Talk:Majin Boo/Archive 2

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Archive This is an archive of past discussions. Do not edit the contents of this page. If you wish to start a new discussion or revive an old one, please do so on the current talk page.

Contents

Note to Everyone

STOP TALKING. Seriously. Don't say a thing past here. It's not worth it, it won't accomplish anything (obviously) - and don't respond to Wikistar, OR ANYONE ELSE, baiting you, it just fosters arguements.. Ignore it totally, and focus on the article. It's not worth fighting over manga, so don't. Now hush. HawkerTyphoon 02:37, 26 June 2006 (UTC)

  • .........................................................................................................(Tumble weed rolls by).............Better?KojiDude 02:51, 26 June 2006 (UTC)
  • Good. Keep it this way. HawkerTyphoon 02:52, 26 June 2006 (UTC)
  • Wiki-star: Don't even try and keep deleting my message, you will loose! Tell me who he is, and maybe i'll shut up! He has to be someone very important! If not, he doesn't have a chance of telling me what to do (especially an insult such as shut up) Wiki-star 02:57, 26 June 2006 (UTC)
  • Jienum: Ok, we've been quiet for the past few days and I think the Majin Buu article has been blocked long enough, so we'd better resolve this dispute fast. First of all, Wiki-Star, I would like to ask you (I'm not giving you an order, but asking you kindly) to stop editing the Majin Buu page paragraphs according to your opinion if it is deleted every time you edit it. That is violating the 3RR rule. Agreed? We will not cause any trouble whatsoever for you as long as you play by the rules.
  • Wiki-star: I can agree with that deal, however there are a substantial amount of you that are against me. As a result, it is almost impossible for me to edit and not run into a conflict with another contributor. I always explain my edits, and there is nothing false about them! The chance i have against you all are the wikipedia guidelines. I have been following most them, while many of you have been voilating many of them. I can be a sweet contributor, but only around sweet motivation. It's just the way it goes my good man. (Thanks for shutting down these folks) Wiki-star 19:33, 27 June 2006 (UTC)
  • Jienum: "My good man"....I like that. Heheh. Anyway, I'm glad that you've agreed. Good job. But what I advise is for you to keep a low profile for a while (a few days, I think), and when you start editing again, people will be a lot friendlier with you if you accept your edit's deletion once in a while. I mean, take it from me, Wiki-Star, because I know how you feel. I used to be a real tough one before, especially with the Gaston page. But then I was given a good and reasonable cause to stop editing the Gaston page to my liking, so I stopped. You can take my advice if you wish. I will not force you. But if you do, it will make things better for you.

    And what did you mean, "Shutting down these folks"?
  • Wiki-star: HawkerTyphoon and Kojidude had joined some kind of alliance to ensure this article remains abondoned until administrators deal with it. But what they didn't understand, is that while administrators govern the site, contributors make the site. I was referring to those two as "These folks". Thanks for the help Jienum. Wiki-star 21:15, 27 June 2006 (UTC)

Conflict Resolution: Part 2

  • Change Super Buu w/ Gohan to reflect him as the "nicest" of Super Buu's forms.
Wikipedia is not a publisher of original thought - Wikipedia:Neutral point of view
  • Remove all mention of Buu's video game transformations.
Discussed millions of times and an overall consensus was formed.
  • Re-add the external links.
Wikipedia is not a soapbox Wikipedia is not a mirror or a repository of links, images, or media files
  • Re-add the episode appearences.
Wikipedia is not an indiscriminate collection of information
Don't feel any of the above should be implemented, except maybe this link, [1]. Just wanted to clear that up.--3bulletproof16 19:39, 27 June 2006 (UTC)
Hahahaha, i really hope you didn't think those were all my proposed edits? Come now, you should know that an article can have infinite amounts of proposed information. Which means i as a contributor can have unlimited amounts of proposed edits (which i do). But thanks for the reminder. Wiki-star 19:53, 27 June 2006 (UTC)
Those are all the proposed edits previously discussed. If you have more in mind, then name them now.
Daishokaioshin 19:55, 27 June 2006 (UTC)
Yes, by all means, state your "propositions" and see what else Wikipedia policy thinks of them. Honestly, what else do you have in mind? --3bulletproof16 19:57, 27 June 2006 (UTC)
Some are correct. POVs and too many links are too much for a Wikipedia page. Episode appearances, well I wouldn't mind, but it's still not up to me. But the in-game transformations should stay, I think. They are after all non-canon forms of Majin Buu, and we do have mention of that non-existant fusion between Yamcha and Tien (Yamhan). And furthermore, it was I who moved Buu to Majin Buu. The old discussions are on the Buu page, which is now a re-direct. That was not Wiki-Star's fault. Jienum

So, Wiki-star, are you going to stop mindlessly editing the article and discuss it with us, so we can get it unprotected? Nemu 20:25, 27 June 2006 (UTC)

  • Wiki-star: Naahhh... don't mention it Jienum! I'm a very forgiveful young man, what can i say. Now, onto matters of importance. Yes, Nemu, i'm going to discuss with you all. We're going to take our discussion step by step. That way, everyone is on the same page. Lets begin folks! Wiki-star 20:44, 27 June 2006 (UTC)


Wiki-star's proposals

We're going to discuss this first PE. As obvious as it sounds, some contributors disagree with it. If you're for this Proposed Edit, sign your signature under that section. If you are against it, do the same under that section. However, you must provide at least 2 sentences explaining your reason for that action. That way, others can persuade you why you are wrong, or why they agree. Lets re-build folks!

In the interest of fairness: Not only will you have provide at least 2 sentences explaining your reason to Disagree but also to Agree. --3bulletproof16 20:51, 27 June 2006 (UTC)



Voting on PE#1

    • Proposed Edit #1: Allow Super Buu w/Gohan the title for Buu's strongest form.
  • I Agree:

Wiki-star 20:44, 27 June 2006 (UTC) I agree with this Proposed Edit because Super Buu w/Gohan has the most powerful fighters in the series absorbed within him. As it was shown, Buu gets tremendously more powerful after he absorbed Gotenks and Piccolo. Because it was shown that Gohan was more powerful than Super Sayain 3 Gotenks, as he horribly defeated Super Buu, Super Buu w/Gohan should recieve the title for Buu's most powerful form. It was also shown that Goku and Vegeta were absolutely nothing compare to Super Buu w/Gohan. Buu grew even more powerful than when he had Gotenks within him. At that point, Vegetto was the only being in existence capable of stopping him. No other Buu harnesses this awsome strength. This is why i agree with this Proposed Edit.

Jienum: So do I. After all, SSJ3 Goku couldn't fight Super Buu w/Gohan, but he could fight Kid Buu. Super Buu w/Gohan is the strongest of all the Buus, let alone the Super Buus, and I think it should be mentioned.

This was never one of your points before and it's common sense. Nemu 20:48, 27 June 2006 (UTC)

Jienum: Do you accept it or not, Nemu?

Yes, that's why I put it under agree. Nemu 20:51, 27 June 2006 (UTC)

  • Wiki-star: See this is what pisses me off, people don't accept the flow! Dam man!!! Anyways, lets wait for others to vote. Wiki-star 20:51, 27 June 2006 (UTC)
Jienum: There's no need, guys. THE PAGE HAS COME BACK!!!!! YIPIIIIIIEEEEEEEEEEE!!!!!!! Now, remember our agreement, everyone. Let's all be nice, and treat each other's edits with respect, even if they have to be deleted.
  • Wiki-star: We still need to discuss matters. As I will always propose my edits, unless other contributors can help me! Wiki-star 20:58, 27 June 2006 (UTC)

Yeah, it's unprotected because Wiki-star said he would stop his editing sprees. His arguments are still here, though. Nemu 21:01, 27 June 2006 (UTC)

  • Wiki-star: Yes, i agree to stop editing uncontrollably. However, i must have a reason not to. Which means we still need to solve our conflicts. Don't worry, i won't touch the article (yet). Please keep this in mind! Thanks! Wiki-star 21:04, 27 June 2006 (UTC)



  • I Disagree:

Voting on PE#2

  • I Agree:


  • I Disagree:

Signing posts

Can people sign their posts using ~~~~? This method of putting your username infront is confusing. People normally do that when they're addressing someone, so it looks like you're all talking to yourself. It's even more confusing when you don't sign your post using four tildes either. --Lord Deskana Dark Lord of YOUR OPINIONS 21:00, 27 June 2006 (UTC)

  • Wiki-star: As far as i'm concerned, i'm the only user on Wikipedia that puts their name infornt of their message. It seems another user known as User:Jienum has taken a liking to this method. It's not illegal, but it's just highly recommended. Wiki-star 21:01, 27 June 2006 (UTC)
...which is why I requested rather than telling you to. Never mind. --Lord Deskana Dark Lord of YOUR OPINIONS 21:05, 27 June 2006 (UTC)
Yep... Wiki-star is like that...--3bulletproof16 21:09, 27 June 2006 (UTC)
  • Wiki-star: Thanks for toning down ladies and gentlemen. Hopefully we can get along even better than we did! Wiki-star 21:13, 27 June 2006 (UTC)

Should we kill the Uub section?

