Wikipedia talk:Media copyright questions

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This is not the page for asking questions.

Please ask questions at Wikipedia:Media copyright questions.
This page is for discussion of the page itself, and the associated process.

Contents

[edit] 1

Well, I think this page has a shocker name, but it's a bit late now. Just a small reminder to please direct users with freely licensed images to the Commons:. Wikipedia:Commons contains some useful information about how image policy and handling between here and there differs. pfctdayelise (translate?) 10:40, 5 April 2006 (UTC)

I agree on the name too :-p, but hey, I didn't make the page. And we do remind people about Commons: :) --Admrb♉ltz (T | C | k) 16:45, 5 April 2006 (UTC)
I made the page, based on a discussion elsewhere, but I'm not really sure I like the name either, it's not necessarily too late to change it though, just a few templates etc. What are some ideas for a better name? I don't like the word legality because it might imply actual legal advice which we certainly aren't giving. Anyway, if people come up with a good name I don't think it's that hard to change. - cohesiont 18:14, 5 April 2006 (UTC)
Image copyright questions? Are you restricting to images only? Media copyright questions? Just copyright questions? pfctdayelise (translate?) 23:15, 5 April 2006 (UTC)
We would handle other media also, not just images, so media in the name is probably a good idea. - cohesiont 05:14, 6 April 2006 (UTC)
Ok, I'll give it a few more days for responses, then change it to Wikipedia:Media copyright questions, unless another idea comes up :) - cohesiont 17:14, 7 April 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Media can now be undeleted

Just to let everyone know that works on this page. See [1]. It only affects media deleted after the change, which is about 4:30 UTC 16 June. Yipee! - cohesion 05:13, 17 June 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Archiving

Does anyone object to User:EssjayBot II archiving this page? Say discussions over a week old, every week. —Simetrical (talk • contribs) 00:20, 15 August 2006 (UTC)

Yes please, reply also on talk page. - cohesion 07:24, 28 November 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Anton Corbijn- how to tag?

I have shrunk and reloaded one of his images. Then I got a message from ophanbot. Do we attribute his images some way other than fairuse?

Thanks, :) Dlohcierekim 12:56, 22 August 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Category?

This page badly needs a category. Does anyone know the appropriate category for this page? --Siva1979Talk to me 05:23, 31 August 2006 (UTC)

Done. This page is now under the category Wikipedia copyright. FL(some restrictions apply) 22:16, 29 January 2008 (UTC)

[edit] How to delete images?

I can't seem to find an article detailing how to delete an image. Let's say I uploaded an image in error and I have no intention of replacing it, how would I go about eliminating said image?

Or is it automatic?

There are three main methods of deleting an image.
  1. Become an administrator.
  2. Beg an administrator to do it for you.
  3. Place a speedy-deletion tag on the image - I recomend the {{Db-noncom}} tag.
Jecowa 04:41, 19 November 2006 (UTC)
    • Thanks :) --Jecrell 06:06, 19 November 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Building a flow chart to aid the process for new users

I'm currently building a prototype flowchart at User:Megapixie/CopyrightFlowChart in an attempt to reduce the number of "I have no idea" beginner questions. Feel free to tweak - but if you want to make any major changes please let me know at User talk:Megapixie/CopyrightFlowChart. Megapixie 04:24, 9 February 2007 (UTC)

Good luck. I tried to make one once, but got bogged down trying to build a series of questions that would let anyone distinguish between a free-license image found on a website, a fair-use image found on a website, and an unusable image found on a website. --Carnildo 05:36, 9 February 2007 (UTC)
Do I know for sure that the copyright to this image belongs to the website's operators? If no, unusable. If yes, does the website specify licensing terms that allow for commercial and derivative use? If yes, free license. If no, do I need to talk about this particular image for an article? If no, unusable. If yes, check the current conditions at Wikipedia:Fair use. Jkelly 05:45, 9 February 2007 (UTC)
If you do manage to make a visual flow chart - I think it'd be a really useful addition to the uploads page. --Peta 06:19, 9 February 2007 (UTC)
It would probably be too big and too complicated with too much text to make it useful on the upload page. But then again - you never know. I'll finish doing a text version (that everyone agrees on) first. Megapixie 07:38, 9 February 2007 (UTC)
I agree, it'd be too complicated. Compare Commons:Image:Decision Tree on Uploading Imagesv2.svg, an attempt at an ultra-compact tree that doesn't cover fair use. ×Meegs 12:29, 9 February 2007 (UTC)
Thanks for pointing that out. I was trying to go for using less technical language as well, which is always more verbose. Feel free to dive in and make changes. Megapixie 12:59, 9 February 2007 (UTC)
"Licensing terms that allow for commercial and derivative use" seems to be too complicated for most people. Likewise, the large number of Creative Commons licenses is a major problem -- people can't tell the difference between CC-BY-SA and CC-BY-NC-ND. --Carnildo 20:24, 9 February 2007 (UTC)
You could probably use graphics. For instance: "If the Flickr image license contains or , it cannot be uploaded to Wikipedia."↔NMajdan•talk 21:39, 9 February 2007 (UTC)
I've been thinking about this for a while now and I believe it would be difficult but doable (both designing a user-friendly and comprehensive wizard as well as the technical implementation.) —Ruud 22:22, 9 February 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Copyright flowchart alpha test at User:Megapixie/CopyrightFlowChart

