Talk:Nissan S30

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Contents 1 Change name to Datsun 240Z 2 Yutaka Katayama to be given his own entry 2.1 Mr. K 3 240ZG 4 Incorrect 260z horsepower 5 BRE Racing Team 6 Merge proposal 7 432 8 Repairs/Additions 9 German Design

[edit] Change name to Datsun 240Z

I would like the title to be changed to Datsun 240Z as this is the original name. Calling them Nissan 240Z are for idiotic people who are ashamed to be associated with the Datsun name WilliRennen 14.07 31 January 2006 (UFC)

-I second this, the title of the article should be made 'Datsun 240z', Nissan 240z can be made a redirect to keep everything tidy. Also I might note that I think the articles on other Datsun models have the same problem, and they need to be fixed aswell. --Silver86 07:40, 18 June 2006 (UTC)

I completely agree. There never was a Nissan 240Z, it was a Datsun.--Mikebrand 21:24, 21 August 2006 (UTC)

After doing research for the 240ZG section, I have changed my mind about the article title. Nissan 240Z is accurate. While the vehicle was released in the US under the Datsun name, in Japan (where it was made) and in other markets, it was known as a Nissan.--Mikebrand 17:44, 22 August 2006 (UTC)

Why then is the article titled Nissan S30? You don't seem too be aware that the S30 was one particular model of the Fairlady Z series which was only available in Japan and had a 2 liter engine, which this article doesn't even mention. As far as chassis codes go there was S30, HS30, HLS30, PS30, RS30, GRS30, S31, GS31. —Preceding unsigned comment added by DatsunZfan (talk • contribs) 17:48, 7 September 2007 (UTC)

I agree, why is the title changed to S30? I know that it is common among conversation to refer to the Z cars (or cars in general) by their chassis code, but in this case it is inaccurate and encyclopedic. --76.186.94.195 17:09, 3 December 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Yutaka Katayama to be given his own entry

As he was in fact the head of Nissan North America at the time. I would also like Yutaka San to be given his own entry and be broke n off from this 240Z link as it does not deal with the man himself.

WilliRennen 31 January 2006 14.12(UFC)

[edit] Mr. K

I have started to create a Mr. K page at the Z wiki [aboutz.net]. Please check that out and contribute as you see fit.

Thank you.

Russ T 23 May 2006 18:11

[edit] 240ZG

I believe the addition of the "Confusion" paragraph about the 240ZG to be fundamentally inaccurate - The ZG was more than just a 240Z with displaced mirrors, it had a whole new nose! and who exactly confuses the two?? to consider it as a variant of the 240Z rather than a completely different model is a valid point of view.

I moved the 240ZG to its own section and condensed the existing wordiig (without changing the meaning), but I am not in a position to list out all the differences between the two.--Mikebrand 22:42, 21 August 2006 (UTC)

I did a bit of research and came up with a description that I am fairly confident is accurate (see article), but I am not sure it is complete. Do anyone know if the differences between the 240Z and 240ZG were purely related to the body? Or were there mechanical differences? --Mikebrand 17:46, 22 August 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Incorrect 260z horsepower

This wikipedia article states that the 260z is not desirable because of it's lower HP rating of 140hp. The inside of the engine bay on a 260z shows that it has a Max HP of 162 at 5600 RPMs. What is the reason for this inconsistency?

A: During the production of the Datsun S30 series, nissan switched from GROSS HP (ie HP before accessories including alternator, etc) to SAE NET HP. This article is somewhat innacurate with its HP figures in that it is comparing the 240Zs 151 GROSS HP with the later 260Z and 280Z's SAE HP ratings. This article is comparing apples to oranges and it should be corrected. I don't have the actual numbers in front of me right now, but someone who does have them should chime in and correct the article.

As a direct answer to your question, I have no idea where this HP figure came from. There were 2 generations of the 260Z (the late 1973/early 1974 and the later 1974 260Zs), noticeable by the bumpers among other things. Unsure completely, but maybe the newer 260Zs had gross and the later had net listed?

