Talk:Pensacola, Florida

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To-do list for Pensacola, Florida: edit · history · watch · refresh

Here are some tasks you can do:
  • Requests:
  • Verify:
  • Cleanup:
    • Move the weather table to the right, somehow
    • Convert #City schools and libraries from a list to text (prose)
    • Convert #Sports teams from a list to text (prose)

  • Expand:
    • #Topography
    • #Law and government (the part that's about the city government)
    • #Demographics (make a population chart similar to the one in Nashville, Tennessee#Demographics)

Contents

[edit] Reword

I'm trying to reword the part calling Pensacola "our nation's first city" for the following reasons:

1) People from nations other than the USA may be reading the Wikipedia
2) Native American cities like Taos Pueblo may be older.

I hope my edits make it clearer and more accurate. -- Infrogmation 04:58, 5 Jun 2004 (UTC)

[edit] Famous Pensacolians

This may be personal taste, but I find this section misleading. To my way of thinking, a "Pensacolian" was born in Pensacola; several people listed were either born near Pensacola or moved to Pensacola. Examples:

I realize many of these either were raised in Pensacola or became prominent while living in the city. Perhaps a change in this section's title (or a short sentence explaining each person's link to Pensacola) is in order. -DynSkeet (talk) 20:00, May 25, 2005 (UTC)

Joe Scarborough is a famous Pensacolian, which anyone who lives in Pensacola would know. He was part of a law firm here, for heaven's sake. Justin Gatlin attended high school here, and the other two grew up here. I personally think it's fine. You can consider yourself "from" somewhere and not actually be "born" there. Mike H 20:03, May 25, 2005 (UTC)
I'm not disputing whether someone in Pensacola would know who Scarborough (or anyone else) is. Boortz' and Bell's articles don't even mention Pensacola at all, even though their connection might be obvious to someone who lived there. -DynSkeet (talk) 20:12, May 25, 2005 (UTC)
How about "Notable Pensacolians and residents"? BLANKFAZE | (что??) 21:30, 15 July 2005 (UTC)

[edit] High Schools

This list should include the suburban high schools of Gulf Breeze, Pace, and Milton, even though they're in Santa Rosa county. They're much closer to the City of Pensacola than, for example, Tate. I can see excluding Northview and Jay. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 158.111.4.26 (talk • contribs)

They're not in the city of Pensacola. It's a Pensacola article. Mike H (Talking is hot) 16:54, July 11, 2005 (UTC)
Tate and Woodham are not in the city limits of Pensacola either. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 158.111.4.26 (talk • contribs)
They're still understood to be "Pensacola" schools. Why are you trying to cause trouble? Mike H (Talking is hot) 15:04, July 12, 2005 (UTC)
How is asking a simple question regarding area schools that you define as having to be in the city trying to cause trouble when you include schools that are NOT in city limits? Why are you out looking for trouble in other peoples questions? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 209.86.139.197 (talk • contribs)
Didnt Derrick Brooks attend schools in pensacola, why is his schools not mentioned or does anyone know, he attended Booker T. Washington High School and as far as the schools in this area, i think most schools in this country are in a county area but are considered in the metropolitan area of a city, that includes the county or surrounding counties, hence santa rosa and escambia counties are within the pensacola metropolitan area....am i correct? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 70.191.218.14 (talk • contribs)
Parts of Santa Rosa and Escambia counties are within the metropolitan area, but both counties have rural areas and towns that aren't considered to be part of the metropolitan area (like Jay, Florida in Santa Rosa and Century, Florda in Escambia). I think the current layout of the page, with schools in Pensacola listed followed by in the metropolitan area separated by county is a good arrangement. WarpFlyght 06:25, 30 November 2005 (UTC)

[edit] West Florida High School of Advanced Technology in schools list

Pensacola city limits
Pensacola city limits

We've been reverting additions of the West Florida High School of Advanced Technology to the list of schools because, while the school has a Pensacola address, it actually falls outside of the city limits. (There are other examples of this in the area: Tiger Point is addressed as Gulf Breeze, even though it's miles outside of the city limits.)

See the map at right for the city limits. If you search for the high school on a map (such as the Google Maps result), you'll see that it's located in the area outside of the city limits. See also the City of Pensacola GIS Viewer -- check "city limits" to see where the city limits are. The school's location is clearly outside of the boundary.

