Talk:Milan

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[edit] The map

The map doesn't show where Milan is, it just shows a municipality or something, but definitely not the location of Milan! 87.61.168.192 (talk) 19:14, 21 March 2008 (UTC)

No answers! :O —Preceding unsigned comment added by 87.61.168.192 (talk) 18:14, 27 March 2008 (UTC)

[edit] July 2005

>The city proper has about 1.3 million inhabitants (2004), but when including the surrounding conurbation totals more than 4.5 million. The >metropolitan area of Milan have around 6.5 million.

What is the difference between "surrounding conurbation" and "metropolitan area"? Do you mean the province with the former, and Lombardy-region with the latter? (because otherwise I don't know where the 6.5 comes from) I think that part of the article is a bit confusing.. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 81.221.133.157 (talk • contribs) 13:15, July 28, 2005

it's easy! the border of the city of Milano was decided 200 years ago, when the city had only 400.000 inhabitants. today inside the same borders there are 1.300.000 inhabitants, but the REAL CITY is bigger, and have a population on 4.500.000 of inahbitants. thats people live in Milano and in other 40/50 municipalities that are called the First and the Second Ring, or also the Grande Milano (the Big Milano). that's the CITY of Milano.
then, as in all the rest of the world there is the Metropolitan Area of Milano, that is not exactly definited and can have from 6.5 Millions if you calculate it with the German, Spanish and English way of the Metropolitan Areas, or more than 7.5/8 Millions if you calculate it with the French and American way for M.A. Milano is the 3° biggest city of Western Europe after London and Paris.
I'm Italian and maybe I can help you as regards the City of Milano... In my opinion we can consider the metropolitan area as a groups of 40/50 municipalities in the province of Milan (let's say Rho, Sesto San Giovanni and so on...).
In the article there is a list of footballers born in this Metropolitan Area... so I can understand that also Bergamo, Varese and all the major city of Lombardia are included. In my opinion it's too much!!! Maybe the list is not really correct: for example Paolo Rossi was born in Prato, near Florence; Franco and Giuseppe Baresi were born in Travagliato, a countrytown in the province of Brescia (more or less 50 miles from Milan...) and so on! --80.104.86.88 00:26, 20 January 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Figures

Milan (Comune) has just above 1.2m people now, it's urban area is not officially defined in Italy, but could be made up of the provices of Milan and Monza and a few more cities around it, that would add up to about 4.5 million. The statement that the urban area has 7+m in the introduction is far fetched and unsustatiated.

[edit] Name

The Article says that in the local Insüber dialect of Milan, the city is pronounced like in French and English, both are not correct. Although French is very similar in pronunciation and spelling,(so one, could let that pass) but the English comment is totally wrong. Since in Insüber you pronounce Milan, ME - LAWN. So that statement isn't correct.

Right, also one could point out that in Milanese, Milan is the only Masculine city in Italy. Milan is read with a stressed ash sound as the second vowel. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 84.69.238.147 (talk) 18:32, 22 January 2007 (UTC).

[edit] Cimitero Monumentale

A link to the article Cimitero Monumentale should also be included in this article. I could not find an appropiate category. --84.44.158.63 15:26, 28 November 2005 (UTC)

Actually I also think it should be appropriate to add something about our beloved Cimitero Monumentale, where the most important personalities of Milan lies. There we have folks like Alessandro Manzoni (that guy named as the most important italian romance writer), Alessandro Volta (that guy who invented the electric-battery) and all the Falk family (those who represented the most important industrial family of Italy for about one century)..and many others. And what can we say about the artistic relevance of the statues in the cemetery? Come on! Let's tell something abuot it. Well, if nobody add anything to this discussion in the next two weeks, I'm going to write something in the article.

