Talk:Louis XIV of France

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[edit] Translation?

Doesn't "L'État, c'est moi" translate to "The State is me"? "I am the State" should be "Je suis l'état", no? Tzittnan (talk) 02:49, 14 May 2008 (UTC)

Well, technically, it translates directly as "the State, it is me". But the most common translation of "l'État, c'est moi" has been, to my knowledge, "I am the State".Brian junhui sim (talk) 08:03, 19 May 2008 (UTC)

[edit] Conclusion section

The section "conclusion" needs a new name. This is an encyclopedia article, not a paper. Garion96 (talk) 22:39, 6 May 2008 (UTC)

[edit] Merge proposal

I propose merging the natural son Louis de Bourbon, comte de Vermandois to this article on the basis that he lacks independent notability. Louis de Vermandois was part of a group of bastard children of Louis XIV and he died aged only 16 years, having achieved nothing. I suggest expanding the illegitmate children section to include:

  • Louis de Bourbon, comte de Vermandois (October 2, 1667 - November 18, 1683), also known as known as Louis de Vermondois, was born at the Château de Saint-Germain-en-Laye. Louis was legitimated at the age of two in 1669 and was given the title of comte de Vermandois. At the same time, he was made the Admiral of France. After his mother departed to become a nun, he lived at the Palais Royal with his uncle and aunt, the Duke and Duchess of Orléans. The duchess was said to have a great deal of affection for her nephew. While he was at the court of his libertine and homosexual uncle, he met the Chevalier de Lorraine, his uncle's most famous lover. It is said that the young comte was seduced by the older chevalier and began practising le vice italien. Louis XIV exiled his son and the Chevalier de Lorraine and in June 1682, Louis was sent to live in Normandy. Seeking peace between father and son, his aunt Liselotte suggested to the king that Louis be sent as a soldier to Flanders, which was then under French occupation. The king agreed with the suggestion and his son was sent to the Seige of Courtray. It was there that Louis became ill but continued to fight, desperate to regain his father's love, regardless of advice given by the royal doctor and the marquis de Montchevreuil that he return to Lille in order to recuperated. He died aged just sixteen and was buried at the cathedral at Arras.

See, one paragraph. The rest is not notable information and reads as a mere genealogical entry. The following should go in other articles if it is important:

"His sister and aunt were greatly impacted by his death. His father, however, did not even shed a tear. His mother, still obsessed with the sin of her previous affair with the king, said upon hearing of her son's death: I ought to weep for his birth far more than his death."

That is all... Charles 18:19, 24 May 2008 (UTC)

For a start I will, as before, voice my disaproval of Charles' way of dealing with articles he deems "unnecessary" - by just redirecting them without even a discussion on the talk page. The article on the comte de Vermandois is of good length and referenced. In other words, certainly not an article that should be redirected on the whim of one editor, who when redirecting also said in the edit summary "If you actually want to help wikipedia, write about him at the article's of his parents" - not a very kind comment to User:Tbharding, who created the article in good faith. Charles seems to have some campaign to redirect as many royal articles as he possibly can, and most without discussing first, and this person, like others, warrant an article in my opinion. One of Charles' reason for the directing appears to be the article contains little information; being a stub is no reason for redirection. It is possible more information can be found, but regardless I think the article stands as it is. And it certainly warrants a discussion first.--UpDown (talk) 11:40, 25 May 2008 (UTC)
Comment on the situation, not the person. UpDown, please do not create a repeat of a prior situation. If you want to investigate the Tbharding issue further, by all means do so, but you will likely be humbled by your findings. If it warrants a discussion then DISCUSS it. Length and references alone do not make for encyclopedic content. Further comments about me should be directed to my talk page otherwise I will seek administrative intervention. Charles 23:20, 25 May 2008 (UTC)
May I remind you that you also commented on the person, with comments in edit summaries like "We all know what you "think". Or is it going to be another silly revert-and-run?". I have no interest to rake through Tbharding's edit history, but he created an article that could be argued to be notable, so a straight redirect is not the right answer. I also have no interest to start a discussion about you, but your actions are important to this article. Regardless, I believe this article to be notable, and it is referenced and has room for improvement. --UpDown (talk) 23:52, 25 May 2008 (UTC)

I have to agree with UpDown's sentiment that "being a stub is no reason for redirection". As he notes, more information could be found and the "Vermandois" article itself lengthened.Brian junhui sim (talk) 04:14, 27 May 2008 (UTC)

The article could be three times as long and it wouldn't be encyclopedic. Charles 04:44, 27 May 2008 (UTC)
Well there we strongly disagree.--UpDown (talk) 07:14, 27 May 2008 (UTC)
i can understand the points of view of both from reading the above but the length of an article or who the person is/was is also of little importance. charles, like your similar views on Louise Adélaïde, wait till what others say. overall though, I would prefere this one to stay as it is :) Tbharding (talk) 16:50, 29 May 2008 (UTC)

I would also prefere to see this article kept, if only because it seems fairly significant for LGBT history. Particularly if his homosexual affair was the only reason for falling out of favor with his father. Dimadick (talk) 16:06, 30 May 2008 (UTC)