Talk:Oldsmobile

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Oldsmobile was a good article, but it has been removed from the list. There are suggestions below for improving the article to meet the good article criteria. Once these are addressed, the article can be renominated. Editors may also seek a reassessment of the decision if they believe there was a mistake.

Delisted version: March 25, 2007
Portal:Cars selected articles Oldsmobile is a former selected article in Portal:Cars


Contents

[edit] Movies

I don't really see how it could possibly be necessary to include this painstaking list of every movie that's ever had a damn Oldsmobile in it. --Dave, 1/1/08

[edit] Year of model pictured

I was told by an afficionado that the car in the top picture is a 1932, not a 1935. The 1935 model does not have louvers in the hood. Please corroborate this.

Pacific1982 15:14, May 10, 2004 (UTC)
Did I miss something? I see no '32 or '35 pic. Was it taken down? --trekphiler, 24/11/05

[edit] Open Directory links

I don't agree with the deletion of the Open Directory links page link. Although it's true that wiki is not primarily concerned with external links, in a case like this, where one link can give easy access to many more on the exact subject at hand, it seems to me well within our guidelines to make use of it. RivGuySC 00:38, 13 Aug 2004 (UTC)

[edit] Oldest? Second oldest?

The opening paragraph says that Oldsmobile is the 2nd oldest (ha) car brand after Daimler, yet in "The End," Oldsmobile is sited as being the oldest (vis a vis GM). Which is it? -To0n 15:15, June 3, 2005 (UTC)

[edit] Sam Raimi

Added the Sam Raimi bit. I thought that was a good addition. (Although it will most probably be removed like all my other edits)

[edit] History of Curved-Dash

I've read the Curved-Dash had a 1563cc 1-cyl, the prototype was saved from a disastrous factory fire by foreman James J. Brandy, and the loss of parts forced Olds to subcontract (including the engine, which was a Leland, I think), creating the auto parts industry. I can't confirm, & I'm unsure how, or if, any of this should be included. It does seem appropriate to include, if verifiable. --trekphiler, 24/11/05

[edit] Deleted Movie References

I deleted the Olds movie references as irrelevant. Are we to include evey appearance of every car brand in a movie? Unltess it's important to the film, or somehow iconic (the Mach 1 in "Bullitt", say), leave it out. I also deleted the "455 Rocket" reference; it isn't historic, the way "Rocket 88" is, so it doesn't merit inclusion. I'm ambivalent about re-post of the Sam Raimi bit; it's a bit off the wall, but interesting enough to leave in. --trekphiler, 24/11/05

Re the Curved-Dash: I've read it used Holley carbs. Trekphiler 20:53, 17 December 2005 (UTC)
  • "I'm ambivalent about re-post of the Sam Raimi bit; it's a bit off the wall, but interesting enough to leave in." Yay! I originally posted that ages ago. I'm glad it's still in. -Wunderbear

[edit] 1903 LSR/442

Who was driving the '03 LSR car? Also, confirm the 442 etymology; it did not always mean 4bbl, 4sp, dual. --trekphiler, 24/11/05

[edit] History

The history of this company was:

Founded: 1897

Retired: 2005

Current Status: Retired

--ZachKudrna18@yahoo.com

Oldsmobile was discontinued in 2004, not 2005. --ApolloBoy 23:59, 29 March 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Removal of 3D Images of 1905 Olds

I've removed the 3D images of the 1905 Olds placed by user: 3dnatureguy While I understand that this user's 3D images have been a furtile ground for trying to decide what is the best way for Wikipedia to deal with, my action was based on 1)there weak descriptive ability to speak for the vehicle being shown (they showed a minimum amount of car and a part of that car) but there are better illustrations that exist of early Oldsmobiles and their effect on popular culture. This isn't an action againts a person, but rather an action meant to give better examples of Oldsmobiles than the 3D images provided. Stude62 19:51, 5 February 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Management/marketing problems

Should there be more elaboration about how the management problems and failed ad campaign led to the demise of oldsmobile? As the son of a lifetime oldsmobile dealer, I strongly feel so. It was a decision based on economics, obviously, but without the terrible management decisions, caused by a culture of "the good ol boys" and hubris (thinking that the japanese cars would just "go away") at GM (which we are now seeing in the restructuring and further division cuts) oldsmobile would still be here today. In fact, at the time when the decision was announced, Oldsmobile was doing better than it had in the last ten years (off the top of my head, not too sure about that). Would that information (wikified) add to the article? Does it belong somewhere else? Can it be wikified? uberblue 05:22, 29 May 2006 (UTC)

[edit] "Spirit" lives on? Eh?