[edit] Industries

Well, not all of the mentioned industries are from Milan. Alemagna and Motta are actually Swiss (Nestlè), and the main Italian factory is in Verona. Aermacchi is in Venegono, near Varese. Bugatti is, I believe, near Mantova. On the other hand, I added the largest Italian Bank (Unicredit) to the existing second-in-rank (Intesa). The largest Italian engineering companies (well, most of) are Milan-based.--UbUb 20:54, 28 June 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Famous Milan people

Who are the most famous peoples to come out of Milan or events that originated from this city...Thank you —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 58.168.234.176 (talk • contribs) 07:37, 23 July 2006 UTC.

This question is adressed in the article. If that's not enough, try the reference desk. --HughCharlesParker (talk - contribs) 19:20, 23 July 2006 (UTC)

Actually I can't see any adress in the article. Some famous Milan people are: Alessandro Manzoni (that is the most important Italian romance writher), St. Ambroeus and St Charles Borromeo(both adressed in the article, I hope), Giorgio Armani (stylist), Franco Baresi (Ac Milan historical great captain), Cesare Beccaria, Enzo Biagi, Silvio Berlusconi, Bettino Craxi, emperor Diocleziano, Giacinto Facchetti, Dario Fo (Nobel prize), Ugo Foscolo, Carla Fracci, Sandro Mazzola, Indro Montanelli, Giuseppe Parini, Gianni Rivera, Umberto Veronesi. And there are many others who lived for many years in Milan, or were born in some little village next Milan, or studied and worked in Milan, like: Alessandro Volta, Caravaggio, Stendahl, Leonardo da Vinci, (and many others). If nobody say something I'm going to add a Famous Milan people section in the article. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 87.25.66.5 (talk) 12:20, 9 October 2007 (UTC)

[edit] MILAN BOUNDARIES. LET'S NOT KID AROUND. THAT'S NOT RISIKO!

Come on. Let's cut off this 'metropolitan area' thing. It almost has got no meaning. Milan is Milan, and the cities near it are simply other cities! Monza is Monza, Brescia is Brescia and Varese is Varese. It's very reductive and in a way ridiculous to make these towns appear like they are PART of Milan Milan's got 1.3 millions of inhabitants, and that IS 'THE REAL CITY'. Its borders are quite visible. The ACTUAL city of Milan doesn't even cover entirely its municipal area, expecially in the southern and western part. North of Milan there's Brianza that is now the name of a new province: Monza-Brianza. If they considered themselves inhabitants of Milan they wouldn't have been asking region Lombardy administration for so many years to separate from Milan.

Come on! It's like if in Germany they would call Ruhr-community DORTMUND.

mos 82.51.163.106 23:36, 26 August 2006 (UTC)

Of course, all opinions welcome. --UbUb 14:04, 27 August 2006 (UTC)


also the wrong ones. Such as those at the top of the page.


the conurbation of Milan it was studied by different organisation (as ONU and Euristat and many different universities). unfortunally in Italy doesen't exixst still the classification of Urban area and Metropolitan Areas. so the exactley number of the inhabitants of the Urban Area are a little bitt different. from the 4.020.000 on Onu to 4.300.000 of different organisation. this is the Urban Area, the conurbation, the REAL CITY.

all the people that live in Milan well know that in the North and Eastern side of the municipality bonduaries is totally impossibile to know when the city of Milan end and when there's a new municipality. that happened also in the South-Western side (Corsico, Buccinasco, Assago) and a little bit less in the South-East (S.Donato, Peschiera...); but the north and the east are totally urbanizated.

i read that someone talk about the southern part of the city that is not urbanizated...there's a reason...there is the Parco Sud Milano that occupied the 33% of the whole surface of Milan Province.

and as someone wrote about Rhur and Dortmund, maybe he doesn't know that the Ruhr IS a Metropolitan Area, but whitout a central city, a dominating city. in the Ruhr there are 5 or 6 cities with similar population (around 500.000) and some dozens of others with less inabitants. all that is called as Ruhr Metropolitan Area. (around 7 Millions of inhabitants).