-- My take on it is the US 260z had 139hp gross, ROW 260z had 162hp gross. The 70-72 240z had 151hp gross, 73 US 240z had 129hp gross. It seems that SAE gross hp was used to measure the power of all Z's 70-78. Remember that going from 9:1 compression in the ROW 260z to 8.3:1 in the US version could easily account for 23 hp gross lost.

^ In regards to that which was mentioned above, the 129 and 150/151 ratings for the 240Z are correct. In SAE gross (which was the rating system for the day), the HP figures for 70-73 240Zs was 151/150; or 129 HP adjusted to later, SAE net specs. This is apparent on dyno testing (which i personally have not done, but other Z owners have) where the 260/280 platform puts out more HP at the wheels than the 240. I will attempt to research some more evidence. --E racer1999 01:10, 3 July 2007 (UTC)

[edit] BRE Racing Team

The following was posted at the bottom of the article, but clearly belongs on the Talk page. I do not vouche for its accuracy and am merely moving it here. --Mikebrand 18:07, 22 August 2006 (UTC)

The article above says Bob Bondurant ran the BRE Racing Team including the 240Zs piloted by John Morton. Check Bondurant's wikipedia article and site http://www.bondurant.com/about/bobbondurant.php to see that is not confirmed. BRE was Brock Racing Enterprises http://www.datsun.org/fairlady/BRE.htm started and run by Pete Brock. See also http://zhome.com/Racing/Racing.htm It seems Bondurant used some Datsuns for a while in his school, http://www.classicdatsun.com/zz/TheBondurant240Z.htm and might have collaborated in some ways with BRE, but does not seem to have been the driving force behind BRE's Datsun racing campaigns.

[edit] Merge proposal

I am proposing to merge this (240Z), 260Z and the 280Z page into one called Nissan S30 as they are universally known as the S30

I support the proposed change. Although many owners may be surprised to learn that their car is really an S30, it would be more accurate (especially for the 260 and 280 versions). Technically, rather than a merger, would this be just a renaming and expansion since the S30 page does not currently exist? --Mikebrand 19:17, 20 November 2006 (UTC)

This discussion has now being mentioned at the WikiProject Automobiles, so far 3 people including myself agree, 1 said they should be split into 3 and nobody is against it so far. So the move is going to take place at the end of the year Willirennen (talk · contribs) 03:11, 16 December 2006 (utc)

Support, Just so long as the redirects still work I'm fine with it. It is pretty confusing typing in Nissan 260Z and coming to an article titled Nissan 240Z. ren0^talk 22:13, 16 December 2006 (UTC)

Weight is WRONG.... Curb weights 2301 lbs | 1043.7 kg and was siginificantly lighter each previous year...

This merge is ridiculous. Each car is a different model. I dont care that the chassis might be the same, as long as the model number is different, there is no point in merging 240Z, 260Z and 280Z/ZX into one page. Zlatko 22:05, 24 April 2007 (UTC)

[edit] 432

This section requires some attention if it is going to be seaprate from the rest of the S30 section. I corrected some grammatical errors in the Z432R section, however much needs to be adressed for this to be a well-flowing entry. --E racer1999 01:18, 3 July 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Repairs/Additions

The compression was 8.8:1 on some years which is not reflected. I believe the 260z made LESS horsepower in the american market than the 240z. If this is due to emissions or switch over to SAE NET rating, fine, but it wasn't more on paper. Also, the 2355lb is a curb weight, not a dry weight. Yay or nay on the ammendments?

[edit] German Design

You should add the fact, the car was designed by Graf Albrecht von Goertz.

That would be fine and dandy if it was entirely true. Von Goertz participated in early works with Nissan for a sports coupe in th 1960s, but the idea was later scrapped. A separate entity was designed by a Japanese fellow shortly thereafter. If you feel that I am inaccurate, you may want to discuss it with the folks over at Nissan, because that is the story that they stand by. It is worth mentioning that von Goertz never explicitly claimed that he designed the Fairlday Z (or any other name it has). For a more in depth discussion on this topic, visit: http://zhome.com/History/Truth/GoertzMyth.htm . In response to this, I am removing the mention of von Goertz from this entry to avoid any further miseducation. E racer1999 19:19, 6 September 2007 (UTC)