Talk:List of universities in Canada

From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

A mortarboard This article is part of WikiProject Universities, an attempt to standardise coverage of universities and colleges. If you would like to participate, you can edit the article attached to this notice, or visit the project page, where you can join the project or contribute to the discussion.
List This article has been rated as List-Class on the quality scale.
Canada Portal
This article is within the scope of WikiProject Canada and related WikiProjects, an attempt to build a comprehensive and detailed guide to articles on Canada-related topics. If you would like to participate, visit the project member page, to join the project and/or contribute to the discussion.
List This article has been rated as List-Class on the quality scale.
High This article has been rated as High-importance on the importance scale.
Education in Canada
This article is part of the Education in Canada WikiProject (Discuss/Join).

[edit] Guelph-Humber

See discussion at Template talk:Ont Uni. --GreenJoe 15:19, 17 August 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Redeemer and Tyndale

There appears to be some discussion about these two institutions. I thought I would point out that the Ontario government's website lists these two on their list of "Privately Funded Ontario Institutions with Degree-Granting Authority" and seem to actually avoid calling them universities. On the other hand, the Association of Universities and Colleges of Canada clearly refers to Redeemer University College as a university; see here. From where I sit, it is not all that clear cut whether these two institutions should be on this list or not. Others' thoughts? --Paul Erik (talk)(contribs) 05:54, 28 December 2007 (UTC)

As I have already stated on GreenJoe's talkpage, They can be considered Universities as they clearly grant degrees that are fully accredited (that includes non-religious degrees). Clearly, they have all the attributes of a university. Also, Tyndale University College and Seminary Act, 2003, Redeemer University College Act, 2000 and Redeemer University College Act, 2003, were enacted for the purposes of making them universities, with both degree granting powers and to change their names to reflect that new authority. nat.utoronto 06:02, 28 December 2007 (UTC)
Yes, the AUCC site supports you for Redeemer, and this supports you for Tyndale. --Paul Erik (talk)(contribs) 06:05, 28 December 2007 (UTC)
I couldn't access that link. GJ (talk) 06:10, 28 December 2007 (UTC)
Sorry about that. Its lead paragraph is, "A private member's bill granting university college status to Tyndale College, Toronto, has been passed by the Ontario legislature and signed into law. This fall, the institution will change its name to Tyndale University College and Seminary and begin offering bachelor of arts degrees." --Paul Erik (talk)(contribs) 06:24, 28 December 2007 (UTC)
University College status != University. Awarding degrees != University. Ontario Community Colleges also award degrees. Does not make them a University. Neither does "university college status". AUCC membership isn't even a full indicator because BC University Colleges are members, meaning, not a University. GJ (talk) 06:25, 28 December 2007 (UTC)
They are not AUCC members, and not listed here. GJ (talk) 06:09, 28 December 2007 (UTC)
Redeemer is an AUCC member it listed on their webpage. The only reason they weren't listed here was because they are not publicly funded, publicly assisted universities, but privately funded universities. Private funding does not strip them of their university status. nat.utoronto 06:32, 28 December 2007 (UTC)
Tyndale isn't though. And "University College" != University. AUCC != University. GJ (talk) 06:37, 28 December 2007 (UTC)

Joe, Colleges usually grant BAAs (Bachelor of Applied Arts) not BAs (Bachelor of Arts), or BScs or BEds, or BBAs, there is a difference. Tyndale and Redeemer both grant BA, BSc, BEd, and BBA. nat.utoronto 06:40, 28 December 2007 (UTC)

(ec x many) I also found a brief Globe and Mail article from 2005. It is not accessible to everyone but here is the link. Again, interestingly, the writer seems to avoid calling Tyndale a university, but does state, "Tyndale provides university education in a wide range of disciplines and accredited programs at both undergraduate and graduate levels." It is an interesting question: Can an institution "provide a university education" but not be a university? I can see both your points, to be honest. --Paul Erik (talk)(contribs) 06:41, 28 December 2007 (UTC)
Not always true Nat, and not an indicator of a University. GJ (talk) 06:47, 28 December 2007 (UTC)

(EC) Also, Take OCAD for example, its called the Ontario College of Art and Design, and its a university, but it has "university status". This news report here states that Tyndale has been "accorded university status in 2003". nat.utoronto 06:44, 28 December 2007 (UTC)

OCAD is listed on the Ont gov website. Tyndale is not. GJ (talk) 06:50, 28 December 2007 (UTC)
The only reason they weren't listed here was because they are not publicly funded, publicly assisted universities, but privately funded universities. Private funding does not strip them of their university status. nat.utoronto 16:40, 28 December 2007 (UTC)
I disagree. I don't think Dominican University College is publically funded or assisted, and it's listed. The page makes no mention of that anywhere. GJ (talk) 20:51, 28 December 2007 (UTC)
Here it states "Ontario has 18 publicly funded universities. These universities, as well as the Ontario College of Art & Design, receive funding from the Ontario government." Dominican is listed as a publicly funded University. nat.utoronto 22:49, 28 December 2007 (UTC)
Your Tyndale is listed here which is listed with the other Seminaries. There is nothing that says it is a full University there. In fact, nothing you've shown as said it's a full University. You've provided circumstantial evidence at best. GJ (talk) 23:14, 28 December 2007 (UTC)

I'm glad that discussion is finally occurring here, instead of continuing the pair of one-sided series on GreenJoe's and Nat's talk pages. The main issue I see with this article is "what is the article's scope"? Currently, the only stated criteria for inclusion in this list are (1) being a university and (2) being in Ontario. Broadly defined, both Redeemer and Tyndale seem to be "universities." If Ontarians agree that "university" should be more narrowly defined for this list, then the article should describe that narrower scope. --Orlady (talk) 14:10, 28 December 2007 (UTC)

Hmmm... All is silence...
It appears to me that any Ontario school listed on either http://www.edu.gov.on.ca/eng/general/postsec/univers.html or http://www.edu.gov.on.ca/eng/general/priv_deg.html meets the definition of "university". That second URL states: "Institutions in Ontario wishing to offer degrees, or programs leading to degrees, must comply with the Post-secondary Education Choice & Excellence Act 2000 which governs degree-granting Institutions. The Act prevents institutions from granting degrees, providing programs of postsecondary study leading to a degree, or being known as universities, unless they are so authorized by an Act of the Legislative Assembly of Ontario or have the consent of the Minister of Training, Colleges and Universities." All of the institutions on the two cited lists are either publicly funded universities or "Privately Funded Ontario Institutions with Degree-Granting Authority" from the Legislative Assembly of Ontario. There are 17 schools on that second list, including Redeemer and Tyndale, but none of them are listed in the List of universities article. If Canadian Wikipedians want to define "universities" for inclusion in the list in a manner which excludes these schools, you had better include a clear definition in the article, as a common-sense interpretation says that 17 schools are omitted from the current version. --Orlady (talk) 05:01, 4 January 2008 (UTC)

I figure if they meant for those on the second list to be called a University, it would say so on the second list. We have community colleges in Ontario that offer degrees, and not just basic applied degrees either, so confurring a degree does not make a University. GJ (talk) 11:20, 4 January 2008 (UTC)