It should just be changed into a brief overview and any of the good parts should be put into the Uub article.Nemu 21:04, 27 June 2006 (UTC)

You're all moving too fast. Right now we're discussing Super Buu w/Gohan. Don't worry, we'll get to this in due time! Wiki-star 21:08, 27 June 2006 (UTC)

We can do multiple things at a time. Your points are separate from the others right now. Nemu 21:13, 27 June 2006 (UTC)

I'll wait, not a problem. But if i see that people aren't responding soon enough, i'm going to have to resort to action. Words come later. Wiki-star 21:17, 27 June 2006 (UTC)

If you mean that you will start your editing sprees, it'll just become protected again. Nemu 21:19, 27 June 2006 (UTC)

Yes. But the only way to stop me, is to sit down and compromise with my edits. I don't want to ruin this article by having it protected from contributors. But so should you. Which is why i need for you all to stop ganging on me, you're only fueling my fire even more, and then thats when i become totally unstopable. You all need to understand me more, and have more empathy. Wiki-star 21:22, 27 June 2006 (UTC)

No one is "ganging on you" or "fueling your fire". People will respond to you when they're ready, not when you feel is "soon enough". And what do you mean "words come later"? Are you suggesting, then, that you DON'T want people to discuss things?
Daishokaioshin 21:31, 27 June 2006 (UTC)
OI!! OI!! OI!! That's enough!!! I have changed the Uub section, and we agreed that Super Buu w/Gohan is the strongest. Jienum
What's enough? I'm trying to clarify what Wiki-star meant, and help him understand that no one is ganging up on him. He has a tendency to take some things as insults when they are not intended that way, so I'm making it clear that no one is being hostile towards him. Thanks for fixing the Uub section, and, yes, it was agreed a long time ago that Super Buu (Absorbed Gohan) is the strongest Buu.
Daishokaioshin 21:37, 27 June 2006 (UTC)
Haaa..... you see, i could explode right here and just not care anymore. But i'm going to forgive you Daishokaioshin. If you read earlier, if i am not confronted about why my edits are wrong or false, then thats when i become unstopable. For example: I keep adding that Super Buu w/Gohan is the strongest of all Buus. But people keep deleting it! But here we are, and everyone agrees he is! If people still deletes it, i become enraged and you cannot stop me. What i'm doing is right, and logical. I start out nice and calm, and give you 2 chances. If you fail them, then you are on my ignore list. Thanks! Wiki-star 21:38, 27 June 2006 (UTC)
...Okay. So. What is it exactly you're going to "explode" over? What are you "forgiving" me for? I haven't done anything. I pointed out that no one is ganging up on you, and we are discussing things peacefully, civilly, and calmly, because it SEEMED as though you were becoming offended. No one is deleting anything. You don't need to give people "two chances" before being put on your "ignore list". You need to discuss things with people calmly, and not overreact things. No one has said or done anything to make you mad. Please, calm down. If I said something that bothers you, discuss it with me.
To other editors: Are there any other issues that we need to clear up on this article? Aside from Wiki-star's proposed edits I mean. Is there anything I'm forgetting that was on the old talk pages?
Daishokaioshin 21:43, 27 June 2006 (UTC)
That's not the way things work around here Wiki-star. First of all you will start out and end up calm here or else the proper measures will be taken. And second of all, No one has an Ignore List so quit pretending. --3bulletproof16 21:45, 27 June 2006 (UTC)
  • Wiki-star: Ok first and foremost, you are knowone to be ordering me arond here. If i feel i have an ignore list, i have an ignore list! If you don't like it, piss off! I'm tired of you analyzing everything i do, and then come with your "smart acts" telling me what to do. If i feel that what i am doing is being destroyed, i will get upset! I'm human, we don't all stay calm forever. So how dare you! Wiki-star 21:50, 27 June 2006 (UTC)
Enough of the attacks and incivility, Wiki-star. No more warnings will be given. --Lord Deskana Dark Lord of YOUR OPINIONS 21:51, 27 June 2006 (UTC)
Jienum: ENOUGH ENOUGH!!!!!!!! STOP TREATING WIKI-STAR LIKE THE WORLD WAR III CULPRIT!!!!! DO YOU WANT TO GET THE DAMN PAGE BLOCKED AGAIN!!!!?????
Do you want to get yourself blocked for incivility? Don't shout. --Lord Deskana Dark Lord of YOUR OPINIONS 21:54, 27 June 2006 (UTC)
Jienum: Oh I give up! I just can't talk sense into any of you guys. I'll just leave you alone. See how long the stupid page lasts!!!
My intention is to make you abide by the civility policy, but if you feel you have to not edit, then so be it. I'm sorry you feel that way. --Lord Deskana Dark Lord of YOUR OPINIONS 21:58, 27 June 2006 (UTC)
  • Wiki-star: Relax Jienum. You are entitled to become upset, but try not to show it boldly to others. We'll just have to see what happens from here on out! Wiki-star 21:57, 27 June 2006 (UTC)
  • Jienum: Alright, I'm calm. But Wiki-Star, try not to be harsh with the other users. Please, I don't won't you to end up blocked again. Let's just take it easy. And that goes for everyone else. Stop behaving childishly with Wiki-Star and causing him to blow his top, because it's starting to annoy me, especially after everything I went to to get you to agree with me.

Nobody is acting like a child but him. No offense, but Wiki-star gets enraged for wierd reasons very easily. He takes everything as insult to him or his intelligence.

Baically, Wiki-star, calm down. You told us to talk it out and be civilized, but then you go off on unneeded rants about nothing. No one is out to get you. Just calm down before you get banned. Nemu 22:13, 27 June 2006 (UTC)

  • Wiki-star: I hear you Nemu. I won't start editing Buu for now. I'm going to give you folks a chance to heal after all the damage that was inflicted. Once again i apologize for any misunderstandings, however i will always stick with what is right and factual, no matter what! Wiki-star 22:16, 27 June 2006 (UTC)

What Buu Is

I keep changing it where it says his race to Djinn but someone always changes it. He's a Djinn as stated in the manga so stop changing it.

