Talk:Miles Vorkosigan

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[edit] Separation

Due to expansion of the series, I feel like Ivan Vorpatril and Mark Vorkosigan should really get their own wikipages. They are major parts of the story but they are only around as sidebars to Miles. What do we think? Dachande 19:49, 31 January 2007 (UTC)

Now I am just going to do it and we can rebuild what doesn't flow well but I really think Mark and Ivan deserve their own pages. They are huge parts of the story, not just sidebars to Miles. Dachande 18:11, 21 March 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Picture

Miles has black hair and grey eyes. The guy on the cover of A Civil Campaign is therefore definitely not Miles. Needs a different picture. Is the one from SJGames useable?


  • It is not uncommon for the artist hired to do the cover to have not read the book, and therefore have no clue what the character is supposed to look like, etc. For instance, the cover of A Civil Campaign (a newer edition? The one I own has a Man in Parade red and Blues dancing with a blonde woman, which I presume to be Gregor and Laisa since the man is taller than the BLONDE Woman) the woman is too skinny to be the curvaceous and "plump" Laisa described in the novel. Dachande 18:09, 26 March 2007 (UTC)
No chance of getting the German picture from The Warrior's Apprentice?
http://www.dendarii.co.uk/Covers/German/twa_de.jpg
—wwoods 06:48, 27 March 2007 (UTC)
Funny, but not helpful/accurate
Actually, I think this picture illustrates quite nicely certain aspects of Miles' personality. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 64.107.217.135 (talk) 18:46, 7 November 2007 (UTC)

[edit] the future of the series

Attn: Tamfang

Hi, as best I can tell, you're the one who wrote "several more books apparently on the way" in this page. I think this is possibly an unwarranted assumption. Lois is happily doing other stuff now, as I'm sure you know. The most recent manuscript is in another new universe, and she still has two "Chalion" books to write. The last time I was reading the LMB list (trying to; a couple of people seem to have taken it over), she was expressing her weariness with all things Vorkosigan - especially all the fans who importune her to write more of it. She's also said that Ekaterin doesn't seem to want to be written about (OWTTE). Whether this means we'll never seen the long-dreaded demise of Aral or not, I can't really tell. I'm sure many would just as soon not, except that apparently might mean nothing else more, period.

I'm the one who made your realnym into an adjective on the list, BTW, if you're having trouble figuring out who I "really" am. :) --Tygerbryght 21:45, 1 February 2006 (UTC)

It wasn't me! The line about "several more books" has been there as far back as I can trace the page's history. — I'm an adjective? For what? —Tamfang 20:28, 2 February 2006 (UTC)
This may be a very long-range exchange. :) You (verbified) became an adjective for a post that includes multiple topics. Best I could do as an homage to show you weren't forgotten. — --Tygerbryght 06:39, 27 September 2006 (UTC)
I'm a verb and and adjective? Aw, that's the sweetest thing anyone's done for me since the "D.A.Sherwood Memorial Obtrusiveness in pad Award" on PLATO.
The reason for it, of course, was that I used to read mail offline and preferred to collect a day's worth of comments into a single mini-digest. —Tamfang 03:25, 28 September 2006 (UTC)
I didn't like The Curse of Chalion as much as The Spirit Ring, her first non-Barrayar (and non-Quaddie) book, so I haven't been motivated to read the sequels — but what's this other new universe? —Tamfang 03:28, 28 September 2006 (UTC)
I, too, feel that The Spirit Ring is severely underappreciated. And I didn't like CoC that wonderfully well on first reading, but it grew on me. However, IMO, Paladin of Souls is one of the very best things LMB has written. Some secondary characters from CoC are much more prominent in it, and we get a closer look at some things WRT the gods (best I can do sans spoilers). The Hallowed Hunt is set elsewhere in that universe (i.e., not in Chalion), and contains none of the same characters as the first two. It's good on its own, and has an entire set of religious beliefs/practices that appear to be unknown to the worshippers of the five gods back in Chalion, Ibra, et al (that astounded me). It's set in the far south, in colder climes. AAMOF, it pretty much stands alone in many ways. It makes me wonder if Lois isn't scared of getting trapped into another series. I hope not, as I really want to see two more books in the Chalion universe, featuring adherents of the other two gods. And could happily read endless books set in that universe; it's a fascinating place in its own way. She writes quite a bit faster than she once did. She could do it; the question is, will she? It can't be too much longer until both kids have finished their educations (if they haven't already), and the pressure to earn enough to pay for it is diminished.
I can't say what's up with the new series. I'm not on the list anymore, either. It reached the point several years ago that two people were dominating the list, and neither of them was talking very much about The Works of LMB. I should be getting a copy of the new book any day now. If I can remember, I'll come back and tell you what I think of it. :)
I do hope Lois will return to the Vorkosiverse someday. But when you look at it from her perspective, it had to get awfully boring to keep writing about the same set of characters, and she must have begun to wonder whether she had a career as a writer, or just a career as a chronicler of House Vorkosigan. Trying to see the view where she stands, I'd feel I had to prove to myself - if no one else - that I could write other things successfully. The more common measure of success as a writer is book sales. And it had to be a pain having all those people endlessly bugging her for more Miles books, as if she were a dope peddler or something. :-P
Further, I haven't felt as though Baen press had treated her very well in recent years. In some ways, she was responsible for a lot of the success of that company. With Jim gone, who can say whether she'd be treated better or worse than before? If she waits long enough, she can assert full control over all those books, and get a better deal on new editions - not to mention a *far* better deal for any new books in the series, if she ever writes any.--Tygerbryght 07:31, 3 October 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Ivan's title

