Talk:Operation Compass

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[edit] To Kurt Lehmann

"men" in force strengths is opposed to guns or tanks or aircraft, not to women

"killed" in casualties, because total casualties are killed+wounded+captured+missing

"India" because there were forces of the (British) Indian Army - specifically 4th Indian Division - involved in this campaign.

Richard Gadsden 12:41, 10 June 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Well..

What else can they be if they are not men?

"....there were forces of the (British) Indian Army - specifically 4th Indian Division - involved in this campaign."

That doesn't change the fact that India was part of the British Empire and did not exist as an independent country. Thousands Indians also fought with the Japanese during WWII, but I don't see any mentionings about that in the Japanese side of the battle boxes of the Asian battles.

And I did not mean to remove the word killed, sorry for that.

[edit] Battle of Beda Fomm

Both this article and the Beda Fomm ones are pretty short. I think that, for now at least, the Battle of Beda Fomm can be a section in the main Operation Compass page. Oberiko 15:20, 21 July 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Stats

Forces for Italiens: 100K But somehow they got 130K captured. Did they spawn new soldiers during the battle by themselfs or is something hidden in the numbers? =) Zarkow 203.144.143.9 12:11, 8 December 2006 (UTC)

100K in the Battle of the Camps - Compass proper; casualties are for the whole Cyrenaica campaign. Richard Gadsden 20:25, 23 January 2007 (UTC)

[edit] British Army total number of troops

has got to be rubbish!

"31,000 soldiers(december 1940 250,000)[1]"

Forces involved in Compass: 7th Armour and the 4th Indian plus iirc some small other units, in December the Indian division transferred to East Africa and the Aussies took there role for the rest of the campaign.

So total of 2 divisions active at any one time .... how does that add up to 250 000 men!

To my understanding, there was other Aussies Divisions in Palestine, other British units based near the suez canal and at the forward base. But including them which is the only thing i can see has happened is just wrong. —Preceding unsigned comment added by EnigmaMcmxc (talk • contribs) 13:48, 4 December 2007 (UTC)

Removed the piece of information, i guess who added it made a mistake and it was suppose to be in the Italian coloumn.

infor removed: (December 1940 250,000)[1] --EnigmaMcmxc (talk) 13:12, 9 January 2008 (UTC)

[edit] Brigata Corazzato Speciale (BCS)

I question existance of the Brigata Corazzato Speciale (BCS) or "Special Armored Brigade." A description of this unit has shown up under "Derna." It is indicated that this unit had 50 M11/39 tanks. Where did they come from? There were about 100 M11 tanks manufactured. About 70 went to Libya and about 24 went to East Africa. Many of the M11 tanks represented "the armor" when Graziani invaded Egypt. A few were held back at places like Bardia. By the time the British were advancing on Derna, the M11 tanks in Libya were almost all captured or destroyed. At the Battle of Beda Fomm, some newly arrived M13/40 tanks were thrown against the anti-tank guns of the British forces blocking the Italian retreat. But this was about two battalions (approximatel 100 vehicles) of M13/40 tanks. As indicated, I have no idea where the Italians would have gotten an additional 50 M11/39 tanks. Also, Lieutenant-General "Valentino Babini" (the supposed leader of the Brigata Corazzato Speciale ) was the commanding officer of the "Sirte" 61st Infantry Division. In 1940, the Sirte Division was part of the Italian 5th Army in Libya which was on the border with French Tunisia. Mkpumphrey (talk) 22:09, 23 February 2008 (UTC)

It appears Babini was reasigned and was placed in command of the Comando Carris Armati dell Libia (Libyan Tank Command), which was set up following the opening engagements and had all tank battalions placed under one command instead of being dished out to the infantry.
In November a Special Armoured Brigade was set up under this formation and was made up of 57 M13/40 coming from the III and V Battalions.
Total Italian tank strenth in 10th Army sector is put at 145 M13/40, 70 M11/39 and 339 L3 (although only the 57 M13s in this "special armour brigade").
Source: Operation Compass, Jon Latimer, Pg 20


The British official history by Playfair, Voloume I of the Middle East series, Pg 352
Januaryish, Babini is placed with his armour brigade in reserve at Mechili with one regiment of the 60th Infantry Division.--EnigmaMcmxc (talk) 01:11, 25 February 2008 (UTC)