Viz gets "Djinn" from a misappropriation of "Majin". Otherwise anyone under "Majin" influence (like Vegeta) would be one. Voice of Treason 02:15, 28 June 2006 (UTC)
Actually they state in the manga that he's a genie, if I'm not mistaken. Or at least I remember Goten and Trunks being hyped up to see the wizard and the genie. Djinn is just another word for the same thing. It says in this article that Majinn means "bad genie." It says in the article on Majin that "it is a term that means a magical being, i.e. a genie or sorcerer. It can also refer to a demonic or evil entity." There's also an article on the Majins as a race in DB, though aside from Buu none of them were born that way. Buu also loses that "Majin" characteristic when he sheds his evil side and becomes Mr. Buu, so I would think "Genie" or "Djinn" would be a fitting word. Buu's also listed on the Genie page under "Jinn in popular culture." Onikage725 14:51, 28 June 2006 (UTC)
They don't call him a Djinn in the Japanese manga, that I know of. I have most of the issues, and don't recall ever seeing Goten and Trunks talk about a genie. It's a Viz thing. That's all.
Daishokaioshin 15:01, 28 June 2006 (UTC)
Then what do they call him? There's also the quote above- "Majin ...is a term that means a magical being, i.e. a genie or sorcerer." It also goes with the whole pun. Two wizards and their genie named after a song sung by a Disney faerie. If we drop that bit, we'd have to drop the "bad genie" bit, because it's in line with that. I would say just go with "Majin" except that in the context with which it's used in the show it seems to be more an indiciation of Bibidi and Babidi's evil magic. But barring a translation citation proving that the word is US only or if it was anime only (my DVDs dont extend that far yet, but if anyone has anything Buu Saga could maybe check this and see what Simmons wrote for the relevent scenes), I don't think genie is a bad term. A magical creature with reality-warping powers who emerged from his prison amidst a cloud of smoke and who has been quoted in at least one respected source as being a genie? If it walks like a duck and it talks like a duck... Onikage725 18:19, 28 June 2006 (UTC)
A majinn is one of babidi's allies or slaves so perhaps buu is really named demon Djinn Buu Lord Frieza 21:25, 28 June 2006 (UTC)
I don't have access to my manga right now, so I'll let you know what they call him when I do, later today. Sorry for the delay.
Daishokaioshin 21:32, 28 June 2006 (UTC)
*can of worms... OPENED!*
Viz gets "Djinn" from a misappropriation of "Majin".
Well... six of one, half a dozen of the other >_>. The character's name is specifically written out as Majin Buu (魔人ブウ) in the original kanji. jin is just a term for "person", and when you see it as a suffix to another word (like, say... Saiya-jin) it states they're a member of that race or refers to that type/group in general.
Now, ma (魔) can be "demon" - like Demon King Piccolo (ピッコロ大魔王 Piccolo-Daimaô) and the psuedonym his offspring takes on, Ma Jr. - or "evil spirit"; it can also slide under something magic and unnatural. It's not a *bad* translation per se, just sorta off from what we're accustomed to - Majin's the proper name, and Djinn's their way of breaking that down to its base element for Western readers to "get" it. It's like VIZ writing Carrot firing the Turtle Destruction Wave at Captain Milk and Cheese - right on paper, but freakin' weird to look at in practice. Papacha 22:11, 28 June 2006 (UTC)
Like I quoted..."Majin ...is a term that means a magical being, i.e. a genie or sorcerer."
 :p
Though I've always wondered with that one, if it's straight up meant as being the "Ma" race, why isn't it hyphonated? Also, somewhat unrelated, just a question while on that subject for those in the know. The difference between seijin and jin, does that basically come into effect when a race is named after their planet? Ex- Saiya-jin from Vegeta-sei; Namek-seijin from Namek-sei. Onikage725 01:29, 29 June 2006 (UTC)


"Buff Buu" or "Super Kid Buu"?

I hate the term, Buff Buu. It is a slang adjective and should not be used on Wikipedia. Super Kid Buu is the best name, I think, because it matches "Super Buu". If we name him Buff Buu, then we might as well call the Super Buus "Tall Buu". Jienum

Call him any thing but Super Kid Buu. That's a really stupid name. If I had a choice between that and Really Big Muscular Buu, I would choose RBM Buu. Nemu 17:10, 30 June 2006 (UTC)
Super Kid Buu is exactly the same as Super Buu, and it is no more stupid than Buff Buu and RBM Buu. I don't know why you think Super Buu is a good name, but Super Kid Buu isn't. You tell me. Jienum
How about Mega Buu instead, as was originally used on this article for a number of months before people decided to name the form "Buff Buu"? Super and Mega are closer in terms of naming than Super and Buff. And I don't care for "Super Kid Buu" either.
Daishokaioshin 19:02, 30 June 2006 (UTC)
Not a bad idea, Dai. But it's just that "Mega Buu" is too close to "Super Buu", and most people may not know the difference. I only said "Super Kid Buu" because that specific one is a Super-Powered version of Kid Buu. But then again, I don't own the article. Jienum

I think we should just go with the most accepted name. That's the same thing with Kid Buu. He was called that so much it became his official name. I've seen both Buff Buu and Mega Buu used a lot. I've never seen Super Kid Buu used before this article, so I think we should choose between Buff Buu and Mega Buu for the name. Nemu 20:58, 30 June 2006 (UTC)

Well, if we choose the "Mega", we should call him "Mega Kid Buu", so as not to be confused with "Super Buu", because "Mega" and "Super" are the same. Jienum
Nemu/TTN, type Majin Buu on the Google Search Engine, and click on the one that says "Dragonball Z, GT Transformations: Majin Buu". See what they call Kid Buu's muscular form. Jienum
Uhh... No. Mega and Super are NOT the same.
Super: Very large, great, or extreme
Mega: Great, extended, powerful
While they may seem similar, Mega does not equal Super, or vice versa. Honestly, I don't see how anyone could possibly get confused by "Super Buu" and "Mega Buu". They're not even spelled the same. There's no need to include "Kid" in the name, either. "Mega Buu" is fine.
Daishokaioshin 16:29, 1 July 2006 (UTC)

I still think we should go with Buff Buu as it's the most used name. On Google, Buff Buu gets 1,670 results while Mega Buu gets 123 and Super Kid Buu gets 34. On Yahoo!, Buff Buu gets 385 results while Mega Buu gets 36 and Super Kid Buu gets 146. Nemu 16:42, 1 July 2006 (UTC)

Well, I don't think a slang term should be used in this instance, but I also don't want to put this to a vote. If you feel that "Buff Buu" is the best name for this article, then I'm not going to debate it. But still, Mega fits the trend and naming conventions better than Buff. I don't have much of an argument besides that, and my feeling that the use of the word "buff" (especially in this instance) sounds dumb, so I can't offer anything else that might persuade you. Once we decide on a name, we should stick to it, regardless of what it is, unless a change in media or culture causes one name to be more appropriate.
Daishokaioshin 16:50, 1 July 2006 (UTC)

Eh, I guess you're right. It should stay Mega Buu. Nemu 17:00, 1 July 2006 (UTC)

Yeah, Mega Buu sounds fine to me, a lot better than that crappy "Buff Buu". Jienum

Super Buu w/Gohan...Again?

Wiki-star. We have been over this so many times it is not even funny. Everyone but you has agreed that Super Buu (Gohan Absorbed) is by absolutely NO means the "nicest" Buu. I thought you were going to put up your edits for voting before making them? We're not going to have any mention of nicety in this article in relation to Super Buu (Gohan Absorbed) or any other version of Buu aside from Fat Buu. The reasons why Super Buu (GA) is not nice have been detailed repeatedly in the past, and I'm not going to repeat them. Please refrain from putting in this incorrect and POV information. Thanks.

Daishokaioshin 00:14, 3 July 2006 (UTC)

  • Wiki-star: Hmmm.... you're right! I was going to make a section about this anywayz, but thanks for saving me the trouble! Ok, lets take this step by step, to see where we all are in this one:


Step 1: Super Buu w/Gohan performed the least expected evil actions, of any Super Buu.


If you agree with the above Step, sign your name under the Agreement section. If not, sign your name under the Disagreement section. Please be aware, that you must include at least 2 sentences explaining your reason for choosing that agreement. The reason must be factual, logical, and backed up with evidence. Thanks!

I Agree:
Wiki-star 00:33, 3 July 2006 (UTC) I agree with this Step, because Super Buu w/Gohan could do some evil things, but didn't. All the other Super Buu's (except the one with piccolo) showed perfect signs of absolute destruction, and pain. Yes, Super Buu w/Gohan is evil. But he is the least evil of all the Super Buus. He just is. He changed Vegitto back, he gave goku a chance to fuse. Super Buu w/Gotenks and Piccolo didn't give goku a chance to do anything. He just immediatley started to attack him, and almost killed him. I definitely agree with this Step.

