Talk:Paco de Lucía

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"It is said that he is able to play 16th note triplets at 180 bpm (beats per minute)." This needs attribution, and is probably not accurate. 16th notes at 180 bpm is not all that fast. Paco and Al Di Meola both play 32nd notes at 110 bpm fluidly on Mediterranean Sundance/Rio Ancho from Friday Night in San Francisco. This is the equivalent of 16th notes at 220 bpm.

Please note that it says "16th note triplets", not "16th notes". 16th note triplets at 180 bpm means 18 notes per second - while 16th notes at 220 bpm is "only " about 14.67 notes per second. J. M. 14:04, 21 July 2006 (UTC)
(So 16th note triplets at 180 bpm would be the equivalent - in terms of speed - of 16th notes at 270 bpm or 32nd notes at 135 bpm, which is also 18 notes per second.) J. M. 14:15, 21 July 2006 (UTC)

Cleaned up some of the comma and semicolon errors here. Jasonguit 04:47, 3 August 2006 (UTC)

Contents

[edit] Paco plays Manuel de Falla

It is said in the documentation accompanying the much earlier classical "crossover" album ("Paco De Lucia - Interpreta A Manuel De Falla"), that Paco had to "painstakingly" read musical notation... granted, it's not easy for him, but he has done it long before the 1991 Concierto de Aranjuez album. Also, he is apparently skilled in "cifra" (Flamenco tablature) reading/writing, so saying that he's not adept with classical musical notation reflects a cultural bias... Paco's far from illiterate.

[edit] Cite tags

This article has a lot of weasel words and other unsourced statements. It would be great if someone could clean this up and offer a more neutral point of view about this fantastic artist. MarkBuckles (talk) 08:18, 30 September 2006 (UTC)

[edit] One of the greatest flamenco guitarists of all time

On digitaldreamdoor.com, click Music Lists, then click Greatest Specialty Guitarists. Lucia is #2 on greatest flamenco guitarists. I don't know how to link this because the web address for the page is digitaldreamdoor.com, meaning it does not change when you click on a link. However, I hope this can be used as a source.

Digitaldreamdoor is a personal webpage and not a very good citation for Wikipedia. Proper citations should come from professional publications. see WP:CITE or WP:V. Anger22 02:09, 29 October 2006 (UTC)

[edit] deleted text

Have deleted the following weasel wording from the introductory para.:

Many think that de Lucia fluently goes into these territories and plays like no other, whereas some purists of these other genres will state that he is just making a venture and is still a flamenco player at heart, lacking the pure jazz style[citation needed].

Will try to continue with a general clean-up of this article. --Technopat 10:34, 18 February 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Sources

The article's only references appear to be two DVD's ... are there no books or articles about him out there? And speaking about DVDs, the 2002 documentary suggests that "Entre dos aguas" (the song) was somehow a turning point in his career, in the sense that he gained a much wider audience after that (while before he might have been known primarily among flamenco aficionados and specialists). If that's indeed the case, perhaps it should be mentioned in the article. 81.96.125.240 16:49, 28 October 2007 (UTC)

[edit] No mention of Elegant Gypsy?

No mention of his wonderful work in Mediteranian Sundance on Al DiMeola's Elegant Gypsy album? This is where I (and I'm sure many others) first heard of Paco... 24.18.201.182 (talk) 16:04, 21 November 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Roma not gypsy

I was taught in school that the term gypsy borders upon being a racial slur and that the preferred nomenclature is Roma / Romani. Maybe we should change this no? —Preceding unsigned comment added by Vvibbert (talk • contribs) 21:38, 11 March 2008 (UTC)

I believe it is acceptable to use it here. When talking about Roma in Spain they call themselves Gitanos which translates into Gypsy. I hope this helps. --Gibmetal 77talk 00:22, 12 March 2008 (UTC)
No, not really; check the article here on Romani people for a discussion of this. +ILike2BeAnonymous (talk) 00:27, 12 March 2008 (UTC)
If you look at the more relevant article on Roma in Spain, you can see the term is widely acceptable. --Gibmetal 77talk 01:07, 12 March 2008 (UTC)
Actually, that article shows no such thing: it merely uses the term loosely (and sloppily), without a proper explanation of its origin, such as is found in the Romani people article. It is offensive, though still widely used, and shouldn't be used in an encyclopedia article in preference to the more appropriate term (Roma or Romani). +ILike2BeAnonymous (talk) 01:49, 12 March 2008 (UTC)
If you really believe it is offensive, I suggest you go ahead and change it from the hundreds of other articles which also use the term Gitano/Gypsie... I still assure you that if someone is proud of calling himself a Gitano it cannot be an offensive term to use in this context, but I see you'd rather revert than discussing things properly to arrive at a conclusion. --Gibmetal 77talk 08:37, 12 March 2008 (UTC)
Gibmetal77 you're way out of line and your argument doesn't quite work. Minority groups routinely adapt offensive slurs for use by themselves as a source of strength and pride. Homosexuals at times use the word 'fag' and 'queer' to refer to themselves. Some Americans of African decent use the term 'nigger' in the same way. Just as it would be offensive for an encyclopedia to use the words 'fag' or 'nigger' it must also be true then that if 'Gypsy' is considered offensive by a large number of Roma and the term 'Roma' and 'Romani' have no such negative connotations, using 'Roma' or 'Romani' is the correct decision here. Leaving the term 'Gypsy' just because it has been used frequently would be a mistake of laziness. Unlike other racial slurs, the use of 'Gypsy' is not being used out of hate or an intention to demean, but out of simple ignorance of the issues at hand. Vvibbert (talk) 02:52, 19 March 2008 (UTC)

Incorrect information: Paco de Lucía has not gypsy or roma ancestry. I had to correct the text. He is well known for being a "payo" guitarist admired by gypsy fans. Provide a reference or credible source that Paco de Lucía is of roma descent, before give erroneus information to the people that read wikipedia.

Well, a reference to that effect (that he's not of Roma descent) would be nice, rather than just your suggestion for using a Web search, which proves nothing. Do you have any valid sources for that? +ILike2BeAnonymous (talk) 04:02, 19 March 2008 (UTC)
I'm not even going to look at any of those links; I have no idea what they are. If you can't be bothered to do anything more than just dump some Google search results here, then I guess you're not serious. How about giving us a link to a credible source, along with a description of what that source is? +ILike2BeAnonymous (talk) 18:12, 20 March 2008 (UTC)