Talk:List of saxophonists

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Contents 1 Saxophonist --> List of saxophonists Saxophone 2 Not really saxophonists 3 New format 4 Bass, contrabass, subcontrabass [tubax] 5 Dan Plonsey 6 Relevance 7 "Rock" saxophonists 8 Questionable edit 9 What?!?! 10 E r i c D a r i u s 11 Some strange omissions

[edit] Saxophonist --> List of saxophonists Saxophone

There was a proposal at Talk:Saxophonist to change Saxophonist to List of saxophonists. The content from the old article was pasted into a new article, and I have changed the Saxophonist article to a redirect. I posted the following comments at Talk:Saxophonist:

It probably would have been better to do a page move, rather than copy the content into a new article. I have made the old page into a redirect, which I guess will accomplish the same thing. I'm thinking that the articles that still link [to "Saxophonist"] (i.e. when the word "saxophonist" occurs) should, for the most part, link to the main Saxophone article instead (or in any event, should skip the redirect). I'll try to get started on that task in a bit.

-- Gyrofrog (talk) 17:16, 27 July 2005 (UTC)

OK, now that the elevator has finally reached the top floor I can see how it would make more sense to redirect "Saxophonist" to "Saxophone." -- Gyrofrog (talk) 23:56, 28 July 2005 (UTC)

[edit] Not really saxophonists

I'm not sure Bill Clinton, Frank Morgan and Adolphe Sax should be included in this list. They aren't really professional or committed saxophone players. Adolphe Sax obviously technically fits, but I'd say first he was an instrument maker - besides the Saxophone article will cover him, and anyone really interested will find out who he is easily. Comments, please. ¦ Reisio 08:59, 2005 July 29 (UTC)

Frank Morgan? I hope he is professional and committed, he was the sax player who mentored my teacher! ;) -- Gyrofrog (talk) 09:16, 29 July 2005 (UTC)

Oops, never mind, different Frank Morgan (born 1933). The one I'm thinking of doesn't yet have an article. -- Gyrofrog (talk) 09:20, 29 July 2005 (UTC)

Forgot to mention...I would of course be game for like a list of Notables that also played the saxophone or something in which Bill Clinton and Frank Morgan could be included. ¦ Reisio 15:22, 2005 July 29 (UTC)

[edit] New format

Wow, the new table must have been quite an effort, Reisio! Cool! -- Gyrofrog (talk) 09:16, 29 July 2005 (UTC)

Thanks; it was worth it, I think. :) ¦ Reisio 15:25, 2005 July 29 (UTC)

BTW, Cannonball did play soprano on at least one album, Country Preacher. Good stuff. -- Gyrofrog (talk) 16:28, 29 July 2005 (UTC)

[edit] Bass, contrabass, subcontrabass [tubax]

Interesting new layout. Would it be possible to add bass, contrabass, and subcontrabass? Or just a category "Lower saxophones"? I don't want to make the column too wide but there are people who use all of these instruments. Badagnani 19:05, 29 July 2005 (UTC)

The "Lower saxophones" (or the like) column sounds like a great idea if there aren't too many of them total - if there's a fair amount of course it'd make sense to give them all their own columns.
One thing we could do that would drastically reduce any possible concern for horizontal expansion is just replace "Soprano", "Alto", "Tenor" and "Baritone" with "S", "A", "T" and "B" (still wikilinked properly, and with an explanation at the top [which we sort of need anyways]). We could have a big column labelled "Bass", with "B", "C" and "S" underneath it for Bass, Contrabass & Subcontrabass - I'd suggest with footnotes for varieties like the Tubax. How's that sound? ¦ Reisio 03:16, 2005 July 30 (UTC)

It sounds simply smashing! Let us march forward into the brave new world of these saxophonist listings. (It's funny, I'm not even a saxophonist, though I play the sax's softer cousin, the oboe!) Badagnani 04:04, 30 July 2005 (UTC)

My sister has an excellent Lorée. :) ¦ Reisio 04:19, 2005 July 30 (UTC)

New columns setup. ¦ Reisio 04:19, 2005 July 30 (UTC)

The new layout is quite attractive. But it seems strange to have the C melody among such low/large saxes. Why your decision to put it next to the bass sax column? I do understand it's good to keep SATB unbroken. Badagnani 04:36, 30 July 2005 (UTC)

What about using a "C" instead of (or in addition to) an "X" in the tenor column? -- Gyrofrog (talk) 04:43, 30 July 2005 (UTC)

Good idea. I've done that. I'm just putting it in the Tenor column (with the footnote for explanation). The C-melody he played had the curve in the neck, so naturally the less knowledgeable will equate it with a tenor, imo. ¦ Reisio 04:53, 2005 July 30 (UTC)

Read last paragraph of this website. Looks like there are at least a half dozen C melody doublers out there. http://home.earthlink.net/~smoulden/scott/melody.html Badagnani 04:56, 30 July 2005 (UTC)

If you think it's justified, we can add a "C" column. No need to worry about columns getting crazy, either - I really will be colorcoding them a bit eventually. ¦ Reisio 05:03, 2005 July 30 (UTC)

