Talk:Palmer Raids

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This page was made by Chris Lorz

Contents 1 Use of the term "database" 2 Imprecision: extremist, radical 3 POV tag 4 Socialist + Anarchist 5 Overall well put together

[edit] Use of the term "database"

• Next: Prehistoric Databases Found on the Moon takes offense to the use of the word "database" in this article. It's not clear to me whether that is in fact the term used by the original investigators so I didn't want to change it myself. Samw 03:58, 19 January 2006 (UTC)

From dictionary.com database: A collection of data arranged for ease and speed of search and retrieval. Some of the things people write on the internet borders on the bizarre. In fairness though. I wonder what are the 1918's and 1921's. 08:12, 4 April 2006 (UTC)

Young whippersnappers like this here Penraker feller might not believe this, but us old-timers managed to organize information back before there were computers. We set up systems using a product we called "paper" which we made marks on with a thing we called "ink" or sometimes a machine called a "typewriter" and then organized using a system based on the "alphabet" and stored in objects we called "file cabinets". And then we went home and hung out with our friend "Barney" while our wife "Wilma" cooked some dino-burgers for our supper. MK2 20:57, 23 May 2006 (UTC)

The Oxford English Dictionary does not have any quotations for the word prior to 1962. Furthermore it defines it as "A structured collection of data held in computer storage" and only by transference "any large collection of information". Thus while it is not incorrect to refer to it as a database this would not have been the term used at the time. 'Index' and 'register' are both older words, which are more likely substitutes. I have rewritten accordingly. --Tallus 11:34, 30 October 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Imprecision: extremist, radical

The article states:

BOI agents, together with local police, orchestrated a series of well-publicized raids against apparent radicals and leftists, using the Espionage Act of 1917 and the Sedition Act of 1918.

The link for the word radical goes to the article extremist, even though there are articles about radicals. The terms are not identical, and misuse of this sort is both sloppy and perjorative. If the correct article to use is extremist, then the linking word should say extremist. If the correct word to use is radical, then the link should go to one of the definitions of radical. Richard Myers 19:29, 4 May 2007 (UTC)

[edit] POV tag

I'm adding a POV tag to this article. The article is heavily biased in favor of Palmer and his actions, and does not reflect the consensus among current historians that the Palmer Raids were a grotesque violation of civil rights and proper legal procedure. It also does not report on how public opinion soon turned against the raids or how Palmer was widely ridiculed after his prediction of a "revolution" on May 1, 1920 didn't materialize.

The article's most egregious paragraph was the one that opined that the raids "may have forestalled reactionary violence by the public." In fact, most current historians would probably say that Palmer's public vigilanteism and Red-scare bigotry encouraged incidents like the lynching of the IWW member that this paragraph described. I've removed this paragraph as unsourced, WP:Original research and WP:POV.

I don't know if I'll find time to research and correct this article myself, but in the meantime, until and unless someone else fixes it, the POV tag is called for. RedSpruce 18:11, 19 September 2007 (UTC)

I've taken out some of the worst POV, but the article could use some serious work. For starters, it should have far more citations. RedSpruce 01:02, 28 September 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Socialist + Anarchist

These terms are not one and the same. Anarchist broken down is one that believes in a society in which there is no institution governed over, ruled over or controlled by a small group of individuals. This article seems like it could very easily lead a more naive reader into believing that socialists and anarchists are one and the same, but in reality a socialist system is run by an aristocracy as with all other forms of government. I think the writing should be altered so that this is not so mis-leading. After all, though anarchists did participate in the Russian revolution, they were not involved in the creation of the new government structures, and were actually pretty outspoken against them. Good examples can be found if you read much about Peter Kropotkin.

—Preceding comment added by the Blind God Io 21:47, 4 December 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Overall well put together

This article makes it sound like Palmer is some kind of hero because he arrested a great number of people, however I believe that in that arrest here didn't accomplish much but wasting every bodies time. That he stated openly that a revolution was certain to take place and one did not I think he proved how accurate all his data was. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 69.153.199.135 (talk) 10:56, 7 March 2008 (UTC)