What is this supposed to mean?:

The spirit of Oldsmobile has lived on in GM's Buick brand as the Intrigue lives on as the Buick LaCrosse, the Aurora lives on as the Buick Lucerne, the Bravada lives on as the Buick Rainier, and the Silhouette lives on as the Buick Terraza.

Is this a factual statement or some kind of marketing hoo-ha? What does it mean for the "spirit" of a discontinued brand name to live on in other car models? I propose that this sentence either be rewritten to say something more concrete or deleted altogether.Acsenray 21:00, 18 July 2006 (UTC)


[edit] Tom Mchahil

wrote for Mechanics Illustrated, stupid. 152.163.100.11 00:17, 23 July 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Fire destroys main Oldsmobile plant in Lansing???

In 1901 Oldsmobile was actually producing it's Curved Dash Runabouts at its first plant which was actually on Jefferson Ave. (near the MacArthur Bridge, which leads to Belle Isle) in Detroit (not Lansing). This was the first Oldsmobile plant and this is the plant that was detroyed by fire.

Yes, R.E. Olds was from Lansing and organized his first company in Lansing. However, a common mistake that people make is that they assume R.E. Olds always operated in Lansing. To the contrary, he chose Detroit as the location of his first Oldsmobile factory, which burned in 1901. The company was moved back to Lansing after some coaxing by the Lansing Businessmen's Association who gave R.E. Olds a good deal on property that was to be used as a state fairground in a failed attempt to move the annual fair from Detroit to Lansing.

[edit] In My Merry Oldsmobile

I very much enjoyed this article relating to an American automobile. I owned a couple of Oldsmobiles in my time, perhaps not the more famous ones, but nice cars nonetheless. I remember even falling in love at a drive-in theatre behind the wheel of a 1959 Oldsmobile Super 88.

I was very taken by the comments regarding the marketing ploy referred to as "not your father's Oldsmobile." I remember that line of advertising in various car publications and recognized it immediately for the ready-made disaster it was. In one ridiculous sweep, this ruse disenfranchised the remainder of Oldsmobile's loyal customer base with one last craven, misguided attempt to salvage sales by redirecting the marketing target to young people, who weren't going to buy an outdated, anonymous, and cheaply made car anyway. Simultaneously, they actually made fun of the generation who supported them to the very (dismal) end. It is poignant because it underlined, bolded, and italicized what was generally wrong with American car marketing, engineering, and manufacturing, not only then but now. It is sad, but it shows that nothing is sacred, nothing is guaranteed, and nothing is forever.

Hamilcar21

That's exactly what I was talking about a few sections up. Your sentiments, wikified and sourced, need to go into the article somehow uberblue 23:54, 17 March 2007 (UTC)

[edit] GA delisting

While delisting, I am supposed to give some suggestions as to how to improve the article. IMHO it needs a complete rewrite, but here are a few things that certainly need to be remedied:

  • The article desperately needs sources/references. EVERY fact mentioned needs to be referenced to a reliable source according to WP standards and policies
  • Laundry lists must be converted into prose
  • Please mind WP:NPOV
  • Make sure fair use images are fairly used ;)

I guess that's it for now, but if somebody feels like working on the article to bring it to GA standards, I will gladly help with more detailed comments/recommendations, and of course editorial help. PrinceGloria 08:21, 25 March 2007 (UTC)

Just to tell Karrmann I am not ignoring his message on my talk page - I will try to give you a more thorough review, outlining what I think the article should look like, in due course (my temporal resources are severly limited these days), as well as join in with some edits later on. Cheers, PrinceGloria 04:44, 21 May 2007 (UTC)
Still don't have time for a proper review and all, but for sure the "in popular culture" and model listing sections have to go. And, Karrmann, please please please make sure you did use a spellchecker (e.g. the one in MS Word for no better example) before you post, as well as try to combine all your subsequent edits into one. Thanks! PrinceGloria 04:50, 23 May 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Fair use rationale for Image:1983 oldsmobile cutlass supreme.jpg

Image:1983 oldsmobile cutlass supreme.jpg is being used on this article. I notice the image page specifies that the image is being used under fair use but there is no explanation or rationale as to why its use in Wikipedia articles constitutes fair use. In addition to the boilerplate fair use template, you must also write out on the image description page a specific explanation or rationale for why using this image in each article is consistent with fair use.

