Talk:Magdalena, New Mexico
From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
 |
This article is within the scope of WikiProject New Mexico, an attempt to better organize and improve articles related to the U.S. state of New Mexico. Join us on our project talk page. |
|
| ??? | This article has not yet received a rating on the quality scale. If you rate the article please leave a short summary here to explain the ratings and/or to identify the strengths and weaknesses of the article. | |
| ??? | This article has not yet received a rating on the importance scale. | |
[edit] Football
Please consider whether the contents of the Football section meet Wikipedia guidelines. Is this information of lasting value? Is it a calendar? --Bejnar 23:14, 25 October 2007 (UTC)
[edit] Village or town
Nyttend indicates that the US Census Bureau classifies Magdalena as a village. That is correct based upon population size; however, legally in New Mexico it was incorporated as a town in 1913, when it had a much larger population. As a town, it is allowed to have a Municipal Court, and certain other functions. So, I changed the language to say village-sized town. --Bejnar 22:39, 11 November 2007 (UTC)
- Of course it's a village: see here for proof. Nyttend 22:45, 11 November 2007 (UTC)
- I don't want an edit war either. You're the one prompting the changes, and I'm seeking to keep it in line with our reliable source. If you don't want an edit war, then don't violate the consensus that the US Census data is to be followed. Nyttend 22:45, 11 November 2007 (UTC)
- There is no question that the US Census Bureau is authoritative as to census figures. And the US Census Bureau has their own definitions of village, town, city etc.; however, those are not the only definitions. New Mexico does not have size definitions for towns and their authority, it requires meeting certain requirements and recognition by the Secretary of State. The Census bureau does not have to be wrong in order for other definitions of town to also apply. The US Census bureau defines these terms solely by size. That is not the only legal criteria. Be open to more than one definition of town. --Bejnar 22:52, 11 November 2007 (UTC)
- "Town" and "Village" are terms that have multiple meanings. Some "villages" under Wisconsin law are much more populous than some "cities"; this is a similar situation. Just wikilink to the meaning of "town" that applies here, since the place's legal status trumps the Census non-statutory definition. --Orange Mike 14:46, 12 November 2007 (UTC)
- But it's not been proven that it's a town. The problem is that all information that has been provided on the article says that it's a village. Nyttend 16:21, 12 November 2007 (UTC)
- Here's a state website referring to the Town of Magdalena. --Orange Mike 16:40, 12 November 2007 (UTC)
- But it's not been proven that it's a town. The problem is that all information that has been provided on the article says that it's a village. Nyttend 16:21, 12 November 2007 (UTC)
- "Town" and "Village" are terms that have multiple meanings. Some "villages" under Wisconsin law are much more populous than some "cities"; this is a similar situation. Just wikilink to the meaning of "town" that applies here, since the place's legal status trumps the Census non-statutory definition. --Orange Mike 14:46, 12 November 2007 (UTC)
- There is no question that the US Census Bureau is authoritative as to census figures. And the US Census Bureau has their own definitions of village, town, city etc.; however, those are not the only definitions. New Mexico does not have size definitions for towns and their authority, it requires meeting certain requirements and recognition by the Secretary of State. The Census bureau does not have to be wrong in order for other definitions of town to also apply. The US Census bureau defines these terms solely by size. That is not the only legal criteria. Be open to more than one definition of town. --Bejnar 22:52, 11 November 2007 (UTC)
- I don't want an edit war either. You're the one prompting the changes, and I'm seeking to keep it in line with our reliable source. If you don't want an edit war, then don't violate the consensus that the US Census data is to be followed. Nyttend 22:45, 11 November 2007 (UTC)
(unindenting) Thanks...but next you need to find a source that shows that the Census was wrong. Remember, US Census is to be preferred over more local things. Nyttend 16:50, 12 November 2007 (UTC)
- Note that the state website capitalises Town: is this perhaps officially part of the name? Indian Hill, Ohio is officially named The Village of Indian Hill, but by Ohio law is a city and is so counted by the Census. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Nyttend (talk • contribs) 16:55, 12 November 2007 (UTC)
- Nyttend does not get it. The Census bureau does not have to be wrong. The labeling of town or village is outside the scope of the census bureau expertise, except for size. The town of Magdalena currently has 913, or so people, which is village-sized. That says nothing about the other aspects of Magdalena that make it a town. --Bejnar 18:02, 15 November 2007 (UTC)
- Where's the definition of town-is-more-than-a-certain-number-of-people? §3-1-3 of the New Mexico Statutes seems to make no difference between cities, towns, and villages. Nyttend 19:35, 15 November 2007 (UTC)
- The definition that town is more than a certain number of people is just for census use. The Oxford English Dictionary says: "Town: In general English use, commonly designating an inhabited place larger and more regularly built than a village, and having more complete and independent local government (esp. one not created a city); applied historically not only to a ‘borough’, i.e. a corporate town, and a ‘city’, a town of higher rank, but also to an ‘urban district’, i.e. a non-corporate town having an ‘urban district council’ with powers of rating, paving, and sanitation more extensive than those possessed by a parish council or the administrative body (where such exists) of a village. Sometimes also applied to small inhabited places below the rank of an ‘urban district’ or its equivalent, which are not distinguishable from villages otherwise, perhaps, than by having a periodical market or fair (‘market town’), or by being historically ‘towns’.
- The distinction between a small town which is not a municipal borough, and a village, is somewhat indefinite; there are also decayed towns, even municipal boroughs, which are surpassed in population by many villages." end OED quote --Bejnar 15:20, 16 November 2007 (UTC)
- Where's the definition of town-is-more-than-a-certain-number-of-people? §3-1-3 of the New Mexico Statutes seems to make no difference between cities, towns, and villages. Nyttend 19:35, 15 November 2007 (UTC)
- Nyttend does not get it. The Census bureau does not have to be wrong. The labeling of town or village is outside the scope of the census bureau expertise, except for size. The town of Magdalena currently has 913, or so people, which is village-sized. That says nothing about the other aspects of Magdalena that make it a town. --Bejnar 18:02, 15 November 2007 (UTC)
So what? The editors of the OED (in my opinion, the best dictionary available) do not, as far as I see it, intend for their book to be a guide to American local government. The reason that I'm listing it as a village is that it's so listed by the Census, and there's nothing that I can find that says legally it's not a village — to the contrary, state law says that it can be a village. Nyttend 15:46, 16 November 2007 (UTC)
