Talk:Nomadic empire

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[edit] title, definition, scope

"Horse archer empires" has one single google hit outside wikimedia, in a game discussion forum. the term seems ad hoc coinage. "Nomadic Empires" has 11,000 hits. I suggest we move this. dab (𒁳) 15:11, 6 February 2007 (UTC)

I also don't see why we need such detailed discussions of each empire here. The Xiongnu Empire should be discussed at Xiongnu Empire; this article should list them, and look at commonalities, not give rehashes of its sub-articles. dab (𒁳) 15:17, 6 February 2007 (UTC)

I copied pasted much of the examples and when I'll have time I'll considerably shorten it. Nomadic Empires is not exactly correct since there were nomads who erected empires in other regions of the world esp. in Africa. The distinctive of these empires are that all were erected by horseback nomads of the Eurasian steppe. Actually some was not strictly saying horse archers (the Sarmatians), but I don't know any better term. Maybe Eurasian Nomads Empires? Eurasian nomadic Empires? Horse peoples Empires? Horseback Empires? Nik Sage (talk/contrib) 15:24, 6 February 2007 (UTC)
well, we'll have to go with whatever term is current in pertinent literature. We cannot just make up our own terms, even if we think ours is better. Strictly, you'd have to establish that the empires you list are even sufficiently connected to warrant treatment in a single article. All they appear to have in common is that they originate in Central Asian nomadic culture. The only titles in the literature section that appear to indicate a similar scope as that of this article are "The Empire of the Steppes: a History of Central Asia" and *Warriors of the steppe: A military history of Central Asia, 500 B.C. to A.D. 1700.". There will be a lot of overlap between this article and History of Central Asia. We should even consider moving this to "Military history of Central Asia", I'm not sure. In any case, let's try to duplicate as little material as necessary; duplicate material means double rate of article attrition (Wikipedia half-life of quality prose). dab (𒁳) 15:36, 6 February 2007 (UTC)
There are many other terms for that subject. Inner Asian, Asian, Central Asian, Eurasian, Eurasian Periphery, Euro-Asian, Steppe and Nomadic are all used with empire to refer to the same thing. Sinor, Di Cosmo, Grousset, Seaman and others all reflect on that and there is no one agreed upon term in the pertinent literature. Grousset uses Steppe Empires. Sinor uses Nomadic Empires and Inner Asian Empires. Seaman sometimes uses Steppe and Nomadic cultures and sometimes Rulers from the Steppe. Khazanov calls it Nomadic States or Eurasian States. Barfield calls it the Imperial Confederacy of the Eurasian Nomads. There is no one conclusive term. It cannot be Military histoy of Central Asia because a lot of it happened in western Asia and eastern Europe (Cimmerians, Sarmatians, Huns, Avars, Bulgars, Magyars, and so on). Steppe Empires sound all right to me. Also Eurasian Steppe Empires Eurasian Nomads Empires and Horse people Empires. There is overlapping because these regions overlap. Steppe Empires have one common feature, all were ruled by Eurasian Steppe nomads, all were on horseback, almost all of them used the bow as their main weapon. Nik Sage (talk/contrib) 16:28, 6 February 2007 (UTC)
Any of Nomadic empires, Steppe Empires, Central Asian empires, Inner Asian empires are fine with me. It would be nice if you did a brief overview of these terms in the article, citing who uses which in what sense. dab (𒁳) 16:44, 6 February 2007 (UTC)
Good idea. Will do that. I'm leaning to Steppe Empires or to Eurasian nomads Empires. From this two what's better in your opinion. Nik Sage (talk/contrib) 01:34, 7 February 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Question about Timurid Empire

It seems that the Timurid Empire was focused in the Iranian Plateau,far from the steppe.So can we list it as a Nomadic Empire.Of course it is a empire but not a nomadic one.--Ksyrie 13:20, 6 March 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Split?

Should we split the article, as per current practice? For instance, we still have no article about the Göktürk Khaganate. What's the point of keeping the extensive coverage of this polity hidden from our readers at this low-traffic page? --Ghirla-трёп- 12:28, 15 May 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Manchu

How about the Manchu state? Gantuya eng 15:23, 10 September 2007 (UTC)

Unlike other neighboring tribes, the Manchu were agriculturalists and sedentary. So, no, their state was never "nomadic".201.37.64.244 21:46, 6 October 2007 (UTC)