Could also just have a "C" footnote like so: X^c or X^C, which jumps to the note "this person doubles on C-melody", etc.. ¦ Reisio 05:08, 2005 July 30 (UTC)

My opinion is just to have no C column, just list under the "tenor" column by putting a "C" there instead of an X. If they play B-flat tenor and C melody, it can say "X+C." This will be more clear if there's a bit of explanation at the beginning (also a verbal list of what the columns mean, from left to right). Badagnani 05:10, 30 July 2005 (UTC)

The problem with "X+C" is that you're mixing something that's purely a "yes, this is used" indicator (for Tenor) with something that indicates type (not mere use of what the column is for). Just having something in the column indicates use of Tenor. How 'bout for people that use or double on C-melody, instead of "X" (or "X+C"), we just use "C" with a footnote (like what Trumbauer has atm) saying something like "This person plays or doubles (along with use of Tenor) on a c-melody saxophone"? ¦ Reisio 05:28, 2005 July 30 (UTC)

That's fine. I'm not sure how to do that and footnotes seem complicated, so I can leave it to you...if I find more C melody people I can just add the C and let you fix it? (Sorry!). I just realized, also, that the "c" next to bass sax is for "contrabass," not "C melody." Badagnani 05:30, 30 July 2005 (UTC)

Okay, how about this... when someone uses (or just doubles along with tenor) a C-melody, just put a lone "C" in the Tenor column (instead of a lone "X"). I will add to the explanation at top that "C" in the tenor column means the C-melody is used, either by itself or doubled with Tenor. What do you think? ¦ Reisio 05:34, 2005 July 30 (UTC)

Y'know... I think I'll just add a "C" column for the C melody. :p What's one more column? - Especially when it doesn't confuse the use of Tenor and more people seem to play it than Subcontrabass, which has its own column. If you guys stay up adding C melody guys, the single "C" or "X+C" will be fine - I'll split it into a new column tomorrow (or at least a few hours from now). ¦ Reisio 06:01, 2005 July 30 (UTC)

If it's okay with you, Badag, I'd like anything that's called "an alto", even if it's called "an F alto", to just be encompassed with the normal "X" for the alto column. The individual articles for the player or group can explain interesting stuff like that (or we could add a footnote link...I'd just prefer to keep it at one character [or one _main_ character, if using footnote] per cell). ¦ Reisio 05:49, 2005 July 30 (UTC)

Sorry to be away so long--I was just creating a C melody page. Your ideas seem okay, especially since we didn't even mention the C soprano (!), saxello, Conn-O-Sax, or slide sax! It could get too complicated. To my mind, the C sax is really closest to tenor and the F sax is closest to alto (though that one is called "mezzo soprano"). Not sure what time zone you're in but I'm running out of gas for tonight. Badagnani 06:13, 30 July 2005 (UTC)

Okay, one more thing to think about. Vinny Golia plays a soprillo (which is a "sopranissimo" sax) and also the straight alto (which he calls "stritch," like Roland Kirk. Can you think of a way to include those somehow? Maybe via footnote. Badagnani 08:25, 30 July 2005 (UTC)

[edit] Dan Plonsey

Is "Dan Plonsey" really worthy of being on this list? Where do we draw the line of who is accomplished enough to make the list?

You have a point, but this particular guy is a pretty well known experimental sax player, and is on probably dozens of CDs. I think he tours a lot and is known in Europe. There are actually "notability" criteria in the WP statutes and I think he would fit at least a few of the criteria.

(Then again, if the last post was made by Plonsey himself (or one of his pals), "having a laugh," then I'll have a chuckle.)Badagnani 22:26, 7 September 2005 (UTC)

The same goes for John Butcher... Also read the next (more general) topic.

[edit] Relevance

Why list Han Bennink and not his brother (Peter), and Why not list Anne Zwaga? If the norm is one's influence or activity, I would list Sean Bergin (VPRO Boy Edgar price winner) and Anne Zwaga (Played on the North Sea Jazz Festival). As a matter of fact Han playing the saxophone is not even mentioned on his wikipedia page!

I started something on Sean Bergin, but I slept so poorly it's probably riddled with errors. Hope those interested can fix it.--T. Anthony 02:48, 24 September 2006 (UTC)

Yes, why not? Although I've never heard of any of these people. Please sign your posts. Badagnani 19:31, 18 December 2005 (UTC)

That would probably be because they are more or less Dutch, and so am I (but hé Amsterdam was part of COBRA!). I think some guidelince must be stated. Number of CD's? Mentioned as influence? Books on theories? Major festivals? Yes, I'll sign now: Jouke 19:41, 18 December 2005 (UTC)

AFAIK there is but one requirement to make this list: that the person plays some type of saxophone enough to be identified as a "saxophonist". Add whoever you like that fits that criterion. ¦ Reisio 02:49, 19 December 2005 (UTC)

Usually we add people who are notable in some way for their performances and/or recordings. Badagnani 03:08, 19 December 2005 (UTC)

[edit] "Rock" saxophonists

am doing a little work on Rock (disambiguation) and note that all the rock saxophonists have ended up in Rock and Roll and not Rock (music), which i feel would be more appropriate. of course some may be rock and roll saxophonists, but i would leave that to those more knowledgable about the instrument. comments?

