Talk:List of longest suspension bridge spans
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[edit] Izmit Bay Bridge
I have not been able to confirm that this bridge exists. I've found citations that say it is being planned, under construction, bankrupt, or completed in 2002 or 2004. I'm guessing that since there are no news stories about its opening, that it hasn't been completed. Also, I have found no trace of it using satellite photos. The photos are probably old, but I can't even find evidence of foundation work.
This is the removed entry, in case it gets finished...
|- | [1] || Izmit Bay Bridge || Marmara Sea, Turkey || 1,668 || 2004
- -- Samuel Wantman 02:23, 13 Jun 2005 (UTC)
[edit] Longest does not mean Largest
This page should be renamed. Largest would be measured in volume or weight.
- This is, I believe, the most common way to refer to the measure of suspension bridges. I just checked, and there were about twice as many hits at google for "largest suspension bridge" than "longest suspension bridge". The length of a suspension bridge is usually taken to mean either the length of total suspension, the length from anchorage to anchorage, the length from shore to shore, etc... This varies quite a bit, and does not really compare the size of the bridge. The larger the span, the bigger the cables, the higher and more massive the towers, the engineering sophistication, etc... I don't think the page should be renamed, and it should definately not be renamed "List of longest suspension bridges". It could possible be called "List of largest suspension bridges by length of main span". But I don't think that would be an improvement or necessary. -- Samuel Wantman 05:30, 14 Jun 2005 (UTC)
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- This page should be renamed, with this original page as a redirect. Unless someone also wants to list the largest ( in terms of numbers of lanes of road & rail traffic perhaps )
- Actually, I think it would be a good thing to have the largest by other measures, but not rename this page. We could add largest suspension between anchorages (Akashi-Kaikyo Bridge), largest by number of lanes (I'm guessing the George Washington Bridge with 14), largest span carrying rail and roads (Tsing Ma Bridge), Longest suspension bridge structure between first anchorage and last anchorage (The three Kurushima-Kaikyo Suspension Bridges), Longest from end to end as part of a multiple bridge structure (Great Seto Bridge), overall length two tower with approaches (I'm guessing the Mackinac Bridge), double layer suspension bridge structure (Great Seto Bridge), longest road and rail suspension bridge structure (Great Seto Bridge), widest (Tsing Ma?), Tallest towers (?), etc... If someone wants to fully research this and add it to the article, please do. If not, I'll try to get to it after completing the main list more thoroughly. I think the top one to five bridges in each category would be sufficient. -- Samuel Wantman 07:27, 10 August 2005 (UTC)
- This page should be renamed, with this original page as a redirect. Unless someone also wants to list the largest ( in terms of numbers of lanes of road & rail traffic perhaps )
[edit] Missing external links
Many bridges do not yet have an external link to their home page. They are marked with a red asterisk. If you click on the link you will end up here. -- Samuel Wantman 03:07, 13 July 2005 (UTC)
- Why not just not put in the link at all, until there actually is a link to put in, rather than creating a seperate page with a custom created error message? EvilPhoenix talk 09:11, July 14, 2005 (UTC)
The numbered links also serve as the auto-numbered ranking of the bridges. Before this week we were using [http://] to serve as a missing link. For some reason, that stopped appearing as a link. Please see the discussion here. -- Samuel Wantman 09:46, 14 July 2005 (UTC)
- Why not just use the # function, list each bridge with its corresponding ranking, without the ranking having to be a link. Then you could put in the link seperately. Ie:
- Tallest Bridge
- Next Tallest Bridge
- Tallest Bridge after that
- etc. EvilPhoenix talk 16:08, July 14, 2005 (UTC)
- Sorry, I do not know how to get auto-numbering to work in a table. I tried, and the # function did not work with a table. Do you know a way to get it work? -- Samuel Wantman 21:44, 14 July 2005 (UTC)
- Hmm. Good question. I don't know if that's doable or not. EvilPhoenix talk 04:29, July 15, 2005 (UTC)
More discussion about this now obsolete method of creating an error message is here. -- Samuel Wantman 07:17, 1 April 2006 (UTC)
[edit] Tokyo Harbor Bridge
I'm doubtful that the Tokyo Harbor Bridge actually exists. This was on a list of bridges that I used as a source for this list, but I cannot find any information about it. It does not appear at structurae.de. I cannot find any bridge that big in the satellite maps of Tokyo other than the Rainbow Bridge. I think it was a duplication of the Rainbow Bridge that made it on the list twice. Here is the information I removed: |- | || [2] * || Tokyo Harbor Bridge || Tokyo, Japan || 540 || 1994
- -- Samuel Wantman 07:33, 29 July 2005 (UTC)
[edit] Fixed links across elsewhere?
