Talk:Moral Orel

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[edit] Did I miss something?

OK, I've seen that episode twice, and I'm still don't get it. Is it supposed to be a tongue-in-cheek social commentary or what? I cannot understand why Cartoon Network chose to hype this show. The promo gave me mixed signals: superficially it resembled a typical syrupy Christmas cartoon, yet I wondered if it was in fact some off-color parody of "Davey & Goliath". What I ended up seeing was this nauseatingly cheerful and deluded young "true believer" who thinks his hyperactive kid brother is Jesus, yet is oblivious to the complete meltdown of his nuclear family. Maybe I'm just being cynical, or maybe that was really the intent of the show to feel that way. Akira625 22:49, 31 December 2005 (UTC)

You aren't missing anything....it is heavy handed poorly conceived "satire". I don't even waste my time with it anymore.

This show is realy a downer. I just saw the first episode and I was shocked by the incredibly depressing ending.

  • It wasn't particularly funny or entertaining in any way. I'll be surprised if Adult Swim keeps this for long. karmafist 06:43, 18 December 2005 (UTC)

I thought this show was pretty good after i saw the first three epidodes. once you know what there talking about and looking at the plot will tell you why its funny, there was actually some really funny scenes.(The tay 06:26, 28 January 2006 (UTC))


I first saw this show last night, and it was the funniest satire I've seen in a long time. What it critiques is the same self-righteous, intellectually and ethically bankrupt, Protestant U.S. "Christianism" that Ben Folds sings about in "Jesusland." As someone who grew up in a similar household and who accidentally took Jesus seriously (i.e., it's all about radical love), I found the cartoon's portrayal of a puddle-shallow culture of repression and denial not only spot-on, but frighteningly funny. 130.126.200.104 22:51, 1 December 2006 (UTC) Mierek 4:51 PM December 1, 2006

Well when I saw the first episode I was like what the friggin heck is this but when I saw like a couple of more I started to watch and like it--Yowiki 23:10, 16 December 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Bias or Unbias?

Why is this entry in the form of personal opinion about the show's standpoint? It should be unbiased, which it seems to have some bias.

The author apparently thought it appropriate to use this article to demonstrate his political views. Right or wrong, they do not belong in the entry. Also, please sign your commments. --Orion Minor 09:11, 23 January 2006 (UTC)

I've read it several times, and I don't think its written in a bias manner. The only instance that could be: "The program centers around Orel who constantly tries to be good and lives by an exaggerated version of Christian morality. However he often misinterprets theology and this results in chaos." This would be a factual statement, since that is how the show is presented, with exagerated Christian morays, which eveything gets all mixed up. The first episode is a good example, when Moral decides to raise people from the dead for "spitting in the face of God", a clear exaggeration of the message.

Therefore, since everything is factual in the article, i would have to say that it is unbiased. --LordKrath, 3:34 AM, Jan 23, 2006

Did you check the history? Look there and you will see what caused the controversy.--Orion Minor 11:10, 23 January 2006 (UTC)

I apologize for the previous edit. I honestly didn't know there was a NPOV policy for Wikipedia but I'll be sure to stick to it from now on. My post was a reaction to other edits if you take a look in the articles history that were pretty much all conservative views. I did expect some of my comments to be edited mostly by people who didn't agree or simply wanted it to be from a NPOV (not knowing it was policy). I didn't expect it to be completely deleted but I guess it's understandable. I was hoping it'd be ok to still leave the following:

"The program was created as a social commentary that exaggerates real misinterpretations of chistian views on life, society, and god. To some, this program comes as a breath of fresh air while to others it is completely obscene, the only thing everyone agrees with about this show is that it's highly controversial."

