Talk:Metempsychosis

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"In India we may explain the whole phenomenon as an infusion of the lower beliefs of the non-Aryan conquered races into the higher religious system of their Aryan conquerors. " deleted this. not appropriate at this time. also correcting the notion that karma is the character. this is nonsense.

also deleting: "Outside the somewhat narrow circle of theosophists there is little disposition to accept the doctrine but it may be worth while to point out that there are two fatal objections to it. " as in modern times reincarnation is a far mor popular idea"

kh7 10:22 Mar 25, 2003 (UTC)

Contents

[edit] Merger notice

Unless there are objections. I will merge this article with the one we have on reincarnation, the exact same topic. RK 18:24, Sep 4, 2004 (UTC)

Keep a redirect --and don't drop any stitches! Wetman 18:29, 4 Sep 2004 (UTC)

[edit] Differentiate article

There is a very clear distinction between the concepts of Metempsychosis and of Reincarnation as explained in the "The Columbia Encyclopedia".

Transmigration of souls or metempsychosis (mtm´´sk´ss) (KEY) [Gr.,=change of soul], a belief common to many cultures, in which the soul passes from one body to another, either human, animal, or inanimate. (in The Columbia Encyclopedia, Sixth Edition. 2001-05)

Most of the material of this article was collected from material "rejected" in the reincarnation article. --212.113.164.104 20:53, 28 November 2005 (UTC) GalaazV

The reason most of the material was rejected was probably because it was unsubstantiated - I suggest we re-merge the two articles again. GourangaUK 11:48, 22 May 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Removed stuff

I removed this from the article:

IN REGARDS TO WHAT IS STATED ABOVE, AND "BEYOND" EDITING IT APPEARS: METEMPSYCHOSIS REFERS TO THE EXPERIENCE OF THE TRANSMIGRATION OF THE SOUL, AND IS INSEPERABLE FROM THE DOCTRINES OF REINCARNATION. WE MUST AVOID TOO MANY CLINICAL HARD EDGES IN REFERENCE TO THE MOVEMENT OF THE SO-CALLED SOUL FROM ONE PLACE TO ANOTHER. REALLY. -WEST GOMEZ

Melchoir 04:20, 21 January 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Unsubstantiated information

I am removing the following passage because it is clearly false:

There is no authority in any of the sacred writings of Eastern religions for such a belief as metempsychosis into other animals. The only semblance to such an idea is found in the Kathopanishad (Chapter 5, Verse 9) which says that some of the souls, according to their deeds, return to the womb to be reborn, but others go into "the motionless", which is interpreted by some that they may reincarnate down even as low as the minerals. The Sanskrit word used in that place is "Sthanu", which also means "a pillar" and it is similar to the passage in Revelation that says: "Him that overcometh, I will make a pillar in the house of my God, thence he shall no more go out." This passage is regarded in Esoteric Christianity with the meaning that when humanity has reached perfection, there will come a time when they will no longer be tied to the wheel of birth and death: that is, liberated from the "rebirth" cycle (or "motionless").

See evidences from Eastern scripture below:

  • "When one dies in the mode of passion, he takes birth among those engaged in fruitive activities; and when one dies in the mode of ignorance, he takes birth in the animal kingdom." (Bhagavad-Gita 14.15)

http://bhagavadgitaasitis.com/14/15/en1

  • "At the time of death, the King saw that the deer was sitting by his side, exactly like his own son, and was lamenting his death. Actually the mind of the King was absorbed in the body of the deer, and consequently -- like those bereft of Krishna consciousness -- he left the world, the deer, and his material body and acquired the body of a deer. However, there was one advantage. Although he lost his human body and received the body of a deer, he did not forget the incidents of his past life." (Srimad Bhagavatam 5.8.27)

http://srimadbhagavatam.com/5/8/27/en1

For a summary of the full story regarding Jada-Bharata Maharaj see the followng link: http://srimadbhagavatam.com/5/8/summary/en1

GourangaUK 11:19, 22 May 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Reason for reversion

The recent edit by User:GourangaUK directly contradicts what I've read on the subject of metempsychosis (for a text reference, see page 15 of Hamel, F. (1969) Human Animals, Werewolves & Other Transformations. New Hyde Park, NY: University Books.). Metempsychosis certainly includes non-human forms. Please do not go back to GourangaUK's non-animal version of metempsychosis unless you can cite a published source supporting that view.