See the arguments above in this section for reasons why schools outside of the city limits aren't included. (It's not totally coherent... Ultimately, the editors maintaining the Pensacola article think the high schools linked should be those within the city limits only. Schools in other communities can be linked from their articles.) • WarpFlyght (talk • contribs) 16:51, 29 February 2008 (UTC)

I've edited many town and city articles for North Carolina and have gone through the same problem with people trying to add schools not in the city. The reason I added this particular school back is because the school's mailing address is for Pensacola. Yes, it is technically outside of the city limits, but the school's address is for Pensacola. Where do you suggest the city is located? The WP article for the school states it is located in Pensacola, List of high schools in Florida states the school is in Pensacola, the school website states it is in Pensacola and a mapquest search shows the school to be in the Pensacola area, not close to another town (such as Gulf Breeze or Milton). Marcus Pointe Golf Club is located very close to the school and it is considered to be in Pensacola. It seems logical to assume the school would be considered being in Pensacola, although technically outside of the city limits. Other sources that state the school is in Pensacola include: 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, etc. AgnosticPreachersKid (talk) 17:18, 29 February 2008 (UTC)
Also, I hope I'm not coming across as argumentative, I'm just trying to understand where you're coming from in this matter. An example of what I meant when I said "it seems logical to assume the school would be considered in Pensacola" is if you were to ask a local where the high school was located, they would reply "Pensacola." When I've added schools to town/city articles, I always go by the mailing address and general location of the school. If the school is closer to another village/town/city, then it would be included in the appropriate article. Some schools are outside of a city/town limit, but still have the mailing address of that town/city. If we don't include the school in that article, then what town/city article does it belong in? They need to be included in some article. (and I'm not referring to just this school because it's different from most cases...the school has its own WP article...but that doesn't change the fact it still needs to be included in some city/town article) AgnosticPreachersKid (talk) 17:41, 29 February 2008 (UTC)
It all comes down to a question of where you draw the line. Most of the southern half of Escambia County, Florida considers itself to be "Pensacola" in some form. I'm sure Gulf Breeze High School has been added to this list at least once, and it's in an entirely different county! We also have Escambia County School District, an article entirely dedicated to "schools in Pensacola." Now, you make good points; perhaps we should expand the section to include more schools that residents typically identify as being in Pensacola. If we do that, though, we need to predetermine what schools fit that criterion, and which don't, and strictly enforce that on the page. —Disavian (talk/contribs) 20:30, 29 February 2008 (UTC)
I totally concur with drawing the line somewhere, but to me the line would be the mailing address. Schools in Gulf Breeze would have a Gulf Breeze address, this particular school has a Pensacola address. (side note: I need to make a userbox that says "I survived PCC") AgnosticPreachersKid (talk) 20:44, 29 February 2008 (UTC)
I imagine it would come down to whether or not the school severs any part of Pensacola. That's often the case here in Mississippi where a school district will build a school "out in the county" but it still serves students in the city and it's still part of that school district which is based in the city. - ✰ALLSTAR✰ echo 21:14, 29 February 2008 (UTC)
The school is still in the city, but just not in the limits. For instance, the Super Wal-Mart on Mobile Highway I use to frequent in west Pensacola would be considered in Pensacola, and it's even further away from the official city limits than the high school. AgnosticPreachersKid (talk) 21:26, 29 February 2008 (UTC)

(outdent) A couple of thoughts some of which may echo those of others: schools not technically in, but that serve the city might reasonably be included, saying as such. Alternatively, it could be listed in a Metropolitan Pensacola article if any such beast exists, or in the Escambia County, Florida article. This latter would probably be my recommendation. I do have to advise against using the mailing address as a criterion though. (I remember arguing with high school classmates that my alma mater was not in Helena, Alabama, even though you had to go through another city to get to Helena, but they had the rural routes for the county at that time.) Aleta (Sing) 00:28, 1 March 2008 (UTC)