I do still stand by comments such as "The show appeared as a social backlash to a recent social and political shift to the right in America." but I'll leave those for the discussion page from now on. --Lefty 2:58PM January 23, 2006

I would stress that the show lampoons not christianity in general, but a particular brand of protestantism: the characters mention being protestant again and again, and compare themselves favorably to Catholics. The creators of the show seem to know that christianity is much bigger than this one insular brand of it. -- GLF 10:21AM May 30, 2006

There are two main issues in the article that either count as bias or original research: 1. "Orel misinterprets theology." 2. "Most of the townspeople do not live the way a Christian is supposed to.... Christianity presented in the show is a jaded view of how Christians act today as opposed to how they are supposed to be setting an example of how to live." On the contrary to these points, from an objective point of view, the show mocks the actual literal tenants of Christianity itself. Humor arises because Orel interprets Christian dogma literally: he believes in actual omnipresence, he believes in the second coming, that the dead will rise again, etc. The show isn't about a failure to live up to a Christian ideal-- this is the bible. 24.56.219.31 (talk) 02:45, 2 June 2008 (UTC) p.s. if you want to link to a source citing the show's creator about his intent in support of a different view, that would improve things, but intent aside, from an objective point of view, the show simply mocks Christianity

[edit] ...AND BEWARE THE THEOCONS!!

Seriously's, this show is going to end up like The Book of Daniel (television), if no one defends it. Sweetfreek 01:53, 28 January 2006 (UTC) A badly written unwatched tv show?

I don't think this show will attract nearly the controversy that show has. This is being aired on cable very late at night. It's on a programming block that is typically ignored by anybody who isn't interested in adult-oriented animation. It's presented as comedy rather than a serious attempt at presenting Christianity in a different light. Whereas The Book of Daniel directly portrayed religious icons in a light that offended some, Moral Orel only portrays the followers of those icons (more specifically, the extremist followers) as being incredibly flawed. In any event, there wasn't much of a mainstream controversy over the portrayal of Jesus in South Park (or, for that matter, the portrayal of Satan in the same series). Jeff Silvers 01:29, 22 February 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Episode Summaries

I'm the one who's been adding these little summaries to the article (I've done 2 so far). I hope this is OK with everyone. I think if everyone likes them, they would probably look better in their own section, but I don't really know how to do that. I haven't done much editing besides little grammar corrections on various articles. I'm not registered here yet, but if I start contributing more I suppose I will create an account. EDIT: I finally registered! Your new Moral Orel Episode Summary Writer is: awesom-o 05:24, 6 February 2006 (UTC)

Registering is an excellent idea, particularly if you're going to edit a section of the site on a regular basis. As a registered user you can put Moral Orel on your watchlist, and you can sign the discussion page any time you make major changes. Incidentally your summaries are a lot more interesting than the show itself. It's possibly the worst thing on adult swim to date, but peversely it's so bad I looked it up to find out more about it. BronzeWarrior 08:10, 3 February 2006 (UTC)
I organized the episode summaries, I hope you don't mind. Anyway, IMO, I think the show is pretty funny. :) Yono 19:16, 20 February 2006 (UTC)

[edit] The Americas

"The globe shown in the opening credits is missing most of the North American continent, with the exception of the United States, and the entire South American continent."

Could we rephrase this so it makes sense? Does this mean that the globe only shows the United States of America in the Western Hemisphere?

In short, yes. Canada, Mexico, South America - all completely missing. The Eastern half of the world is intact, though. I just couldn't think of a better way to phrase it. - Someguy0830 (Talk) 06:03, 10 February 2006 (UTC)

How about "The globe shown in the opening credits is missing the entire Western Hemisphere, with the exception of the United States."

I take it that the creators of the series were trying to imply that the United States is somehow more important than the rest of the Hemisphere, or perhaps the entire world? At least that the sterotypical Christian thinks this? Captain Jackson 22:30, 10 February 2006 (UTC)

That works for me. - Someguy0830 (Talk) 22:45, 10 February 2006 (UTC)

If Christians think that the U.S is more important than the rest of the world, then how do you explain Christians who live in other countries? :) (Christianity wasn't started in the U.S., so how can all Christians believe this?) I think the artists were simply too lazy to put in the rest of the western hemisphere (Besides, the show takes place in the United States and they were probably showing the U.S only, for that reason.) 71.96.11.37 19:09, 6 April 2006 (UTC)

The show is meant to make fun of Christianity in this county, which tends to place undue importance on this nation. It's not a matter of laziness. - Someguy0830 (Talk | contribs) 21:50, 6 April 2006 (UTC)