the same man that talk about Rhur, Milan and Risiko, DONT' KNOW that the 7 Millions of people that live in the Rhur M.A., are on a surface that is the DOUBLE for dimension of the same surface of the Metro Area of Milan (from Magenta to Bergamo and from Como to Pavia, with Milan in the middle), but in that area around Milan there are 6.5 millions of people, and in the Rhur area 7 Millions on the double of the surface!

in Germany all that is called Metropolitan Area, in Italy is called Risiko.

maybe for a long history of "Capanilismo", where every small city have a long history of war with the closest one.

so we can write that: the Municipality of Milan in the city bonuaries have 1.3 Millions. the Urban Area (the real city) have around 4.2 Millions. the Metropolitan Area have around 6.5 Millions.

if we use the French and the Usa way to calculate the Metro Area (the ones used for Paris, or NY or Los Angeles), the Metropolitan Area of Milan should be larger (from Novara and Vercelli to the Alpine Valley of Bergamo and from Lugano in Swiss south to Piacenza and Crema) and with around 7.5-8 Millions of people.

in that days the Italian Governement is trying to introduce the Metro Area in Italy. but it was just a Maquillage Operation. it will be just changed the name to the Provinces, that will be called Aree Metropolitane. but the bonduaries will be the same. so the crazy new Province of Monza, located at 11 km of city from Milan city centre will be NOT in the Milan Metro Area!

the same stupid thing will be happen in Napoli where all the part of the city that is under the Caserta and Salerno Provinces will be not inside the Metro Area of Napoli!

Monza is not crazy, its inhabitants feel like being MONZESI and not milanesi, that's all. Bergamo is another town, and so Varese and Como and Vercelli and so forth.

I think what they call MILAN METROPOLITAN AREA is more a LOMBARD METROPOLITAN AREA (or LOMBARD-PIEMONTESE-TICINESE...) as having included inside it so many important italian cities WE CANNOT ignore. And Milan lies in its southern part. It's not THE CORE of this urbanized area.

This is globalization.


Please watch this document: [1] and stop all the personal opinion about the metropolitan area. Wikipedia is an encyclopedia!!! --87.15.200.90 16:25, 29 November 2006 (UTC)

I agree that the Metro Milan issue should be dropped from this article! It is tiring and takes the focus away from a proper description of the city. Can someone please clean this article up and downgrade the self-boasting! A new and separate article on Metro Milan might be created (if this is an important issue) but, as the writer above alludes, this urban area in Lombardy includes so many important and historical cities that they cannot be lumped together in the article about Milan. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 66.183.217.31 (talk) 23:55, 22 January 2007 (UTC).
3rd biggest?!? Rubbish, it certainly isn't bigger than Moscow, London or Paris. Marky-Son 14:37, 1 May 2007 (UTC)
By the source reported above the Milan Metropolitan Area is the fourth biggest in EU after Rhur, Paris and London, if you include Moscow it is the fifth...--80.104.57.128 (talk) 16:40, 4 March 2008 (UTC)

[edit] recurring linkspam

Checking the contribution of the user who added the aboutfirenze link, I have noticed that a link to aboutmilano has been added to this page. Please see Talk:Florence#External_Links and decide for yourselves. -- Sergio Ballestrero 16:39, 16 September 2006 (UTC)

[edit] climate

who wrote that ironic chapter about climate? Calling Milan's climate subtropical is foolish, it's not more subtropical then Budapest or Winnipeg. It's subcontinental, and IN WINTER SNOW IS RARE due to urban heating, always rarer indeed, apart last year.

Calling Milan's climate subtropical is what climatologist usually do. I don't know if they are so ironic. --Fertuno 15:28, 19 November 2006 (UTC)
I totally agree with Basil II (the anonymous post)! Milan's climate is not subtropical and I really would like to see any evidence for that. Anybody who lived in Milan or in the Pianura Padana would simply laugh (or curse if they read it in winter)! A climate to be classified as subtropical must be influenced by tropical air masses and that does not occur in northern Italy. Milan has a climate similar to Munich o Zurich and I wonder if you will classify those cities as subtropical too... Dantadd 21:58, 20 November 2006 (UTC)
I cleaned up the section. --Fertuno 14:58, 26 November 2006 (UTC)
All across Italy Milan is considered a cold town, and every person from central or southern italy blames Milan for this, assuming that it's a place too cold to live in. Obviously they say that because they live in places very hot. But this reputation shows us that Milan is not hotter than the major part of Italy.