R7 23:15, 20 December 2005 (UTC)

Good work. I think there may be a handful of pre-1960s "rock and roll" (i.e. rhythm and blues) saxists in the list for which "rock" wouldn't be appropriate. Why not make a list here of the ones you want to change if you aren't familiar with them? Badagnani 23:43, 20 December 2005 (UTC)

ta. here are my suggestions for what we have:

---

David Bowie | Rock (music) | change

Clarence Clemons | Rock (music) | change

John Helliwell | Rock (music) | change

Liu Yuan | ?? | presently Rock and roll

Angelo Moore | ?? | presently Rock and roll

Walter Parazaider | Rock (music) | change

Rudy Pompilli | Rock and roll | stet

Boots Randolph | Rock and roll | stet

---

how's that look?

R7 00:11, 21 December 2005 (UTC)

Liu Yuan plays in Cui Jian's rock band, which is pretty heavy; Angelo Moore plays in Fishbone, which is a pretty heavy band with funk and ska influences; you can change both to rock. Badagnani 00:23, 21 December 2005 (UTC)

Hey, Reisio, the changes were good before you reverted; it is true that the term "rock and roll" is generally used for the earliest R&B-style music and most musicians of the '60s and later prefer the term "rock." Badagnani 13:58, 21 December 2005 (UTC)

Sorry, people are Talk:'ing too fast for me these days or I'm going too slow. I'll step aside and let you guys do your business. ¦ Reisio 14:26, 21 December 2005 (UTC)

• I'm not confident with editing a table of this kind but would suggest coloring the columns and adding the following players:

King Curtis tenor | Rock and Roll & Soul

Bobby Keys tenor, bari | Rock

Dick Parry tenor | Rock

Davey Payne alto, tenor | Rock (Ian Dury)

Don Burrows alto | Jazz

Mel Collins bari | Rock

Eric Leeds soprano, bari | Rock & Funk

Design 08:30, 22 June 2006 (UTC)

Great info, why not give it a shot yourself? Just "copy" and "paste" a player, then substitute the new info. You can use "preview" to check it worked before saving your edits. Badagnani 08:34, 22 June 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Questionable edit

I do not know how to revert a page...but in the list of saxophonists, it seems Pat Patrick, who seems to be a real saxophonist, was replaced by Alex Patton--and google for "alex patton saxophone" doesn't seem to turn up anything.--Todd 18:50, 30 May 2006 (UTC)

Thanks, Todd--good call. I've fixed it. To revert a page, go to the page's "history" tab (at the top), select "compare selected versions" (after moving the dots so you can compare the two you want). Then, if the older of the two is the one you want to revert to, click the heading for that article which says "Revision of...," then click the "edit" tab, then "save page." You'll then be reverted to the version you prefer. Badagnani 19:33, 30 May 2006 (UTC)

[edit] What?!?!

Why in the world is Bill Evans on the list? A person even vaguely familiar with jazz should know that Evans is a pianist, not a saxophonist. I don't believe that he is confused with another Bill Evans, but if he is, the link still leads to the jazz pianist and not to the alleged saxophonist.

There is indeed a fairly well known saxophonist named 'Bill Evans'. ¦ Reisio 23:13, 21 August 2006 (UTC)

For the person "vaguely familiar with jazz": Saxophonist Bill Evans played with Miles Davis ca. 20 years after pianist Bill Evans did. Check out We Want Miles e.g. Moreover, saxophonist and multi-instrumentalist Yusef Lateef recorded under the name Bill Evans with Dizzy. :) ---Sluzzelin 20:31, 22 August 2006 (UTC)

[edit] E r i c D a r i u s

He is very new but he is very good, someone please add him to the list! his website is here

[edit] Some strange omissions

Just added Bennie Maupin, King Curtis, Emilio Castillo, Courtney Pine. If they're missing, I suspect other equally notable names are! Stevekeiretsu 06:03, 1 December 2006 (UTC)

I guess that's what you're here for! Nice work. Badagnani 06:09, 1 December 2006 (UTC)

Abi Harding ?

194.46.166.131 23:50, 13 April 2007 (UTC)

Just a thought - where would an artist like Fela Kuti fit into this list?

What size(s) did he play? Yeah, he should be added. Badagnani 06:44, 12 June 2007 (UTC)

More additions to consider: Oliver Nelson, Steve Grossman, George Coleman, Gary Thomas, Jane Bunnett, Gigi Gryce, Marshall Royal, Frank Foster, Lennie Niehaus, Tina Brooks, Lars Gullin, Gene Quill, David Sanchez, Gary Smulyan, Don Lanphere, Erik Kloss, Brandon Fields, Eric Marienthal, ... --Marcozarco (talk) 06:41, 17 January 2008 (UTC)

If you know the sizes they play, go ahead and add them. I know about half these names. Badagnani (talk) 06:43, 17 January 2008 (UTC)