Talk:Mechanical engineering

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 Mechanical engineering is currently a good article nominee. An editor has indicated a willingness to review the article in accordance with the good article criteria. Further reviews are welcome from any editor who has not contributed significantly to this article, and can be added to the review page, but the decision whether or not to to list the article as a good article should be left to the first reviewer.

Date: 16:22, 11 June 2008 (UTC)
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To-do list for Mechanical engineering: edit · history · watch · refresh
  • Expand history section
  • Add information from US labor reports
    • Job outlook
    • Salary range
    • Education requirements
  • Add more pictures?
  • Add Professional Organizations section
    • Partial list to get started: ASME, ASHRAE, SME, SAE
  • Add more Current Areas of Research
    • There is a lot of research in materials engineering, among other things. Any experts want to add to this section?

Contents

[edit] Latest Changes

Added several pictures and links to wikibooks -Âme Errante 22:15, 3 July 2006 (UTC)

I just made an expansion to the subdisciplines section, and as this is my first wikipedia edit, I was hoping that somebody would double-check my work and let me know of anything I should be doing differently.

  • I also took the stuff about education out of the intro section and made an Education section, added info about accreditation and did some misc. cleanup and additions there, added the statistics section, added the current areas of research, and added a number of references. If someone could check these sections as well, I would much appreciate it.

Also, I am an engineering student specializing in CAD/FEA, so if anyone has questions regarding those subjects as they pertain to this article, please feel free to send them my way. -Brandon


Included in Mechanical Engineering is often the supervision of fabrication, and construction of engineered systems. This involves coordination with other engineering specialties such as electrical engineering and structural engineering. Instrumentation and control of engineered systems is often part of the mechanical requirements and this involves the coordination with instrumentation specialists. Such systems may: measure and control flow of materials, stress and strain on equipment, and recording of operational parameters. Engineered systems include Heating, Ventilating, and Air Conditioning (HVAC) specialties.

UK government appointed Ann Dowling, a mechanical engineer, to head its study of nanotechnology molecular assembler issues. This seems to imply they're worth mentioning here.

  • There is now a subsection on Nanotechnology. If you feel more information is necessary, feel free to add it here. -Brandon

From the old introduction: Some major divisions of mechanical engineering are: designs and controls, thermo-science and fluids, engineering mechanics, and manufacturing. In addition, specialized fields exist within mechanical engineering or as a joint field of mechanical engineering and another engineering discipline. Some fields include: mechatronics (and more specifically robotics), transport and logistics, cryogenics, and biomechanics.

Modern analysis and design processes in mechanical engineering are aided by various computational tools like finite element analysis (FEA) and computational fluid dynamics (CFD), computer-aided design (CAD) and computer-aided manufacturing (CAM). In system design and controls, a mechanical engineer may apply CAD/CAM systems to feed “instructions" to computer numerically-controlled (CNC) machines such as robots, milling machines, and lathes.

A mechanical engineer working in thermo-fluids might design a heat sink, an air conditioning system, or an internal combustion engine. Other processes might focus on the fluid itself, such as a fan to cool an electrical system, a turbine to power a submarine, or a spray gun to apply chemical coatings.

[edit] What HVAC software is that?

Could anyone please enlighten me as to which HVAC software belongs this screenshot? The one in the caption...

Sorry if it's off topic, I'm just curious. --Clapaucius* 22:51, 26 August 2005 (UTC)

[edit] Help

I am a mechanical engineer. I passed last year. Now I am searching for jobs. The main problem is this that I live in a country(Bangladesh) which offers very poor fields for mechanical engineers. So i am searching for foreign jobs. Can any one tell me how can i get a foreign job???

Please ask questions unrelated to the development of this encyclopedia article at Wikipedia:Reference desk. Thanks. — Edward Z. Yang(Talk) 21:58, 7 May 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Terse page

The ideology of this page seems to be descendant of Laconia? Is there some reason for the resistance to expand the page to include more detailed information about mechanical engineering? Just wondering where everyone's coming from around here? Cypa 18:09, 13 December 2005 (UTC)

:There is an open request that the article be expanded. Subdisciplines and History look open if you would like to add something there. Tom Harrison (talk) 14:41, 14 December 2005 (UTC)

:: I'm planning to expand it soon! deeptrivia (talk) 14:49, 14 December 2005 (UTC)

[edit] A Broad Area

Mechanical engineering covers a very broad area. Depends on where you are in the world, your experience about this subject may differ. People should add whatever they know about this topic as much as possible. A complete write up is quite impossible at this moment without the help of many professional writers. Perhaps this is why it is in such a sorry state. If you are interested, please take a look at Electrical engineering. hoo0 10:00, 20 February 2006 (UTC)

