Talk:Neil Peart

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[edit] Misc.

Noticed that link to video of "The Rhythm Method Drum solo" is broken as of 11/3/05. Lets see if it magically re-appears. Millifoo 04:40, 4 November 2005 (UTC)

http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Neil_Peart&diff=41317024&oldid=41109882 While I, being a patriotic Singaporean, enjoy this little joke, it is my Wikipedic duty to revert this that I can only consider vandalism. P 17:31, 26 February 2006 (UTC)

For the sake of completeness in the "equipment" section, I could have sworn there is a video of Peart recording a popular Rush song that includes drumming on several different sizes of Tupperware(tm) containers. I believe it was in the TV documentary done a few years ago on Rush. The song may have been "Tom Sawyer" or another released around the same time. 70.68.70.186 08:11, 15 April 2007 (UTC)


Just noticed that the Ludwig-Musser article states that Peart playes Ludwig drums from 1985-1994 and the Gear section of the Peart article says Ludwig Drums (1987-94).

[edit] Objectivist

Is Peart really an Objectivist? Didn't he say, specifically in relation to Rand/Objectivism the "he is no ones disciple"? Just because 2112 is based on Anthem doesn't make him an Objectivist, using that criteria you could label him a Nietzschian based on Hemispheres KaptKos 09:29, 24 April 2006

Since no one responded to this I have removed the cat. I think the quote from Peart in the article shows he wouldn't want to be considered one anyway --KaptKos 08:45, 7 May 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Biography

Started work on the bio. Probable sections:

  • A boy alone - from going to London to joining Rush
  • He has assumed control - the rest of the 70s
  • New world man - the 80s
  • Counterparts - the 90s up to Family Tragedy
  • Ghostrider returns - post tragedy to present

Any thoughts --KaptKos 16:02, 8 May 2006 (UTC)

Kapt, IMHO the section titles are little too "creative". Also, non-Rush fans or people recently exposed to the band wouldn't necessarily understand the headings. I will not change them though, as it doesn't at all hurt the article. I like your breakdown though. When I have more time this week, I'll help you out with adding info. Wisdom89 18:56, 15 May 2006 (UTC)

  • Wis, I agree, if fact I would say they are "crap" rather than "creative", these were just initial, discriptive titles to help me concentrate on the period of each section and probably shouldn't have made it into the article. The simpler the better, "Early Life", "Joining Rush" are fine the rest would best be changed. I ground to a halt at the end of the 70s, anything I came up with was about the band and not specifically Peart except that he took up cycling which I don't think is enough to cover the next 15 years. I'll have a go at the lyric section which I think could do with a rewrite--KaptKos 10:39, 16 May 2006 (UTC)
Any updates on biography? This area seems a little thin and is missing nearly 20 years (post-Hemispheres to 1997 tragedy). In relation to his songwriting and activity with Rush it seems very relevant. Sbrawner 14:30, 5 September 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Phil Collins

I removed Phil Collins as an influence as I have never seen him mentioned anywhere as an influence on Peart and I looked at a lot of stuff recently. If I'm wrong I didn't mean to offend --KaptKos 14:41, 9 May 2006 (UTC)

He in fact said that he was influenced by the drumming in Brand-X. Phil Collins was the drummer in Brand-X. Also, all the members of Rush were influenced by early Genesis, in which of course Phil was the drummer.


I can find no quote where Neil Peart "said" that he was influenced by the drumming in Brand X. Before citing Phil Collins as an influence as fact it really should be substantiated.

http://www.2112.net/powerwindows/transcripts/peartinfluencestozildjian.htm

Soon there were other adventurous and accomplished rock drummers, like John Bonham, Michael Giles (the first drummer with King Crimson and a very important influence on me), Bill Bruford with Yes, his replacement Alan White, Phil Collins with Genesis, and certainly Billy Cobham and Steve Gadd, who must have influenced every drummer in those days.

