Talk:Mad (magazine)

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Contents

[edit] Arnold vs. Alfred

Need to also mention Arnold E Neumann. -- Tarquin

Alfred. --KQ

That's why I didn't add anything to the article myself. I know I always get the name wrong ;) -- Tarquin

I thing Tarquin was confusing Alfred with the governor of California.64.165.203.35 02:52, 9 Apr 2005 (UTC)

:-) I'm not a fan, and couldn't really think of anything to say. That's why I didn't do it either. --KQ

[edit] Image

A picture would brighten up the article. Does anyone have a copy of the famous first front page of MAD #1 that they could scan? Mortene 03:45, 8 Oct 2004 (UTC)

--Or you could put it in the Wikipedia entry for Melvin. Pittsburgh Poet (talk) 02:08, 16 December 2007 (UTC)

[edit] IND

Has anyone ever figured out what the letters "IND" on the cover of each issue stand for? Rad Racer | Talk 02:27, 7 Apr 2005 (UTC)

Actually the IND on the cover of MAD means Independent News Distribution Metlover21 20:27, 22 March 2006 (UTC)

"IND" is the logo for the company that distributes MAD. It's "Independent Magazine Distribution", if I recall. Early issues also had a small logo depicting North America with "ANC" written it it, as it used to be distributed by the two comapnies, then American National folded, leaving just IND.

—The preceding unsigned comment was added by Revme (talk • contribs) 19:07, 23 June 2005 (UTC)

_ _ [1] (under the "comic prohibition heading) is one source on this. I came close to that name from memory, after decades, and i have the feeling it was given in the answer to a question from a reader. I added it under a new Trivia section (which may also deserve a Murphy Brown reference).
_ _ I wasn't prepared to vouch for the fact that the IND is still there; no doubt a colleague will check the latest copy & make an edit that includes an as of 2006 link.
--Jerzy•t 23:54, 26 February 2006 (UTC)

24.239.177.198 04:44, 1 March 2006 (UTC)The "IND" is indeed still there, though the pointing centaur has been retired for decades.

When I was a kid I always thought that MINDAD was "Mind Ad", as in some sort of subliminal advertising message that MAD wanted to get across to us kids. Oh youthful innocence and conspiracy theories... --Valley2city₪‽ 08:17, 3 May 2007 (UTC)

What is a centaur i have Old magazines and dont know what it is Metlover21 00:00, 2 March 2006 (UTC)

A centaur is a sexually-charged mythological creature that has a man's torso on a horse's body. One of MAD's old logo designs waS filled with a herd of centaurs chasing young ladies through the lettering and ravishing them. Incidentally, it's a lady pointing at the IND, not one of the centaurs.

[edit] Alfred E Neumann, Nazi racial propaganda?

I believe I read somewhere that the image of AEN was based on NAZI propaganda about "idiots" and "racial defectives" as an example. I saw it in a book on MAD, browsing in a bookstore. Can anyone confirm this?64.165.203.35 02:52, 9 Apr 2005 (UTC)

Found one http://www.garfield.library.upenn.edu/essays/v12p162y1989.pdf Carl Djerassi 64.160.47.75 04:31, 28 Apr 2005 (UTC)

That is an extremely interesting story. I've read, myself, that the face has been around since the turn of the last century and was used to symbolize the "idiot" in voting campaigns in Britain and the US as well. I doubt it originated as a Nazi symbol but was adopted by them, as many other symbols were, for their own evil ends. Also, as an avid MAD reader, I can tell you that their gross humor is aimed mostly at the conservative reactionary right. Homosexuals and Jews do sometimes find themselves underfire from MAD jokes and barbs but these are mostly gentle silly humor compared to the all-out attacks on such things as the Republican Party. For instance, MAD magazine's parody of "Brokeback Mountain" was almost reverent in how it was treated - the jokes being mainly on the audience and people who didn't like the film for being about homosexuals. So, in MAD's defense, I'd say, even if "the face" had been used by the Nazi's, MAD magazine either didn't know about it when they adopted the symbol or did not intend it to be a secret symbol that MAD Magazine supports secret Neo-Nazi movements. Yanqui9 18:30, 8 June 2007 (UTC)

