Talk:MacGregor State High School

From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

This article, or a portion of it, was copyedited by the League of Copyeditors in 21 December 2006. If you would like to participate, please visit the project page, where you can join the project and see a list of open tasks.
Flag
Portal
 MacGregor State High School is within the scope of WikiProject Australia, which aims to improve Wikipedia's coverage of Australia and Australia-related topics. If you would like to participate, visit the project page.
Start This article has been rated as Start-class on the quality scale.
Low This article has been rated as low-importance on the importance scale.
This article is supported by WikiProject Brisbane.
This article is supported by WikiProject Education in Australia.
Assessment comments
WikiProject Schools This article is related to WikiProject Schools, an attempt to write quality articles about schools around the world. If you would like to participate, you can edit the article attached to this page, or visit the project page.
Start This article has been rated as Start-Class on the assessment scale.
Schools Portal
??? This article has not yet received an importance rating within Schools. Please rate the article.
Articles for deletion
This page was previously nominated for deletion.
Please see prior discussions before considering re-nomination:

Contents

[edit] Just Started

Alright, me being a MSHS Student Myself, and seeing that most other high schools in our area have a page, why can't we. Most of the information will be coming from the website, execpt in my own words. I will aslo try and get some images up, and maby a few more info for you all.

Thanks Tayuke 06:18, 18 November 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Proposed Deletion

I'm sorry, but there are literally tens of thousands of schools in existance around the world and your article in no way identifies any particular importance or relevance that warrants an article. I identify this article as non-notable and propose that it be deleted. (see WP:NOTE) Trusilver 07:31, 18 November 2006 (UTC)

Thats it true, but you, serioulsy, want me, one MSHS student, to make a entire Wiki page, in a day!!! Seriously, I don’t have all the time in the world. And I’m not even at school. And look at this page: Queensland State High Schools Most the schools in the area have a page. Sure, there pages may look better than ours, but in real life, the fact is, MSHS is one of the best high schools in Queensland, with its great history of achievements and awards, in Music, Sports and Academic. Can you please, take that tag away, at least til you see what I do o this page when I return to school on Monday, get some more done up, add a few pictures with the schools permission, ect.

Thanks Tayuke 13:59, 18 November 2006 (UTC)

The deletion procedure allows you a minimum of five days for debate and improvement to the article before it can be deleted. But to be honest, there are VERY few high schools that fulfill notability requirements under the guidelines from Wikipedia:Schools3. And just because there still are some articles out there that haven't been marked for deletion, doesn't mean that they should be here, it just means we haven't weeded them out yet. Trusilver 15:11, 18 November 2006 (UTC)


I've been looking at other High School pages, in Queensland, and came across this page: Atherton State High School It is smaller than our page, and the only interesting information, is the fact that the current State Premiere went to that high school, yet it seems to be O.K. Why is ours under attack, and not there’s? Tayuke 14:28, 18 November 2006 (UTC)

Just because nobody's (yet) suggested deleting Atherton State High School doesn't mean that nobody will. You may want to look at the Wikipedia:Schools3 page, which is a proposal on "how to identify notable schools". In general, references in books, the press, or TV documentaries (and probably in that order of preference) prove that things are notable. If you can provide links to articles about the school on Google, that helps. Ask me if you have any problems with adding links and references. Best of luck ! Angus McLellan (Talk) 14:43, 18 November 2006 (UTC)

Like pages from the school's website itself...

(P.S I was only using Atherton State High School as an expanple) Tayuke 15:41, 18 November 2006 (UTC)


[edit] Copyedit

Supposing you can prove notability of your school, I have gone ahead and copyedited the article. Courtesy of the membership of the The Copyeditor's League. I will continue to monitor and copyedit the growing article until a final decision is made on notability. In the meantime, while I didn't touch the note on the first two school captains, I fail to see it's relevance to the article. I would like to see more about the tornado and it's effect on the school. Trusilver 01:21, 19 November 2006 (UTC)