I have a Zildjian cymbal book from 1981 (it shows the cymbal setups used by several drummers). There is quote in it from Peart stating that Phil Collins was one of his influences. If you listen to early Genesis records (early to mid '70s), it's clear that part of Peart's style from '76 through early '80s closely resembled Collins'. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 24.166.176.141 (talk) 14:17, 9 February 2008 (UTC)

[edit] R30

Neil won best recorded performance in the Modern Drummer reader's poll on the 19th of May, so i updated the awards list. He also won best instructional video for "Anatomy of a Drum Solo" and best Rock drummer, yet i did not think that he was still eligable for the latter of these awards, can anyone clarify this? --RG

Yes, it appears as though Peart amassed the largest number of votes in the category of "Best Rock Drummer" in 2006. Unforunately, his ineligibility precludes him from officially "winning", so perhaps 2006 should be removed from the the "Best Rock Drummer" line and replaced with a notation that indicates this. The other awards obviously should stay. Wisdom89 16:37, 11 June 2006 (UTC)

[edit] pronunciation

Is [put] the proper pronunciation? That doesn't seem right. -- Mikeblas 18:59, 27 May 2006 (UTC)

no, the pronunciation, both correct and on the article is [pɪɹt], not [put]. it's IPA pronunciation. To put it simply, think of it as [peert]. - Evan Seeds (talk) 03:51, 28 May 2006 (UTC)
Ahah, thanks. When I edit the article, I can see the difference. Is there a way to have WikiPedia use a font that clearly shows the difference between ɪɹ and u when viewing the article? --Mikeblas 04:13, 28 May 2006 (UTC)
For me, the difference is clear. If you are using the default skin, perhaps your resolution is too low to tell the difference, although i am set only at 1024x768. Otherwise, i don't know. - Evan Seeds (talk) 04:34, 28 May 2006 (UTC)
I have dual monitors, both at 1600 x 1200, using the monobook skin. -- Mikeblas 15:48, 2 June 2006 (UTC)

The IPA pronounciation dictates that his last name is NOT pronounced "peert", yet the article says it is. Which one is it anyway? Necromancer 16:29, 14 October 2006 (UTC)

According to the man himself in his recent VH1 Classic "Hangin' With" interview [1], the correct pronunciation is in fact "peert". I believe that should look like "pirt" in IPA, but I am not absolutely sure. If you know how it should look, please change it. Raygun 02:10, 31 October 2006 (UTC)
I agree with Raygun. According to this IPA chart, I believe it should be "pirt". I have the same last name, and the vowels are pronounced more like the "y" in "city", not like the "i" in "sit". Chrispynz 12:57, 22 February 2007 (UTC)
Based on this discussion, I changed it to pronounced /ˈpɪərt/. That's the sound I have in pier, which is close to an [i]. kwami 06:20, 8 November 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Lyrics

Just given this section a going over. Its basically cronological and goes up to MP so its really a reordering of what was already there and I retained the quote. I'm not sure if this is the best way to go about it, cronologically I mean, I think there is too much "This song means this and this song means that", where a more themematic approach might be classier but I haven't got my head around how to start that so this'll have to do for now, anyway add, change, revert if you must --KaptKos 15:51, 2 June 2006 (UTC)

Stuck the 2 2112/Rand paragraphs together since its all related. V. interesting NME quote, anyone know where the previous quote comes from which contradicts this--KaptKos 14:34, 15 June 2006 (UTC)

Anyone else ever read "Mystic Rhythms: The Philosophical Vision of Rush"? (http://www.amazon.com/Mystic-Rhythms-Philosophical-Vision-Rush/dp/1587151022) If you guys think it's useful stuff, in a few weeks I'll read through it and give the author's take on some songs. - The Fwanksta (talk) 02:47, 1 March 2008 (UTC)

[edit] Fog vs Frog

It was the Great Frog see here and here and the shop itself

[edit] Links to fan sites

I was contacted via private email by the site owner of http://www.neilpeartdrumsticks.com . Apparently, it is he who has been repeatedly adding the link to that site. His argument is that he's not selling anything directly and he's just a fan with a fansite. I pointed him at WP:EL and asked him to bring the discussion here. He did make the legit point that his site wasn't any worse (and arguably better than) some of the other fansite links, so I removed those that I felt failed to meet the guidelines at WP:EL. I left the link to www.2112.net because it contains actual unique content (an interview with the article subject). --DragonHawk 22:18, 4 September 2006 (UTC)

It was right to direct the user to WP:EL. It's pretty cut/dried as to the rules regarding fansite inclusion. If it doesn't add anything that isn't already available in the authorised links(which 99% don't) or if it isn't added as a citation for content...then it shouldn't be there. I will check in as to how this proceeds. If there is concensus among the regular editors that the site should be included..then it should certainly stay. Anger22 22:34, 4 September 2006 (UTC)