  • Wiki-star (Point 2): You're wrong Dai! Super Buu w/Gohan also gave Goku and Vegeta a chance to fuse. It was short, but it was Vegeta's arrogance that got in the way. If what you're saying is true, about Buu knowing the result of Goku's fusion, that would mean he would've known Goku and Vegeta's fusion would be more powerful than himself. Yes, this maybe arrogance, but he is nice enough to actually give them the opportunity to fuse. This is a risk, and no other Super Buu took this risk. If Super Buu w/Gohan is as evil as any other Buu, he would've destroyed Earth right after he defeated Vegetto. He wouldn't give Goku any chance of fusing, instead he would be the hell out of him first, then kill him. Bad guys have only one motive, but this Buu has many. Wiki-star 01:35, 3 July 2006 (UTC)
  • Wiki-star (Point 3): Not really Nemu. That would be like saying Super Buu could just kill Piccolo and Gotenks after he was trapped within the Hyperbolic Time Chamber, and then figure a way out. Instead he didn't. I'm not saying Super Buu w/Gohan is the nicest Buu, but he is the least evil Super Buu. Everything that i have stated stands. Wiki-star
  • Wiki-star (Point 4): Good KojiDude, but not good enough. You've left enough errors within that statement for me to clean up. It's not the fact that he's arrogant that keeps me responding, it's the fact that he actually decided to have sympathy on Goku. So what if he was arrogant? He could've showed that arrogance another way. He could've beaten up Goku like he did with Gohan, and mock him about how weak he is compare to him. He could've done a lot of stuff to show off, but why give him a chance to fuse? Why change Vegetto back, when he's small and hopeless? Buu wasn't thinking about destroying nothing, which is why his evil intentions were haulted temporarily. Wiki-star 01:35, 3 July 2006 (UTC)
  • Wiki-star (Point 5): (Please do not shift my agreement cases elsewhere. They belong here on this side of the issue! Thanks) First of all Dai, i'm going to need you stop addressing me in CAPS. We're in a civil discussion, not an argument. Maintain you're composure my good miss! Now, back on topic. Super Buu w/Gotenks and Piccolo was arrogant, but he never gave Goku and especially not Mystic Gohan any opportunity to do anything! And he knew he was the strongest being in the universe. So what are you trying to say Dai? Wiki-star 01:35, 3 July 2006 (UTC)
  • Wiki-star (Point 6): I understand that Super Buu w/Gohan was extremely arrogant, that i most definitely agree with you folks. However, there is a very thick line between him and when he had Gotenks. Super Buu w/Gotenks and Piccolo was just as arrogant as Super Buu w/Gohan. He wasn't nearly as powerful, but he was the strongest being in the universe. He was arrogant, but yet he showed no sign of wanting a challenge. He maybe more charismatic, but he was about to kill Gohan, Goku, and destroy the Earth. Super Buu w/Gohan never showed that kind of evil (even though he could). Wiki-star 01:48, 3 July 2006 (UTC)
  • Wiki-star (Point 7): You are correct Koji, however not enough. Super Buu w/Gotenks and Piccolo was about to kill Gohan and Goku, along with destroying the earth. He was beating Gohan to death, whereas Super Buu w/Gohan was toying around with Goku and Vegeta, giving them tons of chances to hit him. Even though he is alot stronger than them both, Super Buu w/Gohan never had to do that. Gohan wasn't as strong as Super Buu w/Gotenks and Piccolo, but he could inflict damage. Regardless he was no match, and Buu took advantage of that and beat him, almost to the point of death. Super Buu w/Gohan was mostly toying around, even giving chances. Thats nice, regardless of how arrogant it may seem Wiki-star 02:00, 3 July 2006 (UTC)


I Disagree:

I disagree, because the reasons you have stated are misinterpretations of events. Super Buu (Absorbed Gohan) changed Vegetto back to his normal form because he thought he would have more luck against him in that form than in his candy form, where Vegetto was far too small and agile for Buu to land a single blow. Super Buu (AG) gave Goku the chance to fuse with either Dende or Mr. Satan, sure. 5 seconds to choose between them. Why? Because he didn't think it would make a difference. He knew he was the strongest fighter in the universe at the time, and didn't think that a Fusion would produce anything capable of harming him, and even if it did, he didn't believe they would truly be able to defeat him. He was being arrogant, not nice. All of this has been pointed out in the past, but I'm pointing it out here again. Daishokaioshin 00:38, 3 July 2006 (UTC)

I disagree, for all the reasons Dai stated, and Super Buu (GA) tried to blow up earth twice. Sounds pretty damn evil to me. KojiDude 00:43, 3 July 2006 (UTC)

Disagree: He was not nice. If you didn't see it, Candy Vegetto was kicking Gohan Buu's ass(Side note: Don't use filler in arguments). He had no way to beat him. His only chance was to change him back. He was just toying with Goku when he gave him the chance to fuse. His options were weak and Buu liked watching him squirm. Nemu 00:45, 3 July 2006 (UTC)

Comments:

(Reply to Point 2)- Buu didn't think they would be powerful enough to beat him. He thought he was the strongest. It wasn't a point of niceness, it was a point of over-confidence in himself. KojiDude 01:10, 3 July 2006 (UTC)

What does point three have to do with anything that I said? Nemu 01:14, 3 July 2006 (UTC)

I'm not wrong. He gave Goku and Vegeta a chance to fuse because HE DIDN'T THINK THAT IT WOULD MAKE A DIFFERENCE. If you actually read what I said, I said he THOUGHT and BELIEVED that Fusion would not result in anything that would be a threat to him. He was being utterly arrogant, not nice. He gave them the chance to Fuse, not only due to arrogance, but due to his desire to have a challenge. If, by some chance, the Fusion wound up being powerful, he still didn't BELIEVE that they would be able to beat him, even if they were a challenge. And he had no REASON to destroy Earth immediately. He was the strongest being in the universe! There was no rush! There were no pressing concerns for him, other than experiencing his new power, and doing as he pleased. And no, "bad guys" do not have "only one motive". I'm not going to get into a discussion on the psychology of villains, but let it be known that just because someone doesn't kill someone else immediately (especially in DBZ) does not make them a nice individual.
And Super Buu in the Room of Spirit and Time wanted to fight Gotenks, because he was promised a strong fighter. He probably WOULD have killed him, but he was distracted from the fight before that could happen, when Piccolo destroyed the entrance and proclaimed they were all stuck in there. Are you going to say that Super Buu is "nice" just because he didn't get around to killing Gotenks and Piccolo, and instead chose to leave them in the Room of Spirit and Time for eternity?
And if you're suddenly not saying that Super Buu (AG) is the nicest of all Buus, then you're going back on all the arguments you just made. Try not to contradict yourself. Daishokaioshin 01:16, 3 July 2006 (UTC)

Point four: The reason he let Goku fuse was to get a challenge. What's the point of beong the strongest in the universe when you can't even use your power against anything? He just miscalculated the fusion's possible strength. That's not nice, it's looking out for your own interests.

Did you not see that episode? Candy Vegetto was not weak. He had all of his strength and was made impossible to hit. Buu couldn't do anything to him. Vegetto was easily beating him in that form, and the only was for Buu to have any chance of winning was for him to change Vegetto back, so it would be possible to hit him. Nemu 01:43, 3 July 2006 (UTC)

(Reply to points 4,5, and 6): You aren't understanding, AGAIN. Buu w/ Gotenks even says himself he didn't absorb Gohan because he wanted a callenge. Super Buu w/ Gohan did try to blow up earth TWICE. He gave Goku the chance to fuse because He wanted a challenge and to test his power. He didn't have sympathy for him, he saw it as an oprotuinity to test his new found power. KojiDude 01:53, 3 July 2006 (UTC)


(Reply to point 7): It wasn't niceness, it was for fun. Buu w/ Gohan was Sadistic and Cruel, just as any other Buu. He wanted to see Goku and Vegeta go through the irony of defeate, and loss of pride. He wasn't less evil he was more self-obsessed. Super Buu killed all humans because he wanted a challenge, where as Fat Buu killed them slowly for fun. Each Buu has different ideas of fun, that doesn't make them any more evil or nice. KojiDude 02:15, 3 July 2006 (UTC)

Comments belong in their own section. You have already voted that you disagree. Putting a bunch of crap under there where it doesn't belong is a waste of space. I reorganized things to be a better read. And I didn't address my response in all caps. I use capitalized words for emphasis, as I pointed out a long time ago. And this IS an argument. And argument is a valid form of communication in which individuals with opposing view points present evidence to support claims and then try to convince others of their point of view.
I have really had enough of this. You have been outvoted. We don't need to convince you of anything. This is a vote, not a "convince Wiki-star to behave"-athon. People voted, the concensus is that Super Buu (AG) is NOT the nicest Buu or any less evil than any other. Your "points" are flawed and don't prove anything. You just refuse to admit when you're wrong. The discussion is concluded. If you want to continue discussing it, feel free, but we have reached a decision here.
Daishokaioshin 02:12, 3 July 2006 (UTC)
  • Wiki-star: Listen Dai, i don't have time for you and "Your Way or the highway". If you don't want to discuss and come to mutual agreement, that leaves me no choice but to keep adding that Super Buu w/Gohan is the least evil of all Super Buus. You're not hurting me when you cut me off in a discussion, you're greatly giving me reason to become non-negotiable. I could've just added this without discussing, because it valid. Oh well, we'll see now won't we? Wiki-star 02:26, 3 July 2006 (UTC)
Look who's talkin. "Your way or the highway" ....Hm.....Reminds me of someone...... KojiDude 02:28, 3 July 2006 (UTC)


