Talk:New World vulture
From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
 |
New World vulture is included in the 2007 Wikipedia for Schools, or is a candidate for inclusion in future versions. Please maintain high quality standards, and make an extra effort to include free images, because non-free images cannot be used on the CDs. |
 |
New World vulture is part of WikiProject Birds, an attempt at creating a standardized, informative and easy-to-use ornithological resource. If you would like to participate, visit the project page. Please do not substitute this template. |
| B | This article has been rated as B-Class on the quality scale. |
| High | This article has been rated as high-importance on the importance scale. |
|
WikiProject Birds To-do:
|
|
I believe that first picture is a California Condor because of the white underwings and lack of the Andean Condor's head and neck ornamentation. I'm absolutely convinced it's not a Turkey Vulture, a bird I'm very familiar with. —JerryFriedman 19:18, 25 Aug 2004 (UTC)
Contents |
[edit] Relation to Storks
My reading shows that these birds are not closely related to storks but they are more closely related than to Old World vultures or other diurnal raptors. --Droll 21:59, 11 April 2006 (UTC)
This issue deserves more thorough discussion, including references. Old World vultures seem to have certain DNA rearrangements that are unique to thats group (Cytogenetics and Cell Genetics April 2006 paper IIRC, but whether anything can be drawn from that I don't know (the other accipitrids have not been checked on that marker it seems). Altogether, molecular evidence for the Cathartidae relationships seems equivocal (and possibly suffering from the errors of early application of molecular taxonomy; I don't have any recent studies on the topic) while, morphological evidence is largely in favor of a relationship with Ciconiiformes (in general - not storks in particular!). Behavior, on the other hand, very strongly supports a ciconiiform relationship. Feeding habits are prone to fast change (in fact, they are possibly one of the driving factors of speciation, we're gonna hear more on this in 2 years or so when the research currently underway gets published), while characters like urinating on the legs are rather conservative. The evolutionary history of all taxa in question is farly well known, but the points of divergence are still a mystery or unresolvable (due to many early Neornithes presenting a mix of characters of many orders). Dysmorodrepanis 21:23, 14 May 2006 (UTC)
OK, the paper I mentioned is: Cytogenetics and Genome Research '112: 286-295. It does not mention whether this has actually been analyzed in NWVs, but it points out that Falconiformes have the most strongly rearranged genomes of all birds analyzed to date (which is to say, in all likelihood all birds since chromosomal studies are fairly bread n butter work and has been done for a long time). For some reason, in Falconiformes there exists a bias for chromosomes to aggregate until a certain size has been reached, and then to rearrange. Most birds have a medium number of large chromosomes and a large number of small chromosomes. Falconiforms have a large number of lerge and medium-sized chromosomes and very few (a handful or so) small chromosomes. So whether NWVs are falconiform could possibly be determined using nothing more serious than a good quality light microscope... Dysmorodrepanis 00:54, 7 June 2006 (UTC)
- Unfortunately, this only holds true for accipitrids. See Falconiformes article for ref. Dysmorodrepanis 17:56, 24 October 2006 (UTC)
[edit] Notes
It would assist verification if page numbers were included in the notes. Snowman (talk) 10:35, 17 November 2007 (UTC)
[edit] Distinction between condor and vulture?
This page makes the distinction between the two condor species, and the five vulture species. However, no distinction between the two is given. This is especially confusing, as the five vulture New World vulture species are different than the Old World vulture species. (Vulture points back to this page for clarification on the New World species.) So ... what's the difference between a condor and a (new world) vulture? Is it purely linguistic? Why make the distinction between New World vultures and condors - it seems that it would be clearer to call the old world vultures in general "vultures", and new world vultures in general "condors", so why isn't it done? -- 20:38, 6 December 2007 (UTC)
"Condor" is used for members of the genera Vultur and Gymnogyps (the Andean and California condors, respectively, the latter being included in Vultur by some ornithologists). The rest of them are called vultures, and "New World vulture" may be used as a collective term for all members of the family Cathartidae, whether they are called "condor" or "vulture" in English. According to Online Dictionary, "vulture" comes from the Latin and entered written English in the 14th century, and "condor" derives from a Native American word and began to be used around 1600. 153.2.247.30 (talk) 04:01, 28 February 2008 (UTC)
[edit] Last piece in the FT jigsaw puzzle...
OK then, what does this need....cheers, Casliber (talk · contribs) 07:04, 22 January 2008 (UTC)
- Mostly expansion. Some sections need adding, like distribution and migration, but mostly single paragraph sections need to be expanded. This shouldn't be too hard as all the research work has already been done for the individual species articles. Sabine's Sunbird talk 19:48, 22 January 2008 (UTC)