Please go to the image description page and edit it to include a fair use rationale.

If there is other other fair use media, consider checking that you have specified the fair use rationale on the other images used on this page. Note that any fair use images uploaded after 4 May, 2006, and lacking such an explanation will be deleted one week after they have been uploaded, as described on criteria for speedy deletion. If you have any questions please ask them at the Media copyright questions page. Thank you.Betacommand (talk • contribs • Bot) 00:10, 25 May 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Discontinuation

I don't like the political correct information on the discontinuation in this article. There used to be background information as to why Oldsmobile was phased out, but now it only says something about "falling sales." There used to be a section explaining the make became increasingly more perceived as boring and not a sexy car, a perception that was imho true and wide spread among car buyers. GM were not willing to invest in Oldsmobile's image anymore. I think such background info should be included again. Matthijs J

[edit] Added movie reference

I added the "Sudden Impact' movie reference, as that movie scene started my love affair with the GM J-body hatchbacks, esp. the Olds Firenza. User:J. Mac 14:21, 11 Sept 2007

At the beginning of National Lampoon's Vacation, Clark Griswold trade-in, a wood paneled Oldsmobile staion wagon, is returned to him flattened when he wants to cancel his "family truckster" purchase. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 63.115.34.34 (talk) 15:50, 3 April 2008 (UTC)

[edit] Picture and Discussion of 60's cars, Toronado and 442

The late 60's were some of the best times for Oldsmobile. The discussion of the 442 and the Toronado is perfunctory, as these were really good (and ground breaking) cars. There styling was particularly good, and I respectfully suggest a picture would be helpful. 7&6=thirteen (talk) 13:11, 4 February 2008 (UTC)Stan

[edit] Fair use rationale for Image:Agent Reloaded.jpg

Image:Agent Reloaded.jpg is being used on this article. I notice the image page specifies that the image is being used under fair use but there is no explanation or rationale as to why its use in this Wikipedia article constitutes fair use. In addition to the boilerplate fair use template, you must also write out on the image description page a specific explanation or rationale for why using this image in each article is consistent with fair use.

Please go to the image description page and edit it to include a fair use rationale. Using one of the templates at Wikipedia:Fair use rationale guideline is an easy way to insure that your image is in compliance with Wikipedia policy, but remember that you must complete the template. Do not simply insert a blank template on an image page.

If there is other fair use media, consider checking that you have specified the fair use rationale on the other images used on this page. Note that any fair use images lacking such an explanation can be deleted one week after being tagged, as described on criteria for speedy deletion. If you have any questions please ask them at the Media copyright questions page. Thank you.

BetacommandBot (talk) 04:58, 12 February 2008 (UTC)

[edit] April Fools' 2008 hoax

I am of the opinion — and am looking for consensus — that the Toyota/Olds hoax is non-notable with relation to Oldsmobile. Its mention belongs in the list of 2008 April Fools' pranks, and is in fact listed prominently there, but it adds nothing to the history of Oldsmobile. Given the edit history, so far the vote appears to be 1 user for the mention, 2 users against. Kevin Forsyth (talk) 01:43, 3 April 2008 (UTC)

I feel that being in Car and Driver magazine, a publication that pertains to the automotive industry, it is notable in relation to Oldsmobile. Anyway, it should not be removed from this article until at least several more people have commented that it should.Hellno2 (talk) 14:07, 3 April 2008 (UTC)
I disagree. A mostly unnoticed hoax (which was, BTW, clearly indicated as such in the source) is not in general notable with regards to the subject of the hoax, unless of course it generated a wider incident (such as the War of the Worlds broadcast). Have any reputable third party media reported on the incident? Until that happens, there is nothing to say here. And under what guidelines do you dictate the terms under which the hoax can or cannot be removed? older ≠ wiser 14:23, 3 April 2008 (UTC)
For now, I provide a "see also" link to the article listing this hoax, and an external link to the Car and Driver article. Let's see where we can go from here.Hellno2 (talk) 14:42, 3 April 2008 (UTC)
I still don't see how that satisfies the notability question. Kevin Forsyth (talk) 14:57, 3 April 2008 (UTC)

There is one aspect of that joke that belongs. The joke required that GM fail to renew the trademarks for Oldsmobile. Did that happen? I came here thinking that Wikipedia might mention it. Will (Talk - contribs) 22:08, 11 April 2008 (UTC)