I think Bill Gaines was Jewish. Having Nazi Propaganda around probably wouldn't be a plus in his case... —Preceding unsigned comment added by 220.253.47.198 (talk) 11:32, 4 November 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Uppercase/lowercase MAD logo

The nuances of the MAD logo, while interesting, aren't normally the sort of thing that go into the introductory paragraph of an article. Even the 9th paragraph seems high, but what the heck. Please let the sentence enjoy a happy life with the other sentence about the logo's italicization.


[edit] Recurring Images and References

I believe Max Korn is the name of Nick Meglin's grandson. Can anyone confirm?

Yes, someone can confirm. Unfortunately, that someone would be Nick Meglin's grandson. And he's not here.

[edit] Planet Tad addition

I mostly deleted the part about LivJournal versimilitude because visual accuracy is not a notable departure for MAD. The obituaries really look like newspaper clippings, the CD warning labels look like the real thing, the "Year in Film" uses the correct fonts for the movie titles, the coupons are designed correctly, the eBay parodies look like an eBay screen, and so on, and so on. It's no surprise that they made a blog look like a blog.


[edit] Max Korn Revealed?

Maybe or Maybe Not but in issue # 299 in the Jock Nicolson Article in the background is a poster of a guys face with Max Korn as a caption on top. is this the identity or did MAD Play a trick on us to get us all hyped up. if anybody else plese tell me if im right or wrong i'm gonna write to MAD and tell them about it. :D

And In issue #263 in Dave Berg's Lighter Side of a man is trying to get a job and the mans name is MR.KORN do you think it's him :[

[edit] Bar code gags

I seem to remember there were gags explaining what the bar code supposedly was. Probably during the '80s when I bought a few copies. Does anybody know about this or was it some other mag? — Hippietrail 18:00, 17 December 2005 (UTC)

Correct The Bar Code Gags wre around in the 80's and Late 90's just before MAD had changed in 1997

IIRC, the barcodes contained letters that spelt out words akin to RIPOFF, etc. Something similar... 81.232.72.53 12:52, 15 January 2006 (UTC)

I know exactly who Max Korn is. (He is extremely hot by the way) But I think I would be upsetting some people whom I don't even know by saying who he is.

Keep guessing.

[edit] Foreign editions

The bit on foreign editions seems a bit negative. The one I'm familiar with, Sweden's Svenska MAD, was very popular at least back in the 1980s, and had as I recall it good native material (although Don Martin seemed to be most people's favorite). Earlier, in the 1960s, nationally important satirists and humorists like Lasse O'Månsson ran it, so you might argue that it was important in at least some places outside the US.

I have an anniversary issue detailing the history in .se stored away somewhere ...

MAD Indian Version in Hindi Back in mid70's and early 80's ;there was a HINDI version of MAD magazine titled "DEEWANA"(literally means MAD in Hindi) with A.E.Neuman as on the covers.It included the usual articles and some altered to suite Indian readers.Like "Madhosh Hosh Mein Aaa !"( translated in english="Get Sober You Boozer...) which had a character constantly drunk and then he will see something that his drunken state would show as something distorted...and when he went for it,he got a slap and the Caption read "Madhosh..." and then the actual thing that he mistook was shown (e.g. An elephant's trunk mistook for a fire hose...and a lady's bosom as ....)--asydwaters 10:05, 2 March 2006 (UTC)

The article says:

United Kingdom (35 years), the Netherlands (32 years) and Brazil (31 years and counting) have produced the longest uninterrupted Mad variants.