Hello and thank you. DragonHawk has kindly taken the time to explain to me the rules on Fan Sites of which at the time I did not know. I do not wish to have my site linked here any further ... just not worth the headache. I do not understand how the linking of the groups own self promoting websites are allowed then? And the link to Carrie Nuttall's site is purely commercial in the promotion of sales of her photographic works. Not at all an information site as stated in the rules. Peartdrumsticks 22:50, 4 September 2006 (UTC)

Do you know how I can delete my current user account on here? I do not wish to be a member any further. Thank you for your kind help above! Peartdrumsticks 23:31, 4 September 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Neil Peart Specs

I never see any measurements for Neil's size and weight, stick reach, and even this same type of measurements for his drum kit. How far does neil have to move his own arm to hit his first tom, next tom, cymbal, hi hat, etc... —Preceding unsigned comment added by 204.249.67.128 (talk • contribs)

On the off-chance that you're not being sarcastic... I'm not sure there are many people out there that ar interested in that level of detail about the man. Personally, I find those things irrelevant. However, if you find that information important, I think you should feel free to post it here, so long as evidence of fact can be provided. Raygun 06:49, 19 September 2006 (UTC)

I think it would be interesting to know; especially for aspiring drummers. How relevant that information is in the context of this article is apparently a matter of debate. If he were an athlete it would surely be considered relevant. In his writings, Mr Peart has indicated that, while not athletic as a child, his musical career has led him to be quite fit. Drumming is very physical and I expect one would not be surprised to find correlations between physical attributes and demonstrated proficiency. If that doesn't convice you of relevancy, consider that Wikipedia has an article that discloses the mass of Albert Einstein's brain.

[edit] Beamsville?

Peart's book, "Traveling Music", states the following: (p. 49) "In January of 1955, the stork brought my brother Danny, and sister Judy a year after that, and soon we moved to a brand-new split-level in the lakeside suburb of Port Dalhousie." And on page 50, "As my new hometown of Santa Monica was to Los Angeles, so my old hometown of Port Dalhousie was to St. Catharines..." and on page 53, "From grades 1 to 5 I attended Gracefield School, just two blocks from our house."

Gracefield School is located at 117 Bayview Drive, clearly in the Port Dalhousie section of St. Catharines. So I'm pretty sure that Beamsville (about 20 km west of Port Dalhousie) is not the town he grew up in. I'll edit the article to reflect this. Raygun 06:49, 19 September 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Merge with Selena Taylor

See here There is very little content, so we should merge and redirect. -Justin (koavf)·T·C·M 22:42, 19 September 2006 (UTC)

Well, it appears that someone has deleted the Selena Taylor page. Personally, I was indifferent about the article, but seeing as it no longer exists, I'll remove the merge request. Raygun 02:19, 21 September 2006 (UTC)
I put it up for speedy delete as per Wikipedia:Criteria for speedy deletion#Articles "7. Unremarkable people or groups/vanity pages". Being the daughter of a famous person does not make you notable. Also the details were all OR and very speculative at that, such as "she apparantly enjoyed playing the flute." Complete junk and pointless, as merging would have been as there was nothing worthwhile that isn't here already . --KaptKos 09:15, 21 September 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Removing paragraph from lyrics section

I removed this recently added paragraph: "He expounds on this frustration with Nazi comparisons in his newest book, Roadshow: Landscape With Drums: A Concert Tour by Motorcycle, along with an interesting revelation: the parents of his bandmate Geddy Lee (who is Jewish by birth) met while in Auschwitz. This puts the song "Red Sector A," a song about the Holocaust, in a very different light." The reasons for its removal are

  • The book should be used as a reference not as detail in this section.
  • This info was not revealed in this book - I first heard about it in the early 80s, I'm sure it was widely know before that
  • The song "Red Sector A" is not specifically about the holocaust and this section deals with songs chronologically and this is out of step without explaining so

regards --KaptKos 10:22, 7 November 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Removing popular culture section

I took the liberty of removing this section from the article on account that it is non-notable and a tad fan-crufty. Frankly, I don't see the merit of keeping it based on the content therein. All who disagree may put their comments here to discuss this. We should try and avoid any type of editorial clashing without civil discussion. Wisdom89 20:34, 28 November 2006 (UTC)

I agree with th rm for the reasons stated. Anger22 (Talk 2 22) 22:42, 28 November 2006 (UTC)

Sounds acceptable to me. Thanks for being civic.

