Talk:List of basic anarchism topics

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1 Mohandas Gandhi
2 Why was anarchosyndicalism listed under anti-market?
3 Evaluation against the featured list criteria
4 Major rename proposal of certain "lists" to "outlines"

[edit] Mohandas Gandhi

I feel that Gandhi doesn't belong on the list of notable anarchists on the basis that he never did anything to propagate, develop, or advance anarchist philosophy in any sense. The most he did was take some inspiration for his ideals of communism from Kropotkin and get his ideas on non-violence from Tolstoy (also not an anarchist.) It can even be suggested he did more to harm the advance of anarchy by assisting in the founding of the nation-state of India. I won't argue that he wasn't an anarchist, though I am biased against the joke of an idea. I believe I read a quote from him in which he stated "I am an anarchist, but of a different sort..." (I paraphrase.) I do not have a citation on that either, so maybe until we have one we should even throw that idea out the window. I don't care if "swaraj" is in favor of self governance. That just makes it anti-authoritarian, a parallel philosophy to anarchy. He was contemporary to it. He knew of it. He was inspired by Kropotkin, a man no one can deny was an actual notable anarchist. If Gandhi was an anarchist himself; advanced it; developed it; propagated it; then we should have a citation for it. Get one. Then add him to the list.--Cast (talk) 08:06, 24 February 2008 (UTC)

You're totally right. I won't re-add him. Zazaban (talk) 08:11, 24 February 2008 (UTC)

After this initial posting, I carried my concerns to the Gandhi article talk page. There, after a bit of further discussion, I came to the conclusion that Gandhi did declare himself an anarchist. He is reported to have done so near the end of his life, as a philosophical anarchist. I accept this, but though I now recognize him as an anarchist, I still do not wish to add him to the list of notable anarchists, because as the subsection is described, it is for individuals who promoted anarchism specifically. Gandhi is notable for promoting non-violence, and though he was an anti-statist, he is not known for this. To a degree we may blame authoritarians who have co-opted his legacy to encourage the masses to idealize his legend over his ideas, but the point remains that he never propagated anarchist philosophy. I raise the issue again, however, in the event that someone wishes to promote adding him to the list. I leave it for future wikipedians to decide.--Cast (talk) 18:41, 24 March 2008 (UTC)

[edit] Why was anarchosyndicalism listed under anti-market?

That doesn't make sense to me. Certainly there are pro-market and neutral forms of anarchosyndicalism, and have been since the 19th century. 72.83.176.154 (talk) 22:14, 26 March 2008 (UTC)

I've been trying to come up with a name for that column since I wrote it. "Anti-market" isn't clear. I originally wanted to write, "socialist" or "anti-capitalist", to differentiate from the pro-free market Agorism, Anarcho-Capitalism, etc. But Anti-capitalist didn't work because Mutualist is both anti-capitalist, and pro-free market. Socialist didn't work because segments of the Anarcho-primitivist project wouldn't say they are socialist in the way Anarcho-communists or syndicalists are. This isn't a major problem. We just need a better term that describes that group. How about you suggest one?--Cast (talk) 23:00, 26 March 2008 (UTC)

Beats me. I tend to avoid the Marxist distinction between proletariat and petty-bourgeoisie, but anarchosyndicalism, anarchocommunism, and collectivist anarchism are most associated with proletarian and (for the latter two) peasant workers' struggles, while mutualism is most associated with artisan, shopkeeper, and (unlike agorism) peasant workers' struggles. 72.83.176.154 (talk) 02:18, 27 March 2008 (UTC)

Maybe it would be best to drop the attempt at categorization all together and place them in alphabetical order? I'll implement that and see how it is recieved.--Cast (talk) 05:54, 1 April 2008 (UTC)

[edit] Evaluation against the featured list criteria

This is an excellent list in its current state,^[sic] which, with a few alterations, could very well qualify as a featured list. Some issues that may need to be addressed:

The organization section is incomplete, and I wonder what this section would ideally contain - an overview of the most important organisations? The various structures anarchist organizations take?
The lamentably absent list of anarchists. Perhaps that needs to be completed before this list is nominated.
The lede does not summarize the sections of the article, per criterion 2 (a).
It requires relevant free images with appropriate captions. This should not be too difficult.
References. The featured list criteria demand that the list be "factually accurate" and contain no contested material that is not supported by reliable sources. Outside of the lede, this list contains almost no references, although as a basic list, it might get some leniancy. The referenced-to-death anarchism and anarchist schools of thought articles might be useful here.

Skomorokh 05:10, 9 April 2008 (UTC)

Regarding the organization section, I say we should include a subsections on both; Notable Organizations (CNT, The Black Cross, etc) and Structures (federations, collectives, affinity groups, etc). Given that the images should be easily incorporated, we don't have to wait to insert them, but what would you have in mind? The most obvious would be portraits, but we could also include symbols and location images (do we have any photos of buildings notable for being anarchist related?) We can include references from those used in the main anarchism page, as I mostly took my cues in writing the brief section summaries from that main page. Assuming there will be future conflicts over the descriptions given for sections, we can direct any complaints to the main anarchism article, as it is Wikipeida policy not to contradict itself.--Cast (talk) 01:04, 9 June 2008 (UTC)

Also, about the organizations: should the IWW be included? It's never been an "anarchist" organization, per se, but it is notable in anarchist history. Perhaps it should carry a note. If there are more organizations that are non-anarchist, but which anarchists have a mutual history with, they could be put in a secondary section. That may be overly complicating though, so for now I suggest just putting a notice.--Cast (talk) 01:16, 9 June 2008 (UTC)