Talk:Ohio Turnpike

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[edit] Category:Interstate highways in Ohio

I think this article should be in this category. The road is part of the Interstate Highway system end-to-end, and there is no category inheritance that would make it actually redundant (as if it were in the non-existant categories "Interstate 80" or "Interstate 90".) Error should be on the side of belonging to too many categories. I'm reinstating the category pending discussion. --CComMack

Should all bridges on the Interstate system be in the Interstate categories? --SPUI (talk) 07:09, 20 Apr 2005 (UTC)

A bridge is not an "interstate highway" because it is not a "highway" (usually; watch someone now throw a causeway I've never heard of at me.  ;-) ) As the category is "Interstate highways in Ohio", and the Ohio Turnpike is unquestionably a highway, in Ohio, and part of the IHS, it seems to meet the prima facie case for inclusion in a way that does not create a slippery slope. --CComMack 12:46, 20 Apr 2005 (UTC)

As a rule, the bridge would not exist without the roadbed upon it.

A bridge, causeway, or viaduct is not a highway; a road upon it is. That should be a simple-enough distinction. A bridge structure deserves attention only if it has some remarkable characteristic typically requiring unusual engineering (length of span is a usual criterion) and administration. All bridges on any highway are essential, but the Ohio Turnpike has at most two bridges that anyone could consider remarkable (over the Maumee near Toledo and over the Cuyahoga near Cleveland). Do those two bridges even have names? Is there any lore about them? Neither draws the attention of the Golden Gate Bridge.

Those two bridges (types, span) might merit discussion within the article , but the sloppery-slope argument suggests that in turn every little culvert on some dirt road might qualify if someone could identify it somehow. I doubt that that will happen, or that anyone would ever give a listing of all the bridges, overpasses, and undercrossings of the Ohio Turnpike. Heck, there is no exit list yet, and that would seem a higher priority.--66.231.41.57 06:44, 2 October 2005 (UTC)

The Ohio Turnpike however is not an "Interstate Highway"; it is a highway that carries two Interstate Highways. --SPUI (talk) 17:43, 20 Apr 2005 (UTC)

I think that's a rather pedantic view to take (no remarks on the irony, PedanticallySpeaking, please!  :-) ) I would think that the average user would find the distinction vanishingly small to nonexistant; moreover, the capitalization of the actual category doesn't support your position. I'm not looking for a major fight over this, but I'm still totally unconvinced that the article should be removed from the category. Is there a group of third parties that could give insight (like, say, Wikipedia:WikiProject Highways)? --CComMack 21:43, 20 Apr 2005 (UTC)

The Ohio Turnpike was completed before the Interstate system but incorporated into the system as the sort of pre-existing Interstate-quality highway that would have to be included so that it would not be pointlessly duplicated. Although more than fifty years old it is fully up to modern standards except perhaps that it could use some modifications to make it less monotonous. Highway hypnosis is a hazard on the Ohio Turnpike, at least west of greater Cleveland, and a newer road would have more curves.--66.231.41.57 06:44, 2 October 2005 (UTC)

The capitalization was imposed by others; the intent of the categories has always been, as with the state highway categories, to include numbered routes. As I have unsuccessfully argued on WP:CFD, the current capitalization means that any road in multiple states should go in the categories; this is obviously not the intent.

As for WikiProject Highways, that seems to be pretty dead. There are a decent number of people here that edit road-related articles, but no real central place we discuss things. --SPUI (talk) 22:11, 20 Apr 2005 (UTC)

I have to agree with SPUI on this point. The Ohio Turnpike designation is distinct from the Interstate Highway system. They happen to coexist. I don't think you will see the Ohio Turnpike listed on any sort of "official" listing of interstate highways. Although I see some other unnumber highway designations are in some other Interstate categories: Eisenhower Expressway, Hillside Strangler (Illinois), Kingery Expressway. older≠wiser 01:48, Apr 21, 2005 (UTC)

I put the article in the category because it has been designated part of the interstate highway system, as clearly shown in the photograph of the route markers. I think categories ought to be broad to help people find stuff easily. There are going to be people who don't know the route numbers but would find themselves looking for the Ohio Turnpike article and it seems logical they might look in the interstate category. PedanticallySpeaking 14:44, Apr 21, 2005 (UTC)

Actually they'd probably either type in Ohio Turnpike or note that the Interstate category is inside Transportation in Ohio. --SPUI (talk) 16:11, 21 Apr 2005 (UTC)

[edit] Removal of Shunpiking section

I am submitting this to mediation to get further opinions on whether the posting of routes that can be used to avoid the Turnpike constitutes original research. User:SPUI keeps removing it, so rather than get into a revert war, I am going to see what others think. --Larrysphatpage 00:46, 5 July 2006 (UTC)

I vote for returning the "Shunpiking" section, particularly the first three paragraphs involving the use of Ohio Route 2 between Toledo, Port Clinton and Elyria. That was there when I first found this article. --Zars 01:52, 10 August 2006 (UTC)

I say the more information the better. Keep it! --cngodles 01:52, 10 August 2006 (UTC)

• Keep, but SPUI has a point: The section does need to cite its sources. Is there a travelogue somewhere which recommends the route as an alternate to the Turnpike? If so, that would alleviate concerns of original research. -- SwissCelt 20:30, 10 August 2006 (UTC)

I have personal knowledge of the route--I drove Ohio 2 every weekend for months when I was working for the railroad in Michigan. 00:54, 11 August 2006 (UTC)Zars

Right, that's sort of the point. Because of the policy on no original research, personal recollections are not adequate references for content. To have a section like that, we need an independently verifiable source.  — JVinocur (talk • contribs) 09:02, 11 August 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Addition of non-metropolitan route

The Ohio Turnpike is somewhat unique in the way it skirts Youngstown, Cleveland/Akron, and Toledo without actually being of much use to daily commuters in those areas. Perhaps this could be elaborated in the article.

This is common among early toll roads; see the Pennsylvania Turnpike, New York State Thruway, Massachusetts Turnpike, and probably others. --NE2 14:38, 11 April 2007 (UTC)

Isn't the Masspike used by Western suburb residents to get to/from Boston?

The extension inside Route 128 was not part of the original construction. --NE2 21:10, 20 April 2007 (UTC)