Milan is at the feet of the Alps. I live in Milan and I can go to sky by car in less than one hour, even in summer. Milan's typical dishes are based on butter, pork, fried meat, and potatoes. I wonder if there is one single other "Subtropical town" with such a traditional cuisine! Obviously our ancestor needed calories! Milan is only 30 Km from Swiss. Do you assume that there is a part of Switzerland with a sub-tropical climate? The climate of the inner old town is maybe "subtropical" because of the great pollution levels (that sadly is about to be the worst of all Europe). But if we talk about the metropolitan area, as we do in this article, we must regard that the boroughs next Milan, especially in the north, are always 3-6 degrees lower than downtown. It is not a little difference. Finnally I think we should talk about pollution in "piana padana" in this section. ..And say also something about global warming. (Do you realize that a town at the feet of the alps is now "subtropical"??) —Preceding unsigned comment added by 87.25.66.5 (talk) 17:26, 10 October 2007 (UTC)

I too have a problem with the "subtropical" (I lived in Milan and, yes, to me it is continental). However, have a look at the Koeppen classification for a description of Humid subtropical climate. It states winters can be cold and the climate of all of the the piana padana (Padan plain) is similar (i.e. the "same") to parts of Argentina- Uruguay, the South-eastern U.S. (from Texas to Georgia and Washington), much of Japan, and other parts of the world. These are not necessarily subtropical places. It's a poor choice for the name, but the Milan article can be clear about this. I think the global warming part added is POV and should be removed (it's in fact irrelevant, since the classification is for not just for Milan but most of the Po valley all the way to the Adriatic... see here). On another note, summers in Milan are VERY hot- mostly because of the humidity- generally moreso than the rest of "Mediterranean" Italy. Mariokempes 18:34, 10 October 2007 (UTC)

Apart from climate definitions, the temperature statitics do not look right for summer: an average low of 15 celsius in June, July and August it's so far from what I have experienced all my life! it's usually much higher, very humid, with real feel higher still, at night also. Again apart from scientific definitions of MIlan's climate, what you experience are temperatures much higher than Munich or Zurich: actually the Alps are Italy's protection from cold winds blowing from northern Europe and Milan also benefits. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Theinsighter (talk • contribs) 22:11, 30 March 2008 (UTC)

[edit] The Sforza Horse

Where is it? I'm not seeing any articles on the recent completion of the horse. Would someone be kind enough to write one? --Valdrone 16:31, 16 December 2006 (UTC)

[edit] The Celtic name

I strongly doubt that a Celtic name "Medelhan" ever existed. I've found it only in non scientific texts but never in linguistic articles on Celtic languages. The only name attested is, as far as I know, Mediolanum, which was latinicized, but the Celtic form could be quite similar (something like *Mediolanom). --Vermondo 15:53, 21 February 2007 (UTC)

[edit] The culture

I added some words about La Scala (should be useful citation of Cannobiana ad Carcano) and some others roman ruins and monuments...but my English is too bad to add some other :-) Should be useful add something 1-about the modern theatres (The "Piccolo" founded by Strehler and Grassi) and the DarioFo ' one (Nobel prize) 2- and TV (f.i. the RAI -public broadcast company now in Rome, but founded in Milan) adn actually hosts mediaset) regards L --Lorenzo Fratti 14:06, 17 May 2007 (UTC)

I don't know if it is "culture" or simply an "habit". But why not add something like: Milan is the second european town, after Wien, in rubbish paper ricycle. Milan is the Italian city with more voluntary associations and charity works. and so on. Once upon a time someone regarded to Milan as the Moral Capital ("capitale morale") of Italy! Davide —Preceding unsigned comment added by 87.25.66.5 (talk) 23:54, 3 October 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Milan and Ferrari