  • I've never been a fan of the popular culture sections, but don't you think the ATHF movie appearance merits a mention somewhere? :) JuJube 04:46, 17 April 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Beamsville

Regarding the Beamsville note I can say quite authoritatively that Neil grew up in Port Dalhousie which is in northwest St. Catharines. I grew up in St. Catharines as well and still live in the area. I am very good friends with a person who lived two doors down from Neil's house in Port Dalhousie. In fact my friend's sister attended Neil's recent marriage. In any event, the "one lane bridge" of Red Barchetta fame or "the Bailey Bridge" as its known locally is located in the Town of Lincoln just west of the village of Jordan towards the other village within the Town of Lincoln called Beamsville.

More information concerning Neil's hometown and his early days there is available in an article which Neil wrote years ago for the St. Catharines Standard Newspaper describing his early days in St. Catharines. That may be googled by searching "A Port Boy's Story". That published article will clear up much of his early days as he wrote it. Envirocop 05:21, 27 January 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Got rid of the solo section.

Not one single thing is sourced in his solos. Source your text and maybe this text will stay. By the way there are many other drummers who, if what you guys say are true..Does what he does, although people don't feel the neeed to put it in. Seriously guys he is not this god you guys make him out to be, John Bonham is equally as good as this Canadian. By the way, the article sounded soo fanboyisy that it made me sick. Pie76 07:44, 18 July 2007 (UTC)

Dear Sockpuppet, not to use this talk page as a discussion forum, but Bonham maybe one of the most over rated drummers in the history of Rock - His songs and solos are simple. Influential, yes, respected, yes, groovy, yes. Technical, complicated, polyrthymic, versatile? No. Sorry. Now kindly stop pushing your POV on everything that is related to Rush. If you don't like the band, that's fine. I know plenty of people who do..and plenty who don't. Don't remove entire sections. IMPROVE THE ARTICLE. Why not try and locate sources yourself instead of antagonizing the editors. Wisdom89 19:15, 18 July 2007 (UTC)

HAHA buddy are you kidding me? Listen to the live version of Moby Dick and come back to me dude. Sure Bonham has his new modern drum kit that can make more complex sounds, but if you compare Bonham's work in the 70s and Peart's work in the 70s then Peart does not hold a candle to Bonham. Look buddy give it up, Zeppelin rapes the **** out of Rush anyday of the week when it comes to their music, and the majority of the people will agree with me.

But either way it sounds extremely biased "Peart is known for complicated, extremely technical drum solos containing odd time signatures, complex arrangements (sometimes total separation between upper and lower limb patterns), and exotic percussion instruments."

Now do I need to explain how that sounds like a magazine? Sorry buddy but either change the wording, leave it out, or we can put a NPOV tag on the main article; your choice. Pie76 19:58, 18 July 2007 (UTC)

Explain why "Peart is known for complicated, extremely technical drum solos containing odd time signatures, complex arrangements (sometimes total separation between upper and lower limb patterns), and exotic percussion instruments." sounds biased. It would be biased if it said "Peart is the best known drummer in the world" but it doesn't. So leave that part in until someone comes up with something better to replace it.Angel Of Sadness T/C 20:15, 18 July 2007 (UTC)
If all that is required is sources, that's no problem. There are plenty of references circulating on the web from reliable magazines/reviewers that could verify all of those claims. Hell, all you need to do is watch the drummer play live for the "separation of limbs technique". Geez - This Zeppelin-Rush stuff is becoming tiresome. Just let it go already. Regardless,I sincerely doubt Mr. Pie76 has even bothered to watch a single video of Peart playing a drum solo. Not that it really matters, but still - Instead of arguing...why not..as I said before...locate sources yourself like a good editor should. Wisdom89 23:57, 18 July 2007 (UTC)
Pie76: C'mon, to use the word rape in a threatening manner and then asterisk-out the word shit is kind of funny. To me, using rape in that manner is much more offensive. To say Bonham is better than Peart is silly. Both drummers are enjoyable to listen to. Rush's music didn't have all the "evil/occult" imagery to it like Zeppelin did, so maybe that's what leads people to think Zep is better. Kinda dumb if you ask me. Both bands had awesome guitarists, bassists, and drummers, although I would say Geddy wins the "technical proficiency" award for singing and playing complicated parts simultaniously. And yes, he has been voted "Best Rock Bassist" in Bass Player Magazine many more times than John Paul Jones. 65.248.164.214 (talk) 20:42, 3 April 2008 (UTC)

[edit] I added some "[citation needed]" to this article.