Very well. I'm now at school, and I'll ask some of the staff here on the tornado, as well as some more interesteing events tha have happend at the school. Tayuke 22:41, 19 November 2006 (UTC)
Easiest answer to that one - Go to the State Library in Brisbane and look up newspapers in the days immediately afterwards. Courier-Mail and any local newspapers for the southeast should be considered. Often comments from government officials and the like can be found easily by this method. Also wouldn't hurt to do a search of State Library's resources for anything else they might have (for example, books on tornadoes in the Greater Brisbane area etc) Orderinchaos78 07:54, 22 November 2006 (UTC)
We could do that...or, we could just ask some of the staff here, who probaly have more info than any newspaper Tayuke 00:25, 23 November 2006 (UTC)
First hand accounts by way of the memories of staff regarding the tornado wouldn't satisfy the requirements of using reliable sources. Articles from notable publications such as newspapers would be fine though. -- Longhair\talk 00:51, 23 November 2006 (UTC)

[edit] What do you know...

While searching for this, on Wiki, I stumbbled upon thsi page, on MacGregor State High School. i don't know who created this other page, but it might help, if we merged both apges together. I'll look at it more at school. Here's the page: [[1]]Tayuke 22:51, 19 November 2006 (UTC)

The other MSHS page, was created only yesterday, and mine was created a day before. So, I took the information form the other page, copied it over to this one, and made a link from the other page, to this page. Tayuke 01:12, 20 November 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Request for Deletion

A request has been made, by staff at MSHS, to shut down this page. Could any admin shut down thsi page, as soon as possibel

Thanks 23:56, 20 November 2006 (UTC) —Preceding unsigned comment added by Tayuke (talk • contribs)

Wow, now I'm suddenly interested in keeping it and maybe doing some research to find enough notability to warrant keeping it. The fact that the 'gang violence' section was removed at the school's request (nobody likes their dirty laundry being spread around) and the author is asking for deletion at the school's request makes me suddenly interested in digging a little deeper. Trusilver 01:31, 21 November 2006 (UTC)
Please, do not make me get ED Queensland involved. Remove the page, or I will, seriously, take down thsi is page, as sson as possible, in any legal way.Tayuke 01:38, 21 November 2006 (UTC)
The article has been nominated for deletion. A discussion will now take place amongst the Wikipedia community to determine the future of the MacGregor State High School article. We don't just delete articles here because the subject requests their deletion. The outcome of the AfD discussion will be taken to be the community consensus on what to do. -- Longhair\talk 01:47, 21 November 2006 (UTC)
True, this page is being considered for deletion. So then why don't we just end it there. The subject here, seriously thinks that it isn't Notable enough to be on Wikipedia. if the sunject thinks it isn't notable, why would the Wikipidea community think so. Tayuke 01:53, 21 November 2006 (UTC)
Your comments of "The subject here, seriously thinks that it isn't Notable enough to be on Wikipedia" aren't grounds for deletion. What if John Howard requested deletion of his article? We'd end up keeping it. As I've said above, the discussion has been opened, and the community is deciding as we speak. You are welcome to add your input at Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/MacGregor State High School. -- Longhair\talk 01:56, 21 November 2006 (UTC)

[edit] While we wait for a consensus on deletion...

1. The section on gang violence NEEDS CITATIONS, PEOPLE! WP's aiming to be an encyclopedia, not a chatroom
2. Suggest another term instead of 'tornado' - I'm guessing that with the school fairly close to the sea it was probably a cyclone —Preceding unsigned comment added by Danlibbo (talk • contribs)

(cheers robbo) --Danlibbo 07:47, 25 November 2006 (UTC)

We probaly won't get any citatons for that 'Gang Violence' Para. Unless the guy who made that Para comes back, you might as well take it off Wiki.

No, it was a tornado. Although cyclones do happen a lot around here, we still do hae the rare times. See here: [[2]] Tayuke 12:42, 26 November 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Students, and there silly ways....

I've been bored over these school holidays, for an an amount of time, and I thought I might come and look at the page I started.....anyway, I was quite shocked, after going over some of the recent edits by people, and how some students of the school would quite such things *shakes head* There all dumb, and seriously, If I knew them, I would try and punish them...

But, back onto the subject. Thanks to all those who've helped so far, make this a wiki page. I'll try and do as much as possible, but I'm always busy with my online game.