The point isn't to convince you. The point is to come to an agreement as long as the majority agrees. If you aren't going to listen to the vote, we'll just have to go through the same crap we've been through, all over again. Nemu 02:30, 3 July 2006 (UTC)

  • Wiki-star: I'm not listening? I'm here showing you all my point, and you all show me yours. That way we can say, "Allright heres out it's going to be....". I don't have a problem going back to the good ol' dayz. If thats ok with you all, then it's definitely fine with me! So when can we start? Wiki-star 02:41, 3 July 2006 (UTC)


What the hell, man? Did you not see what I just said? CONTINUE DISCUSSING. I don't CARE. But discussion is NOT the point of this! This is a VOTE. We voted that Super Buu (AG) is NOT the nicest Buu, and thus the matter is OVER. You can continue discussing it until the universe implodes, and it won't make a difference, because you were OUTVOTED. This isn't "my way or the highway". This isn't ABOUT what I want. This is about the FACTS. The FACTS have been stated, and you have used nothing but POV to support your claims. You haven't proven anything, and we have proven everything in what we said. We don't need to convince you that what we said is true. Once again: This was a vote, not a discussion. If you want to start a discussion on it, then do so. But the vote is over, and the concensus has been reached. It's done. You will continue to obey the rules of Wikipedia, regardless of what other users say or do. The rules do NOT go out the window just because YOU don't like how things are going. ::Daishokaioshin 02:33, 3 July 2006 (UTC)
  • Wiki-star: Haaa... whomsoever would like to discuss this issue until all parties have come to an agreement, please do so! Until then, i'll just keep re-adding. Thanks for all your co-operation folks. Wiki-star 02:41, 3 July 2006 (UTC)
You are the one who started this vote, Wiki-star, and just because you lost you say you're going to continue editing like nothing happened? You are just a narrow minded sore loser. Take a minute to consider just for once, that maybe others might be right, and you won't have a problem. KojiDude 02:37, 3 July 2006 (UTC)
  • Wiki-star: Hmhmhm, the insults never stop do they? Keep it up my good sir! Wiki-star 02:41, 3 July 2006 (UTC)
  • I see that you have all started bickering again. There's honestly no need for it, I swear. Ok, on the matter of Super Buu w/Gohan being the nicest of the Super Buus, I don't think it is true, just because he was going to allow Goku to fuse with someone. After all, Super Buu w/Gotenks was prepared to allow Goku to do so. It's bad enough that you're arguing again, but putting down........I don't know. I tried my best, but it just didn't work. Jienum

You wanted civil reasoning Wiki-star? Here it is.

Super Buu w/ Gohan is not the nicest. We took a vote on that and listed every reason why he isn't. He is the strongest for many obvious reasons. Kid Buu was slightly weaker than SSJ3 Goku, where as Super Buu w/ Gohan could knock him aside easily. He is definitly more powerful than Super Buu w/ Gotenks, due to the power difference between Gohan and Gotenks. What makes you think he isn't the strongest? KojiDude 02:49, 3 July 2006 (UTC)

  • Wiki-star: First of all, please address me by my name. Who is "You"? Anywayz, Their is not proof from either creators or inventors of this series, that clearly states that Super Buu w/Gohan is by far the strongest of all Buus. This theory is only logically proven. So you can't say that "His is the strongest Buu" out flat. Give him a possibilty, but not the title. He has the greatest chance of getting the title for Buu's strongest form, but that doesn't mean he absolutely is! Wiki-star 02:54, 3 July 2006 (UTC)
You just said it was logically proven. If somone asked Akira Toriyama if Super Buu w/ Gohan is the strongest buu, he'd probably say "Well, duh.". He is obviousley the most powerful, and sayign he isn't is just plain stupid, no offense. God, I feel so stupid ranking up the numbers on my electricity bill to talk sense into you...You gonna pay me back or what? KojiDude 02:59, 3 July 2006 (UTC)
We don't NEED Akira Toriyama to say, "Super Buu (Absorbed Gohan) is the strongest version of Buu". If logic follows that he is, and all evidence points to him being so, it can be safely said that he IS. We don't need to put "possibly". Why are you being so stubborn about this? It's two words that don't belong. You're obsessing over this like you did with the addition of a single blank line in the article, previously. It's not something that needs to be debated.
Daishokaioshin 02:56, 3 July 2006 (UTC)
http://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/Paramount
  • Wiki-star: Why thank you for doing all that hard work for me Dai, you're a sweet heart! However, you've just proven me right! According to that Wikitionary, Super Buu w/Gohan's power is above everything (or everyone) elses, and is the highest power in the universe (without Vegetto). So what exactly are you trying to say? And no, i won't accept that. Super Buu is a logical name for when he ate Fat Buu, but wheres the real proof for that name? Where is the proof for when Buu had gotenks within him, he is named "Super Buu w/Gotenks and Piccolo". Leave Super Buu w/Gohan as the highest possible Buu for being the strongest, not the exact strongest! If not, we'll just be dancing all night long. Wiki-star 03:08, 3 July 2006 (UTC)
Please stop talking. I haven't done any work for you, nor proven you right. I didn't put that link in there, and the context in which you have been using paramount is incorrect. It doesn't mean what you think it means. I don't know why KojiDude decided to link that there, but it just confuses the issue further, and should not have been placed there. What would you consider valid "proof" before you will accept that Super Buu (AG) is the strongest Buu? You keep saying there's no proof, but you aren't saying what proof is needed. He was more powerful than anyone else in the universe before Vegetto. There was no one stronger than him. Isn't that proof enough?
Daishokaioshin 03:13, 3 July 2006 (UTC)
  • Wiki-star: I will not stop talking, because you have no control over me. Lets keep discussing civily, and understand each other. Super Buu w/Gohan, i quite possibly Buu's strongest form. Which means it is a possiblity, no other Buu has that possibilty than him. Which means, he is the strongest Buu, or is highly assumed to be. You can't just put, "He's the strongest" out flat. Not everyone agrees, we have to have a neutral point, but factual evidence to back up the point. Wiki-star 03:18, 3 July 2006 (UTC)
Everyone but you agrees. And I thought the link would clear up the argument on the proper use of the word, sorry Dai. KojiDude 03:20, 3 July 2006 (UTC)
Do you not speak English? That version of Buu IS the strongest. "Factual evidence" has been provided, and there is NOTHING that contradicts it. I asked what you would consider "proof" before you will accept this. Tell us what proof is needed before you'll stop this inane reverting. Everyone is being civil, and I never said I had any control over you.
Which means, he is the strongest Buu, or is highly assumed to be. You JUST SAID IT. He IS the strongest. Period.
You can't just put, "He's the strongest" out flat. Why not?
Not everyone agrees, we have to have a neutral point, but factual evidence to back up the point. The only one who disagrees is you. If you really want to be that "neutral" about it, then we should remove all mention of him being the strongest, possible or otherwise.
Daishokaioshin 03:22, 3 July 2006 (UTC)
  • Wiki-star: Not because you aren't participating within this conversation, doesn't mean you agree with it. Guest readers could possibly not agree with it, and move on to another more factual site. I'm not saying Super Buu w/Gohan is not the strongest Buu, but he isn't proven 100% universally acceptable to be. Thats all! Wiki-star 03:27, 3 July 2006 (UTC)
Ok, #1:Wiki-star, you are adding false information over and over, without listening to the reasoning of others. If you have any sense of dignity at all, you will stop your vandalism now. #2:The guest readers don't have a say in it. Only the people involved in the argument, me, Dai, you, and Nemu. Everyone but you agrees. KojiDude 03:29, 3 July 2006 (UTC)
  • Wiki-star: Sorry, but i'm not the one posting false information here. None of you can give a resource, that suggest Super Buu w/Gohan being the strongest of all Buus. As a result, you are all wrong! I don't have to agree with knowone, as long as i can back myself up with logical evidence, resource, and proof! Thats all it takes folks. Wiki-star 03:35, 3 July 2006 (UTC)
We've given more than enough reasoning. You haven't. You're contradicting yourself again. KojiDude 03:38, 3 July 2006 (UTC)
  • Wiki-star: Whatever you say my good man! Lets enjoy the article. Wiki-star 03:44, 3 July 2006 (UTC)
Okay. Look. Stating that Buu is the "nicest" of all Buus is false. You can't prove he is, and we have disproven it. We have voted to not include such POV and incorrect statements in the article. That is over with. Next. You have tried to add in that Buu was going to "crown himself king of the universe". Buu wanted to DESTROY things, not RULE things. He had no interest in crowning himself king of anything. Finally. You have yet to tell us what sources or proof are required to convince you that Super Buu (AG) is the strongest of all Buus. Until you do so, you will have to accept all the evidence previous provided. That Goku and Vegeta, the then two strongest beings in the universe, were no match for Buu after absorbing Gohan. That the only way that Goku could think of to beat Buu was to permanently fuse with Vegeta. That there was NO hope of ANYONE else laying a hand on him, while SSJ3 Goku was able to fight evenly with Kid Buu. Logic, and the evidence I just provided, indicate that Buu (AG) is the strongest of all Buus. You have yet to provide ANY reasoning or evidence that this is not the case.
You're right. You don't have to agree with anyone. But you do have to abide by the decisions and concensus reached by other users, and to follow the rules of wikipedia. If you don't want to accept that others are right and you are wrong, that is your own business. But you will not continue to revert the article, or re-add false information.
Daishokaioshin 03:45, 3 July 2006 (UTC)
  • Wiki-star: First of all, you have no proof to tell me that Super Sayain 3 Goku couldn't challenge Super Buu w/Gohan. As hopless as that sounds, it is only an assumption. Not because Kid Buu could handle Super Sayain 3 Goku, doesn't mean he is no match for Super Buu w/Gohan. That is also an assumption, seeing as though those Buus will never fight each other. Don't ask what i want, ask what the article needs. And i think it needs a resourceful proff stating Super Buu w/Gohan is 100% the strongest of all Buus. Until you do so, you are never going to stop me from doing and saying the right thing! Wiki-star 03:51, 3 July 2006 (UTC)
Try reading what you just said. Don't ask what i want, ask what the article needs. and then And i think it needs a resourceful proff stating Super Buu w/Gohan is 100% the strongest of all Buus. If it's about what the article needs, then why are you telling me what you want and think? You thinking something is true doens't make it so. The article does NOT need the addition of two words that have no place in it, and a bunch of erroneous information. If you want "proff" stating Super Buu (AG) is "100% the strongest of all Buus" then TELL ME WHAT PROOF YOU REQUIRE. You refusing to tell me is just your way of giving yourself an excuse to continue reverting. And you WILL be stopped from doing and saying the WRONG thing as you are doing now.
Daishokaioshin 03:55, 3 July 2006 (UTC)
  • Wiki-star: Instead of asking me what i need, you should allready be giving evidence and resource that states Super Buu w/Gohan is 100% the strongest Buu. But here you are, crying and quarrelling. Using CAPS to show your anger. Tsk Tsk Tsk. Anywayz, i've got contributing to do. Call me on cell-phone when you're calm down, relaxed, have rescources, and ready to talk without cutting off. Wiki-star 04:00, 3 July 2006 (UTC)