Thanks for your input Aleta. The school serves the city of Pensacola, but as you said not techincally in the city. It's definitely not a rural school, so that's why I believe it should included. Placing it in the Escambia County article is a good idea. AgnosticPreachersKid (talk) 12:10, 1 March 2008 (UTC)
You're welcome. I notice that another article exists: Escambia County School District, and it does list the school. Aleta (Sing) 13:18, 1 March 2008 (UTC)
Well, Warpflyght hasn't really responded to my questions I brought up, so I'm going to re-insert the school later today since it's obvious the school is considered to be in Pensacola. Disavian did respond, but the same example is being used about listing schools in Gulf Breeze, which is not what I'm trying to do. It's rather simple to realize the school is in Pensacola because of its location. AgnosticPreachersKid (talk) 18:00, 8 March 2008 (UTC)
Sorry, both Ben (Warpflyght) and I have been really busy this week. Instead of adding that one, can we decide on a comprehensive list of which schools are included, and add them all at once? —Disavian (talk/contribs) 20:08, 8 March 2008 (UTC)
No need to apologize, it came out the wrong way what I was trying to say. I realize some people have a life outside of WP (I need one), but yeah, coming up with a list sounds good. AgnosticPreachersKid (talk) 20:14, 8 March 2008 (UTC)

[edit] List

This article is fast becoming a list. Can these lists be condensed into a paragraph form that a reader may be able to actually get something from? Mike H (Talking is hot) 16:57, July 11, 2005 (UTC)

[edit] Pensacola Metropolitan Area

Pensacola Metropolitan Area includes Eglin Airforce Base and Jay Bell clearly went to school at J.M. Tate High School. Travis Fryman aslo went to school at J.M. Tate High School. I forget were Gatlin went to high school. Travis Fryman's mom was my P.E. teacher at MacArthur Elementary. Joe Scarborough has a home within the metropolitan area of Pensacola/ In fact my friends dad know him personally and I went to his church with another friend. Roy Jones Jr. lives in a Mansion that is within the Pensacola Metropolitan Area/ You have to understand that most Pensacolians do not live within the city it-self, but in the suburbs and other areas. The City itself has only abpout 60k people, but the Metropolitan Area has approximately 412k people. It's fine to mention people like Jay Bell. Most of these Famous People will tell you they cam from Pensacola. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 64.31.180.15 (talk • contribs)

[edit] Famous Visitors

Acknowledging my own bias, I never edit any reference to George W. Bush. Nevertheless, I think it odd that he is the only listed famous visitor. I would think that either that section needs to be removed, or a full list of presidential visitors needs to be added. Just a suggestion. Xoloz 16:40, 8 February 2006 (UTC)

I'm pretty sure Andrew Jackson lived in Pensacola for a while. Disavian 16:02, 20 March 2006 (UTC)
I'm not sure if he ever lived in Pensacola, but he did visit Pensacola when he captured it (and by extension all of Florida). • WarpFlyght (talk) 15:41, 22 March 2006 (UTC)
Andrew Jackson was the first governor of Florida, during 1821. Back then, Pensacola was the capitol of Florida. Disavian 16:06, 22 March 2006 (UTC)

I've come to the conclusion we need to do away with the Notable Pensacolians and residents and Famous visitors sections, as they are targets for POV and vandalism. The article is already too long, and removing that will not significantly detract from it. Any thoughts? --Disavian 22:17, 30 May 2006 (UTC)

I say keep the notable residents section but do away with "famous visitors." Other articles have the notable residents section and I think we can do just fine weeding out people who just want to add their own name (I saw at least two I went to high school with). Mike H. I did "That's hot" first! 01:19, 31 May 2006 (UTC)
Agreed with Mike H. Most towns and cities can probably claim famous visitors, and the fact that a famous visitor passed through (or stayed a while) isn't automatically notable. If it is, it probably relates to something else notable, like hurricanes. I'd suggest merging the notes about Bush's hurricane-related visits into the section on hurricanes, if it fits.
I do think the "Notable Pensacolians and residents" section is acceptable, though. Those people are from Pensacola (or have lived in it for a period of time worth mentioning), which is relevant for someone searching out information about the city. I think there are enough of us watching the page to take care of vandalism in that section. • WarpFlyght (talk) 02:59, 31 May 2006 (UTC)
Very well. I'll delete the Famous Vistors bit, as it is rather lame. Anyone mind me adding Andrew Jackson to the noteable residents bit? --Disavian 03:22, 31 May 2006 (UTC)
No objections here. • WarpFlyght (talk) 20:01, 31 May 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Hurricane Picture

