Talk:Order of St. Gregory the Great

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I removed the text that stated the Order of St. Gregory is the highest honor in the Catholic Church that a lay man or woman can obtain. First, the Order of St. Pius V, which is still awarded, is senior (higher) than St. Gregory. Secondly, The Order of Christ and the Order of the Golden Spur are senior to both of these orders, and while neither has been awarded in decades, have not been abrogated. Thus the Order of St. Gregory is the fourth highest of the five orders of knighthood of the Holy See. Additionally, there are other honors given to lay people by the Pope, which could conceivably be considered higher--the honor of Gentleman of His Holiness is not officially designated as being senior or junior to St. Gregory, but is certainly highly regarded and rarely awarded.

Sources: http://www.papalhonorees.org/intro.htm, http://www.chivalricorders.org, Burke's World Order of Knighthood and Merit (Sainty and Heydoo-Mankal, eds.), Orders of Knighthood and the Holy See (Bander van Duren)

167.80.244.204 15:05, 3 August 2007 (UTC)chevalier

Contents

[edit] Hold list of notables down?

I don't see how we can hold down this list of notables. If there is an article, do they go here, even though most of us have never heard of him/her? Student7 21:14, 12 November 2007 (UTC)

[edit] I thought that Wikipedia was "up to date"....

The degree of a "Knight Grand Cross of the Second Class" was abolished on the 7th. of February 1905. I thought that Wikipedia was "up to date"....

Robert Prummel (talk) 02:28, 20 December 2007 (UTC)

(a source on internet is [1]

Umm. Are we sure that "suppression" (what the article says) is identical to "abolished?" See Another site. Student7 (talk) 03:17, 20 December 2007 (UTC)

  • This "antiquarian" is a bona fide source but it is definitely not the best available source. The site mentions bits of information gathered from all over the world but it gives no sources. Mr. Guy Stair Sainty, a knight of several catholic orders and the author of [2] is a very precise and knowledgable gentleman, and so is Hieronymussen who gives the rank of Commander with Star in his book.

The antiquarian , by the way, mentions two commanders' grades, not two grandcrosses as in the period 1831-1905. What source shall we use? The German and Dutch Wiki claim that the 2nd grandcross was abolished in 1905. But then I have contributed to both. Faithfully yours,

Robert Prummel (talk) 14:10, 20 December 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Notables

Odd that the article never contained the name of Conrad Black until he was convicted. Up until then he was not notable enough for inclusion. What changed? Do Boy Scouts of American, PTA, his local credit union, lodge, all take equal hits? My thought is to take the good with the bad. If he wasn't interesting enough to be in here before, he shouldn't be here now. Same with scouts, PTA, etc. If he was in their articles, however, then they have to take the bad with the good. But they don't all get added retroactively. Student7 (talk) 03:27, 22 January 2008 (UTC)

[edit] Gilbert Levine and the use of "Sir

There's a discussion at Talk:Gilbert Levine about the fact that he's become known as "Sir Gilbert Levine". Some of us are trying to make the point that papal knighthoods do not carry any such pro-nominal title; while others are arguing that Benedict XVI has spoken and his word is law. If anyone can help settle the issue, please come over and join us. -- JackofOz (talk) 07:19, 31 January 2008 (UTC)

[edit] Notables, again

Student7, I notice that you have deleted quite a few attempts to add new names to the list based on the fact that you haven't heard of the person. What criteria are you using to determine who to keep? Why did you decide that, for example, an American conductor or philanthropist is more notable than a Canadian senator? Is it strictly nationality? Is it literally that you personally haven't heard of him? Maybe there should be some set guidelines that more than one person can be in on. I'd be happy to work on that with you. Cheers Dawn Bard (talk) 02:26, 15 April 2008 (UTC)

As I mentioned, the Vatican has distributed these to thousands of people over the years. By distributing them to well-known people, they hoped to enhance the reputation of the order. So when they distributed them to the ordinary folks, they would "mean" something. We could fork people who were ordinary but somehow have an article. In other words keep a few in the main article. This still would mean using some judgement that a movie star is better known than the guy next door. This is pretty much the way most cities have gone. They all tried to hold the line at well=known people then finally gave up and forked a list of "everybody." I suppose we could do the same. The only time anybody ever looks at the page is when trying to insert their grandfather, so the potential editors just don't stay around. I came to insert my wife's grandfather and realized he didn't really belong here. And stayed to try to maintain some balance. Otherwise the article would be an unreadable thousand names with a little explanatin at the top. Student7 (talk) 11:54, 15 April 2008 (UTC)