Now, for the awards: There pretty much a bunch of minor awards, created by some silly and immature students, who want to be famous? The Mi Goreng of The Year Award, was made by a Year 10 Student, who thinks he's cool...all I could find, was a Google cache of the page [[3]] Its a few posts down, but you'll see it ;) I'm gonna remove it, as it isn't a major award given out by someone...in fact, he's pretty much given the silly minor award to himself.

Thats all for now. I'll post more, once I do find more info for ya all. :)

--Tayuke 20:37, 23 January 2007 (UTC)


I'm back, here to report that the other two awards, with no citations, are either fake, or not as big award, as I couldn't find any info on either of them. The 'BMW Fastest and Best young driver race' "Award" isn't as big, as I looked it up on Google...I couldn't find a home page on it, or anything. And the basketball award, seems to be a school award, not a major award, as I also searched that on Google, and couldn't find his name here [[4]]

I'll remove the awards, but the owners of the awards, or whoever posted them up, an repost them, comes with some sources next time, I'll be happy. Til then, I'm not

--Tayuke 21:11, 23 January 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Request of Page Removal

After many months of myself fighting with various MSHS students over page editing, re-edits, and the adding and removal of bits and piece’s, from here, there, and everywhere, as well as another request from a high staff member of MSHS, I request, once again, that this page be considered for removal from Wikipidea, and that it rest at that.

I’m not sure how this process would begin, but I will do everything in my power, to end, what I started. --Tayuke 22:42, 20 August 2007 (UTC)

  • I don't think this page should be deleted. And who keeps deleting my contributions to the Alumni section? How annoying :@

Chocolatebox 05:55, 22 August 2007 (UTC)

  • Thats what I mean. Here I am, coming back, rediting stuff that should have never been removed, or taking away stuff that dump people on the page. Seriously, I never should have created this page in the first place! I've just caused so much trouble's, with students, and staff of MSHS.--Tayuke 06:42, 22 August 2007 (UTC)
  • Lets leave the school fights. The school might not like it but isn't the info true? Just move it down a bit and maybe the page will look better.

Chocolatebox 07:18, 22 August 2007 (UTC)

Well, User:Tayuke, you could try nominating the article for Deletion. You can find out about how to do that from Help. However, it was tried before, and the article kept. As long as any nonsense edits are removed fairly quickly, WP probably has no problem with this article. If you have personal problems from it, though, that is unfortunate. The article itself is equal in quality to many such School articles, quite well written and presented.
One thing, there is no date on the section about Gang fights. What year was it? You could try re-writing that section, in a slightly more formal tone, which may help with the other issue. If you dont have the time to do that, just supply the Year or the date this took place, (here on the talk-page, or in the article) and I would copyedit the section, (after going to the State Library, and checking the relevant copies of the Courier-Mail).
So, if you wish to find out about Deletion, try Help:Deletion process. I am sorry, I do not know all of the procedures myself. As, I said though, WP kept this article before, and that would likely happen again if it were Nominated for Deletion again. (AFD stands for "Article for Deletion", and a Deletion process usually takes place over a number of days) You can always request help from an Admin by putting {{helpme}} on your talkpage.
If you get stuck, you could message my talkpage, and I would try to assist you in understanding the process, or find someone else with more experience. Best of luck with the studies to all at MSHS. Newbyguesses - Talk 07:18, 25 August 2007 (UTC)
A few points I must make. I did add the deletion tag to the page a few days back, but that was removed a number of times by OSOverclocker.
Another thing to point out, is that no decision was made because of the deletion debate. Since we couldn't come to a concusion, we kept it by default!--Tayuke 03:39, 27 August 2007 (UTC)
That is correct, User:Tayuke. This article has already been through a Deletion Process, last year, at the request of User:Trusilver, and that debate was inconclusive. Now, it was correct procedure for that user to use the "prod" Request, it was the first time. Now, according to Deletion Process, (I know this is confusing, though you do have some links to peruse on your talkpage) "prod" is not used for a second time on an article, you see. There is a different, and longer procedure to follow.
If that issue should be discussed again here, do so.
If any user first has any comments to make concerning the questionable material which has been the basis for much expenditure of energy, I suggest that that issue could also be addressed, in advance of consideration of further Deletion processes. Does any concerned editor have any current comments on that? And in particular, User:Tayuke, your case is well-reasoned, so if your concerns can be addressed, continue the dialogue, concerning the article, here, on talk page. — u:Newbyguesses - Talk 04:11, 27 August 2007 (UTC)
Why dont we bring the article to AfD, if people think it should be deleted? The result would be a keep IMO. Then we can discuss the matters indivudually. Twenty Years 04:36, 27 August 2007 (UTC)
That seems reasonable, User:Twenty Years. Would it be on grounds of notability, which may not be an easy case to defend at the Afd, (Wikipedia:Articles for deletion) depending on who gets to hear of it, and comment. Hmm. Newbyguesses - Talk 04:57, 27 August 2007 (UTC)
Thankyou User:Twenty Years for your assistance in this matter, it seems that your extensive edits to the article recently are valid, and display the gist of the material which was at hand. The notability of the video itself, and the notability of the incident itself can be fairly entered into by users on this page as a debate if necessary. In the meantime, there is no urgency, but if any user does wish to proceed with an AFD, or is having difficulty understanding how to proceed with that rather involved process, that can be addressed here on this talkpage or by messaging me on mytalkpage. I will help, if necessary, though I am in no way involved with this school, I was only looking at this schoolarticle in passing, in fact. Newbyguesses - Talk 23:19, 28 August 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Fair use rationale for Image:Macgregorlogo.gif