The picture that supposedly shows flooding downtown during Hurricane Katrina is wrong. We only got the outer bands of that storm with no more than tropical storm force winds and surge. There was not that kind of flooding during Katrina. That looks like a picture from Ivan. Brackish Boy 18:03, 19 July 2006 (UTC)Brackish Boy

If you go to the website the photo is from (the PNJ), it says it was from Katrina. I agree, though, that a photo from Ivan would be more appropriate. —Disavian (talk/contribs) 23:31, 18 November 2006 (UTC)
->This picture is most certainly Ivan as that part of downtown was not flooded like that during Katrina. I was there for both and that is the bay flooding several blocks north near the historic district the morning after Ivan. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 208.245.163.146 (talk • contribs)
Looks like 66.32.4.157 (talk · contribs) changed the picture back to "Katrina." Perhaps you should email the PNJ to confirm the hurricane that was occuring at that time. One thing I noticed was that the date of the picture coincides with Katrina's date. Just saying... —Disavian (talk/contribs) 16:18, 22 November 2006 (UTC)

How about some pictures of Pensacola other than hurricane-damaged pictures? I know that was recent, but it paints the Pensacola, commonly a sunny place, in a pretty dreary light. Greenagain 02:49, 7 December 2006 (UTC)

There used to be a bunch of photos on the page, and it turns out they've gotten moved around and onto other articles when related articles were created. Disavian, thoughts -- bring some of the old images back onto the main page? It does look strangely bare. • WarpFlyght (talk) 03:34, 7 December 2006 (UTC)
Hah. You know I'm always around :p Yeah, sure, it'd be easy to use photos on both pages. Just grab 'em and add 'em. :) —Disavian (talk/contribs) 04:29, 7 December 2006 (UTC)
Okay, the page has now been sprinkled with some more images. —Disavian (talk/contribs) 04:40, 7 December 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Recent Edits

Whomever edited the main article...thanks for an example as to how to make a page look like crap. (unsigned comment by John85mh.)

Which edits are you referring to? If you want to find out who made a specific edit, you can check the page's history. What changes would improve the problem? • WarpFlyght (talk) 18:02, 20 May 2006 (UTC)

I don't know which edits either, but "crap" was the first thing that came to my mind while reading it. Pensacola was permanently reestablished by the Spanish in 1696 on the mainland, near Fort Barrancas (see map), and became the largest city in Florida, as the capital of the British colony of West Florida in 1763. Another major hurricane devastated the settlement in 1722, causing the French occupation to evacuate, and the Spanish returned. This paragraph makes little sense. Why is it written out of chronological order? What French occupation? It's like an elementary school history report. Useless. 76.209.53.226 (talk) 16:43, 25 December 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Section move

The history section of the Pensacola, Florida article was unduly large. With it sectioned off to History of Pensacola, Florida (in a similar manner to Tallahassee, Florida and History of Tallahassee, Florida), it can be referred to from both the Pensacola article and the Escambia County, Florida article. Also, editors working on the Pensacola article can now focus on improving the quality of that article as a whole. —Disavian (talk/contribs) 05:05, 15 October 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Hurricanes Section

I am willing to rewrite the Hurricane section for this article, as it needs cleanup, and I believe references are available. However, researching this I've come across a lot of information. How much information should actually be included in this section? This page alone includes a long history of hurricanes dating back to the first colony-destroying one in 1559. Considering the long history of P'cola and the location of the city, I could make this section longer than much of the rest of the article. I'd like some advice or input about this. I do want to do this section, so please respond here with comments. If no one offers and advice, I will be posting my own version no later than next week. Garnet avi 05:53, 15 December 2006 (UTC)

[edit] West Florida Regional Libraries

The libraries were recently changed. They are now called the Pensacola Public Libraries. That link should be changed. I have also posted on the appropriate Talk Page. FruitMart07 03:07, 24 December 2006 (UTC)

As far as I know, that's not true at all. Around city hall, and even in official city briefings, it's still referred to as the "West Florida Regional Library System." Pat 22:45, 29 January 2007 (UTC)

[edit] City Limits on the map are inaccurate

The city limits on the map in the infobox are inaccurate. I realize the map was provided by the FAA (and thus the federal government) and that you would think that they would have correct information, however it's clearly wrong. I would suggest we look for another map detailing city limits. I work at city hall, and I could look into what we have here, however we should probably try to find another source. Pat 22:38, 29 January 2007 (UTC)