[edit] History Section

As it was explained to me, the mechanical engineer gets his roots from the steam engine. This is alluded to in the article, but not fully. The idea is that only an ME has the skills necessary to design the entire engine. Thermodynamics, structures, kinematics and dynamics, and some controls (Centrifugal governor) are necessary to design the whole thing successfully. - EndingPop 02:35, 12 September 2006 (UTC)

I would argue the mechanical engineer gets his roots in the beginning of engineering (i.e. Ancient Rome, etc.). I wouldn't agree the roots are from steam engines. It was part of the evolution and addition to the field. Taalo 06:15, 6 October 2006 (UTC)
I would say that it started even sooner, to say that the person who first used a wheel was not an engineer would be an injustice. However, the main point is finding references to expand the history section rather than putting in our own assumptions. I'll look into this a little if I get some time over the weekend and post. Jeb8828 17:43, 6 October 2006 (UTC)
We are definitelly on the same page, my friend. I just brought up Ancient Rome as an example, but didn't mean to imply any sort of specific start date with it. :-) I like to think of mechanical engineering as the grandfather of all disciplines. Something that started out as engineering, but expanded into civil, electrical, etc. Just my assumption though, yup! Taalo 17:51, 6 October 2006 (UTC)
I both agree and disagree. I would say mechanical engineering was a child of necessity, just as others were. While engineering has been around for a long time, ME as a profession didn't appear until the steam engine. Before that it was a civil engineer. Just my 2 cents. - EndingPop 12:55, 9 October 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Structural Failure Analysis

I think this should be just Structural Analysis, minus the failure bit. Failure analysis is really just one subset of structural analysis, not to mention any design/engineering area (controls, etc.) is going to have some sort of "failure" analysis. Taalo 06:17, 6 October 2006 (UTC)

Agreed. It should really point to Structural Analysis and be rewritten in that context. It's more about prediction of structure behavior, not necessarily whether failure occurs or failure mode. Structural analysis is still pretty intense when trying to design for cost or packaging or durability even when failure isn't likely to occur. —Preceding unsigned comment added by EndingPop (talk • contribs)
  • I reworded/rewrote the section to be more general. Failure analysis is one part of Structural Analysis. Please review. -Fnlayson 17:12, 10 December 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Just a note

Here is an old engineering joke. It's funny because its true. What is the difference between a mechanical engineer and a civil engineer? Mechanical engineers build weapons, while civil engineers build targets. Zengief 15:50, 31 January 2007 (UTC)

[edit] This article reads like a textbook

And I'd be willing to wager that it was written by an American teacher judging by the MASSIVE number of references to Mech Eng in US colleges/universities. "Solid understanding of key concepts"? What? Lets cut the vague crap and get right to the point shall we? ANY area of professional expertise requires a solid understanding of key concepts, we needn't tell people what anyone with half a brain stem already knows. Lots of little things like this add up to one big wording problem.

Also, not everyone reading this encyclopedia is an American student, and therefore I DON'T think a section on "coursework" specific to the US is really necessary! Nobody cares that some schools offer a 4 year degree either - this is an encyclopedia not a bulletin board for the American higher education system to advertise it's wonderful opportunities. Mainly this is because it has NOTHING whatsoever to do with Mechanical Engineering!

Come on guys, you should all know better than this. Clean it up, or at least reword some of it. If you don't, then I'll be forced to clean it up for you (and you don't want that, because I'll just delete the entire section on education). ▫Bad▫harlick♠ 00:51, 3 February 2007 (UTC)

Hey Chill OUT ^^^


Hey shill out, this is a place where if you want to add something, then add it, only if you know what you're talking about. The person who wrote this, or the people who wrote this were Americans, so they can't write about engineering in Europe because they know squat about it. If you'd like call up some buddies that graduated form some prestigious German engineering school, and ask them to add a European flavor to the article, Otherwise cut the crap.

[edit] Excessive lead reverted

A user reworded the lead to this:

Mechanical engineering is concerned with the design and analysis of mechanical systems, large and small, from screws, bolts and gears to aircraft engines, space stations, satellites. Its scope is easy to describe and awesome to contemplate. Any artificial device that involves physical movement calls for the discipline of mechanical engineering. A mechanical engineer is trained in physics and mathematics, classical mechanics of points and rigid bodies, strength of materials, fluid mechanics, thermodynamics, kinematics of machines, heat engines, and the modeling techniques needed to understand descriptions such as experimental, computational, mathematical and textual descriptions of such systems. The curriculum is shared in large part with other branches of engineering, and to a lesser extent with other academic disciplines across the physical and social sciences, the humanities and other professions. As with many or most academic disciplines, very little is studied in the mechanical engineering department and nowhere else. It is unique in its focus and experience, indispensable to civilization. But it is a modern discipline, not an ancient one. Some aspects of the craft are ancient, but it is a modern academic discipline.