Actually, the Brazilian Mad had two runs; the first one ended in either the late 70's or early 80's; I believe the publisher (Vecchi) went bankrupt or something. It started anew on Record, in the early 80's. Would someone please correct the article? I don't have time now. Thanks in advance. --Cotoco 03:54, 28 October 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Religous Leaders and foodstuff

Although I haven't time to do it myself right now, MAD's contribution to the Danish Cartoons debate, by depicting Mohammed (PBUH)in a Pancake as well as other reliegious figures on other foodstuffs deserves a mention. Epeeist smudge 05:57, 1 March 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Black & White Contents Only era Vs. The Full Colour Contents (except for the ads.)

Perhaps ,the most unique aspect of the MAD magazine was the use of no-colour illustrations in its pre-2000 issues.This was the most creative era ;as the b/w and gray inks had more visual appeal and added to the article's creative.The artists techniques were more highlighted and the impact of the articles was powerful.Though the cover arts and other -in lays /posters/pull outs/fold-ins were in fact in colour but that only added to the appeal. However since the late 1990's the decision to use digital colouring/manual renderings of the articles that have been a regular has generally degraded the quality and artworks of the MAD's usual gang of idiots.The most horrific being "Spy vs.Spy";it should have been given a decent funeral with the death of Prohias instead they went ahead and use this awful ideas/artwork of some new artist.--asydwaters 09:49, 2 March 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Monroe

Monroe has not appeared for several issues. Has he been dropped from the magazine? Czolgolz 03:22, 27 July 2006 (UTC)

I wouldn't know what became of the "Monroe" cartoons. It's fine with me if they haven't appeared lately. I've felt like I'm Monroe. Chris 21:07, 26 August 2006 (UTC)

Monroe's back... drawn by Canadian artist Tom Fowler. Deakat 02:32, 11 September 2006 (UTC)

[edit] 9/20/06 edits

24.215.152.197 18:20, 20 August 2006 (UTC)1. The information about Prince Charles' letter to Mad is contained in each of the published histories: Maria Reidelbach's "Completely Mad," and Frank Jacobs' "The Mad World of William M. Gaines."

2. I've restored the "Mad Mumblings" website, because it fits the criteria: "Links to be used occasionally: On articles about topics with many fansites, including a link to one major fansite may be appropriate, marking the link as such." Also, the Mumblings site does not contain any of the prohibitions in "Links normally to be avoided."

Actually, WP:EL clearly states Blogs, social networking sites (such as MySpace) and forums should generally not be linked to unless mandated by the article itself. MadMumblings is a forum and therefore it has been removed. IrishGuy talk 20:12, 20 August 2006 (UTC)

It is counterintutive to include the juvenile "Official Mad Message Board" as an external link, while deleting "Mad Mumblings," which is more serious of purpose and far more aware of the magazine's history. I hope the slight edit under "Go Fetch" will be satisfactory. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 24.215.152.197 (talk)

The official forum is just that...official. Mad Mumblings is a fan site. It is a forum. Therefore it has been removed. IrishGuy talk 15:31, 26 August 2006 (UTC)

24.215.152.197 05:16, 27 August 2006 (UTC)I believe you are concentrating on one word-- "forum"-- while overlooking the spirit of the rule. WP: EL also states that there should be a link to "Sites that contain neutral and accurate material not already in the article. Ideally this content should be integrated into the Wikipedia article, then the link would remain as a reference, but in some cases this is not possible for copyright reasons or because the site has a level of detail which is inappropriate for the Wikipedia article."

The "official" Mad message board is toploaded with one-sentence-long posts asking "Who else likes Spy vs Spy?" or "Anybody know any jokes?" Whereas the Mad Mumblings webpage includes numerous interviews with Mad contributors, obituaries of same, lengthy information about themes and articles in past issues, business and circulation details, listings of content from various issues, and so forth. It would be unwieldy to link to each specific subpage of merit, so one catch-all listing seemed sufficient.

But as you seem adamant, I have deleted the other forum as well. There is already an "official" Mad link at the top of External Links.