Can anyone add more info on the possible plans of contructing a tunnel and/or bridge across to the other side elsewhere? I am quite curious as to whether any steps have been taken to decide to build infrastructure links across the:
Anyone with inside knowledge on any of these? I've posted similar requests elsewhere. Gruesome Twosome! 8v] //Big Adamsky 09:59, 13 January 2006 (UTC)
[edit] Additional data
Would't it be nice with info on the total lenght, hight and clearance of the bridges? Not for rating, but as additional data. I know it is difficult to define total length. Maby the width of the strait that is crossed? Zarniwoot 21:16, 7 March 2006 (UTC)
- The problem with adding this information is where to put it. Adding additional columns makes the page fairly cluttered. I have considered using rollover notes to add more information they look like this
. You could add information to the rollover, but the info doesn't stay on the screen long, and you have to move to each one to see the info. Here's an example: . You can also just click on the name of each bridge and go to its article, where all this information can be found. -- Samuel Wantman 07:51, 8 March 2006 (UTC)
- Ok, that's a fair argument. I was thinking it would be illustrative to see the correlation of the span and the hight. But as you say, there is always the link to the bridges. I'm not sure people will notice the rollover notes. It took me a while (But maybe that's just me...). Zarniwoot 13:42, 8 March 2006 (UTC)
[edit] removed bridges
|- | || [3] * || Gran'Mere Bridge || Quebec City, Canada || 289 || 1929
|- | || [4] * || Cauca River Bridge || Colombia || 287 || 1894
|- | || [5] * || Peace River Bridge || Alberta - Saskatchewan, Canada || 284 || 1950
were removed from the bottom of the bridge. If they ever become articles, I'll return them to the list. --Samuel Wantman 07:48, 21 March 2006 (UTC)
Rande Bridge in Galicia, Spain is missing in the list and span is 401m length. See http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rande_Bridge —Preceding unsigned comment added by Valdealix (talk • contribs) 01:48, 1 April 2008 (UTC)
- It is a cable-stayed bridge, which is not part of this list. -- ☑ SamuelWantman 06:42, 1 April 2008 (UTC)
[edit] Ogdensburg
There are two bridges in this list near Ogdensburg, New York. Seaway Skyway and St. Lawrence Bridge are both listed (with different stats). I enquired on Talk:Ogdensburg, New York and was advised that there is definitely only one bridge, and it is most commonly known as Ogdensburg-Prescott International Bridge. --Scott Davis Talk 23:28, 30 March 2006 (UTC)
- I have fixed this and there is just one entry now. -- Samuel Wantman 09:06, 31 March 2006 (UTC)
Thankyou. I'm fixing the links and expanding the article a bit. Unfortunately, I have no photos. --Scott Davis Talk 10:38, 31 March 2006 (UTC)
[edit] Mackay Bridge/Macdonald Bridge?