Image:Macgregorlogo.gif is being used on this article. I notice the image page specifies that the image is being used under fair use but there is no explanation or rationale as to why its use in this Wikipedia article constitutes fair use. In addition to the boilerplate fair use template, you must also write out on the image description page a specific explanation or rationale for why using this image in each article is consistent with fair use.

Please go to the image description page and edit it to include a fair use rationale. Using one of the templates at Wikipedia:Fair use rationale guideline is an easy way to insure that your image is in compliance with Wikipedia policy, but remember that you must complete the template. Do not simply insert a blank template on an image page.

If there is other fair use media, consider checking that you have specified the fair use rationale on the other images used on this page. Note that any fair use images uploaded after 4 May, 2006, and lacking such an explanation will be deleted one week after they have been uploaded, as described on criteria for speedy deletion. If you have any questions please ask them at the Media copyright questions page. Thank you.

BetacommandBot 05:11, 16 September 2007 (UTC)

[edit] It ends here!

To Whom It May Concern

For those who have been watching this page with any interest what so ever, you will have noticed that myself, and a few others have been trying to pull down this page of MacGregor State High School. However, our attempts have been foiled due to what we know to be a former student, whose intention is to bring the school’s reputation down, and bring out what he thinks really goes on at MacGregor, just because he was involved in it.

This former student has posted a section, now a paragraph, about Gang Violence at the school, and how there was a fight outside of school grounds at school times involving students that did go to MSHS. If anyone has watched that video, you could see that everyone in the video posted on the Yahoo7 website as a news article, is indeed Asian. Not trying to be racist or anything, but from my point of view, it seems that this wasn’t a gang bash up. This was in fact an act, done by a few friends just to bring down the schools reputation.

The school principal also has now expressed that she now wants this page removed, due to the vandalism of the page, and that other accurate information on this page about the school is constantly being changed, due to other vandals wants to make a few funny or false changes, and have a laugh while the rest of the world has access to view it.

It is therefore my intension, to work with others, as it has been for the past year, and see that this page is removed, until any issues about this supposed Gang Violence matter is cleared, or until future notice. The clown editors have moved on, but this gang editor, who is using various accounts to hide his identity, hasn’t stoped his edits since last year. And nor have I!

If there are any issues, questions, and or suggestions about the future of this article, please leave a message here, or on my talk page.