[edit] 170.141.109.33's Neuman re-re-re-re-re-re-re-edit

The user has deleted the Neuman/Bush/Nation/Clinton-etc. paragraph eight times now, and it has been restored each time. Will they go for nine? Stay tuned!

It's a long weekend, I predict he/she/it will be quite occupied with this. Gzuckier 16:02, 1 September 2006 (UTC)
It's certainly relevant. And the many caricatures escalated into a news story with the Clinton quote (as below) Pepso 16:06, 1 September 2006 (UTC)
The boy's face is now permanently associated with Mad. With the "What, me worry?" motto, Neuman has often appeared in political cartoons as a shorthand for unquestioning stupidity.
In recent years, Alfred E. Neuman's features have frequently been merged with those of George W. Bush by editorial cartoonists, including Mike Luckovich and Tom Tomorrow. The image has also appeared on magazine covers (notably The Nation), and in numerous Photoshop images and GIF files in which Neuman's face morphs into Bush's. A large Bush/Neuman poster was part of the Washington protests that accompanied Bush's 2001 inauguration. The alleged resemblance between the two has been noted more than once by Hillary Clinton. On July 10, 2005, speaking at the Aspen Institute's Ideas Festival, she said, "I sometimes feel that Alfred E. Neuman is in charge in Washington," referring to Bush's purported "What, me worry?" attitude.

[edit] Poetry parodies

My favorite part of the mag has always been the MAD poetry parodies ("I wandered lonely as a clod" etc.). They are priceless and I think they deserve a much more prominent mention in the article, not just the bare mention they get here!

Tom McCormick

Here is the full text of 'Kublai Khan/Irving Khan'

In Levitt Town, did Irving Khan A stately Cape Cod house decree, Where Alf (the sacred Neuman) dwelt And Nick Fazoole and Olaf Svelt And even Sean MaGee.

There: fifty feet of crab-grass ground, with picket-fence were girdled round; A place for little Milt to play, A port for Irving's Chevrolet.

Just one thing is not of all the very best: You can't tell Irving's place from all the rest!

best wishes, bruce bruce (talk) 10:56, 8 May 2008 (UTC)


[edit] Fester Besterchester

How can you have an article about Mad, and not once mention Fester Besterchester (or was it Bestertester ?) and his wife Esther ? Shame on you all ! --89.164.21.28 04:01, 28 October 2006 (UTC)

[edit] NPOV

The lead section doesn't seem very NPOV to me. "Suffered greatly"? It may be true, but it's hardly neutral. Also, a lead section should summarize what is contained in the article. Nowhere else within the article does it mention anything about a "weak" distributor. --GentlemanGhost 22:44, 23 February 2007 (UTC)

64.131.199.179 09:27, 25 February 2007 (UTC)It's more of a space issue. A full discussion of Gaines' distributor woes and how they came to be would eat up room. And the Leader News story is really about why EC Comics folded, since as we know, Mad went on. Hopefully the edit has reworked things to your satisfaction. Some of the complaints seem slightly pedantic, though. "Suffered greatly" didn't mean the guy had migraine headaches or a twitchy leg, it means his company lost money because of what the other companies did. But I've adjusted the text to cover that, too.

[edit] Declining sales/popularity

This article doesn't really mention properly about the magazines decline in popularity, like when it was forced to put advertisements in the magazines and with the advertisements came colour, loss of the actually funny satire and heralded the "gross out" humour that seems to be what the magazine is all about today. Also the article seems to point that the magazine was popular with adults, but I believe it's primary audience was/is teenagers in highschool. The new kids version of mad magazine seems to say that the kids version was made for a younger audience, as if the proper magazine was read by adults. The decline of the magazine isn't "hazy", it's very clear cut. It had a long slow decline up until 1992 where the magazine seemed to sit waiting to die, just like it's publisher did that same year. Then they changed the format to colour, ads and fart jokes in 2001 which was definately a time when the magazine just aint what it used to be. Up until that nail in the coffin though, there still was a clear decline in sales and popularity (ie, sales) JayKeaton 15:27, 3 May 2007 (UTC)

