Talk:National Autonomous University of Mexico

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To-do list for National Autonomous University of Mexico: edit · history · watch · refresh

Here are some tasks you can do:
  • Expand: The History section, the Organization section, the Students and Faculty section, state the graduation year for each alumni mentioned in the Noted Alumni section
  • Update: May 17th, 2007

Contents

[edit] UNAM is now in the wikiproject Universities

I have incorporated the UNAM to the wikiproject "Universities" please respect the basic structure of it. You are free to improve / make changes within each section. The basic structure contain this sections:

  • History -- Describe the history of the college/university, including noteworthy milestones in its development.
  • Campus -- Describe the overall shape and size of the campus. Mention any famous buildings and their architects. This section could be expanded to include satellite campuses:
  • Organization -- Mention the administration, including leading officials. If this college/university has a special organizational structure, such as a residential college system, then it should be mentioned here. Then, in bullet point form, list the schools, colleges, etc. of this university. If appropriate, also list the faculties and departments at the university. If there is a special course system or requisites for enrollment, mention them here, too. If the university is part of a larger system (as in University of California), mention this connection and provide requisite links.
  • Students and faculty -- State the number (and any other useful statistics) of the students. Distinguish between undergraduate, graduate and postgraduate students; also state the number of faculty members. Distinguish between tenure/nontenured, full- and part-time (if possible).
  • Sports, clubs, and traditions -- Mention the sports team(s) of the college/university and what is notable about them. Here is also a good place to mention specific traditions of the college/university, like students' union activities, a student newspaper, fraternities, regular activities, etc. The heading may be changed accordingly in regard to the importance of sports, clubs, traditions, students' unions etc. For example, alternative headings could be Students' Union, Sports and Traditions or Students' Union Activities.
  • Noted alumni -- Bullet list of Alumni that are notable/famous. Mention the graduation date and degree and give a short description why they are famous.
  • Noted faculty -- Bullet list of active and former members of faculty that are notable. If they are alumni/alumnae, mention them here in parenthesis, including the degree and graduation date. For all give a short description why they are famous.
  • External links -- Give a link to the website of the college/university, preferable in the English language.

We look forward for your contribution with this article. Just remember to keep the standard as much as possible. --Hdpercar 16:21, 16 May 2007 (UTC)

[edit] older entries

According to the official UNAM website, [1], the University was founded on September 21, 1551, and opened on January 25, 1553. However, Universidad Nacional Mayor de San Marcos (National University of San Marcos) in Lima, Peru, was founded on May 12, 1551, and opened on January 2, 1553, according to its official webpage [2], which would mean that the statement in this article that UNAM was the first university in America is not true. The same applies for the statement that UNAM is the oldest university in the Western Hemisphere, in the List of oldest universities in continuous operation.

And, if you go over to check the article at Santo Domingo, you'll see that: The Universidad Autónoma de Santo Domingo (UASD) is the oldest university in the new world 1538. If we were to say, "in the New World," (Santo Domingo), "in America" (Lima), and "in North America" (Mexico), all three could have their slice of glory. –Hajor
Agree, except that Hispaniola is also in the Americas. Better South America for San Carlos. --Rbraunwa 15:11, 14 October 2006 (UTC)
Agree, the dates don't make it. Besides, it seems there is another mexican university claiming it's oldest by 10 years. The official site makes no claims about that. So I am removing that claim. Asereje 08:23, 20 Jul 2004 (UTC)

After all the opinions, UNAM is the Oldest university in North America. Please see the maps, Santo Domingo and Perú are no in North America. Pedron 12:00, 12 October 2005 (UTC)

That's right, Santo Domingo is in the Caribean and Peru in South America.

According to UNAM historians experts the Pope never gave the title of "Pontificia", so it should remain as "Real Universidad de Mexico" as official former name. Which is even more remarkable and which separates it to the other eclesiastic university of Mexico that claims being the older and had in his name "Pontificia". By the way, in France the name "Cité Universitaire" is used for a Student dorms place which is like a small city just as in Mexico is the "Ciudad Universitaria" (in the sense that it is a small city, not in the sense that it is a student dorms place). However the term "city" in french comes from the late latin which means "village", therefore "city" in French is "ville", for example Mexico City is translated as "Ville de Mexico". Anyway, I think the best translation for "Ciudad Universitaria" is effectively "University City".