Before I add a link at the top of the page to the flowchart - could a few people have a critical pass over it. I'd rather make any neccesary substantial changes now, before attracts any attention/traffic. Thanks. Megapixie 04:49, 13 February 2007 (UTC)

I see a few problems in the flowchart:
On User:Megapixie/CopyrightFlowChart/InternetImage
  • " is the image the work of the US Federal government or its armed services?" - many people have trouble distinguishing between the various levels of US government. I'm not sure how to fix this.
  • " does the website the image is from have a copyright disclaimer allowing you to download and use the image?" - Very few people will get this one correct. "Copyright disclaimer" is vague, and people often don't know how to find it.
User:Megapixie/CopyrightFlowChart/WebsiteDisclaimer
You're asking people to make some very tricky judgement calls here. People have trouble telling who the copyright holder is, or what the copyright disclaimer allows. I've recently had problems where someone has interpreted Flickr's "this image is publicly viewable" tag as meaning "this image is in the public domain", or interpreted a website's copyright-grab ToS as being a free-license grant. You should split this up into a series of concrete yes-or-no questions, such as:
  • Is this an unofficial fan site or news site? - leads to 'probably not fair use; ask on Media Copyright Questions if you want a second opinion'.
  • Does this website have the phrase "some rights reserved" in the copyright statement - leads to a page on telling Creative Commons licenses apart.
  • Does this website have the phrase "personal use" in the copyright disclaimer? - leads to a page explaining that Wikipedia is not personal use.
User:Megapixie/CopyrightFlowChart/NotFairUse
You should split this out into separate pages for each question that can lead here, and include the reason why the image isn't fair use. People are more likely to do the right thing if they are told why it's the right thing.
User:Megapixie/CopyrightFlowChart/GoodWebsiteDisclaimer
Too vague. You can't put a {{cc-by}} on an {{attribution}} image, or vice versa. This page, however, implies that you can.
The pages covering the easy cases of fair use look quite good. --Carnildo 07:45, 13 February 2007 (UTC)
Thanks for the feedback (and tweaks other people are doing) - I'll attempt to tweak it tonight. If anyone else can see anything - please either fix it or make a suggestion here. Be bold people. Megapixie 08:38, 13 February 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Misdirected questions

Is it just me, or has there been a particularly high number of misguided questions ("mould problem", "The New Amerie Album", "How many humans die in ayear?")? My guess is that a new link to this page was added somewhere which users are now following. Is there any way to check this out? ShadowHalo 04:42, 25 February 2007 (UTC)

The other possibility is that it's hit the top of a Google search for some term. --Carnildo 08:57, 25 February 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Tweaked User:Megapixie/CopyrightFlowChart based on feedback

I've attempted to address some of the concerns raised above, and I've added a lot more branching. However some of the pages could do with fleshing out a little more. I would appreciate it if someone could give it another once over. If it's okay - I'd like to add a link at the top of the page to it (experimentally) to see if it answers users questions (though it might be hard to track). Megapixie 13:02, 27 February 2007 (UTC)

I've changed the page that "no" links to on User:Megapixie/CopyrightFlowChart/CheckGFDL to one directing people to ask on Wikipedia:Media copyright questions. If they reach the CheckGFDL page, and there isn't a GFDL release, then it's more likely that the image is under simple copyright than under a free license. --Carnildo 22:00, 27 February 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Questions by User:NAHID

I'm sorry if I brought NAHID's questions to the wrong place. They were flooding Wikipedia talk:Image use policy, so I brought them here. I know that they are not entirely traditional copyright questions. I hope it is appropriate. --Iamunknown 15:59, 1 March 2007 (UTC)