64.131.199.179 04:55, 4 May 2007 (UTC)Readership surveys have shown that adults comprise a sizeable proportion of MAD consumers. The Wikipedia article specifically discusses the circulation figures under Feldstein (both upwards and downwards), the arrival of advertising and the accompanying backlash, a lengthy treatment of the debate over MAD's decline (perceived or real), and various changes in the magazine's creative direction and marketing strategy. Since you think all this is underselling the subject, suggest some specific edits.

I'm sorry today's fart-filled, gross-out MAD displeases you. But at least you'll always have the classic, classy issues of the past, with the Mole using his nose hairs to dig tunnels, or a Don Martin character dancing in a rain of human spit, or new ways for cities to dispose of sidewalk dog turds. Now THAT was adult satire.

That was actually satire, back then. JayKeaton 13:42, 4 May 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Article comments

Two comments:

  • The article needs more citation notes in order to identify where each bit of information came from. I'd also suggest finding additional references.
  • The images need detailed fair use rationales. (See the "fair use" section on Image:Fritz Bugs Out.jpg as an example of what needs to be written.) (Ibaranoff24 03:18, 6 May 2007 (UTC))
  • I'd also suggest putting the article up for peer review and listing it at requests for copyediting. (Ibaranoff24 03:21, 6 May 2007 (UTC))


[edit] Harvey and NPOV

The loudest among those who insist the magazine is no longer funny are typically supporters of Harvey Kurtzman, who had the good critical fortune to leave Mad after just 28 issues, before his own formulaic tendencies became oppressive. This also meant Kurtzman suffered the bad financial timing of departing before the magazine became a runaway success. However, just how much of that success was due to the original Kurtzman template he left for his successor, and how much can be credited to the Al Feldstein system and the depth of the post-Kurtzman talent pool, can be argued without result.

This is probably the farthest from NPOV I've ever seen in a Wikipedia article not related to politics. 'Formulaic tendencies became oppressive' sounds like the kind of thing that would be in a MAD-magazine parody of its own Wikipedia article.

[edit] GA failed

I have reviewed this article according to the GA criteria and have decided to fail the article at this time. The article does not have enough inline citations for the many facts found throughout the article. The fair use rationales for the images should be expanded upon, as a single sentence or a few words does not adequately explain the rationale for using the copyrighted images. The lead should also be expanded to better summarize the rest of the level. I also think that you should rename the heading "The magazine's impact", to something more descriptive or interesting. Based on these objections, this is enough to fail the article. Once you have addressed these issues and looked over the other criteria, consider renominating again. Let me know on my talk page if you have any questions and if you disagree with this review you can go to Good Article Review. --Nehrams2020 21:02, 20 May 2007 (UTC)

  • Just reading the above, I feel compelled to comment that I have seen articles awarded GA status with flying colors only to be removed from GA because of the tastes or POV of other editors who disagreed with the original promotion. My advice to those who are actively editing this article is not to bother going for GA as what constitutes a GA article appears to change with the phases of the moon. Just concentrate on doing an article that does justice to the subject matter and that people actually want to read/contribute to. 68.146.47.196 22:59, 5 August 2007 (UTC)

[edit] "It's crackers to slip a rozzer the dropsy in snide"

FWIW, this phrase appears in the NRBQ song 'Wacky Tobaccy' LorenzoB 04:38, 9 July 2007 (UTC)

[edit] What me worry?