Sorry in advance. It is the first time I'm writing to Wikipedia, hope I'm doin'it the right way. My question is: what does it mean "Milan is also famous for the Ferrari, Fiat and Alfa Romeo motorcars" ? Only Alfa Romeo is located in Milan Area and it is historically from Milan. Ferrari is from Maranello far from Milan in another region of Italy (Emilia) as well as Fiat which is based in Torino (Piemonte).They cannot be related to Milan (and no one in Italy does)even if you consider the wide urban area, they are outside Lombardia.Thank you

You are correct and this has been removed. Mariokempes 16:09, 18 May 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Milan Train Station

I'm trying to find out more information on the main train station in Milan. When I first got off the train and saw it, I knew immediately that it had been built during the facist era, and then I took this picture of the exterior sign, which confirmed my suspicions. However, I'm trying to find out what the removed part of the sign says--the only part I can really make out is "fasci". Anyone have any ideas? I personally think this is an interesting bit of history that should be included in the article--I can't be the only one wondering about this. Kari marie 14:45, 23 September 2007 (UTC)

Curious synchronicity! Three days ago I photographed the very same inscription. I hadn’t noticed that there was an erased Fascist version, but was curious to see that it was giving an inaugural date in the Christian era, while at the two sides of the façade (or at the front ends of the two sides of the building) the date is given in the Fascist era: AN IX next to a bas relief of the fasces.
I can’t make out much from your picture—and given the light last Wednesday morning around 11.00 am I’ll be very surprised if I can see any more in mine when I get the film developed. But beneath the ‘O’ of ANNO there is an ‘X’ and probably the letter to its left is an ‘I’. The letters beneath the XXI DELL might conceivably be ‘ERA DEI’
—Ian Spackman —Preceding signed but undated comment was added at 13:26, 30 September 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Milan Castle

I think we should use the castello sforzesco jpg of the french wiki-page. It shows the back side of the castle, the one original, (the front has been resteured in 19th century). Finally the "french pic", that shows also a portion of the park, is maybe more beautiful.

[edit] Smiling

Include this, mention it?

Introduce with something like: the denizens of Milan are generally cheery and smiling, in fact smiling is usually compulsory.

"In Milan, it is a legal requirement to smile at all times, except during funerals or hospital visits"

So says http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk/7081038.stm

Thoughts? --81.105.245.251 03:21, 7 November 2007 (UTC)

funny :) Mariokempes 23:02, 8 November 2007 (UTC)
That is probably the stupidest thing I've ever read. --Gspinoza (talk) 17:59, 29 January 2008 (UTC)

[edit] The Cathedral

The article states that the cathedral is the second largest church in Italy. Is that really true? St. Peter's Basilica in Rome is larger but not in Italy. 213.66.209.52 (talk) 21:12, 25 December 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Map

The map in the first box represents the Province of Milan, but it should represent the City. Could we use the same map of Rome, with the correct coordinates? Paolotacchi (talk) 16:03, 31 January 2008 (UTC)

You're right, but unfortunately a map showing the position of Milan in Italy like the map of Rome do not exist... --Conte di Cavour (talk) 15:03, 2 February 2008 (UTC)

Done :-) --Conte di Cavour (talk) 16:24, 2 February 2008 (UTC)

[edit] First Picture on the Page

I think the first picture on the page should be a larger view of Milan rather than of a cathedral. Does such a picture exist which we could use instead?

Zerstoren

[edit] Language

I erased the part which says that immigrants are able ti speak "milanese". Milanese it is a language near to the death, absolutely not speaked by the young peole, morver not by the immigrants. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 160.220.151.48 (talk) 13:57, 27 May 2008 (UTC)

[edit] Milan of the future

I deleted the "European Library" project as for the moment being no fund has been given nor proposed for its realization; will come back to this as soon as something moves on.