Perhaps in a case like this, with so many similiar questions, all the user's questions, and the answers of others, should go on his talk page. That avoids needless clutter of a heavely used page. Once on his talk page, its up to individual people, to decide if they wish to read/answer the questions. --Rob 04:59, 5 March 2007 (UTC)
Probably a good solution. The next question of the Nahid's questions I answer, I'll move directly to his/her talk page, and note that I'll be answering any further questions there and also that I'll watch Nahid's page. Is that appropriate? Would anyone else consider watching Nahid's talk page? --Iamunknown 06:00, 5 March 2007 (UTC)
I'll watchlist it too. ShadowHalo 08:11, 5 March 2007 (UTC)

Did you change your mind? ShadowHalo 22:02, 7 March 2007 (UTC)

No, I must have forgot about my idea. I still would like to do it. Sorry. --Iamunknown 22:57, 7 March 2007 (UTC)

[edit] FAQ for this page?

Anyone think it would be a good idea to add a FAQ to this page, similar to WP:VPT? It should only handle simple things and perhaps explains the first steps of fair use and their questions (Why is it replaceable?). I'd be happy to work on it, but I would definitely need help in putting some of the "common" questions on there. Here's what I can think of:

How do I add a license to an image?
Go to the image description page. Click on "edit this page" and add the appropriate license.
Where can I see all the licenses?
See Wikipedia:Image copyright tags
Why can't I use this fair use image for this person/building/place?
The fair use criteria #1 is replaceability: An image of something that could be replaced. It does not matter if an image currently exists to replace that fair use one.
I got permission to upload this image to Wikipedia, how do I license it?
We don't want or allow images that have been given permission for just our use. We want images for everyone to use. Please do not upload an image with this permission.

Or if there is a FAQ on images somewhere already then we could just link to that. --MECU≈talk 12:04, 24 March 2007 (UTC)

Seems like that would be fine, most of the messages sending people here at least attempt to explain the problem, but people find this page in other ways. I think we have plenty of real-estate at the top of the page to work with. - cohesion 03:01, 30 March 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Archiving

I'm switching to miszabot for archiving, and going to move the archive names a little, nothing drastic, but I thought I'd mention it somewhere :) - cohesion 01:35, 2 April 2007 (UTC)

I just changed the archival settings to archive sections older than 7 days. It appeared after a cursory glance at some of the older sections that issues are usually resolved before 14 days. Feel free to revert or change. --Iamunknown 06:48, 20 April 2007 (UTC)
I think 14 was the default for the bot that used to do it maybe, so it was kinda arbitrary :) 7 seems better, you're right. - cohesion 12:34, 20 April 2007 (UTC)
Its always better IMO to start out conservatively. Hopefully 7 will keep the page a bit less cluttered. --Iamunknown 14:21, 20 April 2007 (UTC)

[edit] What the...?!

In the last few days I've received messages from on high telling me that practically every image I've ever uploaded is about to be deleted. Don't you people have anything better to do?

Go ahead, delete 'em all. Just stop bothering me about it. RMc 14:11, 6 June 2007 (UTC)

You're receiving the messages from an automated bot. Asking here probably won't do anything. ShadowHalo 14:16, 6 June 2007 (UTC)
It is getting out of hand mind you, we're encouraged to add images, but the image procedure is such a pain in the ass now... Douglasnicol 16:23, 6 June 2007 (UTC)
If you learn it, it's not much of a PIA. So don't give up! We all went through this. It's a little rusty but not all that hard when you get the hang of it. Wikidemo 00:15, 27 July 2007 (UTC)
Can you advise on how best to learn it? Everything I read confuses me, and when I step through the wizard, I'm left doubtful at every turn. I feel like because I'm not a lawyer, I don't have a clue. --Melty girl 00:27, 27 July 2007 (UTC)
Okay:
  • First, you need to use the wizard to choose an appropriate and valid image copyright tag, one per image. If you miss it with the wizard you can add the tag manually. Wikipedia:Image copyright tags has a list, some instructions and some xamples. By "appropriate" I mean it has to be one of the tags we accept. Either there is no restrictive copyright, or it is a copyrighted work claimed under fair use. Other situations like a limited / noncommercial release aren't appropriate. By "valid" I mean correct. You can't say it's public domain if it isn't, for example.
  • Next you need to include sourcing information about what it is, where you got it from and who owns the copyright. No fancy rules there, just say it as best you can on the image page.
  • Finally, you need a "use rationale" (formerly called a "fair use rationale") on the image page too, one for each time you insert it into an article. One rationale will do if the image is only used once. The reason you need different rationales for multiple uses is that the right to fair use depends not only on the image but how it is used. There's a discussion of which situations qualify for non-free use at WP:NONFREE and a discussion of how to write the rationales at Wikipedia:non-free use rationale. It also helps to look at some examples of good rationales and they include some there too.
Do all that and your images are unassailable. After a while you can do it in 30 seconds to a minute per image so it's just a little pain, not a huge pain to deal with. Hope that helps. Wikidemo 01:37, 27 July 2007 (UTC)
Thank you so much! This should put me on my way. There's one link that's bad above though, and I remain clueless as to how to search Wikipedia: pages. --Melty girl 07:48, 27 July 2007 (UTC)
My problem is that I upload images so infrequently that it turns into an hours long process of trying to figure out what the heck the wiki-people want. Language like "use rationale" and "nonfree" is not plain English! It gets even worse when an image that someone else uploaded for an article I like gets tagged meaning I don't have the back story of exactly how the image arrived on the Wiki. The only reason I'm here is a robot noticed an image for an article I like and dumped a full 1/2 page of legal gooblygook. What a PITA - I'll just let the image get deleted though it seems like it already had a valid rational in the first place. Marc Kupper (talk) (contribs) 10:45, 27 January 2008 (UTC)