These two bridges have different length numbers here and in their articles. 24.224.158.166 18:19, 1 July 2006 (UTC)
- The numbers here are correct. The numbers on the articles came from the website for the bridge which lists the total length of the suspended spans not the length of the largest span. When I get a chance, I'll double-check structurae.de and update the articles. Thanks for spotting this. -- Samuel Wantman 19:41, 1 July 2006 (UTC)
[edit] Third Kurushima-Kaikyo Bridge
The image use for this span and Second Kurushima-Kaikyo Bridge are the same image. Also the copyright on this image is unclear, it cannot be presumed to be GFDL either it is or isnt. That if an image appears on another language wikipedia ask for the image to but added to Commons so that it can be used here. Gnangarra 10:13, 20 July 2006 (UTC)
- The same image is used for two bridges becasue both spans are in the image. I have tried getting a Japanese speaker to communicate with the uploader of the image without success. I assumed GFDL, because of the poor quality of the image, which looks like it was taken from a cell phone. If someone wanted to steal an image, there are many better images to be found on the web. I don't spend much time policing pictures. If you determine that the picture needs to be deleted, so be it. -- Samuel Wantman 10:37, 20 July 2006 (UTC)
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- I have left a message on the Wikiproject Japan requesting help, they have been helpful before with other articles suggest you add this to your watchlist for the reply. Wikipedia_talk:WikiProject_Japan#Translation_help_please.. Gnangarra 12:05, 20 July 2006 (UTC)
- The image has since been replaced with a GFDL image that shows all three bridges. I don't know which is which from the picture. -- Samuel Wantman 06:29, 7 September 2006 (UTC)
[edit] Severn Bridge
Surely this would count as the third largest suspension bridge? Does the Second Severn crossing count as well? Simply south 15:15, 11 October 2006 (UTC)
- The Severn is on the list at position 20. It was never the #3 bridge. It may have been the #3 bridge in Europe when it was built. The Second Severn Crossing is a cable-stayed bridge which are not included in this list. See List of largest cable-stayed bridges. -- Samuel Wantman 20:49, 17 October 2006 (UTC)
[edit] Name of article
Wouldn't a better name for this article be "List of longest suspension bridges" rather than "List of largest suspension bridges"?
I now notice that this has already been discussed above. Notwithstanding the comments made earlier, IMO the page should be called "longest" rather than "largest".
- I would be agreeable to "List of longest-span suspension bridges" or "List of suspension bridges with the longest spans" or "List of suspensions bridges by length of main span" or just leaving it alone. -- Samuel Wantman 06:07, 14 May 2007 (UTC)
I now think the best name would be "List of longest suspension bridge spans". Pending any objection, I will rename it. -- ☑ SamuelWantman 22:02, 21 May 2007 (UTC)
- I am content with present name of article. --Jklamo 00:28, 22 May 2007 (UTC)
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- It seems quite clear that for the purposes of this article "largest" actually means longest (suitably defined), so I'm at a loss to understand why the title can't just say that and be done with it. Matt 02:52, 23 July 2007 (UTC).
[edit] Howrah Bridge
Should this be included? The longest span is 457.50 m according to that article. -- Paddu 21:07, 3 January 2007 (UTC)
- No, it is a truss bridge, not a suspension bridge. Cmprince 21:15, 3 January 2007 (UTC)
- Sorry, I got misled by the "balanced cantilever suspension" terminology in the article. -- Paddu 21:42, 3 January 2007 (UTC)
[edit] The lede
This is the final paragraph of the lede (as of 14 May 2007):
- Suspension bridges have the longest spans of any type of bridge. Cable-stayed bridges, the next longest design, are practical for spans up to around one kilometer. So the top 23 bridges on this list are also currently the longest 23 spans of all types of vehicular bridges. The Tatara Bridge has the largest span of any cable-stayed bridge at 890 meters. It was originally planned as a suspension bridge, but the design was changed to a cable-stayed bridge for environmental reasons. Two cable-stayed bridges with even longer spans, are currently under construction in China. The longest of these (Sutong Bridge, 1088m) will be longer than all but the top twelve bridges on this list.
How much of this really belongs in this article? If it belongs at all (discussion of bridge applications probably belongs on the individual-type articles), the copy starting at "The Tartara Bridge ..." to the end definitely seems out of place. Any objections before I be bold and remove the paragraph? Cmprince 02:20, 14 May 2007 (UTC)
- I'm assuming that someone looking at the list would be interested in the longest spans of all types of bridges. That was the the idea behind the paragraph. I don't see a problem with having information that is redundant with information found elsewhere in Wikipedia. If you think the information would be unhelpful remove it. If you think it is just redundant, I'd say leave it be. I'm too close to this to be objective. Perhaps there are other opinions. -- Samuel Wantman 06:04, 14 May 2007 (UTC)
- I have no problem with that paragraph, i support leave it on its place. --Jklamo 19:41, 14 May 2007 (UTC)
[edit] 1851-1867?