In Reply - You are correct that I'd got the wrong end of the stick originally on the actual meaning of the phrase. However, you must admit that this page was full of irrelevant information. After some research I've re-amended the page to give as clear a definition of the term as I could muster. I obviously welcome any improvements or comments for the article in order to expand it further, although much of the topic is already explored in some detail on the reincarnation and transmigration pages. GourangaUK 14:49, 25 May 2006 (UTC)
Thank you - Thanks for gracefully re-editing. I'd love to expand the metempsychosis article, but I've currently got my hands full with my current projects. Maybe later. Blue Milk Mathematician 23:24, 31 May 2006 (UTC)

[edit] GourangaUK's edit

Metempsychosis is the belief that after death the soul begins a new cycle of existence in another human body. It rejects the concept that a 'human soul' can take re-birth in that of an animal body.

[edit] The original text that GourangaUK deleted

Metempsychosis is a doctrine among some followers of Eastern teachings which expresses a theory of transmigration, that the human spirit may incarnate from one body to another, either human, animal, or inanimate, which is very different from the doctrine of reincarnation, which holds that man is an evolving being progressing through repeated human embodiments.

Blue Milk Mathematician 04:10, 24 May 2006 (UTC)

Hello BlueMM - I had changed the introduction based largely on the definitions given on these two links from the online dictionary:
Google Definitons Following this link do you think it would be more accurate to say Metempsychosis is the Greek concept of transmigration?
Otherwise what would be the difference between the terms 'Metempsychosis' and 'Reincarnation'? Reincarnation simply refers to 'taking re-birth in another body', the whole sentence regarding evolution of a soul is a point of view . Best Wishes, GourangaUK 08:57, 24 May 2006 (UTC)

[edit] etymology of metempsychosis

Can someone describe metempsychosis in terms of its constituent parts of speech? The word would make more sense to English speakers if the parts meta + psycho + osis were taken individually and explained separately. That way, we could understand what on earth the Greeks meant by the word they coined. Are there similar words, like katapsychosis and parapsychosis?


[edit] Metempsychosis in popular culture

The word appears in Molly Bloom's question to her husband, Leopold, in James Joyce's seminal modernist novel, Ulysses. In this multi-layered novel, at one level, Leopold's matter-of-fact and accurate response indicates that the ancient Greek hero's spirit resides in this most typical of modern men, a bumbling, cuckolded, seller of advertising copy.

'Metempsychosis' is the name of the last stage of the video game Ikaruga. The stages are Ideal, Trial, Faith, Reality, Metempsychosis, then Spirit Being.

Omega Metempsychosis is the name of the boss at the climax of Chapter 8 in Xenosaga III. The significance is that the boss itself is a combination of the bodies of Omega Res Novae, Abel, and Dmitri Yuriev; or more accurately Yuriev's transmigration into godhood.

'Metempsychosis' is the meaning of 'Tensei' in the Japanese series of role-playing games, Megami Tensei. The full title translates to 'Metempsychosis of the Goddess'.

In the video game Soulcalibur III, upon entering a battle against Zasalamel, a character seeking to free himself from an endless cycle of reincarnation, the announcer will sometimes say, "After countless lives, he challenges the chains of metempsychosis."

In the short story 'Angelic Butterfly' by Primo Levi, he refers to "Physiological Foundations of Metempsychosis". This is a chapter in a study that proposes that all animals possess that ability to transform like a butterfly.

"Infinite Jest" by David Foster Wallace, features a hypnotic late-night radio DJ named Madam Psychosis.

PLEASE NOTE. I was unable to verify the bulk of this material, much of which is both dubious and highly trivial, and all of which lacks any kind of reliable sources. Listing every minuscule mention of "metempsychosis" in a book or film IS NOT A GOOD THING AND WEIGHS DOWN THE ARTICLE. As a compromise measure, I have moved this unsourced section here, to talk page, so that it is not "lost" in the edit history shuffle. Please do not re-insert this material without providing the reliable sources deemed necessary by WP:V policy and carefully consider whether or not the material you are reinserting is actually going to be an improvement. Thank you, Burntsauce 17:57, 10 October 2007 (UTC)