SSJ3 Goku didn't stand a chance against Buu w/ Gotenks, so he'd get massacered against Buu w/ Gohan. Simple logic. Super Buu w/ Gohan is the strongest buu. None of the other buus compare to his strength, nor does anyone but Vegetto and other non-cannon villains. KojiDude 03:59, 3 July 2006 (UTC)
  • Wiki-star: Yes, i agree with you there. But Super Sayain 3 Goku didn't stand a chance against Kid Buu either? So what are you saying? Wiki-star 04:01, 3 July 2006 (UTC)
Yes, he did stand a chance. He even said so himself he could've won, but saved some fighting for Vegeta. The only reason he lost was his in-ability to hold Super Saiyan 3. He says in the manga "Damn! If only I could gather the power I could win! This never happened in the after-life..." KojiDude 04:02, 3 July 2006 (UTC)
  • Wiki-star: Goku said that with Fat Buu as well, but they both looked pretty evenly matched to me. Kid Buu was stronger than Goku, because he got serious at the middle of the fight, and Goku was loosing then. He tried to fight back, but Buu was too fast, and too childish. His power was draining, and he was a hopeless puppy. Even if he was at full power, he probably would've been slightly even with Kid Buu. However, Buu would always have some advantage over him! Wiki-star 04:11, 3 July 2006 (UTC)
When he fought Fat Buu he was dead, and could use more of his power. He said he could kill Kid Buu if he could gather that power. It was the weakness of a living body that stopped him, not a lack of power. Onikage725
This is pretty off topic...Why don't you wait until the argument is over before editing the page like a nomral person? Why don't you face the fact that you're wrong like a normal person? Why don't you understand that we are right? Why don't you friggin stop being an idiot? Read everything in the talk page from the begining. You're the stubborn one who can't accept logic. You're the vandal. You're the one who has been blocked over and over. Think really hard Wiki-star, what does it all add up to? Un-fair treatment? No. People not seeing your point of view? No. Figure it out. KojiDude 04:16, 3 July 2006 (UTC)

Oy...Here we go again. I don't know if this will even help, but hey...gotta try. You listening Wiki?

Super Buu w/ Gohan, in the manga, didn't let Goku fuse with Vegeta. He gave him 5 seconds to pick between Dende and Mr. Satan (and, technically, Bee). It was pretty much a joke. Neither of them would have added much power, and may have possibly limited him in the process. When Goku sensed Vegeta, he teleported him and talked him into fusin before Buu got there. Anything beyond that was filler and has little place in a discussion like this. Buuut let's go with the filler for a sec, just for the sake of argument. Even saying that, you have to realize one thing. Buu was beyond Gotenks. He had Goten and Trunks in him, as well as the even more powerful Piccolo. He had the good Majin Buu. He had Mystic Gohan, who's power surpassed even an SSJ3's (at least while alive). It certainly surpassed Gotenks'. As far as he was concerned, he had some of the most powerful beings inside of him. And he was rolling in Super Saiyans. What could two more do to him, even if they joined? He'd faced fusion and as far as he was concerned it was no longer a threat. Basically, he underestimated them. Remember Vegeta vs Cell? Remember how Vegeta was so confident in the fact that he had ascended and was the baddest SOB alive that he allowed Cell to abosrb 18? That wasnt kindness. This with Buu would be the same thing.

Second, you cant keep on about him not wanting to blow up Earth, cuz he tries it more than once. The second time he says that he's going to destroy it to celebrate his omnipotence. On top of that, he also tried to unmake all of creation just to win a fight. And ya know...technically by your criteria Super Buu is the "nicest." Super Buu 3 gave Goku 5 seconds to fuse with one of two worthless fighters? Super Buu 1 gave Goten and Trunks 30 minutes to perfect a fusion that Piccolo told him was going to kick his ass. Super Buu 3 was going to destroy the world/reality, while Super Buu 1 killed 1/3 of the human population (Fat Buu had already killed 2/3 of the populace before the Genocide Attack) and even spared Mr. Satan. So even on those grounds the whole argument falls flat.