ALOT fo stuff is unsourced. You guys are having fun on John Bonham so I think it's time to play with Neil Peart a bit. Only sounds fair to me, right? Pie76 02:41, 19 July 2007 (UTC)

Yes, there are several claims unsourced. I won't agree with you there. However, as far as I can tell, I've never visited the John Bonham article, however, if you're going to point fingers, you were the initial instigator and the first person to mention Bonham with respect to Peart. I'm a pretty big Zeppelin fan myself, owning all of their albums (and I've listened to Moby Dick many a time), as I do Rush. I will be more than happy to provide you with any citations you desire. And again, this is not "fun", it's supposed to be constructive, so lets just agree to disagree about how we feel about both drummers and address the issues civilly. Wisdom89 02:59, 19 July 2007 (UTC)

Look Wisdom I respect you, alright? You and me have been arguing for what? two or three days so far and you STILL have reamined civil. I mean that is inspiring, really it is. But I have a few things to say:

A. I highly recommend you listen to the LIVE version of Moby Dick, preferably on the How The Wwest Was Won album.

B. I'm only doing this because people are questioning if he is as influential as they say he he is. Alright? Now you and I both know this is absurd.

C. So witht that being said, I'm added some [citations needed]s in PEART's article because they are doing the same thing, saying things that would make one's eyebrow raise without providing numerous sources. And even stuff that would NOT make their eyebrow raise, like his inlfluences; I'll STILl add some {{Fact}}s on that JUST to get revenge.

Pie76 03:04, 19 July 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Thank you for the sources on Peart, I'll just turn around and use these for Bonham's article.

Thank you for the sources on Peart, I'll just turn around and use these for Bonham's article.

However, if somebody STILL takes away those sources on bonham's aticle I'm afraid I have to do the samef or Pearts. Pie76 03:23, 19 July 2007 (UTC)

I find it sad that people would spoil the enjoyment of both Neil Peart and John Bonham with arguments and sabotage to wikipedia articles about both. There are many arguments about the merits of both. I would like to feel it is a tribute to both drummers that passions would run so high. I, myself am a die hard Bonham fan but I recognize the genius of Peart and acknowledge his skill and depth on the drums. But this really needs to stop. This is Wikipedia and there is room for both and their fans. Please don't feel that your opinion alone will sway others to feel one is better than the other. As a side note ..Der Trommelier (sp) is spectacular. And for the fans of both...Moby Dick is always cited as the definitive John Bonham performance..but if you will watch the Knebsworth performance..I think it showcases Bohnam's skills more than any other video ever will. Particularly Kashmir and In the Evening.

[edit] Aqua Teen Hunger Force Colon Movie Film For Theatres?

Is Neil really in this movie? 199.214.24.71 21:30, 3 August 2007 (UTC)

Yes, he is. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 70.48.217.69 (talk) 02:46, August 23, 2007 (UTC)

[edit] edit incorrectly reverted, now fixed properly I hope

Wisdom89 reverted my change of "an a personal writing style"->"a personal writing style" when s/he presumably meant to change it to "an apersonal writing style" (apersonal being synonymous with or at least similar to impersonal). So I went back and changed it again, this time to something I'm sure we'd agree upon. TimProof 08:42, 23 September 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Historically?

i removed this bit: "Peart is distinguished historically for playing "butt-end out"" he is not the first drummer to do this, i dont think he evens comes close, as i know Art Blakey did it years before Peart. FloydNIN 05:27, 16 November 2007 (UTC)

[edit] References

  • Sorry, but only 2 references in Early life is not enough.
  • Career prior to joining Rush has only one.
  • Joining Rush has only one (repeated).
  • Early career with Rush has none.

