Talk:Naporitan

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[edit] Neapolitan

What, if any, is the difference between this and Neapolitan sauce? Jpatokal (talk) 11:51, 19 March 2008 (UTC)

This dish is quite different from the Naepolitan sauce. The dish was inspired from US ration spaghetti and the chef named it 'Naporitan', because it was a city popular for spaghetti. This is not Italian Style spaghetti, but rather Americanized spaghetti that has been adapted for Japaneses' taste.Stevefis (talk) 02:13, 7 May 2008 (UTC)

The "Neapolitan sauce" article states that it is "the collective name given (outside Italy, particularly in the U.S.) to various basic tomato-based sauces derived from Italian cuisine, often served over pasta and then sprinkled with grated Parmesan cheese." Surely Japanese Neapolitan sauce also fits the bill? Jpatokal (talk) 04:16, 7 May 2008 (UTC)

Naporitan is different that it is originated from Americanized Spaghetti, not Italian Spaghetti. If you use your argument, then Marinara sauce would also be considered as Neapolitan sauce, but they are completely different sauce. Both of them are tomato-based (So does Naporitan), but they are completely different kinds of sauce. Besides, the original Naporitan was made using Tomato Ketchup, but the Neapolitan sauce are not made with ketchup. And Naporitan doesn't have the various herbs that Neapolitan sauce has. It is instead flavored with bacon, which is another proof that it is American influencedStevefis (talk) 10:16, 7 May 2008 (UTC)

I remain unconvinced. Sure, it's localized, but it's still a "basic tomato-based sauce derived from Italian cuisine" -- the Japanese article notes that, while the US army version was ketchup only, the original Japanese chef used tomato puree from day one.

I think we should do the same as the Japanese WP does now: merge them into the same article, and give "Naporitan" a subsection. Jpatokal (talk) 13:03, 7 May 2008 (UTC)

The definition for "Neapolitan sauce" is ridiculously vague: "the collective name given (outside Italy, particularly in the U.S.) to various basic tomato-based sauces derived from Italian cuisine, often served over pasta and then sprinkled with grated Parmesan cheese." By definition, just about any tomato/spaghetti sauce could be referred to as a "Neapolitan sauce". I would be more inclined to leave Naporitan alone (for now, at least) and focus on cleaning up Neapolitan sauce so that it is distinguished from other kinds of tomato sauce. CES (talk) 18:43, 7 May 2008 (UTC)

There are different kinds of Tomato sauces such Marinara and Marinara is definitely not 'Neopolitan' sauce. Stevefis (talk) 01:54, 8 May 2008 (UTC)

[edit] What should we believe, and why?

Stevefis, your argument above seems to be close to something that the article says: the dish was created by the general chef of the New Grand Hotel in Yokohama, when he was inspired by one of the military ration of GHQ, which was a spaghetti mixed with tomato ketchup. But the article precedes this with It is speculated that. Unless I misunderstand, the premiss for your argument is mere speculation.

Let's put aside for a moment the important question of whether mere speculation should appear in an article. The article also flatly asserts as fact: Naporitan is not originated in Italy, but instead in Yokohama, Japan. It gives no source for this assertion. The article as a whole does cite a book, and it's clear from what the author writes in the amazon.co.jp page for it that this is close to what she (he?) writes.

Neither this book or its bunkobon version is stocked by Tokyo metropolitan library, which does stock books about (psychological) depression by somebody with the same name. This is odd, as the library stocks a vast amount. I wonder why it doesn't stock the book.

Is Ueno a credible authority, and if so, how? What sources does Ueno cite for her (his) assertions about Naporitan? What distinction does Ueno draw between what she (he) states as fact and what she (he) reports as speculation? Can you not cite any indisputably authoritative sources on Japanese yōshoku?ナポリタン Once we know what the verifiable facts are, then we'll know whether or not to merge this article. -- Hoary (talk) 07:46, 11 May 2008 (UTC)

Thanks for your Point. As you know about Wikipedia, one man does not contribute to the article. I've created this page with basic information and some other people happen to add more information to it. Please look at the History section of the article. There is a Japanese version of this page Naporitan and I need to add more informations from this page. My Japanese is only at intermediate level, so it will take some time. Let's postpone the merging the article to the Neapolitan Sauce Article, because even that article is far from complete. If we merge it now, there will be more informations about the Naporitan spaghetti than the Neapolitan Sauce. Thanks for your opinion on this aritcle :) Stevefis (talk) 23:00, 11 May 2008 (UTC)