Thanks --Tayuke 22:29, 29 October 2007 (UTC)

First off, we don't deal with vandalism by deletion; we deal with it using admin tools - protection and blocking. However, this is not a case of vandalism it is an editorial dispute. The way forward is not to engage in a revert war but to produce some NPOV wording that accurately deals with the video issue since, on the face of it, the fact of the video and the controversy surrounding it are sufficiently notable to be included. Finally, the wish of the Principal for the page to be removed is irrelevant. We never allow the subjects, or their representatives, to determine the existence of an article and we won't start now. TerriersFan 04:02, 30 October 2007 (UTC)

[edit] WikiProject class rating

This article was automatically assessed because at least one WikiProject had rated the article as start, and the rating on other projects was brought up to start class. BetacommandBot 10:21, 10 November 2007 (UTC)

[edit] No personal attacks

The material concerning the 2006 video seems to be adequately sourced, if a Youtube video is a reliable source, but editors who view the material may question whether this matter is sufficiently notable to warrant inclusion. In any case, this should be discussed on the talkpage, and editors should Wikipedia:Assume good faith in their discussions and edit-summaries.

One sentence which made an allegation that a principal had not returned calls to a local newspaper has now been removed - it is not possible to verify whether a principal has or has not returned such calls, nor would they necessarily be required to do so, nor does that qualify as notable, in this editor's opinion, from the sources available. Actually, I am not convinced that the video itself satisfies Wikipedia:Reliable sources, nor seen convincing arguments either way as to whether the video is or is not notable.

To justify removing the material, it is not enough just to say that the material may affect the school's image. And to justify including the material, it is not enough just to say that there is a video and it must be included, nor to use the material to make attacks against the school. Newbyguesses - Talk 06:37, 28 November 2007 (UTC)

The YouTube video can not be a reliable source about itself. However, there is a reliable article ([5]) describing the video, so it can be mentioned if deemed sufficiently notable. Superm401 - Talk 05:56, 1 December 2007 (UTC)
Any editors who are attempting either to delete or re-add information concerning the video should be expected to discuss such edits and the reasons for them on this talkpage. Otherwise such edits may be considered as being detrimental to Wikipedia. In particular, any editors coming in on an anonymous IP address should consider creating an account, or at least adding to the discussion on this page. This is particularly useful if the edits are being made from a shared IP address. Newbyguesses - Talk 22:04, 2 December 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Fight video

The sources of this paragraph is not suffiecent. Youtube is not a reliabel source by itself and the videos that are linked to do not exist. As for the newspaper article there is nothing to say for certain that it involved students from this school —Preceding unsigned comment added by 220.239.85.96 (talk) 05:20, 3 December 2007 (UTC)

It is not possible to simply remove sourced content because of personal reasons. --Catgut (talk) 05:51, 3 December 2007 (UTC)

It is not because of personal reasons, i could'nt care less however in protecting the integrity of wikipedia it is important that all claims are supported. The sources quoted are not sufficent in proving that this figght involved students from this school as a result does not belong on this page.220.239.85.96 (talk) 05:54, 3 December 2007 (UTC)

I have rewritten it however i am more than happy for this to change after this discussion is finalised. In my view the paragraph should'nt exist however we will see how this turns out. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 220.239.85.96 (talk) 09:30, 3 December 2007 (UTC)

I have reverted your edits, they are not WP:NPOV. They removed 3 sources from the article, and added your own POV. This is simply not acceptable. Twenty Years 16:40, 3 December 2007 (UTC)
The most reliable source for this incident is the newspaper article. Link to Reliable Sources Noticeboard. There are good reasons to keep this paragraph. Newbyguesses - Talk 23:55, 3 December 2007 (UTC)


As mentioned on the notice board youtube in this case can't be seen as a reliable source due to the fact that it is impossible to determine at what school the fight took place at. The newspaper article also does not establish 100% the fact that the fight took part at this particular school therefore i believe it is not a reliable source. Unless there is another source that can confirm without doubt that the fight took part at the school in question the fight paragraph [b]should[/b] be removed Printer222 (talk) 03:57, 5 December 2007 (UTC)

Unless there are any objections to my point of view i'll edit the page in the near future to reflect my stance Printer222 (talk) 12:46, 8 December 2007 (UTC)

Well, the Brisbane Times article bylined March 27, 2007 by reporter Shannon Molloy, has "Two boys, identified as being from MacGregor State High School, are seen engaged in a fight while bystanders look on.". All the information about this incident in the article comes from this one newspaper article, but with the other sources there seems little doubt that students from MacGregor High were involved. Newbyguesses - Talk 03:44, 10 December 2007 (UTC)