User talk:Liv110

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Welcome!

Hello, Liv110, and welcome to Wikipedia! Thank you for your contributions. I hope you like the place and decide to stay. Here are some pages that you might find helpful:

I hope you enjoy editing here and being a Wikipedian! Please sign your name on talk pages using four tildes (~~~~); this will automatically produce your name and the date. If you need help, check out Wikipedia:Questions, ask me on my talk page, or ask your question and then place {{helpme}} after the question on your talk page. Again, welcome!  Great job for Léo Lagrange ! Not an easy feat to translate all this text! I've copy-edited a bit, but as I had contributed to the French article also, I'm pleased to see you find an interest in that. May I ask you where you are from? Salud y libertad, as they say in Spain! Tazmaniacs

Sorry I got stranded somewhere... anyway, there are loads of things to translate, although clearly National Revolution (Vichy) is important. See also here for something that will do the 3/4 of the work for you ! Language problems get fixed, the important is to get the facts corrects... Just don't forget to use the past tense in English, pas comme en français ou on utilise plutôt le présent! A +, translation on wiki is a very good way to practice your language skills! Salut ! Les erreurs sont vite corrigées : regarde les miennes ! Tazmaniacs

Hello, I am very pleased with you answer. Who I am ? : from the Aquitaine, 59y, living in the west of Paris, member of a very old Aquitaine family and of several (some of them officially recognized in 1944) French Résistants (mother and father side, this as from 1941), former international bank officer, sometimes writting in correct English but more often in very bad English despite my old job.

Like translator, you mention Google but Google is American-english to French or the inverse; I prefer these:
http://chaines2-c.free.fr/?cat=192
http://www.toile.com/traduire
http://www.freetranslation.com/
and by comparaison to find between them the appropriated word, expression, sentence, ... .

For full page translation, I appreciate:
http://www.worldlingo.com/fr/products_services/computer_translation.html
http://www.online-translator.com/srvurl.asp?lang=en (for japanese for example).

Yes, the translation of the Vichy spirit i.e. National revolution is very important because:
. in the administration of France Vichy continued also (on several points) the works of the Popular front,
. in the present administration of France (since 1945) many thing (bad and good) come also from Vichy or from Vichy ideas.

The politic is like the mode -fashion-: during several years you forget ideas, styles and some years after they make their comeback with some changes.
Liv110 14:47, 15 March 2007 (UTC)

Liv, I've reverted your edits for several reasons:

  • Your comments should appear on the talk page, not the article page.
  • Your history is a slanted anti-British view of the appeasment policy, which the many French inter-war governments supported even more than did that of the United Kingdom; the reason Chamberlain went to Munich rather than French representatives was because the French government had made clear it would repudiate its alliance treaties with the states of Eastern Europe and was unwilling to go to war unless Britain did so.
  • The article doesn't need to say "Vichy faced a difficult choice" to be objective: it should simply state the facts. The article does so; your edits come off like trying to excuse the choice made to establish a collaborationist government.
  • Finally, your English in some points is, unfortunately, a bit unidiomatic.

With that out of the way, I'd like to address your central contention that there was "no choice" for the French but to collaborate. This is, frankly, ridiculously untrue. Firstly, the government made a choice to sign the armistice, breaking its commitment to the United Kingdom not to seek a separate peace; similarly, it made the decision not to continue the war from French North Africa, a course of action urged by many others aside from De Gaulle; thirdly, Pétain and others used the opportunity provided by the collapse of the French Republic to implement their quasi-fascist, oppressive right-wing regime to settle grudges that had existed on the extreme Right in France since the time of Dreyfuss. The Dutch and Polish governments made a very different choice from the French: they fled the country, established governments in exile, and exhorted their populations to resist occupation. The fact that French citizens were ordered to assist acts of genocide not by a foreign occupying power, but by French rulers, who purported to uphold the authority of the French state, is a mark of eternal shame on Vichy. The Dutch and Polish governments were not held responsible for the atrocities that occured on their territory; the same cannot be said, unfortunately, for the French. Slac speak up! 23:03, 23 March 2007 (UTC)

I don't think I'm attempting to excuse or exonerate anyone. Frankly, the question of who supported who in the Spanish Civil War isn't relevant in an article on Vichy France. I'm 23, for what it's worth. And I don't think my understanding is fascist: it is the same understanding held by de Galle, the Resistance, and other French patriots throughout the world. Pétain and his cronies were traitors responsible for monstruous crimes against French citizens.
But anyway, I don't wish to be this confrontational. I've stated my objection to your edits: if you wish, we can discuss on Talk:Vichy France about how to improve the article. Slac speak up! 00:37, 26 March 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Discoutez s'il vous plait

Liv, je suis desole si je suis trop argumentatif. Pour imprimer cet encyclopedie, on a besoin de discuter des amendments etc. avant qu'on les ajoutera aux articles. La page de discussion pour Vichy France c'est ici: Talk:Vichy France. L'article c'est la. On a aussi besoin de sources verifiables, parce que les arguments sans verification et references scholaires ne sont pas a l'accord avec les policies de l'encyclopedie. S'il vous plait, essayez vous lire les Wikipedia policies, et contribuer aux discussion dans une mode polie. Les discussions ici sont pour proposer des amendment, pas pour abuse et argument sans but. Slac speak up! 12:07, 26 March 2007 (UTC)

Liv, j'ai remis la version de Vichy France comme elle l'était, pour les mêmes motifs que Slac. Regarde svp les remarques à Talk:Vichy France. La question de la langue n'est pas un problème majeur: comme je te l'ai déjà dit, ça peut s'arranger. En particulier, si tu as des doutes, tu peux faire un "draft" (brouillon) en Wikipedia:Subpages subpage (le mieux est de la faire sur ta page utilisateur, mais tu peux la proposer sur Talk:Vichy France (slash, etc.). C'est comme ça qu'on a procédé avec un Italien sur Imam Rapito, et ça marche très bien! Maintenant, s'il s'agit pour toi simplement "d'excuser" Vichy, je ne pense pas que ce soit ni le lieu, ni la bonne manière de s'y prendre. Tu serais d'une aide beaucoup plus grande si tu enclenchais la traduction d'articles, par exemple fr:Révolution nationale comme tu me l'avais montré! Merci encore, salut! Tazmaniacs 14:21, 29 March 2007 (UTC)

[edit] National Revolution

I have redirected your auto-translate from the french wikipedia to the article Tazmaniacs created from the same source back in August. Algebraist 18:10, 30 October 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Speedy deletion of "I.R.E.L.A.N.D"

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If you have any questions, please contact an administrator for assistance. Thank you StaticGull  Talk  14:19, 6 May 2008 (UTC)