge based on nationality. I see now that there was more detail later in the article, so in retrospect I probably wouldn't have reverted. However, the later text isn't cited either, which should be addressed. --Ckatz^chat_spy 08:14, 30 October 2007 (UTC)

Is "Canadian" an insult now? Hesperian 23:20, 30 October 2007 (UTC)

On reviewing the books at my disposal, it is clear that the only documentary material available on the source of the name "Perth" is Fremantle's diary entry for 12 August, which states

"On the 12th our Party increased, & there being no stone contiguous for our purpose, to celebrate the commencement of the new Town, Mrs. Dance cut down a tree; fired Volleys, made Speeches & gave several Cheers; named the Town Perth according to the wishes of Sir George Murray."

That it was at Murray's request is therefore the only thing we can say with any certainty; any suggestion that it was named after Perth or Perthshire is speculation. Logical and likely, yes, but speculation nonetheless.

The restraint shown by my sources is admirable; not one of them leaps to the conclusion that our Perth is named after Murray's Perth. Appleyard and Manford (1979) The Beginning and Statham-Drew (2003) James Stirling merely quote Fremantle's diary, and leave it to the reader to draw their own conclusions. Uren (1948) Land Looking West, Crowley (1960) Australia's Western Third and Stannage (1981) A New History of Western Australia go a little further by saying that the name was in honour of Murray, who was Member for Perthshire in the House of Commons.

Therefore I think it inappropriate for this article to baldly state what none of my sources does. I will refactor the claim in the article. Hesperian 12:02, 1 November 2007 (UTC)

I submit this diff for your consideration. Hesperian 12:57, 1 November 2007 (UTC)

Looks good, and is certainly an improvement. Your scholarship is much appreciated! - Gobeirne 20:01, 1 November 2007 (UTC)

Well Done - thanks ! GrandPoohBah 01:23, 2 November 2007 (UTC)

I also updated the Perth disambiguation page: diff Comte0 18:16, 2 November 2007 (UTC)

It is surely rather nitpicking to worry whether the city is named after the town of Perth or after the county of Perthshire, given that Perthshire itself is named after Perth. It's just a question of whether the naming is direct or indirect. Either way the ultimate source for the name is the town of Perth. -- Derek Ross | Talk 21:05, 2 November 2007 (UTC)

interesting side thought while we argue over whether its named after Perth or Perthshire the person to whom the naming is attributed isnt considered as being a person of note from Perthshire#Notable people from Perthshire ...by the editors of that article Gnan garra 09:38, 3 November 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Economy Sec

what the hell this city produces?what they live of?services, industries, financial sectors? what is the Gross Regional Product!

all this should be included in this section guys!any body has any info about Perth's Economy?EdwinCasadoBaez 04:32, 15 November 2007 (UTC)

The Perth metropolis/urban area would hardly warrant much of an economy section. Its just place where people live and work. Economy of Western Australia is the right place for this material. —Moondyne 08:26, 21 January 2008 (UTC)

[edit] Demographics

The recent edits to the demographic section [2] may or may not be correct in listing the Malaysians as the third largest group of "settlers". However by deleting reference to Italians and other southern Europeans it grossly distorts the situation where these ethnic groups are of very considerable importance in Perth. I would like somebody with access (and expertise) in the relevant statistics to have a look at setting the record straight. Paul Fisher (talk) 13:36, 5 December 2007 (UTC)

Checking the source confirms that the edit was correct, though possibly it could be worded better - the apparent distortion is due to the fact that the number of Malaysian, South African and Italian immigrants (only) is virtually identical. There is still reference to Italy in the article. Gazjo (talk) 06:13, 6 December 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Name/use of this page

Am I only one who thinks:

this article should really be at Perth Metropolitan Area?
we should have a separate article on the CBD/6000 postcode area at this page? The official name of the 6000 area is "Perth City", so the CBD article could also go at Perth City, Western Australia. I have two reasons:

this sense of the name "Perth" is not adequately covered by this article or City of Perth (local government area)
thanks to politicians and bureaucrats the 6000 postcode area straddles both the City of Perth and the Town of Vincent.