The bridges currently on this list as "largest from [x] to [y]" don't account for the period from 1851 (the end date for Wheeling Suspension Bridge being the largest) to 1867 (opening of the John A. Roebling Suspension Bridge). The Queenston-Lewiston Bridge article claims it was the largest at its opening in 1851; it was destroyed in 1864, but I don't know if it retained the "largest" status through then or was superseded in the meantime by another bridge missing from this list. --Delirium 23:33, 15 May 2007 (UTC)
- Check out the more detailed history in the suspension bridge article. If I recall correctly, Bridgemeister.com has quite a bit of information about historic bridges. --☑ SamuelWantman 10:44, 18 May 2007 (UTC)
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- According to http://www.bridgemeister.com/bridge.php?bid=35
- the length of the span of 1851 Lewiston-Queenston was 849 feet and the distance between the "towers" 1043 feet. The photograph shows that there were no real towers, the cables were attached to the cliff, so the span length have to be shorter than the inner distance between the "towers".
- Since the length of Wheeling is 1010 feet, the 1851 Lewiston-Queenston never broke the record. Najro (talk) 19:42, 29 January 2008 (UTC)
-
-
- This article says: This list of suspension bridges ranks the world's suspension bridges by the length of main span (distance between the suspension towers). So in the sense "distance between the suspension towers" the 1851 Lewiston-Queenston actually did break the record. But in the sense "road deck span" it did not. The question is what the most appropriate definition would look like. Najro (talk) 17:20, 26 March 2008 (UTC)
- Thanks for the clarifying edit to the L-Q entry. When I wrote "by the length of the main span", it was my attempt to add descriptive language to explain what a main span was. It was also important that the rankings be limited to main spans because otherwise many of the side spans of the largest bridge would have ended up on the list. The definition of a main span was not not the result of finding a reference that said that the spans were measured and ranked this way. In initially creating this list, the sources I found did not define "main span" at all. Considering this lack of precision, and lacking a clear citation, the current approach by Najro -- making the ambiguity transparent -- is probably the best approach. -- ☑ SamuelWantman 20:10, 26 March 2008 (UTC)
- This article says: This list of suspension bridges ranks the world's suspension bridges by the length of main span (distance between the suspension towers). So in the sense "distance between the suspension towers" the 1851 Lewiston-Queenston actually did break the record. But in the sense "road deck span" it did not. The question is what the most appropriate definition would look like. Najro (talk) 17:20, 26 March 2008 (UTC)
-
[edit] Dartford Crossing (QE2 Bridge), United Kingdom
I am under the belief that the main span of this suspension bridge is 1,476ft allowing it to qualify for this table. However, for some reason it is not included. Have I made a glaring oversight myself or should it be added? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 172.159.42.174 (talk) 00:49, 17 January 2008 (UTC)
- It is not suspension bridge, it is cable-stayed bridge. --Jklamo (talk) 02:20, 17 January 2008 (UTC)
[edit] Links following the table
Should the embedded links that follow the table which are actually references, be changed to reference links with a new section added titled "NOTES" with the references then listed their using the standard format <references/>? I did not what to make such a major change without discussing it first. Dbiel (Talk) 13:17, 24 October 2007 (UTC)
- I think not, because of main purpose of use that non-standart referencing is flexible ranking. You can just add new bridge and not to be bothered with changing ranking (in this table with more than 100 entries it can be kind of editor hell to add some new bridge on top with fixed ranking). So i agree with change to standard referencing outside table, but totally disagree change inside table. --Jklamo 00:20, 25 October 2007 (UTC)
[edit] Record held column
As record held column is applicable to only 11 of 113 rows i feel it as a waste of space and i propose to revert this change. --Jklamo (talk) 02:53, 4 February 2008 (UTC)
- I also agree that this column seems wasteful given how few bridges would use it. Perhaps a better solution is a second table at the bottom of the page with a timeline of longest suspension bridges similar to what is done on articles such as List of tallest buildings in Philadelphia or other "Tallest buildings" lists. VerruckteDan (talk) 09:14, 4 February 2008 (UTC)
-
- Okay, maybe it is too ugly to have a column that is almost empty. The purpose was to create a timeline by the sorting funtion of tables, so a separate column was needed. But now I found out it was not good to use this table for the timeline, because some old bridges are too short to be listed here like
- http://www.bridgemeister.com/bridge.php?bid=373
- and some old do not exist anymore like
- http://www.bridgemeister.com/bridge.php?bid=395
- A timeline within this table would then be incomplete. Maybe I put it in a new section or article instead.