So I take it no one has a problem with that map image detailing the city limits in the infobox being inaccurate? Pat 21:05, 22 March 2007 (UTC)

If you want to do something about it, do something about it. You don't need our help to scan a map. —Disavian (talk/contribs) 01:56, 18 June 2007 (UTC)

The current map is incorrect. Pensacola's city boundaries are much more constrained to the southeast than what is shown here. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 74.160.96.70 (talk • contribs) 21:35, 17 June 2007

30-July-2007: I have revised the FAA map, reducing the Pensacola city limits to more southeast, by separating & labeling "Brent" and "West Pensacola" or "Warrington", etc. The original FAA coding might have used the yellow "city limits" to indicate regional heavy-population or restricted areas (as a warning to personnel). I also clarified icons for Interstate-10 & I-110. See image for details and Reference maps used to determine city boundaries:
Most maps are copyrighted, so Wikipedia has almost no maps of city-limits: "Pensacola" is among few articles that show a city-area map. Thanks for the input. -Wikid77 12:14, 30 July 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Wikipensacola auxiliary wiki project

Hello all. Thanks to everyone that has put work into this article; it has come a long way. I wanted to let anyone and everyone who holds an interest in Pensacola and West Florida in general that I have started a Pensacola-centric wiki project at http://wikipensacola.com. Its goal is to be as in-depth as possible. It's quite barebones right now but I encourage participation from anyone and everyone interested. Anything is game, historical, contemporary, places, people, locations, anything.

Thanks all. Blankfaze 17:15, 28 February 2007 (UTC)

FYI, there's another Pensacola wiki at Pensapedia.com. Looks like they have similarly-meager content right now, but there are differences in the layout & design. Now... fight!
PcolaBoy 20:48, 8 March 2007 (UTC)
Tsk. Did not know that. I think they've got the up on content right now. There are things I like, but the restrictive license is not one of them. My site is GFDL. Who knows though, maybe we will find some way to integrate or at least work together sometime. Blankfaze 03:40, 11 March 2007 (UTC)
They should probably change the license to GDFL; although all articles copied from WP to there are still under GDFL, even if the project copyright doesn't say so. For example, if they improve their version of the Holly Benson article, it'll be under GDFL. However, their article on Clay Ford is not. —Disavian (talk/contribs) 03:48, 11 March 2007 (UTC)

Hi everybody. With Wikipensacola merging into Pensapedia, would it be appropriate/acceptable to add a Pensapedia link to the External links section of the article? Any objections? --Pensapedia 17:50, 29 March 2007 (UTC)

I went ahead and added the link. Feel free to remove it if anyone objects. --Pensapedia 14:40, 3 April 2007 (UTC)
No objections here. —Disavian (talk/contribs) 16:20, 3 April 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Weather

It only says that the highest temperature was 106 degrees. I used to live there and the temperature once got to 111 degrees. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Cemd012 (talk • contribs) 11:46, 20 April 2007

Do you have a source to back up your claim? Note that the weather statistics cited are from a specific webpage. —Disavian (talk/contribs) 17:54, 20 April 2007 (UTC)

hmmm... good point.--"Murder is such a harsh word. why don't we just say mutual disagreement and leave it at that?"-cemd012 18:10, 21 April 2007 (UTC)

It is my guess that the highest OFFICIAL RECORD temperature was 106. So it may have gotten higher than 106 degrees on many thermometers, just not at any official weather stations which send in reports to the National Weather Service. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 72.242.38.140 (talk) 08:17, 1 March 2008 (UTC)

[edit] Cite

I can't find a cite for

“ In 2007 the funding for ECAT system came under attack and the system was almost closed down. ”

So I'm removing it. Feel free to add it back with a proper citation. —Disavian (talk/contribs) 13:26, 25 October 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Population chart

Since I'm from Ohio, I just happen to have been looking through some city articles outside my home state and happen to come accross this article that called for a population chart like those I added to some Ohio cities. Since the to-do list called for a population chart, I went ahead and added one to this article.

I coulden't find any room for this image that was in the way of the population chart that I added:

Population density map per 2000 census
Population density map per 2000 census

---OHWiki (talk) 22:09, 13 May 2008 (UTC)