That would give us three articles, dealing with the separate senses of "Perth": the suburb, the local government area (City of Perth) and the metro area. What do others think?

Grant | Talk 02:49, 21 January 2008 (UTC)

I agree with the need for separation but this article should be the metropolitan area (this is consistent with other cities in Australia and around the world). The question which kind of stalled last time I raised it was what to call the suburb article - Perth city centre and Perth CBD were deemed inappropriate as (1) city centre seems to include the area between at least the Freeway, if not Thomas Street, and the WACA, and (2) it excludes the meandering bit of the suburb going up to Walcott Street. Melbourne got around this question by ignoring (2) (part of the suburb of Melbourne goes quite some way down St Kilda Road south of the Yarra), but I'm not sure what we should do. Agreed that the status quo is not where we should remain, though. Orderinchaos 06:38, 21 January 2008 (UTC)

Just did a quick map there - the shaded yellow area enclosed in the dotted line is the "city centre". The coloured areas represent gazetted suburb boundaries (other than Kings Park which is simply enclosed by such), while the grey line represents the City of Perth/Town of Vincent boundary, which cuts through all three suburbs in question. Orderinchaos 07:38, 21 January 2008 (UTC)

I agree with the need for a change. Hows about:

Perth, Western Australia - a disambiguation page
City of Perth - the LGA
Perth metropolitan area, Western Australia - most of what this is now and what will presumably be the main article. (I added a scoping statement to History of Perth, Western Australia)
Perth (CBD), Western Australia - the city centre/CBD, exact boundaries to be defined, but broadly OIC's dotted line boundary above is fine with me. The right name for this is problematical but it shouldn't be a hindrance to writing the article, and a few redirects won't do any harm.

—Moondyne 08:17, 21 January 2008 (UTC)

It seems we are getting somewhere. "CBD" to me suggests the area south of the railway line. Why not use Perth City, Western Australia (which is the official name) or Perth (6000), Western Australia? That will include the Cultural Centre, the Beaufort-Lord-Newcastle-Railway area, the "rump" in Vincent (etc) which will otherwise not be included in an article on a suburb. Grant | Talk 08:52, 21 January 2008 (UTC)

We probably wouldn't need to disambiguate "Perth metropolitan area" if we go with Moondyne's suggestion on that - and we need to be clear that we are referring to the Metropolitan Region Scheme area (940k PDF) which is also defined by the ABS as the Perth Statistical Division (quick map) (they're identical), so that people don't try to add Mandurah in there, or leave out Rockingham/Mundaring/Serpentine/Jarrahdale/Bullsbrook areas which are inside the line. I tend to agree with Grant on the suburb basis for the simple reason that no CBD area has ever been officially defined or gazetted (my line above is essentially OR). Is there a source for the name "Perth City" btw? (I believe it, but GA seems to disagree) Orderinchaos 11:47, 21 January 2008 (UTC)

I'll be more equivocal re the CBD def and will contact CoP tomorrow to find out if they have a definition we can use (they may have a planning document somewhere). After discussing the whole thing with an offline friend, though, I think "Perth" should be the metropolitan area - Sydney, Melbourne, Brisbane etc point to articles about their metro areas. Orderinchaos 11:53, 21 January 2008 (UTC)

The ref and further reading is worse than pathetic - as I am on the road i might not be able to populate the area - off the top of my head there should be up to 6 or 8 books that are essential history reading - but all the discussion above might preculde or include the very odd 'northbrdge project' government mob and website too Satu Suro 12:11, 21 January 2008 (UTC)