The caption for the alfred E. neuman picture is stupid. It seems like a joke and someone should change that.--Arceus fan 21:03, 19 September 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Lengthy list of humor magazines

The edits of December 20 created an excessively large section whose theme (magazines copied MAD) is easy enough to establish without an encyclopedic list. The information therein is of some interest, but not in this context. It should be spun off into its own Wikipage, whether it be "Mad Magazine imitations," "American humor publications," or whatever. Needless to say, it should also be linked back to the "Imitators and Variants" section here.208.120.226.72 (talk) 07:34, 21 December 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Fair use rationale for Image:Mad24.JPG

Image:Mad24.JPG is being used on this article. I notice the image page specifies that the image is being used under fair use but there is no explanation or rationale as to why its use in this Wikipedia article constitutes fair use. In addition to the boilerplate fair use template, you must also write out on the image description page a specific explanation or rationale for why using this image in each article is consistent with fair use.

Please go to the image description page and edit it to include a fair use rationale. Using one of the templates at Wikipedia:Fair use rationale guideline is an easy way to insure that your image is in compliance with Wikipedia policy, but remember that you must complete the template. Do not simply insert a blank template on an image page.

If there is other fair use media, consider checking that you have specified the fair use rationale on the other images used on this page. Note that any fair use images lacking such an explanation can be deleted one week after being tagged, as described on criteria for speedy deletion. If you have any questions please ask them at the Media copyright questions page. Thank you.

BetacommandBot (talk) 14:35, 2 January 2008 (UTC)

[edit] Fair use rationale for Image:Mad30.JPG

Image:Mad30.JPG is being used on this article. I notice the image page specifies that the image is being used under fair use but there is no explanation or rationale as to why its use in this Wikipedia article constitutes fair use. In addition to the boilerplate fair use template, you must also write out on the image description page a specific explanation or rationale for why using this image in each article is consistent with fair use.

Please go to the image description page and edit it to include a fair use rationale. Using one of the templates at Wikipedia:Fair use rationale guideline is an easy way to insure that your image is in compliance with Wikipedia policy, but remember that you must complete the template. Do not simply insert a blank template on an image page.

If there is other fair use media, consider checking that you have specified the fair use rationale on the other images used on this page. Note that any fair use images lacking such an explanation can be deleted one week after being tagged, as described on criteria for speedy deletion. If you have any questions please ask them at the Media copyright questions page. Thank you.

BetacommandBot (talk) 14:36, 2 January 2008 (UTC)

[edit] Fair use rationale for Image:MAD Taiwan.jpg

Image:MAD Taiwan.jpg is being used on this article. I notice the image page specifies that the image is being used under fair use but there is no explanation or rationale as to why its use in this Wikipedia article constitutes fair use. In addition to the boilerplate fair use template, you must also write out on the image description page a specific explanation or rationale for why using this image in each article is consistent with fair use.

Please go to the image description page and edit it to include a fair use rationale. Using one of the templates at Wikipedia:Fair use rationale guideline is an easy way to insure that your image is in compliance with Wikipedia policy, but remember that you must complete the template. Do not simply insert a blank template on an image page.

If there is other fair use media, consider checking that you have specified the fair use rationale on the other images used on this page. Note that any fair use images lacking such an explanation can be deleted one week after being tagged, as described on criteria for speedy deletion. If you have any questions please ask them at the Media copyright questions page. Thank you.

BetacommandBot (talk) 22:18, 2 January 2008 (UTC)

[edit] Irving the cannabis plant or is it Arthur the avocado plant?

In the section "The Magazine's Impact," there's a reference to Irving the cannabis plant that makes frequent background appearances. I vividly recall Arthur the avocado plant popping up here and there, but not Irving. Is there some confusion here possibly? -- joeyharrison

Yup. Your correction is correct and has been correctly corrected.208.120.226.72 (talk) 13:50, 8 January 2008 (UTC)

[edit] A couple of missing items

1. Songs, such as "Nose Job" distributed in the magazine as a tear out plastic record.

2. The early (1960s)computer language compiler, the Michigan Algorithm Decoder (MAD), would print a line-printer rendition of Alfred E. Neuman at the end of the user's program listing if that program was found to contain errors. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 65.79.188.116 (talk) 02:53, 26 February 2008 (UTC)