Now, since you've opted to do a 180 on the hypocrisy scale and argue about Super Buu's strength, let me remind you. You used to be big on that. Seriously, it was like the one thing we ever agreed on. How did you go from "he IS the strongest" to "there's no proof?" Would you like me to restate the proof? Simple power chart- Super Buu w/ Gohan > Super Buu w/ Gotenks > Mystic Gohan > Gotenks = Super Buu > SSJ3 Goku. If you doubt that, then you need to stop basing your arguments on anime filler and pick up the manga from time to time. That stuffs cool, but has no weight on these discussions. We're talking about the same people who suggested Yamcha, with like a month of training with Kaio-sama and without learning Kaioken, went from "just better than a Saibaiman" to "complete pwnage of Rikum." Filler is just that: filler. Onikage725

Must have been one hell of a weekend

I must have missed on hell of a weekend... I was gone for two days and all of sudden I come back to find Wiki-star blocked (again) for a week now, Dragon Emperor (along with all of his sockpuppets} blocked indefinitely, and my user page Semi-Protected against vandals? What happened? Someone fill me in... --3bulletproof16 16:35, 3 July 2006 (UTC)

Wiki-star made it look like he was going to be rational by voting on his changes. He didn't accept the vote and went back to his usual behavior. Nemu 16:42, 3 July 2006 (UTC)
Well, hate to tell you guys "I told you so", but I Told You So... You can try to be "nice" to him all you want, you can try to communicate and discuss the problem with him in a civil and respectful manner a dozen times, you can try to come up with different ways to handle this situation a million times, you can ban him for 24, 48, 72 hours, hell even a week only to see him return and act in the same disrespectful, ignorant, uncivil, hostile, manner that he has grown accustomed to. Not once has he listened to the voice of reason. The fact of the matter is this plain and simple. Wiki-star has been, is, and always be Wiki-star. --3bulletproof16 16:55, 3 July 2006 (UTC)
Seriously. Next time this happens (and mark my words, it will happen again) we can just copy/pasting old arguments. How many times have we voted on the exact same thing? Just so he can put the words "nice" and "possibly" in? Onikage725 17:00, 3 July 2006 (UTC)
It seems almost too unreal. Just look at us. We have all been argueing with Wiki-star, for almost 2 months now over whether or not Super Buu with Gohan is the "nicest". Of all things in this article, we've been force to deal with this troll because he hates that the article doesn't include a list of his favorite character's episode appearances among other things. And the way he talks about the article, to editors in general, makes me sick. " Oh, I will not let you harm such a wonderful, fascinating, amazing article!" and "Hate to break it to you sweet heart...". It is unbelievably annoying. And honestly... (Real World View On This) all this over a lousy Japanese comic book character. Now I don't mean to insult any fans by saying that ('cause I'm one myself) but come on! (You gotta admit) This is ridiculous! --3bulletproof16 17:27, 3 July 2006 (UTC)
Yeah, you have a point. I wasn't involved in any of the arguments except this one but I did observe the rest. This is pretty stupid. What should we do? KojiDude 17:43, 3 July 2006 (UTC)
No KojiDude, stupid doesn't even begin to describe how stupid this argument was. What we should do is be patient on this and eventually ("Eeeeeeeeeeeventually"), as stated before, Wiki-star will shoot himself in the foot and get banned indefinitely... (Not that he hasn't already shot himself in the foot before, there just hasn't been an admin around long enough to notice it, unfortunately) --3bulletproof16 17:53, 3 July 2006 (UTC)
I don't believe this!! Wiki-Star just won't quit "fighting the battle", will he? Is it possible for someone to be blocked for good from Wikipedia? Jienum
  • I have come across plenty of troublemakers...and I can undoubtedly confirm that wiki-star takes the cake at being the most annoying revert anarchist. He simply does not quit his senseless bickering. He should somehow permanently be banned. He will obviously not stop his annoying regime of causing chaos. - Zarbon

Dispute Resolution

Wow, I'm somewhat glad I'm on vacation and cannot access a computer regularly. You guys need to realise that you have to move forward in the Wikipedia:Dispute Resolution process. Someone find out where you lie here: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Resolving_disputes. File a report and move on. I get the feeling a lot of people have not done this because of the work it requires. Rest assured, this arguing takes up much more time and effort. Also, do not say to yourself, "Well, Wiki-star is banned for a week so I don't need to think about it." No, this is the perfect time to do it. --Orion Minor 20:01, 4 July 2006 (UTC)

Do you honestly think that this is going to help in the arguments with Wiki-Star? Well, it's not. Jienum
Words of wisdom... --3bulletproof16 15:20, 5 July 2006 (UTC)
What's that supposed to mean, Bullet? Jienum
...Proof... and you forgot the 3:16... Anyways... No I'm not being sarcastic if that's what you think, I'm just agreeing with you. Thumbs up. --3bulletproof16 14:55, 6 July 2006 (UTC)
Oh, well thanks for the backup. So, I heard that Wiki-Star says that Super Buu w/Gohan is the nicest of the Buus. If he means all the Buus, then he's wrong, because we all know that the nicest of the Buus is Fat Buu. And if he means nicest of all the Super Buus, he's still wrong because Super Buu w/Gohan was just as evil as the other Super Buus, only more powerful. Jienum

Wiki-Star's Continued Vandalism

  • I am posting this time because Wiki-Star has not only vandalized here at wikipedia, but he entered a forum of mine and posted idiotic, moronic, and flamatory remarks...it's becoming very annoying. I just want to say that he is being a real chaotic troublemaker and his obscene language and disgusting mannerisms are causing mass havoc. I am excessively tired of his annoying foolishness. I need someone to help me with this child's behavior because he is continuing to vandalize and I am frankly tired of deleting and ip banning him from my place. - Zarbon
  • I don't know what in god's name you're talking about Zarbon, but whatever it is, it sure won't get in the way of me contributing! Wiki-star 05:49, 10 July 2006 (UTC)


Just a lil' Too Much

  • The current state of this article is too broaden, and wide. Majin Buu has fought too many battles to all be thoroughly explained. "VS" battles are only for temporarily seen characters, for example Vegetto or Gogeta. Otherwise, you might wanna keep the article short and concise! Any concerns? Ask away Wiki-star 05:49, 10 July 2006 (UTC)
You deleted more than half the article because they used the word "VS"... KojiDude (talk) 05:59, 10 July 2006 (UTC)
After all that time I put into cleaning up and improving the article, you just had to change it. The article is too summarised like this. I think my way, the detailed one, should be on wikipedia, instead of a very brief explanation Jienum
  • Wiki-star: You can still edit your detailed information, but please do not create so much "VS" section. Keep the article concise. Just give a brief, if not a couple detailed description about each section. If you still fail to understand why your format is not acceptable, then i'll just have to keep sinking it in your head the old fashion way. But you're free to reply. Wiki-star 17:08, 10 July 2006 (UTC)
Wiki-star, please talk about your edits BEFORE making them. And wait for your edits to be debated before making them. KojiDude (talk) 18:32, 10 July 2006 (UTC)
That won't work. He's under the impression that we need to convince him that his edits are wrong. He's to stubborn to think he's wrong, so he'll just keep going. Nemu 18:39, 10 July 2006 (UTC)
Good point. Let's just wait until he breaks the 3rr and then revert it to the old version. KojiDude (talk) 18:42, 10 July 2006 (UTC)
  • Wiki-star: Thanks, but you don't need to remind me about talking things over, because i always do. And strategize all you want on how you're going to get rid of me. Still won't work, the right will always prevail! Wiki-star 18:58, 10 July 2006 (UTC)

You do not talk things over. You pretend to listen to people then declare that all those arguments are false. You are very annoying. Nemu 19:01, 10 July 2006 (UTC)

  • Wiki-star: Whatever you say Nemu, you're a fine contributor too! Wiki-star 19:07, 10 July 2006 (UTC)

Actions and Effects

Are those sections really nesecary? The reader already knows what Buu did, and re-listing it seems pointless. KojiDude (talk) 19:53, 10 July 2006 (UTC)

  • Wiki-star: Wrong again! Not everyone knows that Buu did. Consider those that are new to the article! But thanks for asking, you're a good man! Wiki-star 20:01, 10 July 2006 (UTC)
If the person was new they would read the atricle, then they would know. It already states everything you're putting, just in more detail. KojiDude (talk) 20:02, 10 July 2006 (UTC)
  • Wik-star: You're half right! These sections point out the legacy of Buu, what he did and what he was famous for. Their neccessary for when a reader just wants to know Buu's legacy. Ok? Wiki-star 20:06, 10 July 2006 (UTC)

Wiki-star

Ok, Wiki-star, think about it. Read the rules, and think about it. Read your block log and think about it. Read the talk page's archives and think about it. It all points to you being incorrect. Stop being so stubborn. You do have to convince somone: Us. You have to explain your edits before you make them and wait until they are aproved to make them. You can't say you talked about it because you said "Talk it over on the talk page!" in your edit summary. KojiDude (talk) 20:29, 10 July 2006 (UTC)

  • Wiki-star: I opened the discussion for those who actually wish to talk it over. And as far as i'm concerned, not everyone will want to speak with me. It really doesn't bother me, as long as i take the initiative to open the discussion. As you can see, i've opened every discussion about the current conflicts (or most of them). I don't need anyone's approval to edit, so please don't tell me to wait on approval. However, i need feedback to correct anything wrong in what i am doing. And knowone is really giving me that. I've told TTN to stop adding these "VS" sections, there are completely obsolete in this article. Buu fought too many battles to all be thoroughly explained. Just give me the juice, i don't need to bag! Understand? If not, i'm all ears! Wiki-star 20:37, 10 July 2006 (UTC)