Books such as "A New History of Western Australia" by Tom Stannage (1981), "A Fine Country To Starve In" by Geoffrey Bolton (1972), "Australia's Western Third" by F.K. Crowley (1960), Current Affairs Bulletin 37(7) (1965) which I have a copy of, together with the Political Chronicle series which chart controversies in the 1960s and 1970s re development and urban growth, may all be useful for the history section. Orderinchaos 12:54, 21 January 2008 (UTC)

Why not

Perth, Western Australia -- current article
City of Perth -- LGA
Perth (suburb), Western Australia -- suburb article, includes CBD.

and then create Perth, Western Australia (Dab) which has a link from Perth, Western Australia for other uses of Perth within Perth, Western Australia. Gnan garra 12:50, 21 January 2008 (UTC)

Sounds like a goer to me. (Either Perth (suburb) or Perth City) Orderinchaos 12:54, 21 January 2008 (UTC)

I agree, both would be fine. "Perth City" is what it says on some Landgate webpages, although others just say Perth and Australia Post simply refers to the 6000 postcode area as "Perth".

BTW, nice map Order, will be useful for the proposed article. Grant | Talk 06:12, 22 January 2008 (UTC)

Go for Gnangarra's suggestions. Kransky (talk) 08:17, 22 January 2008 (UTC)

Whilst we should create an article for the 6000 suburb, I don't think Perth, Western Australia should as a result morph into an article solely about the metropolitan area. The history of the CBD belongs here just as much as in an article about the CBD itself, as it remains the focus of the metropolitan area and is in no small part what the metro area has grown around. - Mark 15:56, 10 February 2008 (UTC)

I'd imagine that we'd handle that using the "main" convention, so this article would contain history, geography, natural history, culture, politics and government, having a subsection dealing with the CBD that has a "main" tag linking to the CBD article; while the CBD article would be more like any suburb article focussing on local history, prominent buildings, development of the CBD (eg. new Century City etc) and such things. Orderinchaos 07:43, 11 February 2008 (UTC)

[edit] Original?

Is this the original Perth? —Preceding unsigned comment added by LagosGuy (talk • contribs) 05:53, 25 February 2008 (UTC)

No, that would be Perth, Scotland. -- Mattinbgn\^talk 06:37, 25 February 2008 (UTC)

[edit] Religion

This section recently contained only a reference to Roman Catholicism. Someone has now added a reference to Mormonism. This seems misleading, as the RC population of Perth is much, much higher than LDS (despite the number of knocks I get on my door on Saturday mornings). I cant excuse removing the LDS reference, as it is most certainly worthy information, but if anyone can think of a way to more accurately express the religious representation of Perth, and hopefully add references to more religions, it would make me feel much happier. Metao (talk) 01:21, 17 April 2008 (UTC)

Here are the stats from the Aust Bureau of Stats site (2006 census for Perth statistical region). I've only included those with > 10,000 members.

Catholic    360,257 
No Religion      320,516 
Anglican         286,121 
Religious affiliation not stated         173,823 
Uniting Church   49,980 
Presbyterian and Reformed        33,514 
Buddhism         31,422 
Christian nfd    30,485 
Baptist          23,647 
Eastern Orthodox         23,628 
Islam    22,138 
Pentecostal      14,110 
Other religious affiliation      11,292

The Latter Day Saints (Mormons) had 4259.

http://www.censusdata.abs.gov.au/ABSNavigation/prenav/ViewData?&action=404&documentproductno=51&documenttype=Details&tabname=Details&areacode=51&issue=2006&producttype=Community%20Profiles&&producttype=Community%20Profiles&javascript=true&textversion=false&navmapdisplayed=true&breadcrumb=PLD&&collection=Census&period=2006&producttype=Community%20Profiles&#Basic%20Community%20Profile

Paul Fisher (talk) 07:02, 17 April 2008 (UTC)

Thanks, Ive put it in. I just have to put in the cite. Metao (talk) 09:48, 17 April 2008 (UTC)