I think it is non-neutral and too detailed. So I'm reverting to the previous one. The later sections cover a lot of that better, imo -Fnlayson 22:01, 31 August 2007 (UTC)

[edit] M.E. Experience Levels

How are job positions of Mechanical Engineer I, II, III, IV, etc defined? A lot of engineering job position listings have these numerals in their titles. Please add this to the article if you know. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Posilute (talk • contribs) 03:06, 14 October 2007 (UTC)

  • That'll vary from company to company as to what exactly the levels mean. I've seen junior, senior, principal and other terms used as well. I don;t think wikipedia articles should get into that kind of thing. -Fnlayson 05:09, 14 October 2007 (UTC)
  • I second Fnlayson's comment, above. Mechanical Engineer I, II... is something that is specifically defined by a company, so the approprate place to discuss it, if anywhere, is the article for that company. However, as these titles may change even within a company, and are generally not widely used outside the hiring process, I question whether they meet notability and encyclopaedic content criteria. -Âme Errante (talk) 01:27, 7 May 2008 (UTC)

[edit] ME user box

If you are a mechanical engineer, please add this to your user page. Thanks: ----CheMechanical 00:53, 21 October 2007 (UTC)

Image:Icon-gears.png This user is a  
Mechanical Engineer.


[edit] PE user box

If you are a professional engineer, please add this to your user page. Thanks: ----CheMechanical 00:54, 21 October 2007 (UTC)

PE This user is a licensed Professional Engineer.


[edit] How do you become a mechanical engineer?

How do you do it? What is the difference between other engineering things? Someone should put this into the article. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 69.63.60.32 (talk) 02:11, 22 October 2007 (UTC)

The article discusses engineering education around the world, and the various degrees denoting a mechanical engineer. It also discusses the act of licensure, i.e. becoming a licensed mechanical engineer. I'm curious as to what supplementary information you're looking for.
I'm curious as to what you mean by 'other engineering things'. Are you asking what the difference is between a mechanical engineer and, say, an electrical engineer? If so, this article links in the first paragraph to the article on 'engineering', which describes the field of engineering in general and how it is split up into disciplines.
Overall, I'm not sure what you're looking for. Could you please provide a more in-depth explanation of what you believe to be missing in this article?
-Âme Errante (talk) 01:24, 7 May 2008 (UTC)

[edit] Update to Tools section

I updated the Tools section to more better represent the state of the CAE industry (which I assume was the point of the section). Feel free to fix anything I missed! - EndingPop (talk) 22:23, 25 March 2008 (UTC)

Thanks for the edit... that section looks a lot better now. The section was originally added several years ago by someone (I don't remember exactly who it was) who didn't like how I split the article into subdisciplines. He felt the article needed a section on exactly how mechanical engineers do their engineering, rather than just discussing all the areas we work on, hence this section. From my experience at several companies, a large part of the design process is computer-aided. However, you'd be surprised at how much of it is still low-tech and rule of thumb in practice. Perhaps this would be something to discuss eventually, but I'm not sure this is the article for it. All that being said, I'm going to remove the 'please improve this section' tag... it could certainly be expanded, but it's not exactly in 'dire need' compared to any other section.
Also, in relation to the note about this article being written by a teacher, I was actually a student when I wrote most of this article, hence the focus on education... you write what you know, certainly. I never expected my edits to last this long, so please feel free to (intelligently) edit the article as you wish. -Brandon (Âme Errante (talk) 21:45, 6 May 2008 (UTC))

[edit] Education: Extraneous Information

I removed the following sentence from the article:

In Germany, Austria, and many other central and eastern European countries the (BSc) and (BTech) are available as an intermediate (or final) 4 year degree; however, the longer "Diplomas";(Dipl), (Dipl-Ing), (Dipl-Tech); are still the most relevant degrees.[citation needed]

Not only is it uncited, it does not seem to add to the article. However, I am not from any country in eastern Europe, so I do not know if this is an important distinction. Can someone knowledgeable look over this and let me know if we should include it in the article?

Thanks,

-Âme Errante (talk) 00:41, 7 May 2008 (UTC)

[edit] Things to add?

These used to be in the to do list, but they sat there for a long time.

  • Add a 'Related Disciplines' section. Because mechanical engineering is so broad, there is overlap between mechanical engineering and other branches of engineering. For example, in aerospace the design of aircraft bodies is performed by both mechanical engineers (who look at structure) and aerospace engineers (who look at drag and lift).
  • Mechanical enginnering is not just " ...the application of principles of physics..." it's much more, e.g., combustion is more chemistry than physics.

I'm wondering if perhaps the first of these is outside the scope of the article and shouldn't be added. As for the second, this should probably be debated, rather than put on the to-do list. My experience in engineering, for one, is that combustion is explored in terms of energy states (thermodynamics) and end products rather than electron transfer and intermediate chemical reactions. Thoughts?