[edit] Screen grabs

Using a program like PowerDVD to screen grab an image to illustrate an article is okay isn't it as long as I provide a fair use rationale and the appropriate copyright tag? Douglasnicol 17:46, 6 June 2007 (UTC)

No, please read our policy on original research. (Just kidding.) Yes, that's fine; you should probably also specify in the image description that you took the screenshot yourself. In you have any questions in the future, make sure to ask them on the project page. This talk page is for discussing the question process itself. ShadowHalo 18:08, 6 June 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Help with Tags

I uploaded Image:Louis sockalexis portrait.jpg recently and tagged it with the {{PD-US}} template. The orphan bot keeps adding warning labels and i can't figure out why. How do I add information about the picture to prevent the orphan bot from tagging it?

Topic moved to main page here - cohesion 01:36, 11 July 2007 (UTC)
  • Long levi Banned. FYI, Longlevi -- who posed the original question -- has just been found to be a sockpuppet of a banned user named Tecmobowl, who has used socks in the past. Accordingly, he has also been banned indefinitely. See [2]--Epeefleche 00:34, 13 July 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Warning

This is such a minor thing, but apparently we need to discuss it. User:Sparrowman980 keeps adding warning messages all over the page regarding the archive. [3] [4] [5] [6] [7] I personally don't feel that the existence of an archive requires a warning. It's noted, people can find it. This page already deals with people who are a little frustrated already, better to not throw stopsigns and warning images at them for no reason. I've reverted a few times and other people have also, but can we state that we don't want them here as a record? - cohesion 00:32, 13 August 2007 (UTC)

I agree with your reasoning. Dr Aaron 01:22, 13 August 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Severely messed up edit

Can anyone sort out this mess? Carcharoth 00:30, 24 August 2007 (UTC)

Note to self: when page is restored, add comments to panorama of signs discussion re: pics of blue heritage plaques and the Tolkien fan art discussion. Carcharoth 00:34, 24 August 2007 (UTC)

here's what happened. SSilver was evidently reading an old version of the page and added a comment to it. We can just revert. TCC (talk) (contribs) 00:41, 24 August 2007 (UTC)

Thanks! Carcharoth 00:53, 24 August 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Merge with Wikipedia:Requested copyright examinations

They overlap, but are not similar: the Wikipedia:Requested copyright examinations page is to request someone to review a license, while here people can ask whatever they want (besides the same questions done at Wikipedia:Requested copyright examinations). This is more of a Help Desk for images (maybe it could be moved into the Help Desk, though). -- ReyBrujo 02:02, 22 September 2007 (UTC)

Another similar one is Wikipedia talk:Copyrights/Can I use... Garion96 (talk) 23:59, 22 September 2007 (UTC)

There is no real need to merge itSparrowman980 01:30, 23 September 2007 (UTC)