If I was reviewing this, it would be quickly failed. There seem to be enough 'Notes' references, so why not add some more? --andreasegde (talk) 10:14, 7 February 2008 (UTC)

Yeah, I'm working on these now. Biographies of Neil Peart are short to come by (at least in any sort of detail) however, one that you will see repeated is actually his own words. Wisdom89 (talk) 03:14, 11 February 2008 (UTC)

[edit] GA on hold

  • "players who were at the forefront of the British hard rock scene[1]." - put it after the full stop Check markY
    • "winning the Juno Award for most promising new act[12]," - again Check markY
  • "Peart has received many awards (see below)" - see below not necessary Check markY
    • "in his book Traveling Music (see below)." - again Check markY
  • "ranked as one of the greatest rock drummers of all time.[4][5][6][7][8]" - better not to source this here than to have 5(!) and just source it later in the article when you discuss it in more depth Check markY
  • Is the last para of the lead necessary? Check markY
  • First para of Early life section needs wlinking for locations etc. Check markY
  • "and described his childhood as happy and says he experienced a warm family life." - fix tense Check markY
  • 2nd para of Early Life unsourced
  • No more sources for Early Life? Actually, no not really, just his own words in an interview Check markY
  • Career prior to joining Rush section also needs more sourcing
  • "Receiving an advance from their record company the band purchased new equipment. - needs ref - removed claim Check markY
  • "B side spanning epic "The Fountain of Lamneth," Peart responded by penning the A side spanning epic "2112"" - the repetition doesn't sound good here. Check markY
  • "a venue Peart had dreamed of playing in his days on the Southern Ontario bar circuit and where he was now introduced as "The Professor on the drum kit." - need refs. Same with next paragraph Check markY
  • Image in Family tragedy & continuing on section needs caption. Check markY
  • "and Gene Krupa.[20] [21]" - space not needed between refs. Check markY
  • "Peart: "When I was starting out, " - introduce the quote better. What's he talking about, and when? Check markY
  • 2nd Check markY and 3rd paras of Style and influences need refs
  • "his rotating drum riser." -remove EL. You can wlink to the page instead Check markY
  • "For a detailed listing of Peart's equipment, see the section on Peart's "Gear", below." - not necessary, TOC at top suffices Check markY
  • "Each successive tour sees the solo more advanced, with some routines dropped in favor of newer, more complex ones." - says who? Refs - Couldn't find a reference to substantiate these, removed the entire sentence Check markY
  • ""There was a remarkable backlash, especially from the English press, this being the late seventies, when collectivism was still in style, especially among journalists," Peart said. "They were calling us 'Junior fascists' and 'Hitler lovers.' It was a total shock to me."" - needs citing. You can cite liner notes Check markY
  • 4th para of lyrics needs sourcing Check markY
  • You don't need to cite the books themselves. Instead, cite some RS talking about the books (in the descriptions of them).
  • All of the YouTube videos are copyvios Check markY
  • Some of the ELs should be removed and used as refs. info contained in external links more or less present in article Check markY

Leave a note on my talk page when done. dihydrogen monoxide (H20) 09:05, 14 February 2008 (UTC)

I'll get to work on the above changes - thanks for taking the time to peruse the article. Wisdom89 (T / C) 09:08, 14 February 2008 (UTC)
Per your comment on my talk page, I've taken a quick look. Nothing seems to be out of order; everything seems OK so far. Keep it up! dihydrogen monoxide (H20) 07:38, 20 February 2008 (UTC)

Passed. dihydrogen monoxide (H20) 22:59, 23 February 2008 (UTC)

[edit] Lyrics

Let's get some discussion going here on the talk page - since the article is currently being reviewed for GA status, it would be prudent to make sure that if we add new information that is likely to be challenged (e.g claims and opinions regarding peart's lyrics) it is already sourced. Thank you! Wisdom89 (T / C) 17:10, 23 February 2008 (UTC)

[edit] Addition to Lyrics

Correct me if I'm wrong, but this paragraph should be included in the article:

In the Hemispheres album, the song "The Trees" is considered by many to be a classic example of Peart's talent in writing lyrics, believed to focus on the inequality of the labor force, racism and even communism. It is unlikely, however, that he wrote these lyrics in defense of racism, for it is inconsistent with previous writings, such as "Freewill". Peart himself has remarked that the inspiration for penning the song came from chancing upon a humorous comic strip which depicted trees arguing like people.[1] Many fans, however still take this song to be a strong political statement."