[edit] Flags
I'm not sure that the flag icons are strictly helpful here. WP:MOSFLAG outlines some guidance on the use of flags and flag icons, in which the decorative display of flags in lists and articles are discouraged. -- Jza84 · (talk) 18:59, 11 February 2008 (UTC)
[edit] Xihoumen Bridge
Is there are reliable info, that this bridge was really opened to traffic (not only completed)? If i look on that link with photo [6]. Link mentioned in article (http://www.zhejiang.gov.cn/zjforeign/english/node491/userobject1ai13685.html) sounds like mistranslation for me. --Jklamo (talk) 12:36, 15 February 2008 (UTC)
- I went by the link. I haven't found any other information. The same think happened with the Izmit Bridge. I found a mention on the web of it being finished in 2004. It turned out the bridge hadn't even been started. Do you know any native speakers who can translate from original sources? -- ☑ SamuelWantman 04:23, 23 February 2008 (UTC)
[edit] Link to 1 E+3 m
This link has been restored after having been removed by Lightmouse. I agree with Lightmouse's delinking. I don't believe links to these order of magnitude articles from specific measurements makes much sense and even less so when you link from one measurement in a long list (albeit the first). If we are to keep the link, I propose that it be from the around one kilometer which appears in the introduction. JЇѦρ 20:14, 11 April 2008 (UTC)
[edit] Sorting
I think the table looked better before with a single column "Main span metres(feet)". Now the table looks more complicated with two columns "Main span metres" and Main span feet". User:Roxi2 wrote that the table did not sort correctly with metres and feet in same column, but I dont understand that because it sorted ok for me. Maybe its a browser problem? In the table below I have written meter(feet) numbers in some different ways. (To view the syntaxes in detail one has to edit/cancel this section). I have tested and reported in the second table which syntaxes sorts correctly or not with my particular browser.
| Syntax 1 | Syntax 2 (nbsp space...) | Syntax 3 (nbsp nbsp...) | Syntax 4 (sms) | Syntax 5 (smn) | Syntax 6 (nts almost) | Syntax 7 (nts) |
|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|
| 1 (3) | 1 (3) | 1 (3) | 1 (3) | 1 (3) | 1 (3) | 1 (3) |
| 9 (29) | 9 (29) | 9 (29) | 9 (29) | 9 (29) | 9 (29) | 9 (29) |
| 10 (32) | 10 (32) | 10 (32) | 10 (32) | 10 (32) | 10 (32) | 10 (32) |
| 90 (295) | 90 (295) | 90 (295) | 90 (295) | 90 (295) | 90 (295) | 90 (295) |
| 1,000 (3,280) | 1,000 (3,280) | 1,000 (3,280) | 1,000 (3,280) | 1,000 (3,280) | 1,000 (3,280) | 1,000 (3,280) |
| 9,000 (29,527) | 9,000 (29,527) | 9,000 (29,527) | 9,000 (29,527) | 9,000 (29,527) | 9,000 (29,527) | 9,000 (29,527) |
| 10,000 (32,808) | 1,0000 (32,808) | 10,000 (32,808) | 10,000 (32,808) | 10,000 (32,808) | 10,000 (32,808) | 10,000 (32,808) |
| 90,000 (295,275) | 9,0000 (295,275) | 90,000 (295,275) | 90,000 (295,275) | 90,000 (295,275) | 90,000 (295,275) | 90,000 (295,275) |
sms = sort mode string. smn = sort mode numeric. nts = number table sorting. See also Help:Sorting.
| Browser | Syntax 1 | Syntax 2 (nbsp space...) | Syntax 3 (nbsp nbsp...) | Syntax 4 (sms) | Syntax 5 (smn) | Syntax 6 (nts almost) | Syntax 7 (nts) |
|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|
| Sorts correctly with Internet Explorer 7.0 | no | no | yes | yes | no | yes | yes |
| Sorts correctly with Firefox 2.0 | no | no | no | yes | no | yes | yes |
The article used what I have named Syntax 2 (nbsp space...). It worked for me. It does not work in the test table above, probably because it contains more complicated numbers than the article. Najro (talk) 14:20, 21 April 2008 (UTC)
[edit] Balinghe suspension bridge
Balinghe suspension bridge with a span 1088m is located in Guizhou province, China, it has a high clearance 370m and it is maybe the highest bridge in the world. it's scheduled to open to traffic in August,2008. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 222.68.163.4 (talk) 16:16, 8 June 2008 (UTC)