The only reason I readd them is because you have too many bad edits within the small amout of good ones to search out. The only time you agree with peoples' arguments is when they agree with you. We should not have to tell you what's wrong. YOU should have to tell us what's right. Nemu 20:43, 10 July 2006 (UTC)

You do need aproval, you need somone to tell you your edits are right and you need to prove to us that they're right. So far, that hasn't happened. Just people saying they're wrong. If so many people think you're incorrect, then logically you are. If you disagree with that, it just proves how stubborn and anoying you are. KojiDude (talk) 20:46, 10 July 2006 (UTC)
  • Wiki-star: Stubborn, Shmubbern! You're making it sound like all my edits are always wrong! And that whatever you folks say about them are always right! Ha, you folks are something. Call me whatever you wish, i'm still going to contribute! Thanks anyways! Wiki-star 20:53, 10 July 2006 (UTC)
You've still yet to show anything to imply that your edits are right. KojiDude (talk) 20:55, 10 July 2006 (UTC)
  • Wiki-star: Why should i always have to be the one explaining huh? You've got flaws too you know Koji, so why not explain you'rs? Wiki-star 20:59, 10 July 2006 (UTC)
He isn't the one adding a ton of changes. Nemu 21:01, 10 July 2006 (UTC)
Super Buu (w/ Gohan) is just as smart as Super Buu (w/ Gotenks and Piccolo), or even smarter. There's no evidence to prove Super Buu w/ Gotenks is smarter. The effects and actions isn't really needed. It just makes the over sized article longer. The VS sections are fine, its a show all about fighting, and a character made for fighting. There's gonna be alot of VS. KojiDude (talk) 21:04, 10 July 2006 (UTC)
  • Wiki-star: Ok, first and foremost. Look at the Frieza article, why isn't there every VS battle about who Frieza fought? Why isn't there the same for Cell, Picollo, Goku, and the rest? Listen, just do no add these VS threads. They are only for temporarily seen characters. Now, onto the intelligence of the Super Buus. For one, Super Buu w/Gotenks and Picollo was shown to be smarter than any other Buu, including Super Buu w/Gohan. He knew all about Gohan, he tested Gohan, he even mentioned everything about the Z Fighters. Super Buu w/Gohan grew more powerful, and as a result loss any intelligent fighting. He was just a being of pure energy, and his confidence rose at it's pinacle! You can't show me one more intelligent action Super Buu w/Gohan did, that proves his equality if not superiority in intelligence, over Super Buu w/Gotenks and Picollo! Wiki-star 21:10, 10 July 2006 (UTC)
Why would he lose Piccolo's intelegence? And, Gohan had all the intellegence Super Buu w/ Gotenks had, so there really wouldn't be a difference. For what you're saying to be true, Gohan would have to know nothing about himself or the Z Fighters, and somhow he would cancel out Piccolo's intellegence for no reason. KojiDude (talk) 21:13, 10 July 2006 (UTC)
  • Wiki-star: It doesn't matter if he harnesses it or not. He never once showed a sign of being more intelligent than Super Buu w/Gotenks and Picollo. That Buu showed so many signs of patience, and test. It was a new Buu of pure knowledge! Wiki-star 21:18, 10 July 2006 (UTC)
Show me one page from the manga that implies that Super Buu w/ Gohan isn't as smart as Super Buu (w/ Gotenks). KojiDude (talk) 21:20, 10 July 2006 (UTC)
  • Wiki-star: There isn't! But that question is like asking me to show you one page from the mange that states Super Buu w/Gohan is the strongest of all Buus. These questions are invalid. They can only be logically explained. And as far as i'm concerned, i've given the logic! Wiki-star 21:24, 10 July 2006 (UTC)

How have you used logic? Think about it. Gotenks is very childish and "stupid". Why would the much smarter Gohan take more away from Piccolo's knowledge than Gotenks? Nemu 21:27, 10 July 2006 (UTC)

[2] There. Super Buu says he powered up alot from Super Buu w/ Gotenks. Scince Super Buu w/ Gotenks is stronger than Kid, Evil, Super, and Fat Buu, its obvious that Super Buu w/ Gohan is the strongest. KojiDude (talk) 21:30, 10 July 2006 (UTC)

  • Wiki-star: (I never said anything about Super Buu w/Gohan not being the strongest of all Buus) It's not the sacrifice that matters, it's the reward! Buu gained power through absorbing Gohan, and through his power he grew more confident in himself. He never once demonstrated ANYTHING about intelligence. He was too into his supreme power to show any sign of charismatic behavior. On the other hand, Super Buu w/Gotenks and Picollo showed more signs of intelligence. Gohan can also act strange at times, while picollo is all buisness and and a very smart fighter. Wiki-star 21:33, 10 July 2006 (UTC)
Did he ever show anything of loseing intellegince? No. He made up all those plans to defeate Vegetto, that seems pretty smart (even though Vegetto was smarter). The absorbtion, the candy, the "ripping the universe" thing. If Vegetto hadn't been so strong, those would have all worked. KojiDude (talk) 21:44, 10 July 2006 (UTC)

Suggestion

If you guys are so concerned about article length, why not make seperate articles for the various Buu's. (Good, Evil, Super, and Kid)

  • Wiki-star: Not neccessary! (But good idea) There wouldn't be too much to put, and in any case all Buu's are a result from the other. It's better if they all stay within the original Buu article. Wiki-star 20:42, 10 July 2006 (UTC)
I think it's a good idea. We should take a crack at it. KojiDude (talk) 20:46, 10 July 2006 (UTC)
Wait, hold your horses!! Just think, they're all forms of Buu, and they shouldn't really have an article each, should they? I mean, look at Freeza, Cell, Super Saiyan and Bebi. But if you're going to do that, leave the Fat Buu article for me, please. Jienum
That's another good idea. We could assign the articles to three people. Jienum could do Fat Buu (and put Evil Buu in there as another form), Nemu could do Super Buu (and list all his forms), and I or somone with more experience could do Kid Buu. And for what you said first Jienum: Freeza and Cell don't have as much information and transformations as Buu. KojiDude (talk) 20:54, 10 July 2006 (UTC)
Alright then. It's settled. So what do we do with the current page? Do we make this one into Fat Buu? I think we should because the initial picture is of Fat Buu. Jienum
Yeah, that makes sense. But let's try to get an admin's opinion, or a wikipedian with more experience, before we go and make changes like that. And changing this article would be the last thing to do, seeing as how it'd be easier to copy and paste current things on here. KojiDude (talk) 20:58, 10 July 2006 (UTC)
  • Wiki-star: What the hell do you folks think you're doing? This isn't about what you folks want, it's what the party wants! I personally don't care what articles you make, you just make sure you leave this article alone! Wiki-star 20:57, 10 July 2006 (UTC)

I don't really think it's a good idea. They're all the same entity and I think separate articles would just be too small and confusing in a way. Nemu 21:00, 10 July 2006 (UTC)

Yeah, you're right. Especially explaining the Kaioshin thing. That'd be practically impossible to do if there were three different articles. KojiDude (talk) 21:07, 10 July 2006 (UTC)
  • Wiki-star: Oh so now you're disagreeing because Nemu disagreed? Ahhhhh.... i see now. This definitely boosts my knowledge more about you now Koji. Wiki-star 21:11, 10 July 2006 (UTC)

Some of the Buu's actually do appear as entities seperate from the other. Fat Buu and Kid Buu exist at the same time as seperate combatants.

To Wiki Star: I didn't think about the Kaioshin thing until Nemu said "too small and confusing". If you had mentioned somthing about confusion or the kaioshin, I would have agreed. I go with whats right, not who I like. KojiDude (talk) 21:17, 10 July 2006 (UTC)

I meant that they are all still Buu. There is also the issue of the placement of Kid, Buff, and Evil Buu. None of them have enough information to really have a large article. You also have to think about how a person would have to switch around too much to get the full story. First start at Kid Buu, then goto Fat Buu, then read Super Buu and finally read a mix of Kid and Fat Buu. That would be annoying. Nemu 21:20, 10 July 2006 (UTC)

  • Wiki-star: Haaaa.... Nemu has finally given me a break from explanation. My fingers feel so much better! Haaaaa.... thank you! Wiki-star 21:22, 10 July 2006 (UTC)