76.108.224.197 (talk) 17:24, 23 February 2008 (UTC)

Well, only add it if YOU HAVE a (or several) good, reliable, sources. Try to find direct quotes from Peart himself. Don't be POV, rely on Peart for your addition. No speculation, supposition here please. What is "considered by many" probably should not be in the article, it would become unruly. This is an encyclopedia, so "Jack Webb it": Just the FACTS ma'am.
I always thought the song was inspired from the CLASS conflict of historical England (the Lords versus the peasants) Serfdom, from the sixth to the twelfth centuries, or secondarily from time of Cromwell and James the I, the English Civil War, and had nothing to do with race, or the 20th Century. It had to do more with economics of the haves and have-knot's of 17th Century England, something Peart would have studied a lot about in the 1960s school system of Canada and his early travels to London as a young teen, then applied this historical thought analysis to what was happening in the 60s & 70s. So, there could be two different things here: 1) where the inspiration ACTUALLY came from (which could be in the article) and 2) the application of it to numerous (literally thousands) David-versus-Goliath scenarios around the world, throughout history (which probably should NOT be in the article). Depending on ones education and background they could take this song an apply it to many different historical events in time. Since RUSH had previously done "Bastille Day" this song could just be an analysis (using that comic strip inspiration) to the French Revolution. It could be applied to any colonial revolution (American, India, etc). So, tread lightly and don't hog off all the light. WikiDon (talk) 22:21, 23 February 2008 (UTC)
PS: Album titles are italicized and not put in "quotes".
PPS: If you put a paragraph about every song that Peart has written, it would be its own article, and become huge. This article should just include his philosophy of writing lyrics, his broad themes that apply to many songs, not to much of analyzing individual songs. Individual song analysis should be done in those, individual song articles (or maybe album articles). This article should just have what his influences where, parents, childhood, education, travels, etc. WikiDon (talk) 22:58, 23 February 2008 (UTC)
1) I do have a source listed there describing how Peart depicted trees arguing as people because he saw it in a comic strip. 2) I'm not writing a paragraph about every song just this one. Honestly when I was introduced to Rush and I asked about lyrics the first song I was shown was this one because it's one of (if not the) most famous songs by rush in terms of lyrics because of the statement. 3) If you think I should shorten the paragraph then tell me what to remove (specifically) and I'll do it. I just think it's worth mentioning that the trees is considered a big lyrical work on his part. If you want I'll even shorten it to a sentence (In the Hemispheres album, the song "The Trees" is considered by many to be a classic example of Peart's talent in writing lyrics, believed to focus on the inequality of the labor force, racism and even communism.) but I think it's incomplete without a bit more elaboration. 4) I don't know. What do you guys think? 72.28.140.169 (talk) 18:33, 27 February 2008 (UTC)
Your reference only says that he saw a cartoon and got the idea about trees talking to trees, it does NOT say that he got the idea of what to talk about. You need a reference for: "...inequality of the labor force, racism and even communism." Your paragraph as written is not acceptable. WikiDon (talk) 20:06, 27 February 2008 (UTC)
Alright but there is no reference for that it's just the truth; it's what people assume the song means. There's no website for that it's just the truth. It's just reality. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 72.28.140.169 (talk) 03:00, 28 February 2008 (UTC)
Correct, but then we have a verifiability problem. I wish it wasn't so, but that's the rule of the game. Wisdom89 (T / C) 03:13, 28 February 2008 (UTC)
Whatever if you guys dont want to put it up on the article i dont really care 72.28.140.169 (talk) 19:59, 28 February 2008 (UTC)

[edit] "No one's disciple" quote

I'm not sure how to do it, but could we get a quote format here or something? When I was reading it I got a little confused whent he text became separated. In short, I think there needs to be more there to introduce or explain that it's a quote. Ideas? - The Fwanksta (talk) 03:03, 1 March 2008 (UTC)

[edit] Athiest/Agnostic/Anglican/Episcopican?

I've recently heard rumors that Neil is either a practicing Anglican/Episcopican or simply an Athiest or Agnostic. Are any of these rumors true? - Spokenwordsegment (talk) 22:01, 24 March 2008 (UTC)

He is actually Agnostic to answer your question.

Lostinsidemyworld (talk) 15:58, 16 May 2008 (UTC)

[edit] Portrait request

I think we need a head / portrait shot of Neil Peart. I think this will help make the article's introduction look better. - Spokenwordsegment (talk) 17:19, 29 March 2008 (UTC)

I definitely agree, but I don't know where to find one we can use... - The Fwanksta (talk) 05:48, 7 May 2008 (UTC)
Nothing WP:FU. Someone needs to take a better photo in concert and upload it. That's really the only way you're going to get one as Peart generally does not appear in meet and greets or take photographs with fans. Wisdom89 (T / C) 07:43, 7 May 2008 (UTC)