Please correct me if I'm wrong about the football team. Also, I concur with the statement that there is controversy about the title of being "oldest university in the Americas". San Marcos in Lima and the university in Santo Domingo also claim this honor. glasperlenspiel 18:15, Jun 17, 2004 (UTC)

Hi. I would like suggestions about how to translate "Ciudad Universitaria". Currently I use University City but I am unsure if Universitary City would be better. Is there a similar term in english-speaking countries? Thanks. Asereje 08:23, 20 Jul 2004 (UTC)

What do you mean by university city? If you mean a place where students live, then try "Student dorms", note this is a very american (as in USA) phrase, and is not used outside the US, however it will be understood. by the way, tomorrow when i have time i will come back and fix up the english on this page, i saw no mistakes as such, just lots of constructions that weren't natural (an example is the second sentence which frogot that in english unlike spanish you cant just use the verb "to be" with out a pronoun (spcefically it). And using reflexive pronouns where they would be needed in spanish but not in english. Great article though, thanks all for the translation work. The bellman 13:32, 2 Oct 2004 (UTC)
On reading the article more i think university city means university campus. The bellman 13:41, 2 Oct 2004 (UTC)
It is like this: The University used to be located in the downtown area of Mexico City, scatered in several buildings. In the 1940s (or was it 1950s?) a vast campus was built in the outskirts of the city and was christened Ciudad Universitaria, the City (Ciudad) in the name refers to the fact that it was something of a city in itself at the time, it was somewhat isolated from the rest of the city (that has since changed quite a bit), and thus had several public services of its own, such as a postal office, bank branches (although that's not a public service, but you get my meaning), etc. Today UNAM has several campi around Mexico City and elswhere, but Ciudad Universitaria remains the main and largest campus. I'm inclined to use University City as a translation, but it would require an explanation if that term is not really understood in english speaking countries. Suggestions? --Jsf 01:49, 12 Nov 2004 (UTC)
Hi, I'm new to editing etc. so please bear with me. The article is generally informative. I've just copyedited the strike section as a native English speaker, but please let me know if you feel I've changed the meaning. As far as Ciudad Universitaria goes, and as far as I understand it, it is not just a "normal" university campus as understood in the US or the UK, for example. The main difference is the autonomy referred to in the name, and mentioned (although without enough emphasis, in my opinion) in the article: it is almost a separate region within Mexico City, with its own regulations, councils, police (to some extent) etc., in a more fundamental way than most universities around the world. Law enforcement officials from outside the University are not welcome, and are not allowed to enter, although there would not be very much to stop them if they tried to do so -- it is just understood that they must not do so. I agree with Jsf that it's difficult to translate this idea -- it took me a while to get used to it. University City does not sound very idiomatic, but I agree that it is difficult to improve on. How about University Village, which is somewhat like olympic village. Not brilliant either. --Pruple 18:58, 14 Nov 2004 (UTC)
I think we would do better leaving it as is and adding a (literally: University City) after the name, if you really want to know wat is it, you are just going to have to read the paragraph and get used to the idea :-) --Jsf 01:24, 12 Dec 2004 (UTC)
Jsf and Pruple's comments above about the autonomy are correct. I tried to give in the article the idea that the campus is a lot more than that. I insist on the term because it is the official name: Ciudad Universitaria. Main campus would probably give the idea but miss a lot on the facilities (like the soccer stadium) that are targeted not only to students but to the rest of the population. According to [[3]], Ciudad Universitaria has a surface of six million square meters (a meter being a bit more than three feet). I wanted most of all a term as natural as possible to a native english speaker. If there´s no natural sounding way of translating the official name I would go for "main campus", but again, the name itself is widely used. It seems spanish-speaking countries use "Ciudad Universitaria" as "main campus", but I still believe is worth translating because the campus is a landmark in Mexico City and its size, as has been said above. Asereje 06:27, 12 Dec 2004 (UTC)

[edit] National University of Saint Mark oppinion

However the spanish name for university its national university of san marcos the most accurate translation to english it is National University of Saint Mark in honor from evangelist from the 1st century, although university in santo domingo indeed is the oldest, has been disrupted in many occations from operation, specially during tough years of independence during early 19th century. Saint Mark National University may not be the oldest in newly spanish conquered territories during the 16 th century, but it has been the only university on this continent (america) to have been since its stablishment in continuously operation without any kind of interrumption since the 16th century until nowadays.

[edit] What about the CGH strike?