-Âme Errante (talk) 01:12, 7 May 2008 (UTC)

[edit] Sorry it's taking me a while

I want to be really careful on the Cold fusion review...and as luck would have it, a significant event happened this week that we have to cover. I should get to this article within a day or two. In the meantime, read the first part of WP:LEAD, please; the lead section is meant to tell readers what to expect in the article, and the lead of this article should be a bit longer than it is. WP:WIAGA mentions WP:LEAD and a few other specific guidelines to follow. - Dan Dank55 (talk)(mistakes) 04:01, 24 May 2008 (UTC)

I liked the images and captions in this article, and I have used some of them as examples of good, succinct caption style at WP:Captions. - Dan Dank55 (talk)(mistakes) 04:16, 24 May 2008 (UTC)
Apologies again; I'm almost ready to start the review at Mechanical engineering. It looks like the review of Cold fusion is going to have to go on hold unless/until people can come up with better sources. - Dan Dank55 (talk)(mistakes) 17:28, 27 May 2008 (UTC)
As I feared, Cold fusion took a long time, but we're done now. Is anyone else working on this article, or am I dealing only with the nominator here? - Dan Dank55 (talk)(mistakes) 12:37, 29 May 2008 (UTC)

[edit] Good Article review

I have to apologize again; illness in the family and various wikidramas have made me take much, much longer on this review than anyone should. Also, it's important to me to do a good job and be able to justify my decisions, and this is of course harder with a technical article on a subject that I'm not entirely familiar with. I'll get it done just as soon as I can. - Dan Dank55 (talk)(mistakes) 16:55, 3 June 2008 (UTC)

[edit] GA Review

This review is transcluded from Talk:Mechanical engineering/GA1. The edit link for this section can be used to add comments to the review.

[edit] Quick-fail criteria

  1. Plenty of reliable sources.
  2. Neutrality issues are completely absent; quite a relief after Cold fusion!
  3. No cleanup tags.
  4. The article has been very stable recently.
  5. The article doesn't concern a current event.

I don't see any issues; editors are welcome to correct me. - Dan Dank55 (talk)(mistakes) 16:33, 29 May 2008 (UTC)

[edit] Well written

  • Please read WP:LEAD. The lead section for this article should be two to four paragraphs, summarizing the main points.
  • There's an issue with the "sea of blue" in the lead section, although this is sometimes a point of disagreement between WP:FAC reviewers and more scientifically-inclined editors. Scientists prefer denser articles with more links than the average Wikipedia reader, so it's a judgment call. I have followed all the links from the lead, and I thought they all added very useful information, except for motor vehicles.
  • I replaced the ampersands with "and", per WP:MOS.
  • Correct me if I'm wrong here, but I replaced "Mechanical engineering could be found in many ancient and medieval societies throughout the globe" with "Applications of mechanical engineering...". You're defining mechanical engineering as an academic discipline, but your examples don't point to academicians, they're pointing to devices that were designed using principles that nowadays would come from mechanical engineering.
  • I added a bit of information on engineering societies in the 19th century.
  • When discussing history in general, use "can be found" rather than "could be found", if the implication is that modern people are the ones doing the finding.
  • I wouldn't mind inclusion of a study breaking down which courses are taken on average by mechanical engineering students in various countries, but just saying that they tend to study humanities doesn't really help, IMO.

[edit] Factually accurate and verifiable

  • There's no reference, inline or otherwise, for the statement about the importance of Heron of Alexandria. You can't use a WP article as a reference, and that WP article unfortunately doesn't use web references. I suggest using this one: http://www.britannica.com/eb/article-9040189/Heron-of-Alexandria. If you don't subscribe to EB, it begins: "Greek geometer and inventor whose writings preserved for posterity a knowledge of the mathematics and engineering of Babylonia, ancient Egypt, and the Greco-Roman world." That's enough to establish what you're trying to say. You don't need a reference for every statement in an article, just a reference for every statement "challenged or likely to be challenged" (WP:V). A lot of people haven't heard of Heron (aka Hero) of Alexandria, so that needs a source.
  • "deeply influenced" is not good. Per WP:WEASEL, give a short sentence, at least, saying what we got from Heron and Archimedes that makes them important. I added a short list of accomplishments for Zhang Heng and Ma Jun (which would be improved by citations from those articles).

[edit] Broad in its coverage

[edit] Neutral

[edit] Stable

[edit] Images

The images are helpful, and the captions are good. In fact, I'm using the captions as an example of good caption-writing at WP:CAPTIONS.

[edit] References comment

Doesn't seem to have enough inline references to me. But then I don't see any fact tags either and I'm more used to Feature Article reviews. -Fnlayson (talk) 16:44, 29 May 2008 (UTC)