Seems like significant overlap with Wikipedia talk:Copyrights/Can I use..., so I vote merge, not so sure about Wikipedia:Requested copyright examinations though. That's a little different. - cohesion 02:05, 23 September 2007 (UTC)
I don't know which pages should be merged with which, but some consolidation is in order and some direction for inexperienced users. As it is we get "why is my image tagged/deleted", "is this image okay", and "what do I need to do to upload an image / find a tag / create a use rationale" questions placed indiscriminately on quite a few different pages.Wikidemo 03:20, 23 September 2007 (UTC)
Most (all?) of the templates point here already, so that seems much easier. Also, I like this page's name better, but I may be biased :) - cohesion 04:06, 23 September 2007 (UTC)
Support merge of all three, no need to have so many pages doing essentially the same thing. Calliopejen1 23:18, 26 September 2007 (UTC)
I think there should be a page where you can ask copyright related questions and a separate page for copyright examinations to prevent backlogs and to distinuguish between the 2. However I thunk 2 pages is enough. I would say keep Wikipedia:Media copyright questions and Wikipedia:Requested copyright examinations. Tbo 157(talk) (review) 12:25, 13 October 2007 (UTC)
They should all be merged as they all serve essentially the same purpose, requesting an opinion on whether copyright and/or the NFCC are being complied with for one or more image. Stifle (talk) 11:21, 24 January 2008 (UTC)
And merge in Wikipedia:Image copyright help desk too. Stifle (talk) 11:21, 24 January 2008 (UTC)
Ok, I merged requested copyright examinations and can i use. The image copyright help desk still needs to be merged. Calliopejen1 (talk) 14:05, 24 January 2008 (UTC)
I was watching Wikipedia:Requested copyright examinations. Most things posted there belonged elsewhere anyhow, so the merge sounds reasonable to force all discussion at one place. I think some active questions from several months ago should be been copied here, including one of my own questions. Royalbroil 14:20, 24 January 2008 (UTC)

Merge. There are confusingly too many help desks located in too many different places. Of course they should be merged unless the level of traffic is ridiculously high. It is much easier for those answering questions to pick out the ones they should be answering than it is for the user to work out where to post in the first place. At least, that is my experience from answering Science questions. They should at least all be accessible from a single help index page organised in a self-explanatory way. SpinningSpark 11:25, 5 April 2008 (UTC)

[edit] Doubt about this kind of images

I'm willing to use a computer-drawn picture, to illustrate a particular instance of a data structure. It is a diagram of some instance of the data structure, simple but illustrative. I found an image like this, in a book. I re-drawn that image by myself, but only to achieve a better quality than the scanned pages had. So, I have an image that depicts a diagram of a simple instance of a data structure; it is the same diagram and the same instance of one found in a book. May I free to use it in my article? To what extent? Thanks in advance! Alfredo J. Herrera Lago 04:28, 16 October 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Proposed template change

I'm proposing an additional category in the Template:Editabuselinks to reduce the number of posts at WP:AN and WP:AN/I, please feel free to comment here User:Mbisanz/TemplateSandbox. MBisanz talk 13:15, 5 January 2008 (UTC)

[edit] New tool

Per [8] BC has created basically an NFCC-checker tool that looks very promising and should be easy enough for even a beginner to use (I understand it at least). MBisanz talk 19:04, 7 January 2008 (UTC)

[edit] Non-free promo claiming fair use

Here's a question about Image:KosherLamp.gif. As far as I know, a free version cannot be reasonably found. So, that leaves the question of whether it can be created. Right? So, what are the expectations about creating such an image? Would I be expected to either buy the product or somehow find such a product? This is a speciality item purchased by a narrow market. I'm wondering if the expectation on editors should be relaxed in such cases. Thanks. HG | Talk 17:47, 28 January 2008 (UTC)

various attack lines would be asking identified jewish wikipiedians if they know someone who has one or contacting an othodox jewish organisation to see if they have anything of use.Geni 11:32, 24 February 2008 (UTC)

[edit] Completing merge

See Wikipedia talk:Image copyright help desk#Completing merge. – Luna Santin (talk) 00:36, 20 April 2008 (UTC)

I linked the to archives "Wikipedia:Image copyright help desk" to Wikipedia:Media copyright questions/Archive.
ps. because the "Wikipedia:Image copyright help desk" was archived after the merge the link above is broken the new link is Wikipedia_talk:Image_copyright_help_desk/Archive_2#Completing_merge.
--IngerAlHaosului (talk) 11:44, 6 June 2008 (UTC)

[edit] Own image

Hello, a bot recently informed me that I need licenses for Image:Ma'amoul.JPG and Image:Nuts and Watermelon seeds.JPG. I took both of the pictures myself and then uploaded them to illustrate the Palestinian cuisine article. If I need a license what could I use? --Al Ameer son (talk) 21:29, 24 April 2008 (UTC)

You choose which image license you'd like them distributed under; see WP:ICTIC --Rat at WikiFur (talk) 00:49, 25 April 2008 (UTC)