There's no mention of it in the article. Perhaps it doesn't belong there, but it was a nationally covered event that deserves to appear somewhere in the Wikipedia. I think it was there in the first versions of the article. Asereje 01:03, 20 July 2005 (UTC)

Given the political implications of the whole thing (e.g. different political parties supporting different groups behind the scenes) I think it deserves to go in a new article, with a brief mention of it in the political climate section. -- Rune Welsh ταλκ 07:01, July 20, 2005 (UTC)
Well I definitly think is worth od mention. Although, if the article mention the CGH strike, it should also mentioned the 1968 CNH strike, which was larger and WAY more importante --Legion fi 07:10, 21 May 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Motto

"Por mi raza hablará el espiritu" had been translated as "Through my race will the spirit speak"... I have my doubts on this; It's not only the syntax but also "Por"'s actual sense... It's not like the race is a medium of communication, but that the spirit will speak on behalf of our race. In my opinion the proper translation is "For my race, will the spirit speak"... --Agurza 18:24, 21 July 2005 (UTC)

I disagree. If you go through a window in Spanish, you go "Por la ventana". In this context, and in my discussion with UNAM students while I was a student there, the "through" meaning was the most commonly understood. However, some students agreed with the "for" meaning. Maybe we can list both translations, as it is a little ambiguous in the Spanish language. What do you think?

--Richardmtl 20:20, 15 February 2006 (UTC)

Reading the official interpretation by the man who actually coined the motto (Vasconcelos) I'm inclined to think the "for" meaning is what is implied here. See [4] (In Spanish). -- Rune Welsh | ταλκ 21:37, 15 February 2006 (UTC)

I´m from Mexico City, I'm a student of "La UNAM" and it is meant to say "Through my race...." --Revolver42 05:57, 14 May 2006 (UTC)

The problem any one face when attempting to translate poetry is the intrinsic difficulty of the original language. I graduated from the UNAM and the idea of this short piece of poetry is that the SPIRIT will speak ON BEHALF of my race. The preposition "POR" in the motto is used in the sense of "in favor or on behalf of someone or something." "On behalf of my race the spirit will speak" would be the closest translation. Tomas Hernandez

Okey, another UNAM student here. Two things. First to Revolver42, YOU ARE WRONG. It is a shame that our beloved university has or had students like you. Second, as Run and "Tomas Hernandez" (btw, please sign your posts) mentioned, the meaning is "for". There is no doubt that is the way that Vasconcelos intended it. I support the "For my race, the spirit will speak" although I think it also could be "For my race shall the spirit speak". And another thing. That is not poetry. It is a methaphor. --Legion fi 07:08, 21 May 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Number of bachelor degrees

Source: [5] at the bottom. Note that "carreras" is the stat that matters. -- Rune Welsh | ταλκ | Esperanza 10:10, 10 October 2005 (UTC)


I would like someone to reflect that undergraduate is not quite the term that describes the level of the academic content that is acquire at UNAM. The academic rigor presented in the study plans is comparable to the MD of the US. Alejandra

[edit] The oldest?

I do not understand what is the matter of the discussion: Lima was founded in 1548, Mexico in 1551. Lima is in South America, Mexico is in North America. So, what is the point? Pedron 19:25, 12 October 2005 (UTC)

[edit] Vandalism?

Someone deleted the Undergraduate Studies part of the article?

[edit] Endowment

Is there a source for the endowment number? I am not an expert but, I thought that most of the school’s budget came from a yearly transfer of public money, I was not aware that UNAM had an endowment. If it has a 2 billion dollar endowment and it is invested at a conservative 5% real rate it receives at least 100 million a year from its investment. An important question is who made this endowment? 2 billion would put it in the league of several private US universities. For example UC Berkeley (a public university) one of the crown jewels of UC has an endowmwnt of 3.3 billion, only a bit more that what this article claims for UNAM endowment. --LS1010 23:28, 3 October 2007 (UTC)

UNAM doesnt have an endowment. Each year UNAM receives money from the goverment, each year ca 2 billion dollars. The guy didn't undestand the difference between endowment and budget. This university has more money that some of the ministeries of the goverment or some states in Mexico, like Tlaxcala. Fabrizzio 15 April 2008 12:48 —Preceding unsigned comment added by 201.141.127.1 (talk) 05:48, 15 April 2008 (UTC)

[edit] Campi vs. Campuses

While campi is the plural of the Latin word campus, the standard English plural for this word is campuses. I have changed headings and instances of this word in the article accordingly. Marco polo (talk) 16:15, 28 December 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Pumas Dorados de la UNAM Merger proposal

Pumas Dorados de la UNAM is small and, if it is to stand on its own, needs a rewrite. It's far easier to merge what little verifiable, encyclopedic content there is into National Autonomous University of Mexico#Professional football team. Comments? davidwr/(talk)/(contribs)/(e-mail) 15:12, 21 March 2008 (UTC)