"Although not an heir to a Countship, Ivan is addressed as Lord Vorpatril, rather than Lord Ivan (non-heir in a Count's Household) or just "Vorpatril", presumably because of his descent from an Imperial daughter." Ummm ... Miles had exactly as much Vorbarra blood in him as Ivan did -- they trace their lineage to the same grandmother -- and Miles was referred to as "Lord Miles" until his grandfather's death. Is there any actual reference in the books to him not being the Vorpatril heir? RGTraynor 19:58, 4 May 2006 (UTC)

Search for "Count Vorpatril". The Author says:
"In addition to the usual Count Vorlastname – Lord Vorlastname – Lord Vorfirstname sequencing for a Count and his immediate heirs, there are a slew of Lord Vorlastnames running around who hold their titles by virtue of being clan heads or for other, idiosyncratic historical reasons. Padma's father (and hence Padma and Ivan) may well have acquired this honor by virtue of marriage to Prince Xav's younger half-Betan princess daughter, or for some prior historical reason. There is a senior Vorpatril line, and a Count Vorpatril — I feel, in retrospect, that the Vorpatril liveried retainers we saw at the beginning of The Warrior's Apprentice must have been a courtesy loan from the Count to Alys. There are bunches and bunches of other Vorpatrils in line ahead of Ivan for that Countship; it is in the highest degree unlikely that he'll inherit it at any time, let alone soon."
Quibble: if memory serves, the mothers of Padma and Aral were sisters, daughters of Prince Xav, so Ivan and Miles do not share a grandparent. —Tamfang 20:18, 4 May 2006 (UTC)
Countess-Princess Olivia was Piotr Pierre's wife. As Tamfang says, her sister was Padma's mother. Lots about Olivia in A Civil Campaign. I believe there's also some discussion of her (by Aral & Mark) in Mirror Dance when they are having their talk (just before Aral's heart attack). Somewhere else (can't recall where), someone talks about what a mistake it was for the mad emperor to kill Olivia and not Piotr, as that inevitably led to Piotr's taking vengeance. Could it be the dying emperor in Barrayar? &mdash --Tygerbryght 07:00, 27 September 2006 (UTC)

I can't put my hand on it this moment, but didn't Ivan and Miles have a discussion at one point where Ivan was lamenting the fact that inheritence doesn't work backwards? The gist of the discussion was that he wasn't going to inherit anything interesting, but that at least one very old Vor (Count?) would inherit from him if he died.MilesVorkosigan 20:28, 4 May 2006 (UTC)

Sorry, that was the sort of challenge I couldn't resist. (Yay ebooks.) The Warrior's Apprentice, Chapter 18. Ivan's heir was Lord Vortaine, who wasn't in good health. Lord Vortaine's stuff would go to his daughter, and his titles to Count Vordrozda. -- Kazrak 21:01, 4 May 2006 (UTC)
That passage implies, by the way, that hereditary titles on Barrayar pass like ordinary property (albeit restricted to males), rather than according to descent from the first grantee. In RealLife™ it's easy to find cases where X had two titles and left them to different people, because X was the last descendant of the marriage that brought them together. When Miles asks Ivan "Who's your heir?", I'd expect Ivan to reply, "For what?" —Tamfang 00:27, 5 May 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Duv Galeni

Someone should create a section on Duv Galeni, who had fallen into Miles' orbit, and eventually became Miles' ward (Miles: "Contrary to what people believe, Duv is not my personal property!") Despite Miles' protestations, Duv and his career have become very dear to Miles (best evidenced in Memory).

  • There is a wikipedia page for Duv Galeni though it needs work to be worth anything. Dachande 17:14, 30 December 2006 (UTC)


[edit] Spoiler Alert Debate

Both TheFarix and I are quoting the WP:Spoiler as to whether Miles's page deserves a spoiler warning. I claim that since it is NOT about a story, and NOT labeled "Plot" there should be a spoiler warning since this page reveals a lot of plot about Miles. Wikipedia is based on concensus and I truly invite discussion on this. Please let me know what you guys think. Dachande 03:03, 23 July 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Fair use rationale for Image:Der Kadett.jpg

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BetacommandBot 06:57, 27 October 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Correction of Misattributed Reference

I have removed the statement that Tung has referred to miles as "skinny neurasthenic git," as this reference was to Gregor Vorbarra. Dan ad nauseam (talk) 06:00, 6 January 2008 (UTC)