I'm still not convinced. I have never heard the idea that Christians think America is more important than other countries. If America was the only country they cared about, then there wouldn't be such thing as missionaries (and there wouldn't be Christians living in other countries). Also, they showed Europe and the rest of the world, thus, the U.S. was not the only country on the globe, which in turn shows that they weren't implying that the U.S. was more important than the rest of the world. Again, I think the writers either made a mistake, or were simply too lazy. (or they might have meant something else)71.96.11.37 16:14, 7 April 2006 (UTC)

First off, the writers aren't the ones designing the props, so its not their mistake. Second, they took the time to make the rest of the world, so why not those specific regions? They obviously did so on purpose. This show exaggerates Christianity, which like it or not will tend to place undue importance on the country its based in. They're not saying that all Christians simply pretend those countries don't exist. Read the quote in Bias or Unbias? Honestly, I don't know why you're trying to argue against this. It's not going to change and it's not even mentioned in the article. - Someguy0830 (Talk | contribs) 18:28, 7 April 2006 (UTC)

I'm incredibly sorry, I did not mean to get on your nerves. You are probably right about the whole thing, and the only reason that I argued, was because I have never heard that Christians think the U.S. is more important than other countries. (maybe they do, but I have personally never heard that) You made a reasonable point, and I will accept that. Sorry again for wasting your time. (no seriously, I had no intent on angering you.)71.96.11.37 20:33, 7 April 2006 (UTC)

It's not a matter of anger, but rather of relevance. I notice you've been arguing similar issues in other articles. I just don't see the point here. The show is intended to make fun of Christians, some of whom don't tend to recognize the importance of other countries, particularly those with differing beliefs. - Someguy0830 (Talk | contribs) 21:02, 7 April 2006 (UTC)

I guess I got carried away! (again) Once more, I'm sorry for taking your time.

P.S. How did you know I had been debating similar issues on other articles? (did you see my signature on other articles, or what?)71.96.11.37 21:21, 7 April 2006 (UTC)

It's actually quite simple to track other users' edits. Someguy0830 (Talk | contribs) 21:44, 7 April 2006 (UTC)

That's somewhat creepy. Let's pretend this little thing never happened, ok? 71.96.11.37 22:40, 7 April 2006 (UTC)

Note that not all Christians think that America is the most important country. There are many many Christians in Canada, Mexico, Central and South America. Just that there is this thing for WASPs that tend to see the world as revolving around the USA and other countries are not as important.

I'm guessing they left out Mexico because Mexico is very well known for having many catholics, and in the show they are constently making fun of catholics. Also, most religious people tend to be more on the conservitive side and conservitive/right winged people tend to think America is perfect (see American Dad!) Uber Cuber 05:51, 15 January 2007 (UTC)

I think the ommission of most of the Western Hemisphere is a geopolitical jibe, not anything to do with religion -- just a simple reflection of US self-centeredness. It would make no less sense to me if Orel and his fam were atheists.Bustter (talk) 04:38, 10 January 2008 (UTC)

[edit] The Lost Commandments

I'm a bit confused on the addition of the "Lost" 19th commandment. I can't remember, "Thou shalt not masturbate," mentioned in the show. Ryulong 04:29, 29 May 2006 (UTC)

It's in their bathroom in one of the newer episodes. – Someguy0830 (Talk | contribs) 21:58, 29 May 2006 (UTC)
"Spare the Rod and Spoil the Choild" is in 'Love' at around 7:22, not sure though now if it's an actual lost commandment, any way to confirm?

[edit] Episode 10

The article has no information on "God's Chef" However the following website has a summary of it: http://www.toonarific.com/episode.php?episode_id=61726&show_id=7555

"In order to masturbate and still go to heaven, Orel hatches a hair-brained scheme that turns Moralton topsy-turvy."

Maybe they're making it up. Then again, it may be right. Point is, it hasn't aired. – Someguy0830 (Talk | contribs) 05:21, 3 July 2006 (UTC)
They're not making it up. FreakyMutantMan 21:09, 24 July 2006 (UTC)
We know that now. Didn't then, though the "Thou shalt not masturbate" commandment is a dead giveaway. – Someguy0830 (Talk | contribs)

[edit] No Criticism or Controversies Section?

