Talk:Luitpold, Prince Regent of Bavaria

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Alright, would anyone care if I moved this to Prince Luitpold of Bavaria? Charles's comma tyranny must be ended! The guy is called "Prince Luitpold of Bavaria". Being Prince Regent isn't like being a sovereign. john k 21:03, 24 November 2006 (UTC)

Beyond this, what's the deal with calling this "controversial." One can only know if it's controversial if someone objects. As it stands, it's been moved back without it being clear that anybody actually objects. This strikes me as the wrong way to do things. Perhaps I was wrong for moving it in the first place, but I don't see how moving it back is the right response, unless you actually personally feel that the "Prince Regent of Bavaria" title is better. john k 21:04, 24 November 2006 (UTC)

It is clearly controversial to move a page which has been moved before (in July 2006), and which has also been the subject of a page merge (in June 2005).

Mr Kenney has given little reason here for the move (other than an ad hominem attack contrary to Wikipedia rules). On his edit summary he says that "'Prince Regent of Bavaria' is an *office*, not a *title*". I think that it is both. Mr Kenney states that "Being Prince Regent isn't like being a sovereign", when the exact opposite is actually the case; being prince regent is very much like being a sovereign. Noel S McFerran 21:53, 24 November 2006 (UTC)

It is very much like being a sovereign in every way except the formal sense that he was not the sovereign. And it is the quality of being the sovereign that makes us treat monarchical titles differently from other official titles. The future George IV was called the "Prince-Regent", but in terms of formal titles he was still "HRH The Prince of Wales." Was Luitpold not still "Prince Luitpold of Bavaria"? If Prince Luitpold of Bavaria is technically correct, it also has the advantages of being the most straightforward and intuitive title, and there's absolutely no reason to use the more awkward Luitpold, Prince Regent of Bavaria. I don't particularly like the Rupprecht, Crown Prince of Bavaria format - I find it awkward, and much prefer Crown Prince Rupprecht of Bavaria. I certainly don't like seeing this expanded beyond crown princes. Junior dynasts should only employ the "X, X of X" format, imo, if it is actually a noble title, like "Duke of X" or "Prince of Y". "Prince Regent of Bavaria" is awkward, and would be an almost unique form for Luitpold. john k 22:55, 24 November 2006 (UTC)

Apparently "Prince Regent" was Luitpold's official title after all. See http://www.deutschemonarchie.de/?titulaturen-und-anreden,63 under Prinz-Regent and Bayern (quick translations):

"Prince Regent. The Prince Regent of Bavaria has the predicate of Royal Highness and the style of Allerdurchlauchtigster (Most Serene?). (Prince Albert of Prussia is not Prince Regent, but Regent of the Duchy of Brunswick)"

Bavaria. The Prince Regent holds royal predicates with the exception of the style of Majesty and the title of King. (...)"

Although I don't like the English language Wikipedia practice of putting titles of nobility in the article title (it only causes disputes like this, I'd prefer the plain and simple Luitpold of Bavaria, like most other Wikipedias), under the current standards, Luitpold, Prince Regent of Bavaria would be correct, although I don't think that Prince Luitpold of Bavaria would be incorrect either. Känsterle (talk) 13:14, 7 December 2007 (UTC)