It seems to me like anytime Wikipedia has an article on any person, thing, program, or institution that can be labelled as leaning towards a conservative viewpoint, there is (rightly) a subhead called Controversies or Criticism in said article. Brent Bozell has called the Moral Orel show the very definition of heavy-handed propaganda ("Going to church seems to disqualify you from being capable of love, charity and the slightest fraction of common sense"). Is there any reason there should be an absence of said sections in Wikipedia articles when they feature persons, things, programs, or institutions that can best be termed as leaning toward a liberal viewpoint? Asteriks 16:09, 6 January 2007 (UTC)

One thing is Adult Swim shows are primarily watched by males 13-25 and people who are high. (When Home Movies was still on this might've been less true) It's a little difficult to offend those groups. Still I might add a bit of controversy if I find a notable example.--T. Anthony 04:47, 2 June 2007 (UTC)
Yes, there is a grand liberal conspiracy which will make you disappear if you write one. They have black choppers. But you know what? I'm kidding. Nevertheless, let me tell you a story. I was browsing the web, when I bumped into the critisism page you are linking to. It listed several examples of events in the show and concluded that since none of them were funny, it's a bad show. However, I did find some of the events funny, so I searched for episodes at YouTube and Google Video finding some. Then I became curious if anyone had written any good critisism and came here finding none. So if you can find some critisism, which elaborates beyond "wasn't funny, I'm not like that" why don't you summarise it and add it to the article so I can read it. --Lakefall 20:26, 8 January 2007 (UTC)

'Criticism and Controversies' sections aren't really the sort of thing us conservatives put into articles. After all, it takes one viewpoint and inserts it into the article under the veil of neutrality, while at the same time solidifying it as 'valid' simply because it exists. ^_^

Are you saying you conservatives rather want other people to add your criticisms into Criticism and Controversies sections for you or are you simply disagreeing with Asteriks above, who seems to want such a section? Or are you conservatives declaring a War on Criticism to eliminate all criticism from the world in general and Wikipedia in particular? :-P I don't think Criticism and Controversies sections are a bad thing as long as the criticism in them is reasonable. If it's something utterly ridiculous and easily rebuttable and only kept there to soothe the other side then your point holds. --Lakefall 16:13, 7 February 2007 (UTC)
My point was we aren't as whiny as liberals. :p
If you can find criticisms of the show online, which I have no doubt you can, then add a section. I can't imagine anyone not welcoming the addition and I don't see why you bring the matter to the discussion page instead of just adding it. If you do so, you might want to include criticisms on qualitative grounds as well as philosophical ones. Since the show began, there's been about as many comments that it was poor satire or not funny from people who aren't offended as there have been comments that it was blasphemous from those who find it offensive. -- 22 February 2007

[edit] Religious animation?

I thought I was the only one who noticed that. But should this be considered "religious animation?" That would be like classifying Police Squad! under "crime dramas."

Agreed. SelfStudyBuddy 05:48, 17 June 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Episode guide as its own article

I'm in favor of making it a separate article, if a full second season appears. Replace the whole guide with a bulleted list of the episodes and original airdates. --SidP 02:36, 18 January 2007 (UTC)

I think that each episode should now have its own article. 136.186.1.190 04:41, 27 May 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Music

I believe the episode "Courtship" had music other than mark rivers if anyone canfirm this a note should be added to the music section. SelfStudyBuddy 05:08, 4 June 2007 (UTC)

I did a little research and I was right "Peter Blood" was featured his track you was used through out the episode. --SelfStudyBuddy 22:20, 20 June 2007 (UTC)

[edit] original research or unverified claims.

There is not one citation needed flag in this entire article, until there is citation needed flags, I am removing the original research or unverified claims tag. --SelfStudyBuddy 01:37, 26 June 2007 (UTC)

[edit] General Overview

The second sentence of this article has to be fixed. The show is simply rated TV-MA. To guess at how it got that rating reeks of bias. I'm too lazy to clean it up.